Re: [carfree_cities] Re: Cheaper to drive their cars to work than take public transport
> One objection I've heard to carfree/urban living is that it=v= Bear in mind that NYC is a singularity, and thus not exactly
> would turn into NYC--not affordable unless you live in a very
> small space.
the best example to apply. So many variables involved there.
=v= That said, Manhattan is only one of NYC's five boroughs.
I think carfree living in still-affordable parts of Brooklyn
and the Bronx are a better model than Manhattan.
Save Zeeba! Jeffy is God!
- In North Africa, where carfree areas (medinas) of substantial size exist in
most cities, the carfree areas include a mix of income levels, from very
poor to very rich. This is true even in cities with a population of over 1
million. Of course the local and national economic situations have a lot to
do with it, and the fact that carfree areas aren't seen as a luxury. In some
cases they are even run down.
But in a large North American city, there is no reason why all carfree areas
would need to be in or near the city center, as Jym said. It is possible to
strengthen and revitalize neighborhood centers by making them carfree. If
this is done frequently enough and carfree areas become more commonplace,
the cost of living in such places could drop. Or more proactively, city
councils and planning departments could require that affordable housing be
included in such projects. And of course if car owners were not allowed to
live in the carfree areas, the prices could also drop for that reason.
To answer your question more directly, I do know of a large optically
carfree residential area in Berlin where rents are probably not very high.
We visited it during the Towards Carfree Cities IV conference. I say
"optically carfree" because it includes quite a bit of underground car
parking. Markus Heller, who is on this list, would have more information.
Matt Hohmeister wrote:
> That brings up an interesting point with carfree cities. Does anyoneout there know of a carfree area in an at least midsized city (over
100k) that has reasonable property values? One objection I've heard to
carfree/urban living is that it would turn into NYC--not affordable
unless you live in a very small space.
> As a reference point, Tallahassee's population is 159k (337k MSA), andwe're paying $1050 monthly for 1800 square feet, a few blocks from
WORLD CARFREE NETWORK
home address: 20 Gale Lane
Acomb, York YO24 3BB, U.K.
tel: +(44) 1904 796860
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- In Asia also, I have walked through some lovely
neighborhoods of narrow lanes, particularly in Dhaka
and Kathmandu, no cars, very colorful and vivid street
life, vendors with bicycle carts, kids playing in the
streets, very quiet (the occasional motorbike hardly
compensates for constant honking!). They are indeed
low-income neighborhoods, and I doubt the residents
realize how lucky they are (poor ventilation,
crowding, etc. etc.).
In Dhaka we chose a lower income neighborhood to live
in; directly across the main street the rents are
higher, the streets wider, the cars far more abundant,
and thus the noise that much worse. There are still
cars where we live, and as a result the only people I
know are not the residents of the buildings but the
guards, vendors, students, and beggars.
The problem, again, is that nobody in these
neighborhoods seems to see carfree as a good
thing...yet anyway...so it seems there are two angles
to approach, highlighting the advantages of already
carfree areas, and making them widespread enough that
the rents can't always be atrociously high when people
DO realize the benefits. ??
--- Randall Ghent <rghent@...> wrote:
> In North Africa, where carfree areas (medinas) of____________________________________________________________________________________
> substantial size exist in
> most cities, the carfree areas include a mix of
> income levels, from very
> poor to very rich.
Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online.
- Regarding Debra's post on low-income carfree areas and her remark that
"nobody in these neighborhoods seems to see carfree as a good thing..",
I'm reproducing the following paragraph from a nice book I'm reading
(full reference at the end):
"So it is with this village. Its ecological and peaceful way of living
is unconsciously won and thus is vulnerable to the winds of change that
fan the latent desires of its people. Even now there is a familiar
though jarring note in this sylvian village scene. The sounds of static
and that impersonal professional voice of another civilization - the
radio announcer- cut through the harmony of sounds as a young man of the
village holding a portable radio to his ear comes around a bend. On his
arm there is a silver wristwatch, which sparkles in the sun. He looks at
me proudly as he passes. And a wave of understanding passes through me.
Just behind that radio and wristwatch comes an army of desires that for
centuries have gone untested and untasted. As material growth and
technological change activate these yearnings, they will transform the
hearts, minds, work, and daily life of this village within a generation
Elgin, Duane (1981/1993 ). Voluntary Simplicity. New York: Harper. pp 14-15.