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Re: [ce-gnu-lug] Seeking advice: To virtualize or not?

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  • Noel Martin Llevares
    Thanks for the additional info about Xen. I read it s somehow like KVM. I ll add it to my list also. As for your questions... This server is only for intranet
    Message 1 of 15 , Jun 30, 2013
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      Thanks for the additional info about Xen. I read it's somehow like KVM. I'll add it to my list also.

      As for your questions...

      This server is only for intranet purposes. Just internal tools that we want to use like Wiki, CMS, Groupware, LMS, some custom apps, etc. I'm only deciding to separate them into VMs to avoid developers breaking each other's web apps. We're not planning to deploy this outside of our network. Also, bandwidth is a bit of an issue for us since we don't have a leased line to the internet (this will be the subject of my next email). Users of the apps will suffer more lag if the server is hosted outside.

      Some services (the custom-developed ones) are critical so downtime has to be prevented as much as possible. I'm thinking that it would be easier to redeploy/reprovision VMs compared to physical servers.

      Thanks for the info on DigitalOcean. I might use this in the future for other projects.


      Noel


      On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 9:59 AM, John Clark Naldoza <njclark@...> wrote:


      Hi,


      I'll just chime in a bit..  If you want Virtualization, not sure why no one would like to suggest Xen =)  Or more to the point, XCP

      http://www.xenproject.org/developers/teams/xapi.html

      This might be a bit overkill for your requirements as you just need this for 1 HW Server, this is much better if you have a cluster of servers that you want to deploy virtual machines on =)

      XCP can be managed using XenCenter -> http://community.citrix.com/display/xs/XenCenter

      Now for your specific problem set...

      1.) Do you want to be able to package/provision a Virtual machine wherein you can then decide to deploy it through Cloud providers such as Amazon, DigitalOcean, etc ?

      2.) You may want to think about the best way to recover from issues/problems...
         - ie Build from scratch, restore from previous backup or have a hot standby.

      3.) Do you need it to be hosted locally?  Or would you rather have it hosted on the Cloud by day 1.  If your budget is 50,000 pesos - that's already more than $1k (if that is spread over 2 years of operation until another purchase.. that's about $42/mo)..   There are solutions around that allows you to provision, save a snapshot of what you have so you can create a new VM based on your skeleton system.  for example DigitalOcean -> https://www.digitalocean.com/

      about $5/mo. for a server with 512MB + 20G SSD.   So with a $42/mo budget.. you can start up 8 small servers or mix and match what you want and shutdown what you don't need to save further on costs =)

      This is just a sample.  

      4.) Talking about linux containers ==> there's also Docker... =) www.docker.io, and you can deploy it on DigitalOcean with this howto =)

      http://kencochrane.net/blog/2013/06/running-docker-on-digital-ocean/

      Hope this helps!


      Cheers,


      John Clark
      "Linux Bum" =)



      On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 9:34 AM, Noel Martin Llevares <noelmartin@...> wrote:
       

      LXC looks good. Do you think it is easy enough to learn?

      I have cross-posted this question on Google+ and on ServerFault.

      All answers lead to the use of containers, which is totally new to me. I'm going to try the following options or read more about them to see which one is easy enough for me but good enough to do its job.
      1. VMWare Hypervisor ESXi
      2. Proxmox VE
      3. KVM
      4. OpenVZ
      5. ...and now... LXC.
      Thanks for the replies, everyone. I'll post here whatever I learn about these.


      Noel




      On Mon, Jul 1, 2013 at 8:41 AM, Richard Sentino <richard@...> wrote:


      Yes, sounds like a good option for LXC which is being used by Docker.io @see http://www.docker.io , worth a look i think then manage those containers with Puppet or Chef - in the future.
      --
      Richard
      @mindginative



      On 1/07/2013, at 11:59 AM, Simon Cornelius P. Umacob <soulfury@...> wrote:

       

      If you don't need to run other OSes, don't use virtualization. It has lots of overhead. You might want to look into Linux Containers. It's like FreeBSD jails.
      On Monday, July 1, 2013, Noel Martin Llevares <noelmartin@...> wrote:
      >  
      >
      > Hi everyone,
      > I'm seeking advice for an upcoming intranet server that I will soon administer. I'm more of a developer than an admin so basically my linux skills are not very good and that's why I'm seeking advice from the group.
      > This server will serve as the host for several "technology stacks". There are several open-source apps that we want to use and they have varied requirements. There are apps that run on typical LAMP setup, there's one or two that runs on Ruby on Rails w/ PostgreSQL, a few that runs on Python/Django and we might want to use Node.js + MongoDB in the future.
      > My concern is that there are too many services which I have to support on the admin side. These are only for our intranet so our traffic is not much. But I fear that if one service becomes troublesome, the others might also suffer.
      > Now I cannot use several separate servers due to budget constraints so I'm thinking of using virtualization technologies such as Virtualbox. We also don't have much spare space inside the server room so we want to use just one machine (with as beefed up specs as we can afford) . We haven't bought the server for this yet, but we only have something like maybe PHP 50,000 as budget for this new server.
      > Am I correct in thinking that it will be much easier to use one VM for each stack they need? Or, should I just setup all services on that one server to avoid the virtualization overhead?
      > For virtualization, which software is better but at the same time easy to use for a newbie admin like me? I've used Virtualbox and Parallels on the Mac as a developer but not as an admin.
      > I'll be grateful for any info that you can share. Thank you in advance!
      >
      > Noel
      >
      >

      --
      Sent from Android.









    • Noel Martin Llevares
      We ve been doing some thinking about hosting it locally vs. hosting it in the cloud and we re warming up to the idea of putting them into the cloud due to the
      Message 2 of 15 , Jul 4, 2013
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        We've been doing some thinking about hosting it locally vs. hosting it in the cloud and we're warming up to the idea of putting them into the cloud due to the difference in costs. Then, we're planning to use the savings from the original budget to beef up our bandwidth. So, now I have two questions:

        1. On ISPs: We currently have three separate PLDTMyDSL 10Mbps lines that are sometimes unreliable (that's why we are hesitated putting critical intranet apps on the cloud). And we also have an old 4Mbps line that we keep for backup (I honestly don't know why...). The three 10Mbps lines are (not so sure of the term) made to be redundant (don't know what this exactly means either) or something like "load-balanced". Or, I think sometimes they are dedicated to one building for each line. All-in-all, the lines cost us about Php 35,000 per month. I'm not very well-versed with our ISPs here in Cebu but do you guys know if we can get a better connection with that same monthly budget? Can we get a leased line with that budget?

        2. On the hosting platform: I'm looking at DigitalOcean vs Linode. Has any of you had experience with both? For the same price of $20, here's the comparison:

        Linode's $20DigitalOcean's $20DigitalOcean's $5
        RAM1 GB2 GB0.5 GB
        CPU8 cores2 cores1 core
        Storage24 GB40 GB20 GB
        Bandwidth2 TB3 TB1 TB

        Now, for sure, we want to start with DigitalOcean's cheaper plans that start at $5. The starting specs are quite good enough for simple web apps. Linode's Library is quite a treasure though. And it will be very useful for a newbie admin.


        Noel

      • mayukmok00
        Noel, I have only tried linode. I can say that their after sales support is good. They also monitor your vps and send you alerts. sample alert: Your Linode,
        Message 3 of 15 , Jul 5, 2013
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          Noel,

          I have only tried linode. I can say that their after sales support is good. They also monitor your vps and send you alerts.

          sample alert:
          Your Linode, linode xxx, has exceeded the notification threshold (90) for CPU Usage by averaging 109.0% for the last 2 hours. The dashboard for this specific Linode is located at <link>
           
          Hope this helps.

          --
          Regards


          From: Noel Martin Llevares <noelmartin@...>
          To: ce-gnu-lug@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Friday, July 5, 2013 2:30 PM
          Subject: Re: [ce-gnu-lug] Seeking advice: To virtualize or not?

           
          We've been doing some thinking about hosting it locally vs. hosting it in the cloud and we're warming up to the idea of putting them into the cloud due to the difference in costs. Then, we're planning to use the savings from the original budget to beef up our bandwidth. So, now I have two questions:
          1. On ISPs: We currently have three separate PLDTMyDSL 10Mbps lines that are sometimes unreliable (that's why we are hesitated putting critical intranet apps on the cloud). And we also have an old 4Mbps line that we keep for backup (I honestly don't know why...). The three 10Mbps lines are (not so sure of the term) made to be redundant (don't know what this exactly means either) or something like "load-balanced". Or, I think sometimes they are dedicated to one building for each line. All-in-all, the lines cost us about Php 35,000 per month. I'm not very well-versed with our ISPs here in Cebu but do you guys know if we can get a better connection with that same monthly budget? Can we get a leased line with that budget?
          2. On the hosting platform: I'm looking at DigitalOcean vs Linode. Has any of you had experience with both? For the same price of $20, here's the comparison:
          Linode's $20DigitalOcean's $20DigitalOcean's $5
          RAM1 GB2 GB0.5 GB
          CPU8 cores2 cores1 core
          Storage24 GB40 GB20 GB
          Bandwidth2 TB3 TB1 TB
          Now, for sure, we want to start with DigitalOcean's cheaper plans that start at $5. The starting specs are quite good enough for simple web apps. Linode's Library is quite a treasure though. And it will be very useful for a newbie admin.

          Noel


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