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XP Tutorial #5 help

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  • L. Lee Saunders
    Hello Everyone, I ve been trying to get my head around how I want to do tutorial #5. It is the tutorial that will create the random name generator command.
    Message 1 of 6 , Jan 5, 2006
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      Hello Everyone,
       
      I've been trying to get my head around how I want to do tutorial #5.  It is the tutorial that will create the random name generator command.  It will also create a setup command where you select a data file that is stored in the registry.
       
      My problem is that this is an in depth, long tutorial. I've been taking very small steps with all the previous tutorials, mapping our each and every step in detail. 
       
      Question #1: Should I continue to use the same level of detail in future tutorials.  I ask this because at some point shouldn't I be able to assume that the reader, having worked through the previous tutorials, knows how to create a new project, etc?
       
      Question #2: If I include everything to create our final product on a single page, it will seem to scroll forever.  Is this a bad thing?  Or, should I break it up into parts like Tutorial 5a, Tutorial 5b etc.?
       
      Question #3: I feel like I should be focusing on XP creation USING C++ & C#, not teaching C++ and C#.  So, would it be bad to just include links to other sites that teach the parts that a reader needs to know before doing my tutorial or is this abandoning my readers?
       
      Qustion #4: And as related to #3, these tutorials are for YOU, so do you want generic tutorials on C++ and C#?
       
      I really want to get this next tutorial out to everyone because it gets into some really furn stuff, but I need to know WHAT everyone wants the tutorial to focus on.
       
      Thanks in advance, Lee
    • dalton_spence
      ... You don t need to recap the things covered in previous tutorials, but a cross reference to specific old tutorial items would be useful. ... If it is long
      Message 2 of 6 , Jan 5, 2006
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        --- In cc2-dev-l@yahoogroups.com, "L. Lee Saunders" <saunderl@h...>
        wrote:

        > Question #1: Should I continue to use the same level of detail in
        > future tutorials. I ask this because at some point shouldn't I be
        > able to assume that the reader, having worked through the previous
        > tutorials, knows how to create a new project, etc?

        You don't need to recap the things covered in previous tutorials,
        but a cross reference to specific old tutorial items would be useful.

        > Question #2: If I include everything to create our final product
        > on a single page, it will seem to scroll forever. Is this a bad
        > thing? Or, should I break it up into parts like Tutorial 5a,
        > Tutorial 5b etc.?

        If it is long enough that it has to be broken up, the individual
        sections should be treated a separate tutorials. Each tutorial
        should teach one specific item (drawing a simple shape, working with
        existing drawing entity objects, creating new ones, etc.). This does
        not mean a new project must be started for every tutorial; instead,
        a single project could be developed over the course of several
        tutorials, with each one covering a different phase of its
        development.

        > Question #3: I feel like I should be focusing on XP creation USING
        > C++ & C#, not teaching C++ and C#. So, would it be bad to just
        > include links to other sites that teach the parts that a reader
        > needs to know before doing my tutorial or is this abandoning my
        > readers?

        Unless this is supposed to be an "XP Development for Non-
        Programmers" course, you have to assume a certain level of
        programming competence. The important thing is to show complete and
        clearly documented examples of using the XP toolkit in these
        languages. Links to the relevant sections of online programming
        language references would be a plus though.

        > Qustion #4: And as related to #3, these tutorials are for YOU, so
        > do you want generic tutorials on C++ and C#?

        Yes, but I'm sure this particular wheel has already been invented,
        so links to such online programming language tutorials would be
        sufficient. If you find specific PL tutorials that are directly
        relevant to the current XP tutorial, so much the better.

        > I really want to get this next tutorial out to everyone because it
        > gets into some really furn stuff, but I need to know WHAT everyone
        > wants the tutorial to focus on.

        See my answer to question 2 for some examples, but ultimately we
        should be able to create a brand new XP drawing tool with a
        reasonable number of bells and whistles. (Maybe one to help build
        new symbol collections? ;) )

        --

        Dalton "ready, willing and eager to learn" Spence
      • Charles Sykora
        Lee, here s my view: 1) I would say condense it the second time if you ve covered it before (possibly with a link to a target in the tutorial that shows how to
        Message 3 of 6 , Jan 8, 2006
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          Lee, here's my view:
          1) I would say condense it the second time if you've covered it before
          (possibly with a link to a target in the tutorial that shows how to do
          it) on the second occassion and then simply say "Generate a new
          project" the third time (again, with link, preferably, to where
          covered).
          2)I would say have a master page with an intro and conclusion and then
          links to the separate sub-files. Dial-up users would really appreciate
          that, I think.
          3)I think it's safe to assume C++, but C# is hardly widespread yet.
          Maybe just cover where C# is different. (Personally, that'd be useful,
          as I know C++ fairly well, but don't know how to spell C#)
          4)C# as far as I'm concerned.
          --Dale--

          On Jan 5, 2006, at 12:24 PM, L. Lee Saunders wrote:

          > Hello Everyone,
          >  
          > I've been trying to get my head around how I want to do tutorial #5. 
          > It is the tutorial that will create the random name generator
          > command.  It will also create a setup command where you select a data
          > file that is stored in the registry.
          >  
          > My problem is that this is an in depth, long tutorial. I've been
          > taking very small steps with all the previous tutorials, mapping our
          > each and every step in detail. 
          >  
          > Question #1: Should I continue to use the same level of detail in
          > future tutorials.  I ask this because at some point shouldn't I be
          > able to assume that the reader, having worked through the previous
          > tutorials, knows how to create a new project, etc?
          >  
          > Question #2: If I include everything to create our final product on a
          > single page, it will seem to scroll forever.  Is this a bad thing? 
          > Or, should I break it up into parts like Tutorial 5a, Tutorial 5b
          > etc.?
          >  
          > Question #3: I feel like I should be focusing on XP creation USING C++
          > & C#, not teaching C++ and C#.  So, would it be bad to just include
          > links to other sites that teach the parts that a reader needs to know
          > before doing my tutorial or is this abandoning my readers?
          >  
          > Qustion #4: And as related to #3, these tutorials are for YOU, so do
          > you want generic tutorials on C++ and C#?
          >  
          > I really want to get this next tutorial out to everyone because it
          > gets into some really furn stuff, but I need to know WHAT everyone
          > wants the tutorial to focus on.
          >  
          > Thanks in advance, Lee
          >
          >
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        • dalton_spence
          It s been nearly seven months since I ve seen anything regarding new XP tutorials on this list. (See L. Lee Saunders Cartographica Fantastica site at
          Message 4 of 6 , Aug 3, 2006
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            It's been nearly seven months since I've seen anything regarding new
            XP tutorials on this list. (See L. Lee Saunders "Cartographica
            Fantastica" site at http://home.alltel.net/ls15426/ for the existing
            XP tutorials.) On Thu Jan 5, 2006 8:17 pm, I wrote:

            >--- In cc2-dev-l@yahoogroups.com, "L. Lee Saunders" <saunderl@h...>
            > wrote:
            >
            > > Question #1: Should I continue to use the same level of detail
            > > in future tutorials. I ask this because at some point shouldn't
            > > I be able to assume that the reader, having worked through the
            > > tutorials, knows how to create a new project, etc?
            >
            > You don't need to recap the things covered in previous tutorials,
            > but a cross reference to specific old tutorial items would be
            > useful.
            >
            > > Question #2: If I include everything to create our final product
            > > on a single page, it will seem to scroll forever. Is this a bad
            > > thing? Or, should I break it up into parts like Tutorial 5a,
            > > Tutorial 5b etc.?
            >
            > If it is long enough that it has to be broken up, the individual
            > sections should be treated a separate tutorials. Each tutorial
            > should teach one specific item (drawing a simple shape, working
            > with existing drawing entity objects, creating new ones, etc.).
            > This does not mean a new project must be started for every
            > tutorial; instead, a single project could be developed over the
            > course of several tutorials, with each one covering a different
            > phase of its development.
            >
            > > Question #3: I feel like I should be focusing on XP creation
            > > USING C++ & C#, not teaching C++ and C#. So, would it be bad to
            > > just include links to other sites that teach the parts that a
            > > reader needs to know before doing my tutorial or is this
            > > abandoning my readers?
            >
            > Unless this is supposed to be an "XP Development for Non-
            > Programmers" course, you have to assume a certain level of
            > programming competence. The important thing is to show complete
            > and clearly documented examples of using the XP toolkit in these
            > languages. Links to the relevant sections of online programming
            > language references would be a plus though.
            >
            > > Question #4: And as related to #3, these tutorials are for YOU,
            > > so do you want generic tutorials on C++ and C#?
            >
            > Yes, but I'm sure this particular wheel has already been invented,
            > so links to such online programming language tutorials would be
            > sufficient. If you find specific PL tutorials that are directly
            > relevant to the current XP tutorial, so much the better.
            >
            > > I really want to get this next tutorial out to everyone because
            > > it gets into some really furn stuff, but I need to know WHAT
            > > everyone wants the tutorial to focus on.
            >
            > See my answer to question 2 for some examples, but ultimately we
            > should be able to create a brand new XP drawing tool with a
            > reasonable number of bells and whistles. (Maybe one to help build
            > new symbol collections? ;) )

            Sorry to bump an old thread like this, but now that the CC3 feeding
            frenzy has subsided to a dull roar <G>, I was hoping there would be
            some further word on the subject. At the very least, I'd like a few
            hints on how to upgrade old CC2Pro XPs to work with CC3. I'm not
            even sure if the XP tutorial project itself has been scrapped, or if
            the XP toolkit at http://www.pkdata.se/xp/download/fcwxp.exe has
            been updated since then to handle the most recent revisions to CC3.
            Any information would be greatly appreciated.

            --

            Dalton "who wants to become a programmer again" Spence
          • L. Lee Saunders
            Everyone, Dalton is right, this needs to be continued. I can only plead that for awhile I was wrapped up in updating my code for Profantasy from CC2 to CC3.
            Message 5 of 6 , Aug 4, 2006
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              Everyone,
               
              Dalton is right, this needs to be continued.  I can only plead that for awhile I was wrapped up in updating my code for Profantasy from CC2 to CC3. 
               
              Peter, could you create a new fcwxp.exe that contains the CC3 version of the toolkit?
               
              I'll be trying to get my butt in gear and get out a new tutorial.
               
              Lee


              From: cc2-dev-l@yahoogroups.com [mailto:cc2-dev-l@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of dalton_spence
              Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 12:39 AM
              To: cc2-dev-l@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [cc2-dev-l] Re: XP Tutorial #5 help

              It's been nearly seven months since I've seen anything regarding new
              XP tutorials on this list. (See L. Lee Saunders "Cartographica
              Fantastica" site at http://home. alltel.net/ ls15426/ for the existing
              XP tutorials.) On Thu Jan 5, 2006 8:17 pm, I wrote:

              >--- In
              href="mailto:cc2-dev-l%40yahoogroups.com">cc2-dev-l@yahoogrou ps.com, "L. Lee Saunders" <saunderl@h. ..>
              > wrote:
              >
              > > Question #1: Should I continue to use the same level of detail
              > > in future tutorials. I ask this because at some point shouldn't
              > > I be able to assume that the reader, having worked through the
              > > tutorials, knows how to create a new project, etc?
              >
              > You
              don't need to recap the things covered in previous tutorials,
              > but a
              cross reference to specific old tutorial items would be
              > useful.
              >
              > > Question #2: If I include everything to create our final product
              > > on a single page, it will seem to scroll forever. Is this a bad
              > > thing? Or, should I break it up into parts like Tutorial
              5a,
              > > Tutorial 5b etc.?
              >
              > If it is long enough that it
              has to be broken up, the individual
              > sections should be treated a
              separate tutorials. Each tutorial
              > should teach one specific item
              (drawing a simple shape, working
              > with existing drawing entity objects,
              creating new ones, etc.).
              > This does not mean a new project must be
              started for every
              > tutorial; instead, a single project could be
              developed over the
              > course of several tutorials, with each one covering
              a different
              > phase of its development.
              >
              > > Question
              #3: I feel like I should be focusing on XP creation
              > > USING C++
              & C#, not teaching C++ and C#. So, would it be bad to
              > > just
              include links to other sites that teach the parts that a
              > > reader
              needs to know before doing my tutorial or is this
              > > abandoning my
              readers?
              >
              > Unless this is supposed to be an "XP Development for
              Non-
              > Programmers" course, you have to assume a certain level of
              >
              programming competence. The important thing is to show complete
              > and
              clearly documented examples of using the XP toolkit in these
              > languages.
              Links to the relevant sections of online programming
              > language
              references would be a plus though.
              >
              > > Question #4: And as
              related to #3, these tutorials are for YOU,
              > > so do you want generic
              tutorials on C++ and C#?
              >
              > Yes, but I'm sure this particular
              wheel has already been invented,
              > so links to such online programming
              language tutorials would be
              > sufficient. If you find specific PL
              tutorials that are directly
              > relevant to the current XP tutorial, so
              much the better.
              >
              > > I really want to get this next tutorial
              out to everyone because
              > > it gets into some really furn stuff, but I
              need to know WHAT
              > > everyone wants the tutorial to focus on.
              >
              > See my answer to question 2 for some examples, but ultimately we
              > should be able to create a brand new XP drawing tool with a
              >
              reasonable number of bells and whistles. (Maybe one to help build
              > new
              symbol collections? ;) )

              Sorry to bump an old thread like this, but now that the CC3 feeding
              frenzy has subsided to a dull roar <G>, I was hoping there would be
              some further word on the subject. At the very least, I'd like a few
              hints on how to upgrade old CC2Pro XPs to work with CC3. I'm not
              even sure if the XP tutorial project itself has been scrapped, or if
              the XP toolkit at http://www.pkdata. se/xp/download/ fcwxp.exe has
              been updated since then to handle the most recent revisions to CC3.
              Any information would be greatly appreciated.

              --

              Dalton "who wants to become a programmer again" Spence

            • dalton_spence
              ... How you did that (in terms of tricks and techniques) would make for a good tutorial in and of itself. ... Comprehensive lists of the XP functions and data
              Message 6 of 6 , Aug 5, 2006
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                --- In cc2-dev-l@yahoogroups.com, "L. Lee Saunders" <saunderl@...>
                wrote:
                > Everyone,
                >
                > Dalton is right, this needs to be continued. I can only plead that
                > for awhile I was wrapped up in updating my code for Profantasy from
                > CC2 to CC3.

                How you did that (in terms of tricks and techniques) would make for a
                good tutorial in and of itself.

                > Peter, could you create a new fcwxp.exe that contains the CC3
                > version of the toolkit?

                Comprehensive lists of the XP functions and data types in C format (as
                opposed to assembler) would be *extremely* useful additions to the DOC
                folder. I know it may come as a bit of a shock, but not too many people
                take the time to program applications in assembler anymore. ;)

                > I'll be trying to get my butt in gear and get out a new tutorial.

                Before you do that, there may be a couple of changes you may want to
                make to tutorial 2.

                1. At the end of the paragraph following the first 'Property Pages'
                dialog box where it says "If you installed the toolkit in the default
                location, it will be 'C:\fcwxp\xpdev'." please add "Otherwise, if the
                path to the toolkit contains embedded blanks, it should be enclosed in
                quotes." This should be repeated (or at least referred to) at the end
                of the next paragraph. (This may seem obvious, but it caught me off
                guard.)

                2. At the end of the linker paragraph you may want add "For CC3 XPs,
                change 'xpdev' and 'xpdev\lib_v6' to 'xpdev\CC3' above." (Assuming, of
                course, that is correct.)

                Since tutorials 3 and 4 use 'MyFirstXP' as a starting point, you
                shouldn't need to change them. However, a macro/wizard for adding new
                commands to an existing XP (adding the XPCALL prototype and empty
                function shell code and updating CList and PList) would be nice.

                --

                Dalton "who's just full of ideas (among other things) ;)" Spence
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