Re: [carfree_network] The Chicken-and-egg issues of sprawl; the high price of living in the centre...: Land Trusts!!
- Here's the approach I'm looking into:
Land needs to be held in trust, by an organization with an earth care
ethic--and removed from the endless growth economy/speculation.
see my post at:
See also _Permaculture: A Designer's Manual_ by Bill Mollison, Chapter
14: Strategies for an Alternative Nation.
Right now, In San Diego, the activists and progressives are doing a
lot to make the city a better place to live.
Who benefits financially? Those who "own" land--Most of the activists
This is an important question.
http://j9k.org/pc TJ/SD permaculture gathering
2007/1/12, Todd Edelman <edelman@...>:
> Recently I think the following was posted on the Carfree Network list:
> Urban growth and cars: Chicken-and-egg issue
> By Elisabeth Rosenthal
> Full story:
> Carlos Pardo <carlos.pardo@...> reposted it on the Sustran list and
> "Its funny how it seems that people cant choose to live inside the cities"
> and I replied:
> "THE insides of cities in many cities in Europe are generally really
> expensive right now. This is a complicated problem directly related to all
> our sprawl and mobility discussions but I dont see enough discussion about
> it, never mind solutions."
> To which Lee Schipper <SCHIPPER@...> said:
> "Six years ago I raised this issue to the UITP guy selling the Millennium
> data base... why was there nothing about housing and land costs/rents
> etc. The insides of most Asian and L American cities are also expensive in
> the central, most desirable areas.
> The UITP answer was that this was a fiduciary problem, almost a fiction.
> In fact it is what drives sprawl. Land farther out is cheaper. Homes are
> larger. And in the densest of cities, living space is less than in the
> less dense cities. The World Bank's "Sustainable Transport" from 1996
> takes the Newman And Kenworthy data (which morphed into the Millennium
> data base) and looks at gasoline per capita vs housing space per capita,
> and voila.. those living in the cities with the highest NK "gasoline per
> capita" have the highest home area per capita and by implication from N
> and K the lowest population densities.
> Yet look at all the environmentalist generated blather on sprawl and you
> never see housing costs; how much more does it cost to live 100 m from a
> metro vs 1 km away? We hear about which people spend the most or least
> on transport, but not how much the same people spend on housing, yet we
> know that housing cost may be a more sensitive function of location than
> distance travelled.
> I am writing this from a hotel in Tokyo close to the center and some of
> the most expensive land in the world. And the Tokyo city residents who
> live near in without a car have less space/capita to live in than those in
> the rest of japan or even in the outer suburbs of Tokyo
> So in discussing sprawl, lets talk about what could be the main driving
> force, desire for living space. And let's remember in the US case tax
> deductions let us deduct all our mortgage interest from the home loan, in
> contrast to (more compact) Canada. Kinda makes you wonder whether in all
> of the studies of km we should have been studying square meters of home
> SOME thoughts:
> * More internalisation of the costs of transport will make living in the
> suburbs even more expensive relative to living in the centre, and it will
> effect construction costs, depending on where the materials and machines
> are coming from.
> * I propose that the green mobility people start talking about
> densification and the densification people start talking about its
> unintended effects :-)
> Seriously, this issue IS rarely mentioned, BUT sometime in the past six
> months or so someone on the Carfree Cities list mentioned they were
> working on it or familiar with some particular parts of it, and Joel
> Crawford recognized that the issue was important and asked for info...
> What became of that?
> Is there more research and real examples which people can share?
> On one hand it seems densification could lower prices as it will add
> housing units, but on the other it would make the neighbourhood more
> desirable (e.g. for self-selecting home-seekers, who are prepared to live
> in less space and carfree) which would counter that.
> Clearly, there are some "little piggy" issues here, as with getting people
> out of their cars: We spend lots of energy on creating alternatives to
> cars (and motorised two wheelers), and not enough on holistic and
> sustainable reasons why people should sacrifice (of course for many people
> the sacrifice is an illusion: it is only relative to their current overuse
> or resources) and simply be more responsible, i.e. lowering their
> ecological footprint to a reasonable level).
> So, this means people have to live in smaller homes, not just bigger homes
> for the same price further away. There are discounted loan programmes in
> some places for people that liver near transit hubs, and that may be a
> good start but it is certainly not enough, as the evidence shows.
> I would really like this issue to be a central theme of among other things
> the Towards Carfree Cities events in 2007 in Istanbul and 2008 in
> Portland, Oregon OR San Luis Potosi, Mexico. This means lots of outreach
> to urban planning and spatial planning specialists, and advisers to and
> people from public and even private housing loan entities, architects, and
> so on. Clearly we wont get too many people to help with this issue from
> UITP and other parts of the Green Mobility Mob, but of course they also
> have to participate. I spoke to middle-level person at UITP in the past
> year about this issue, and I think they are at least sensitive to it and
> possibly willing to listen, but they - and other large organisations -
> dont recruit staff who specialise in the issue... so we cant expect too
> much until our great arguments persuade them to expand their focus.
> Todd Edelman
> Green Idea Factory
> Korunní 72
> CZ-10100 Praha 10
> Czech Republic
> ++420 605 915 970
> Skype: toddedelman
> Green Idea Factory,
> a member of World Carfree Network
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