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RE: [carfree_cities] Segway / Ginger

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  • Lanyon, Ryan
    Personally, I was very disappointed with the release of the Segway. My immediate reaction is not that it will replace car trips, but that it will replace
    Message 1 of 4 , Dec 4, 2001
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      Personally, I was very disappointed with the release of the Segway. My
      immediate reaction is not that it will replace car trips, but that it will
      replace pedestrian trips (including postal carriers). In a society already
      battling to increase participation in active transportation, this is not
      good.

      The Segway offers no benefits to a motorist that are not provided by a car,
      except for economy and emissions. The Segway has no protection from the
      elements, little capacity to bring goods, no 'luxuries' that have become so
      ingrained into car and convenience culture. These factors are significant
      barriers to first adopting use and then altering the built environment to
      suit it.

      With current conditions, those who drive in downtown areas do so because
      they come from far away and 'need' their car to get there, so they continue
      through in their vehicles (public transit is the obvious 'alternative' to
      this). Those who live closer already walk or cycle or use public transit -
      should these trips be replaced by the Segway?

      The likelihood of drivers parking outside of downtown and Segwaying is
      slightly better than parking and walking - but again, the pedestrian trip is
      replaced moreso than the auto trip. The fact that the manufacturer is
      lobbying to permit these on sidewalks is proof positive of the real intended
      market.

      I don't see these as being any different than Razor Scooters. Nifty, neat,
      trendy and then back to the garage. The technology used, however, could be
      the real benefit. The product may also work wonders for providing mobility
      to the physically disabled.

      -RL

      > Message: 1
      > Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2001 12:02:49 +0000
      > From: "J.H. Crawford" <postmaster@...>
      > Subject: Segway
      >
      >
      > Well, the curtain has finally been lifted from all the hype.
      >
      > "Ginger," AKA "it" is the Segway:
      >
      > http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,186660-1,00.html
      >
      > To say that this has major implications is an understatement.
      >
    • Boileau,Pierre [NCR]
      I agree with your point Ryan, The video even states that the Segway is intended to replace/improve walking. With a top speed of 12 mph, 15 mile battery and
      Message 2 of 4 , Dec 4, 2001
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        I agree with your point Ryan,

        The video even states that the Segway is intended to replace/improve
        walking. With a top speed of 12 mph, 15 mile battery and $5000 Canadian
        price tag, I would see this as being difficult to apply to a carfree city
        environment.

        1. If the Segway were used to provide transportation to the folks on the
        outskirts of the city districts, so that these districts could be bigger,
        where would we park these thousands of Segway's at the metro station?

        2. How would we ensure that these fairly expensive modes of transportation
        would be secured. Dutch bicycles are not typically worth stealing, but
        these Segway's might be.

        Any thoughts welcome,

        Pierre.

        -----Original Message-----
        From: Lanyon, Ryan [mailto:ryan.lanyon@...]
        Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2001 1:20 PM
        To: 'carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com'
        Subject: RE: [carfree_cities] Segway / Ginger


        Personally, I was very disappointed with the release of the Segway. My
        immediate reaction is not that it will replace car trips, but that it will
        replace pedestrian trips (including postal carriers). In a society already
        battling to increase participation in active transportation, this is not
        good.


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • J.H. Crawford
        ... If they become popular, I expect the price to fall below US$1000. ... As I noted in an earlier post, they re much easier to park than bikes, which are
        Message 3 of 4 , Dec 4, 2001
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          Pierre said:

          >I agree with your point Ryan,
          >
          >The video even states that the Segway is intended to replace/improve
          >walking. With a top speed of 12 mph, 15 mile battery and $5000 Canadian
          >price tag, I would see this as being difficult to apply to a carfree city
          >environment.

          If they become popular, I expect the price to fall below US$1000.

          >1. If the Segway were used to provide transportation to the folks on the
          >outskirts of the city districts, so that these districts could be bigger,
          >where would we park these thousands of Segway's at the metro station?

          As I noted in an earlier post, they're much easier to park than bikes,
          which are parked in huge numbers at Dutch RR stations. Also, you CAN
          take it with you, for use at the other end.

          >2. How would we ensure that these fairly expensive modes of transportation
          >would be secured. Dutch bicycles are not typically worth stealing, but
          >these Segway's might be.

          They're apparently password-protected or some such. And Dutch bikes
          ARE stolen, in huge numbers.

          I see serious problems here, but at the same time, I think I see
          some opportunities. At least people on Segways are participating
          in the street environment, and they're not sealed up in a cocoon.
          True, you don't get the exercize you need, but in really hot climates,
          most people will see this as a boon.

          The big problem is whether or not they'll be allowed to terrorize
          pedestrians on the sidewalks.



          -- ### --

          J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
          postmaster@... Carfree.com
        • Mark Rauterkus
          Hi All, Some of these quotes are killers. ... Same as saying a $10 bill has no benefit over a $1,000 bill except economy. I dare say economy and environment
          Message 4 of 4 , Dec 7, 2001
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            Hi All,

            Some of these quotes are killers.

            > The Segway offers no benefits to a motorist that are not provided by a car,
            > except for economy and emissions.

            Same as saying a $10 bill has no benefit over a $1,000 bill except economy.

            I dare say economy and environment are not exceptions that can be
            discounted. No benefits except ... -- was that a joke?

            > The Segway has no protection from the
            > elements, little capacity to bring goods, no 'luxuries' that have become so
            > ingrained into car and convenience culture. These factors are significant
            > barriers to first adopting use and then altering the built environment to
            > suit it.

            So, you wanted a more expensive -- more luxuries -- alternative. Well then,
            the economy is NOT a motivator for you then.

            > With current conditions, those who drive in downtown areas do so because
            > they come from far away and 'need' their car to get there, so they continue
            > through in their vehicles (public transit is the obvious 'alternative' to
            > this). Those who live closer already walk or cycle or use public transit -
            > should these trips be replaced by the Segway?

            I think you are wrong. Many cars in downtown areas are from locals.

            > The likelihood of drivers parking outside of downtown and Segwaying is
            > slightly better than parking and walking - but again, the pedestrian trip is
            > replaced moreso than the auto trip.

            Very good point.

            However, a car-free downtown is a benefit.

            > The fact that the manufacturer is
            > lobbying to permit these on sidewalks is proof positive of the real intended
            > market.

            Could we say a "lobby" effort has been made on the roll-out?
            Intentions mean little in the real world however.



            Ta.


            Mark Rauterkus
            Mark@... http://Rauterkus.com
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