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Re: Surprisingly, parts of LA are walkable

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  • turpin
    ... Sometimes. Not always. Some states and counties have laws or ordinances that keep the shoreline open to the public. In these areas, all buildings are set
    Message 1 of 12 , Jun 13, 2002
      --- In carfree_cities@y..., "powerwalker" <exqmtl@a...> wrote:
      > I've never been there, but I guess it's possible
      > to walk or cycle long distances throughout cities
      > and states.

      Sometimes. Not always. Some states and
      counties have laws or ordinances that
      keep the shoreline open to the public.
      In these areas, all buildings are set
      away from the shoreline, and you can
      walk without interruption for miles
      and miles. In other areas, property
      runs to the shoreline, buildings have
      been located close to the water, and
      fences or other barriers prevent you
      from walking across private beach.
      This creates a shore that is divided
      into a series of small private lots,
      and sometimes guests at one hotel are
      prevented from walking the six blocks
      to a hotel down the beach, to visit
      someone there.

      Beach erosion is also an issue to
      shoreline development. The taxpayers
      have spent hundreds of millions of
      dollars trying to save or to restore
      shorelines that have been destroyed
      by development too close to a beach,
      or on a barrier island, which by
      nature is a moving target. Barriers
      that hotels put up to protect their
      own structures increase erosion
      downstream. There has been a lot of
      research into this issue, many
      papers, and some good books, but
      knowledge has little role in
      politics when big money is on the
      table, and the taxpayer is available
      to protect private investments.

      Myrtle Beach, South Carolina,
      exemplifies the worst combination
      of sprawl and bad beach construction.
    • J.H. Crawford
      Hi, The reason for my reaction is that there are any number of bicycle-oriented lists and web sites where this sort of thing is the standard fare for
      Message 2 of 12 , Jun 13, 2002
        Hi,

        The reason for my reaction is that there are any number of
        bicycle-oriented lists and web sites where this sort of thing
        is the standard fare for discussion. I'm sure that lots of
        good advice is available from them.

        We're trying to stay fairly focused here on things that are
        uniquely relevant to the issue of carfree cities. We do
        sometimes wander a little too deeply into the public transport
        disucssions, but there are far fewer venues for the practical
        issues of better public transport (there's no shortage of
        sites on train spotting).

        Hope this helps.

        Regards,


        > Hi Joel - thanks for the link. However, I wonder how discussing every aspect of public transport fits better into this carfree cities list than bicycles? If I take my kid and self out of a car and put us on a bike instead, doesn't that attribute to making my city car free, which is the topic of this list? -Just trying to get a handle on the proper discussion...
        >thanks, Elena
        > "J.H. Crawford" <mailbox@...> wrote:
        >Hi,
        >
        >This is not really a suitable venue for this discussion. Please see
        >the bicycle-related links at:
        >
        >http://www.carfree.com/link/fbik.html
        >
        >for better places to look.
        >
        >Thanks, and do keep on bikin'
        >
        >Regards,
        >
        >
        >> I am looking into buying a bike carrier for my 9-month-old. My research has come up with a trailer that attaches behind the bike, a seat that goes on the rear of the bike, or a seat that hooks onto the handle bars (a brand called BoBike). From this group's experience of traveling by bike with child, which method is safest, least expensive, etc.?
        >>thanks, Elena
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >>---------------------------------
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        >>Sign-up for Video Highlights of 2002 FIFA World Cup
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        >>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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        >>
        >>
        >
        >
        >-- ### --
        >
        >J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
        >mailbox@... Carfree.com
        >
        >
        >To Post a message, send it to: carfree_cities@...
        >To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: carfree_cities-unsubscribe@...
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        >
        >
        >
        >
        >---------------------------------
        >Do You Yahoo!?
        >Sign-up for Video Highlights of 2002 FIFA World Cup
        >
        >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >To Post a message, send it to: carfree_cities@...
        >To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: carfree_cities-unsubscribe@...
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        >
        >


        -- ### --

        J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
        mailbox@... Carfree.com
      • RIIN GILL
        Elena, I recommend the commute-logistics list. You can subscribe by sending an email to commute-logistics-subscribe@topica.com.
        Message 3 of 12 , Jun 13, 2002
          Elena, I recommend the commute-logistics list. You can subscribe by
          sending an email to commute-logistics-subscribe@....

          ***********************************************************
          Riin Gill
          Interlibrary Loan 734-615-6168
          Taubman Medical Library fax 734-763-1473
          University of Michigan
          ***********************************************************
          If you were riding your bike, you'd be having fun by now.

          On Thu, 13 Jun 2002, J.H. Crawford wrote:

          >
          > Hi,
          >
          > The reason for my reaction is that there are any number of
          > bicycle-oriented lists and web sites where this sort of thing
          > is the standard fare for discussion. I'm sure that lots of
          > good advice is available from them.
          >
          > We're trying to stay fairly focused here on things that are
          > uniquely relevant to the issue of carfree cities. We do
          > sometimes wander a little too deeply into the public transport
          > disucssions, but there are far fewer venues for the practical
          > issues of better public transport (there's no shortage of
          > sites on train spotting).
          >
          > Hope this helps.
          >
          > Regards,
          >
          >
          > > Hi Joel - thanks for the link. However, I wonder how discussing every aspect of public transport fits better into this carfree cities list than bicycles? If I take my kid and self out of a car and put us on a bike instead, doesn't that attribute to making my city car free, which is the topic of this list? -Just trying to get a handle on the proper discussion...
          > >thanks, Elena
          > > "J.H. Crawford" <mailbox@...> wrote:
          > >Hi,
          > >
          > >This is not really a suitable venue for this discussion. Please see
          > >the bicycle-related links at:
          > >
          > >http://www.carfree.com/link/fbik.html
          > >
          > >for better places to look.
          > >
          > >Thanks, and do keep on bikin'
          > >
          > >Regards,
          > >
          > >
          > >> I am looking into buying a bike carrier for my 9-month-old. My research has come up with a trailer that attaches behind the bike, a seat that goes on the rear of the bike, or a seat that hooks onto the handle bars (a brand called BoBike). From this group's experience of traveling by bike with child, which method is safest, least expensive, etc.?
          > >>thanks, Elena
          > >>
          > >>
          > >>
          > >>---------------------------------
          > >>Do You Yahoo!?
          > >>Sign-up for Video Highlights of 2002 FIFA World Cup
          > >>
          > >>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          > >>
          > >>
          > >>To Post a message, send it to: carfree_cities@...
          > >>To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: carfree_cities-unsubscribe@...
          > >>Group address: http://www.egroups.com/group/carfree_cities/
          > >>
          > >>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          > >>
          > >>
          > >>
          > >
          > >
          > >-- ### --
          > >
          > >J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
          > >mailbox@... Carfree.com
          > >
          > >
          > >To Post a message, send it to: carfree_cities@...
          > >To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: carfree_cities-unsubscribe@...
          > >Group address: http://www.egroups.com/group/carfree_cities/
          > >
          > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >---------------------------------
          > >Do You Yahoo!?
          > >Sign-up for Video Highlights of 2002 FIFA World Cup
          > >
          > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          > >
          > >
          > >To Post a message, send it to: carfree_cities@...
          > >To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: carfree_cities-unsubscribe@...
          > >Group address: http://www.egroups.com/group/carfree_cities/
          > >
          > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          > -- ### --
          >
          > J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
          > mailbox@... Carfree.com
          >
          >
          > To Post a message, send it to: carfree_cities@...
          > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: carfree_cities-unsubscribe@...
          > Group address: http://www.egroups.com/group/carfree_cities/
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          >
          >
        • powerwalker
          ... In these cases, are the buildings set away from the beach accessible, from the beach, with no car road to cross? ... Then it s more problematic, but at
          Message 4 of 12 , Jun 13, 2002
            >
            > --- In carfree_cities@y..., "powerwalker" <exqmtl@a...> wrote:
            > > I've never been there, but I guess it's possible
            > > to walk or cycle long distances throughout cities
            > > and states.
            >
            > Sometimes. Not always. Some states and
            > counties have laws or ordinances that
            > keep the shoreline open to the public.
            > In these areas, all buildings are set
            > away from the shoreline, and you can
            > walk without interruption for miles
            > and miles. In other areas, property
            In these cases, are the buildings set away from the
            beach accessible, from the beach, with no car road
            to cross?

            > runs to the shoreline, buildings have
            > been located close to the water, and
            > fences or other barriers prevent you
            > from walking across private beach.
            > This creates a shore that is divided
            > into a series of small private lots,
            Then it's more problematic, but at least you
            can walk in front of these private lots, and
            return to the shore after, provided there are
            not too many.

            > and sometimes guests at one hotel are
            > prevented from walking the six blocks
            > to a hotel down the beach, to visit
            > someone there.
            That's bad. But maybe they could go by boat, by the
            water, or just swim, assuming they can't fence the
            waterfront and they fence both sides only.

            Knowing you have a hotel along the beach at, say 3-4 hours (walking) of each
            other, one could plan a tour
            and become a customer of each hotel in turn.

            Are there campsites too, or is free camping allowed? It
            would be nice to pop up
            a small tent to spend one night near a beach, before
            continuing your route the next day. Some tents
            are so compact you can carry them in a backpack.


            Louis-Luc
          • T. J. Binkley
            ... Near a few piers and short boardwalks, yes. Most of the Southern California coast, however, is lined with parking lots and private residences. Cyclists
            Message 5 of 12 , Jun 14, 2002
              >
              >Are there many restaurants, hotels, groceries, shops, entertaining
              >businesses,... directly accessible by the beach, with no car traffic to
              >cross? If so that would make another possibility for a carfree vacation
              >trip.

              Near a few piers and short boardwalks, yes. Most of the Southern
              California coast, however, is lined with parking lots and private
              residences. Cyclists routinely use the Pacific Coast Highway, which runs
              most of the length of the state, and a good bike path runs from roughly
              Santa Monica down to Long Beach, perhaps further south, in LA County.

              There are hotels and bike rental outfits in Ventura, as well as a coastal
              bike path that connects to a bike/equestrian path that leads 16 miles
              inland to neighboring Ojai.


              -T.J.
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