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The case for the Monorail

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  • cjb121@york.ac.uk
    Monorails are popular with riders, which is important if people are ever going to give up their beloved cars. In 1990, the voters of Los Angeles were asked in
    Message 1 of 9 , Feb 27, 2001
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      Monorails are popular with riders, which is important if people are
      ever going to give up their beloved cars. In 1990, the voters of
      Los Angeles were asked in a referendum to select their preferred mode
      of transit for the San Fernando Valley Line. The results were:
      * 10 percent preferred the extension of subway heavy rail.
      * 21 percent preferred light rail.
      * 21 percent preferred no rail.
      * 48 percent preferred monorail.

      Monorail track is MUCH cheaper to build than a subway. Although
      monorail trains do cost more to maintain than subway trains, the
      track itself needs much less maintenence. As well as saving money,
      less track maintenence means a more reliable service.

      Monorail trains are very quiet as they run on tyres. They can
      therefore easily run through the middle of districts.

      Modern tracks feature heating coils, so snow and ice do not stop the
      trains.

      Running a 2-story monorail through a 4-story district does not affect
      the skyline. Tracks can also be covered in mirrors to further reduce
      their visual impact on the surroundings. You can even have only a
      single track for both directions, with trains passing at stations.
    • Doug Salzmann
      ... Monorails may not effect the skyline for distant viewers, but they thoroughly destroy the public realm in the neighborhoods they run through. Not In My
      Message 2 of 9 , Feb 27, 2001
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        At 08:05 AM 2/27/2001, cjb121@... wrote:

        >Running a 2-story monorail through a 4-story district does not affect
        >the skyline. Tracks can also be covered in mirrors to further reduce
        >their visual impact on the surroundings.


        Monorails may not effect the "skyline" for distant viewers, but they
        thoroughly destroy the public realm in the neighborhoods they run through.

        Not In My Back Yard, please, or anywhere else people live and work.

        The only effective way to adequately mitigate the visual (and consequent
        neighborhood) blight created by elevated trains of any kind is not to build
        them.

        -Doug
      • Mike Lacey
        I suppose a monorail might be OK if it was at street level or better still underground. (The Skytrain in Vancouver runs underground for its last two stops).
        Message 3 of 9 , Feb 27, 2001
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          I suppose a monorail might be OK if it was at street level or better
          still underground. (The Skytrain in Vancouver runs underground for
          its last two stops).

          Elevated tracks? No way.

          Monorail boosters would do their case some good if they didn't assume
          the tracks would be elevated. Why the association between monorail
          and elevated tracks? I blame Disney

          Mike

          --- In carfree_cities@y..., cjb121@y... wrote:
          > Monorails are popular with riders, which is important if people are
          > ever going to give up their beloved cars. In 1990, the voters of
          > Los Angeles were asked in a referendum to select their preferred
          mode
          > of transit for the San Fernando Valley Line. The results were:
          > * 10 percent preferred the extension of subway heavy rail.
          > * 21 percent preferred light rail.
          > * 21 percent preferred no rail.
          > * 48 percent preferred monorail.
          >
          > Monorail track is MUCH cheaper to build than a subway. Although
          > monorail trains do cost more to maintain than subway trains, the
          > track itself needs much less maintenence. As well as saving money,
          > less track maintenence means a more reliable service.
          >
          > Monorail trains are very quiet as they run on tyres. They can
          > therefore easily run through the middle of districts.
          >
          > Modern tracks feature heating coils, so snow and ice do not stop
          the
          > trains.
          >
          > Running a 2-story monorail through a 4-story district does not
          affect
          > the skyline. Tracks can also be covered in mirrors to further
          reduce
          > their visual impact on the surroundings. You can even have only a
          > single track for both directions, with trains passing at stations.
        • Ronald Dawson
          ... Could it be part of the cool factor? http://www.erha.org/seveneras.htm ... Hopefully, but there are also questions of what kind of operations and
          Message 4 of 9 , Feb 27, 2001
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            cjb121@... wrote:
            >Monorails are popular with riders, which is important if people are
            >ever going to give up their beloved cars. In 1990, the voters of
            >Los Angeles were asked in a referendum to select their preferred mode
            >of transit for the San Fernando Valley Line. The results were:
            >* 10 percent preferred the extension of subway heavy rail.
            >* 21 percent preferred light rail.
            >* 21 percent preferred no rail.
            >* 48 percent preferred monorail.

            Could it be part of the "cool" factor? http://www.erha.org/seveneras.htm

            >Monorail track is MUCH cheaper to build than a subway. Although
            >monorail trains do cost more to maintain than subway trains, the
            >track itself needs much less maintenence. As well as saving money,
            >less track maintenence means a more reliable service.

            Hopefully, but there are also questions of what kind of operations and
            services you want to provide. In San Diego when the LRV's aren't running at
            night, some of the lines are used by freight trains.

            >Monorail trains are very quiet as they run on tyres. They can
            >therefore easily run through the middle of districts.

            Montreal's metro also runs on tires (and steel wheels)
            http://www.emdx.org/rail/metro/principeE.html , but there are also monorails
            that run on steel wheels. http://www.lightrail.co.uk/wsw/

            >Modern tracks feature heating coils, so snow and ice do not stop the
            >trains.

            Suspended monorails with enclosed track wouldn't need these.

            >Running a 2-story monorail through a 4-story district does not affect
            >the skyline. Tracks can also be covered in mirrors to further reduce
            >their visual impact on the surroundings. You can even have only a
            >single track for both directions, with trains passing at stations.

            Monorails do have their niche, but what it is, I do not know. Though I've
            heard that in Japan they have been quite successful, but I don't have to
            many details.
            Dawson







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          • duane cuthbertson
            I have to say that i agree with Doug. Every city that I think of with an elevated transportation corridor (be it LRT, MONO, or highway) sucks underneath. All
            Message 5 of 9 , Feb 27, 2001
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              I have to say that i agree with Doug. Every city that I think of with an
              elevated transportation corridor (be it LRT, MONO, or highway) sucks
              underneath. All the ghetto situations that you see on TV tend to have els
              running through their neighborhood, isn't that the kind of neighborhood that
              'Rocky' came from? In my city, Underneath the elevated highways is for the
              homeless. I know that Chicago's el is successful but I can remember seeing
              some not so pretty sights even under it. Are there any elevated systems in
              Europe? I can't remember seeing or riding any.

              Duane


              >From: Doug Salzmann <doug@...>
              >Reply-To: carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com
              >To: carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com
              >Subject: Re: [carfree_cities] The case for the Monorail
              >Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 08:46:20 -0800
              >
              >At 08:05 AM 2/27/2001, cjb121@... wrote:
              >
              > >Running a 2-story monorail through a 4-story district does not affect
              > >the skyline. Tracks can also be covered in mirrors to further reduce
              > >their visual impact on the surroundings.
              >
              >
              >Monorails may not effect the "skyline" for distant viewers, but they
              >thoroughly destroy the public realm in the neighborhoods they run through.
              >
              >Not In My Back Yard, please, or anywhere else people live and work.
              >
              >The only effective way to adequately mitigate the visual (and consequent
              >neighborhood) blight created by elevated trains of any kind is not to build
              >them.
              >
              > -Doug
              >
              >
              >
              >To Post a message, send it to: carfree_cities@...
              >To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
              >carfree_cities-unsubscribe@...
              >Group address: http://www.egroups.com/group/carfree_cities/
              >
              >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
              >

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            • J.H. Crawford
              ... The only one I can recall is the one in Wuppertal, which is about 100 years old. It most runs above a shipping channel, and it s ugly beyond words. ###
              Message 6 of 9 , Feb 28, 2001
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                Duane said:

                >I have to say that i agree with Doug. Every city that I think of with an
                >elevated transportation corridor (be it LRT, MONO, or highway) sucks
                >underneath. All the ghetto situations that you see on TV tend to have els
                >running through their neighborhood, isn't that the kind of neighborhood that
                >'Rocky' came from? In my city, Underneath the elevated highways is for the
                >homeless. I know that Chicago's el is successful but I can remember seeing
                >some not so pretty sights even under it. Are there any elevated systems in
                >Europe? I can't remember seeing or riding any.

                The only one I can recall is the one in Wuppertal, which is about
                100 years old. It most runs above a shipping channel, and it's
                ugly beyond words.


                ###

                J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
                postmaster@... Carfree.com
              • Mike Lacey
                ... Are there any elevated systems in Europe? I can t remember seeing or riding any. Paris has a fairly big section of elevated metro, mainly through the
                Message 7 of 9 , Feb 28, 2001
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                  --- In carfree_cities@y..., "duane cuthbertson" <dcuthber@h...> wrote:
                  Are there any elevated systems in Europe? I can't remember seeing or
                  riding any.

                  Paris has a fairly big section of elevated metro, mainly through the
                  poorer neighborhoods

                  >
                  > Duane
                  >
                  >
                  > >From: Doug Salzmann <doug@t...>
                  > >Reply-To: carfree_cities@y...
                  > >To: carfree_cities@y...
                  > >Subject: Re: [carfree_cities] The case for the Monorail
                  > >Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 08:46:20 -0800
                  > >
                  > >At 08:05 AM 2/27/2001, cjb121@y... wrote:
                  > >
                  > > >Running a 2-story monorail through a 4-story district does not
                  affect
                  > > >the skyline. Tracks can also be covered in mirrors to further
                  reduce
                  > > >their visual impact on the surroundings.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >Monorails may not effect the "skyline" for distant viewers, but
                  they
                  > >thoroughly destroy the public realm in the neighborhoods they run
                  through.
                  > >
                  > >Not In My Back Yard, please, or anywhere else people live and work.
                  > >
                  > >The only effective way to adequately mitigate the visual (and
                  consequent
                  > >neighborhood) blight created by elevated trains of any kind is not
                  to build
                  > >them.
                  > >
                  > > -Doug
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >To Post a message, send it to: carfree_cities@e...
                  > >To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
                  > >carfree_cities-unsubscribe@e...
                  > >Group address: http://www.egroups.com/group/carfree_cities/
                  > >
                  > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                  http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  > _________________________________________________________________
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                • J.H. Crawford
                  I shot my mouth off when I said that Wuppertal was the only one I knew of. I actually have several examples right here in Amsterdam. I was thinking, in fact,
                  Message 8 of 9 , Feb 28, 2001
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                    I shot my mouth off when I said that Wuppertal was the only one
                    I knew of. I actually have several examples right here in
                    Amsterdam. I was thinking, in fact, only of center cities,
                    where overhead systems ARE fairly uncommon; the newer parts
                    of these cities often have some above-ground metro.

                    Still doesn't make it a good idea, though.

                    >--- In carfree_cities@y..., "duane cuthbertson" <dcuthber@h...> wrote:
                    >Are there any elevated systems in Europe? I can't remember seeing or
                    >riding any.
                    >
                    >Paris has a fairly big section of elevated metro, mainly through the
                    >poorer neighborhoods
                    >
                    >>
                    >> Duane
                    >>



                    ###

                    J.H. Crawford Carfree Cities
                    postmaster@... Carfree.com
                  • Richard Risemberg
                    ... Some of the Metro lines in Paris run as elevateds for a while. Really quite charming, but Paris is different. Richard -- Richard Risemberg
                    Message 9 of 9 , Feb 28, 2001
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                      duane cuthbertson wrote:
                      >
                      > I have to say that i agree with Doug. Every city that I think of with an
                      > elevated transportation corridor (be it LRT, MONO, or highway) sucks
                      > underneath. All the ghetto situations that you see on TV tend to have els
                      > running through their neighborhood, isn't that the kind of neighborhood that
                      > 'Rocky' came from? In my city, Underneath the elevated highways is for the
                      > homeless. I know that Chicago's el is successful but I can remember seeing
                      > some not so pretty sights even under it. Are there any elevated systems in
                      > Europe? I can't remember seeing or riding any.

                      Some of the Metro lines in Paris run as elevateds for a while. Really
                      quite charming, but Paris is different.

                      Richard
                      --
                      Richard Risemberg
                      http://www.living-room.org
                      http://www.newcolonist.com

                      "Life is complicated and not for the timid."
                      Garrison Keillor
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