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8449Re: 20mph/30kph minimum

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  • Stefan Langeveld
    May 5 12:03 PM
      Chris,
      your wife made a crucial point. For all nowadays cars, 30 km/h is
      darn slow. So, even in those 30 km/h zones , 85% of cars go above
      that
      limit (research by road safety NGO), in spite of speed humps; they
      slow a car 'during' 15 meters or so.
      Cities will implement such zones (getting grants for this purpose),
      but will not evaluate effects.
      Converting to Tempo 30 streets, with or without signs, humps,
      campaign is clearly not enough.
      30 is an appropiate speed in built up areas, but even without
      touching the accelerator, cars will go faster.
      There are these remedies
      1. ISA
      2. Lane narrowing and/or meandering.
      3. NEVs (& various cycles of course), for inner city trips. In
      those, 30 km/h is a proper speed.
      Still not sure which is best. Both cost a lot (in time-to-achieve and
      money, although one can achieve a lot with (2:) strategic placement
      of blocks or cones that make a lane 2.0 m wide, before crossroads and
      highspeed stretches).


      --- In carfree_cities@yahoogroups.com, Todd Edelman
      <traintowardsthefuture@y...> wrote:
      > In a follow-up to my earlier message, my wife (the
      > driver in the
      > house) informed me that 20mph is about the slowest she
      > can drive for
      > extended periods. Does anyone else have anecdotal
      > evidence to support
      > that? I know it's the wrong list to ask, but perhaps
      > there are a few
      > recovered drivers out there. ;)
      >
      > Cheers,
      > ~chris
      >
      > Todd: 20mph or 30kph (30km) is the standard MAX.
      > operating speed for a growing number of built up areas
      > in European towns.
      >
      > Here is some info if you are new to this:
      >
      > "Tempo 30" campaign from VCD in Germany (in German,
      > use Babelfish or other translator):
      > www.vcd.org
      > click on "kampagnen" at top,
      > click on "Mehr Tempo 30" down the page...
      >
      > VCD is the alternative mobility assoc. in Germany to
      > ADAC and includes trains, bikes, even walking as part
      > of full hearty German offering of mobility.
      > +
      >
      > "Cycling: The way ahead" at
      > http://europa.eu.int/comm/environment/cycling/cycling_en.pdf
      >
      >
      > see pages 35 to 36 starting with "Combining safety
      > measures" and including very excellent graphs which
      > you should convert into mph as necessary for your own
      > purposes! No permission necessary, just polite mention
      > of source.
      >
      > --
      >
      > I once did a 30kph test with a friend in Prague in my
      > neighborhood. On level streets where speed limit is
      > normally 50kph 30 seemed slow (darn!) but problem was
      > going up a long hill, where car "didnt like" going
      > 30kph due to transmission ratios - it was revving too
      > high for 2nd gear... but 3rd would be a problem too.
      > This is for a manual transmission of course, which
      > almost all European cars have as standard.
      >
      > I dont understand the problem with anything under
      > 20/30 being a problem on level surfaces and automatic
      > transmissions. Probably American or all automobile
      > engineers dont really think anyone wants to go that
      > slow except in the parking lot, drive thru, or
      > automatic car wash, so they optimise throttle for
      > higher speeds.?
      >
      > I just thought of a idea related to this, but to find
      > out more you are gonna have to contact me OFF-LIST.
      > Hint: Cruise control.
      >
      > Todd, World Recovered Drivers Net(foot)work
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