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Re: [carfree_cities] Re: Jaywalking is good for cities

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  • Simon Baddeley
    My understanding is that jaywalking was also used as a form of courageous dumb insolence in southern towns as a protest by non-car owning and segregated
    Message 1 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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      My understanding is that "jaywalking" was also used as a form of courageous
      "dumb insolence" in southern towns as a protest by non-car owning and
      segregated Blacks versus car driving car owning Whites. Does anyone have the
      reference/s? It'd be good to put that in Wikipedia entry on "Jaywalking".

      Best

      S


      > From: ktsourl <ktsourl@...>
      > Reply-To: <carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com>
      > Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2006 12:11:18 -0000
      > To: <carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com>
      > Subject: [carfree_cities] Re: Jaywalking is good for cities
      >
      > What remains usually unnoticed to natively english speakers is that
      > there exist no corresponding to "Jaywalk" term in many (I think almost
      > all - with the exception of english) languages of the world, to
      > denigrate a free, easygoing and unconcerned pedestrian behaviour. The
      > formulation of the language is not a neutral process,
    • J.H. Crawford
      ... It s important to be clear that jaywalking implies a violation of a traffic law. If there are crosswalks, the law says you are obliged to use them. If
      Message 2 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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        >What remains usually unnoticed to natively english speakers is that
        >there exist no corresponding to "Jaywalk" term in many (I think almost
        >all - with the exception of english) languages of the world, to
        >denigrate a free, easygoing and unconcerned pedestrian behaviour.

        It's important to be clear that jaywalking implies a violation
        of a traffic law. If there are crosswalks, the law says you
        are obliged to use them. If there are none, then you may
        cross where you please, and you are therefore not jaywalking.

        >The
        >formulation of the language is not a neutral process, but has deep
        >implications to the way people interpret the world and create
        >"obviousnesses" (consider G. Orwell's newspeak, or Sapir-Whorf
        >hypothesis). Does a similar term exist for reckless driving?

        If jaywalking as a lexical concept originates in US English
        (I am not sure), then it implies that the US was the first
        place to criminalize what had until then been normal behavior.
        That would have arisen because the US was the first place
        where there were enough cars for the issue to arise.

        >And of course Jaywalking is good for cities, as recent studies have
        >proven - after all is the best large scale traffic calming procedure.

        Well, the best large-scale traffic calming procedure is
        to put up barriers to cars and keep them out entirely.




        ----- ### -----
        J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
        mailbox@... http://www.carfree.com
      • Carlos F. Pardo SUTP
        What is the origin of the word jaywalking ? Original source: http://www.askoxford.com/asktheexperts/faq/aboutwordorigins/jaywalking The complete Oxford
        Message 3 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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          "What is the origin of the word 'jaywalking'?
          Original source:
          http://www.askoxford.com/asktheexperts/faq/aboutwordorigins/jaywalking

          The complete Oxford English Dictionary traces the word jaywalker back to
          1917 and labels it 'originally US'. There is a cross-reference to the word
          jay, which has a number of slang senses. The relevant one is 'a stupid or
          dull person, a simpleton. Also (as adjective) dull, unsophisticated;
          inferior, poor'. This is labelled 'US colloquial', and there is evidence of
          use from 1900. So persons who stupidly ignored traffic regulations were
          given (in Boston, it seems) this compact name."

          This is a great discussion. I think there must be other terms in the
          US-english strictly related to auto-centric views, which are not found in
          other languages. I fully agree with the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis. Language
          constructs reality. Thanks for the comment!

          Best regards,

          Carlos F. Pardo



          -----Original Message-----
          From: carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com [mailto:carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com]
          On Behalf Of Simon Baddeley
          Sent: Viernes, 03 de Marzo de 2006 07:18 a.m.
          To: Carfree Cities
          Subject: Re: [carfree_cities] Re: Jaywalking is good for cities

          My understanding is that "jaywalking" was also used as a form of courageous
          "dumb insolence" in southern towns as a protest by non-car owning and
          segregated Blacks versus car driving car owning Whites. Does anyone have the
          reference/s? It'd be good to put that in Wikipedia entry on "Jaywalking".

          Best

          S


          > From: ktsourl <ktsourl@...>
          > Reply-To: <carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com>
          > Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2006 12:11:18 -0000
          > To: <carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com>
          > Subject: [carfree_cities] Re: Jaywalking is good for cities
          >
          > What remains usually unnoticed to natively english speakers is that
          > there exist no corresponding to "Jaywalk" term in many (I think almost
          > all - with the exception of english) languages of the world, to
          > denigrate a free, easygoing and unconcerned pedestrian behaviour. The
          > formulation of the language is not a neutral process,





          Yahoo! Groups Links
        • Todd Edelman
          carlos.pardo@sutp.org wrote: ... I fully agree with the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis. Language ... Or does it really, CARlos...? ;-p - T ... Todd Edelman
          Message 4 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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            carlos.pardo@... wrote:

            "... I fully agree with the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis. Language
            > constructs reality..."

            Or does it really, CARlos...? ;-p

            - T


            ------------------------------------------------------

            Todd Edelman
            International Coordinator
            On the Train Towards the Future!

            Green Idea Factory
            Laubova 5
            CZ-13000 Praha 3

            ++420 605 915 970

            edelman@...
            http://www.worldcarfree.net/onthetrain

            Green Idea Factory,
            a member of World Carfree Network
          • Carlos F. Pardo SUTP
            Sorry for this quick email regarding my name s meaning... Once I was in a lunch in Thailand, and a guy told me that my name meant Car- loss... no more cars!
            Message 5 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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              Sorry for this quick email regarding my name's meaning... Once I was in a
              lunch in Thailand, and a guy told me that my name meant Car- loss... no more
              cars!

              Carlos F. Pardo



              -----Original Message-----
              From: carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com [mailto:carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com]
              On Behalf Of Todd Edelman
              Sent: Viernes, 03 de Marzo de 2006 09:05 a.m.
              To: carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [carfree_cities] Re: Jaywalking is good for cities

              carlos.pardo@... wrote:

              "... I fully agree with the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis. Language
              > constructs reality..."

              Or does it really, CARlos...? ;-p

              - T


              ------------------------------------------------------

              Todd Edelman
              International Coordinator
              On the Train Towards the Future!

              Green Idea Factory
              Laubova 5
              CZ-13000 Praha 3

              ++420 605 915 970

              edelman@...
              http://www.worldcarfree.net/onthetrain

              Green Idea Factory,
              a member of World Carfree Network




              Yahoo! Groups Links
            • Simon Baddeley
              The idea of segregation suggested here worries me, but then I am keen on the naked street as the next best to no cars at all.
              Message 6 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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                The idea of segregation suggested here worries me, but then I am keen on the
                "naked street" as the next best to no cars at all.

                http://www.conwyctc.fsnet.co.uk/pages/safe_rds.htm

                Simon


                > Well, the best large-scale traffic calming procedure is
                > to put up barriers to cars and keep them out entirely.
              • Richard Risemberg
                ... In California, you may cross anywhere, crosswalk or not, UNLESS the street has signals at both ends of the block you re on, in which case you must use
                Message 7 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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                  On Mar 3, 2006, at 4:41 AM, J.H. Crawford wrote:

                  > It's important to be clear that jaywalking implies a violation
                  > of a traffic law. If there are crosswalks, the law says you
                  > are obliged to use them. If there are none, then you may
                  > cross where you please, and you are therefore not jaywalking.
                  In California, you may cross anywhere, crosswalk or not, UNLESS the
                  street has signals at both ends of the block you're on, in which case
                  you must use crosswalks.

                  My street has such signals, but I jaywalk anyway. Every single day.

                  Rick
                  --
                  Richard Risemberg
                  http://www.rickrise.com
                  http://www.newcolonist.com
                  http://www.living-room.org
                • Doug Salzmann
                  ... That s incorrect, at least in most North American jurisdictions. First, it is a common misconception that paint creates crosswalks. It does not.
                  Message 8 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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                    > It's important to be clear that jaywalking implies a violation
                    > of a traffic law. If there are crosswalks, the law says you
                    > are obliged to use them. If there are none, then you may
                    > cross where you please, and you are therefore not jaywalking.

                    That's incorrect, at least in most North American jurisdictions.

                    First, it is a common misconception that paint creates crosswalks. It
                    does not.

                    "Crosswalk" is typically defined as an extension of the sidewalk,
                    shoulder, or whatever pedestrian R.O.W. there may be, across an
                    intersection of roadways. The crosswalk thus exists, and the associated
                    rights and obligations of pedestrians, drivers, etc. apply, whether it is
                    marked (painted) or not.

                    Second, mid-block crossings are generally perfectly legal, with the
                    proviso that crossing pedestrians must yield to auto traffic before
                    beginning to cross. The main exception is between two signalized
                    (traffic-light controlled) intersections, where such crossings are
                    usually prohibited.

                    As this should make clear, "jaywalking" is pretty meaningless as a legal
                    term.

                    All of the foregoing is subject to the variable provisions of local
                    ordinances, of course.


                    > >And of course Jaywalking is good for cities, as recent studies have
                    > >proven - after all is the best large scale traffic calming procedure.
                    >
                    > Well, the best large-scale traffic calming procedure is
                    > to put up barriers to cars and keep them out entirely.

                    Yes, indeed. And, THAT is the subject of this list, isn't it?


                    -Doug
                  • J.H. Crawford
                    ... and reality constructs language ... J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities mailbox@carfree.com
                    Message 9 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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                      >This is a great discussion. I think there must be other terms in the
                      >US-english strictly related to auto-centric views, which are not found in
                      >other languages. I fully agree with the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis. Language
                      >constructs reality. Thanks for the comment!

                      and reality constructs language


                      ----- ### -----
                      J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
                      mailbox@... http://www.carfree.com
                    • Simon Baddeley
                      So can I ask again whether you are comfortable with the Wikipedia entry on jaywalking ?: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaywalking It seems that it might be
                      Message 10 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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                        So can I ask again whether you are comfortable with the Wikipedia entry on
                        "jaywalking"?:

                        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaywalking

                        It seems that it might be reasonable to edit in a few sentences at the end
                        of the paragraph headed "Driver cooperation" where reference might be made
                        to mutual cooperation among ALL road users as encouraged by "naked streets"
                        - and indeed give a link to examples of this idea which has behind it the
                        idea of no traffic exceeding 17mph in order to allow negotiation between
                        different road users via eye contact.

                        QUOTE: To disrobe a street, you remove all the conventional methods of
                        controlling vehicles and keeping them separate from pedestrians. Traffic
                        lights, barriers, signs, curbs, and pedestrian crossings are all taken out.
                        The idea behind it is to make the road space less predictable. Instead of
                        drivers being able to rely on road markings and charge along on the
                        assumption that pedestrians are all corralled safely out of the way, they
                        will have to continually interact with people, make decisions about how fast
                        to drive and generally take more responsibility for their actions. London is
                        trying the idea in Exhibition Road, Kensington, in which some of the
                        capital¹s biggest museums are sited. The idea sounds extraordinary, so much
                        so that the British tabloid newspaper the Sun wrote in an editorial: ³Have
                        you ever, in your whole life, heard of anything more stupid? Apparently the
                        idea was conceived in Holland, where everyone is on drugs and drives slowly
                        anyway.² It was indeed pioneered in the Netherlands, but by the soberest of
                        traffic planners, who claim success in significantly reducing accidents.

                        The concept of the naked street was spearheaded by the Netherlands, where
                        traffic lights and markings have been stripped from several junctions in
                        recent years.
                        [Denver Post, 14 Feb. 2005]


                        In the Danish city of Christiansfeld, a busy intersection known for traffic
                        jams and accidents was given the naked street treatment four years ago.
                        Since then, there have been no fatal accidents.
                        [Australian, 10 Feb. 2005]


                        Best

                        Simon


                        > From: "J.H. Crawford" <mailbox@...>
                        > Reply-To: <carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com>
                        > Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2006 16:57:45 +0000
                        > To: <carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com>
                        > Subject: RE: [carfree_cities] Re: Jaywalking is good for cities
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >> This is a great discussion. I think there must be other terms in the
                        >> US-english strictly related to auto-centric views, which are not found in
                        >> other languages. I fully agree with the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis. Language
                        >> constructs reality. Thanks for the comment!
                        >
                        > and reality constructs language
                        >
                        >
                        > ----- ### -----
                        > J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
                        > mailbox@... http://www.carfree.com
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • Lloyd Wright
                        One small suggestion regarding naked streets . The person attributed with developing the idea, Hans Monderman, tends to use the term shared space rather
                        Message 11 of 13 , Mar 3, 2006
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                          One small suggestion regarding "naked streets". The person attributed with
                          developing the idea, Hans Monderman, tends to use the term "shared space"
                          rather than "naked streets". I think that "shared space" is probably a
                          slightly more marketable name. I have also heard it called "post traffic
                          calming" and "third-generation traffic calming". However, it seems that the
                          people who have worked hard to make the concept a reality seem to prefer
                          "shared space". There is a Wikipedia entry for shared space, if anyone is
                          interested:

                          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shared_space

                          Best,

                          Lloyd

                          ------ Original Message ------
                          Received: Fri, 03 Mar 2006 12:17:02 PM EST
                          From: Simon Baddeley <s.j.baddeley@...>
                          To: Carfree Cities <carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com>
                          Subject: Re: [carfree_cities] Re: Jaywalking is good for cities

                          of the paragraph headed "Driver cooperation" where reference might be made to
                          mutual cooperation among ALL road users as encouraged by "naked streets" - and
                          indeed give a link to examples of this idea which has behind it the idea of no
                          traffic exceeding 17mph in order to allow negotiation between different road
                          users via eye contact.
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