Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

update

Expand Messages
  • John Enriquez Ada
    Hi Vip, I hope that you are doing fine. I have been thinking about the past topics that have been hinted before. Is the provincial gov t serious about
    Message 1 of 10 , Jun 1, 2007
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi Vip,
      I hope that you are doing fine. I have been thinking about the past
      topics that have been hinted before.

      Is the provincial gov't serious about researching the history of each
      town? How is it going so far?

      You mentioned about the boundaries of Daang Lungsod, who is doing this?

      Are you planning to map the genealogy of every family in Carcar? Maybe
      we can publish it.

      About the old houses, is the heritage group writing histories since
      the principal members are co-heirs of these houses.

      Do you know of diaries and old letters of Carcaranons? I hope there
      was a fanatic writer back then. It would be nice to have an idea of
      how it was in the past and to date certain traditions.

      take care,
      john
    • tcee15
      Hi Vip, I think the mapping of the genealogy of every family and/or the prominent personages of Carcar is an excellent idea to do. I am sure you will generate
      Message 2 of 10 , Jun 1, 2007
      • 0 Attachment
        Hi Vip,

        I think the mapping of the genealogy of every family and/or the
        prominent personages of Carcar is an excellent idea to do. I am sure
        you will generate a lot of support for this project.

        Take care,
        Tessa


        --- In carcarfamilies@yahoogroups.com, "John Enriquez Ada"
        <johneada@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi Vip,
        > I hope that you are doing fine. I have been thinking about the past
        > topics that have been hinted before.
        >
        > Is the provincial gov't serious about researching the history of
        each
        > town? How is it going so far?
        >
        > You mentioned about the boundaries of Daang Lungsod, who is doing
        this?
        >
        > Are you planning to map the genealogy of every family in Carcar?
        Maybe
        > we can publish it.
        >
        > About the old houses, is the heritage group writing histories since
        > the principal members are co-heirs of these houses.
        >
        > Do you know of diaries and old letters of Carcaranons? I hope there
        > was a fanatic writer back then. It would be nice to have an idea of
        > how it was in the past and to date certain traditions.
        >
        > take care,
        > john
        >
      • Peary Aleonar Jr.
        Before I even started anything with Carcar, I had discussed the idea with a historian who was all gung-ho about it. We figured it would take the approval and
        Message 3 of 10 , Jun 4, 2007
        • 0 Attachment
          Before I even started anything with Carcar, I had discussed the idea
          with a historian who was all gung-ho about it. We figured it would
          take the approval and cooperation of the Carcar parish priest and
          probably the support of the town and Carcar history society. We
          figured it would take at least a year to encode all the old books of
          Carcar (starting 1759) into a data base. This assuming a battery of
          volunteer encoders (I read about English towns where retired teachers
          volunteered to encode the records of their town). Plus of course a
          capable data base program and programmer and computers of course. A
          fuill-blown project as this would need the financial support of the
          govt (whichever) as well as foundation grant(s).

          And then I heard the Carcar church was now stingy about having its old
          books opened, and understandably so. Although they must also admit
          that the older books are really sturdier than the newer ones in terms
          of paper quality.

          This would even have been a self-liquidating project from fees
          collected on those interested on old records.

          So, I just decided to go ahead with my own Aleonar tree, which was
          really my original intention, but included bits of items that I could
          find involving Alegado and Barcelo families, which provide ancestral
          roots to the Aleonar family. The Alegado data touched on some Alfafara
          records and so on.

          But please remove the idea of me making a project involving EVERY
          family of the town, HOY! obviously there must be more than a hundred
          surnames in the town. The previous concept would have been more up to
          the task.

          If the Mormon church where I order and read the Carcar microfilms
          could be enticed to cooperate on the project, probably yes it can be
          done. But who's gonna do it?

          So it's just the bits and pieces that I once in a while share in our
          yahoogroup.
        • John Enriquez Ada
          Hi Vip, Are you talking about encoding the Carcar church records? The Convento already did it. Unfortunately, it contains wrong information. When we went to
          Message 4 of 10 , Jun 6, 2007
          • 0 Attachment
            Hi Vip,

            Are you talking about encoding the Carcar church records? The Convento already did it.
            Unfortunately, it contains wrong information. When we went to get the baptismal records
            of some relatives, the names were spelled wrong so they are useless to use for legal
            papers. The people working there are not from Carcar so they do not know that they got
            the names wrong. I remember during the 1980s when the books were open for anyone to
            flip through since I once just walked around after school and just started looking through
            the pages. How did the Mormons got all these information, I can't imagine all the churches
            readily opened their records to them. Is there another place that holds church records? I
            am also curious why the Carcar church records only date back to 1759.

            What would you say are the best books out there that touches on the history of Carcar and
            Cebu? Are these books readily available for purchase or the only limited copies are in
            repository libraries?

            I know it was difficult to get into genealogy. Thanks a bunch.

            john
          • Peary Aleonar Jr.
            Dear John and everyone interested in tediousness, I went to the convento sometime towards the end of last year to get 12 records for my family tree. These were
            Message 5 of 10 , Jun 6, 2007
            • 0 Attachment
              Dear John and everyone interested in tediousness,

              I went to the convento sometime towards the end of last year to get 12 records for my family tree. These were all 1800s and only one involving a Burial c. 1905.  I was of course willing to pay the fees for the certifications, as these are what the church will issue. I didn't really need a certification, I was only after the dates and other information but a certification would give weight to any genealogical research.

              The in-charge was on day-off but I was allowed to search the books. I found 9 of the records and with the clerk there bookmarked them to make it faster for the in-charge when he got back. I was then told to come back two days after when the in-charge would be back.

              I did as told and two days after the in-charge asked me to come back the next week. I went back the next week and he may have forgotten about it because he asked I come again the next week. I told him the clerk and I had bookmarked 9 of the requests and could I just have the 9? At even just P30 it would have been P270 for the parish. It was lunchtime and I was willing to come back in the afternoon but again he said next week.  I never went back.

              If they had encoded the records already, no need for me to have been allowed to open the books themselves and the in-charge could just have whipped the certifications in a minute. But no.

              Anyway, while I was there I had noticed a young man screened at the back on a computer, and I thought he was encoding the books. Maybe they're starting with the latter records.

              A carcaranon yahoogroup member had asked a Carcar programmer to analyze some records for the purpose of creating a data base program and he consulted me about it.

              I informed them that the old records contained not just the subjects but a wealth of historical information about Carcar of that period. You would also find there the names of the places/barrios (now sitios or barangays), the cabezas, and around 1870s already the names of the paternal and maternal grandparents.  Including the padrinos. You could virtually extract who were the cabezas in Carcar from the very start.

              All this would entail a data base of certainly more than 30 fields, and the programmer thought he'd get by with less than 10. It's because the present Baptismal Certificate would need only about 7 fields, plus extra ones for the sponsors.  I would divide the names to surnames and first names because the data base should be able to sort them by both fields, to make searches easier.

              Now on names. Before the Decree, the data base wouldn't know what to make of the names. Would Alejo Abillo (sometimes Alejo Xavillo or Xabillo or Jabillo-- your GGG-grandfather, later Alejo Alfafara) be filed under Alejo or Abillo? Very misleading that because some later used the first names and others the second. Especially the Marias!

              And did you notice the spellings I used? I can imagine the spelling of the names you got. But the data base should use the spelling found on the books, not the spelling the family later remembered him or her by, or even what the correct Spanish spelling is. Thus, there would be an individual named Alejo Abillo, another individual Alejo Xabillo, and so on and so forth.

              To illustrate, Filemon could be Filemon, Felimon, Filimon, Felemon, Philemon, Phelimon, Philimon, Phelemon--depending on the mood of the church clerk that day. If he had been gay, he'd even try on Sholemon, and nobody would be the wiser, because most of the parishioners could not read or write.

              Then picture yourself bringing those parish certifications with variant spellings for family members, and be told at a government agency to produce an affidavit from two disinterested persons that they knew the subject and attesting that the subject and the one in the 1860 certification is one and the same person.   Our rules are that funny, and the people implementing them are even funnier. They are horribly bookish at the same time that they had never read a book their entire lives.

              Mormons. I'm sure they microfilmed the Catholic parish records with the approval of the Catholic higher-ups. I understand that the agreement was for them to give a copy each to the Archdiocese of Manila, the National Archives and the UST Library.

              Hey, wherever you are, just locate a Mormon Family History reading center nearest you and you're on your way if you ever need a record. They may even observe better office hours and ours here in Cebu City. BTW, the Carcar records were filmed 1980, it said there on the film.

              History
              . I can only think of Pigafetta and Blair. Maybe, the Cebuano Studies Center in U of San Carlos could help. And I imagine Americans may have better collections of Philippine data than we have here anywhere in the country.

              The records starting only 1759 could be a clue to some possibilities: could be that's the year the parish transferred from Daanglungsod, or from the second one after Daanglungsod to this new one (pointing to another possibility that there could have been an original church structure before this present one which was built only 1860).

              Hey, enough, I'm not an authority AT ALL.

              Vip



            Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.