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Archive Regulations

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  • Debbie
    Philip, Well, this doesn t sound promising! I don t understand why we can t copy records that are more than 100 years old! These aren t church records! I am
    Message 1 of 15 , Sep 22, 2003
      Philip,
      Well, this doesn't sound promising! I don't understand why we can't copy
      records that are more than 100 years old! These aren't church records!

      I am sure someone on this list sent the link to the Polish Civil
      Archives Regulations in English. Evidently I kept the link for the
      Polish version. Will whomever sent the link for English, please do so
      again?
      http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html

      Thank you
      Debbie

      Philip Semanchuk wrote:
      > Hi all,
      > A Polish friend of mine sent me this email and it contains some valuable
      > info about researching in Przemys~l so I thought I'd forward it to the
      > group.
      >
    • Philip Semanchuk
      ... I see no reason for that either. Archival records are made available to the public 30 years after the date of their origin according to this page:
      Message 2 of 15 , Sep 22, 2003
        On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 14:13, Debbie wrote:
        > Philip,
        > Well, this doesn't sound promising! I don't understand why we can't copy
        > records that are more than 100 years old! These aren't church records!

        I see no reason for that either. "Archival records are made available to
        the public 30 years after the date of their origin" according to this
        page:
        http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/archiwa/korzystanie.eng.html

        > I am sure someone on this list sent the link to the Polish Civil
        > Archives Regulations in English. Evidently I kept the link for the
        > Polish version. Will whomever sent the link for English, please do so
        > again?

        This is the main page for Poland's state archives. Is that what you were
        looking for? I can't find any regulations on the site other than the
        page referenced above.
        http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/index.eng.html

        Cheers
        P
      • Debbie
        Philip, No, that s not the link. The web site, in Polish is: http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html Say, Philip, would you mean asking your friend if he would
        Message 3 of 15 , Sep 22, 2003
          Philip,
          No, that's not the link. The web site, in Polish is:
          http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html

          Say, Philip, would you mean asking your friend if he would find out when
          the Przemys~l Civil Archives will be closed next summer for vacation?
          July or August? They won't answer my emails.
          Debbie

          Philip Semanchuk wrote:
          >
          > On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 14:13, Debbie wrote:
          > > Philip,
          > > Well, this doesn't sound promising! I don't understand why we can't copy
          > > records that are more than 100 years old! These aren't church records!
          >
          > I see no reason for that either. "Archival records are made available to
          > the public 30 years after the date of their origin" according to this
          > page:
          > http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/archiwa/korzystanie.eng.html
          >
          > > I am sure someone on this list sent the link to the Polish Civil
          > > Archives Regulations in English. Evidently I kept the link for the
          > > Polish version. Will whomever sent the link for English, please do so
          > > again?
          >
          > This is the main page for Poland's state archives. Is that what you were
          > looking for? I can't find any regulations on the site other than the
          > page referenced above.
          > http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/index.eng.html
          > Cheers
          > P
        • Philip Semanchuk
          ... Right, I saw that, but what exactly are you looking for? The page I found was for the state archives in Poland. Are you looking for information specific to
          Message 4 of 15 , Sep 22, 2003
            On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 16:32, Debbie wrote:
            > Philip,
            > No, that's not the link. The web site, in Polish is:
            > http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html

            Right, I saw that, but what exactly are you looking for? The page I
            found was for the state archives in Poland. Are you looking for
            information specific to the archive in Warsaw? Is there a difference
            between "civil", "state" and "national" archives?

            > Say, Philip, would you mean asking your friend if he would find out when
            > the Przemys~l Civil Archives will be closed next summer for vacation?
            > July or August? They won't answer my emails.

            Will do. I owe him an email anyway.

            Bye
            P
          • Debbie
            Philip, Civil, state, and national mean the same in the context of Poland s Archiwum Pan~stwowe Pan~stwowe means of the people sort of. Using the term
            Message 5 of 15 , Sep 22, 2003
              Philip,
              Civil, state, and national mean the same in the context of Poland's
              "Archiwum Pan~stwowe" Pan~stwowe means "of the people" sort of. Using
              the term civil though, merely points out that reference is not being
              made to the church records.

              The site that I listed gives the actual regulations "we" and presumably
              those who work for the archives, have to follow.
              Debbie

              Philip Semanchuk wrote:
              > On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 16:32, Debbie wrote:
              > > Philip,
              > > No, that's not the link. The web site, in Polish is:
              > > http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html
              >
              > Right, I saw that, but what exactly are you looking for? The page I
              > found was for the state archives in Poland. Are you looking for
              > information specific to the archive in Warsaw? Is there a difference
              > between "civil", "state" and "national" archives?
              >
              > > Say, Philip, would you mean asking your friend if he would find out when
              > > the Przemys~l Civil Archives will be closed next summer for vacation?
              > > July or August? They won't answer my emails.
              >
              > Will do. I owe him an email anyway.
              > Bye
              > P
            • Philip Semanchuk
              ... That s what I think too, with the exception that civil also covers gmina archives like the one in Bukowsko. Which leaves me wondering what the difference
              Message 6 of 15 , Sep 22, 2003
                On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 18:18, Debbie wrote:
                > Philip,
                > Civil, state, and national mean the same in the context of Poland's
                > "Archiwum Pan~stwowe" Pan~stwowe means "of the people" sort of. Using
                > the term civil though, merely points out that reference is not being
                > made to the church records.

                That's what I think too, with the exception that "civil" also covers
                gmina archives like the one in Bukowsko. Which leaves me wondering what
                the difference is between this site:
                http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html
                and this one:
                http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/index.eng.html


                P
              • Debbie
                Philip, The link I posted, http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html is, I think, to the State Archive of the Capital City of Warsaw and Mazowia, which is under
                Message 7 of 15 , Sep 22, 2003
                  Philip,
                  The link I posted, http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html
                  is, I think, to the State Archive of the Capital City of Warsaw and
                  Mazowia, which is "under" the "Central (main) Archive of Historical
                  Records" which is also located in Warsaw. The site is for the archives
                  which house the old (older than 100 years) records for the wojewo~dztwo
                  Warsaw. Whereas the "Central" Archive is the main office for all the
                  archives (old and new) in Poland. Did that make sense?

                  The site you listed "belongs" to the "Central (main) Archive of the
                  Historical Records" and because it is the "boss", it lists all of the
                  archives "under" it; woj. archives and branch offices OF the woj.
                  archives.

                  I've written this three times in three different ways and I'm still not
                  sure I'm explaining it clearly.

                  Perhaps seeing the structure will help:
                  http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/archiwa/schemorg.eng.html

                  Personally, when I refer to gmina records, I don't consider them to be
                  "archived" records as they are "current" (less than 100 years old
                  supposedly) vital records. When gmina records get old, past 100, then
                  they "become" archives and they go to the "State Archive in______, the
                  appropriate woj. archive. At this point those records are part of the
                  Civil Archives in ______.

                  What do you think? Did it make sense?
                  Debbie

                  Philip Semanchuk wrote:
                  >
                  > On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 18:18, Debbie wrote:
                  > > Philip,
                  > > Civil, state, and national mean the same in the context of Poland's
                  > > "Archiwum Pan~stwowe" Pan~stwowe means "of the people" sort of. Using
                  > > the term civil though, merely points out that reference is not being
                  > > made to the church records.
                  >
                  > That's what I think too, with the exception that "civil" also covers
                  > gmina archives like the one in Bukowsko. Which leaves me wondering what
                  > the difference is between this site:
                  > http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html
                  > and this one:
                  > http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/index.eng.html
                  >
                  > P
                • Philip Semanchuk
                  ... Yes! ... Mmmmmmmmmmmm, dunno about that bit. What about all of the records 100 years old in the Bukowsko gmina archive? P
                  Message 8 of 15 , Sep 22, 2003
                    On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 22:48, Debbie wrote:
                    > Philip,
                    > The link I posted, http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html
                    > is, I think, to the State Archive of the Capital City of Warsaw and
                    > Mazowia, which is "under" the "Central (main) Archive of Historical
                    > Records" which is also located in Warsaw. The site is for the archives
                    > which house the old (older than 100 years) records for the wojewo~dztwo
                    > Warsaw. Whereas the "Central" Archive is the main office for all the
                    > archives (old and new) in Poland. Did that make sense?

                    Yes!

                    > Personally, when I refer to gmina records, I don't consider them to be
                    > "archived" records as they are "current" (less than 100 years old
                    > supposedly) vital records. When gmina records get old, past 100, then
                    > they "become" archives and they go to the "State Archive in______, the
                    > appropriate woj. archive. At this point those records are part of the
                    > Civil Archives in ______.
                    >
                    > What do you think? Did it make sense?

                    Mmmmmmmmmmmm, dunno about that bit. What about all of the records > 100
                    years old in the Bukowsko gmina archive?


                    P
                  • Debbie
                    Philip, I addressed that in an email I tossed out. Not everybody follows the rules and Bukowsko gmina, for some reason, hasn t turned over their 100 year old
                    Message 9 of 15 , Sep 22, 2003
                      Philip,
                      I addressed that in an email I tossed out.
                      Not everybody follows the rules and Bukowsko gmina, for some reason,
                      hasn't turned over their 100 year old records. I'm guessing that the
                      head office in Warsaw doesn't keep tabs on all the gminas and doesn't
                      enforce the "send them to us" law when records reach a certain age. It's
                      the same with parish records. There are lots of parishes who haven't
                      turned over their records to their diocesan archives.

                      So, even though the records held at gmina Bukowsko ARE more than 100
                      years old, they are still gmina records because that's where they are,
                      at the gmina.
                      Debbie

                      Philip Semanchuk wrote:
                      > On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 22:48, Debbie wrote:
                      > > Philip,
                      > > Personally, when I refer to gmina records, I don't consider them to be
                      > > "archived" records as they are "current" (less than 100 years old
                      > > supposedly) vital records. When gmina records get old, past 100, then
                      > > they "become" archives and they go to the "State Archive in______, the
                      > > appropriate woj. archive. At this point those records are part of the
                      > > Civil Archives in ______.
                      > >
                      > > What do you think? Did it make sense?
                      >
                      > Mmmmmmmmmmmm, dunno about that bit. What about all of the records > 100
                      > years old in the Bukowsko gmina archive?
                      > P
                    • josdoc
                      Dear Debbie I think that the important point is that any records which are over 100 years old may legally be copied,and even if still in their possession,they
                      Message 10 of 15 , Sep 23, 2003
                        Dear Debbie

                        I think that the important point is that any records which are over 100 years old may legally be copied,and even if still in their possession,they should/must allow copies to be made.

                        Ian
                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: Debbie
                        To: bukowsko_triangle@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Tuesday, September 23, 2003 4:34 AM
                        Subject: Re: [bukowsko_triangle] Archive Regulations


                        Philip,
                        I addressed that in an email I tossed out.
                        Not everybody follows the rules and Bukowsko gmina, for some reason,
                        hasn't turned over their 100 year old records. I'm guessing that the
                        head office in Warsaw doesn't keep tabs on all the gminas and doesn't
                        enforce the "send them to us" law when records reach a certain age. It's
                        the same with parish records. There are lots of parishes who haven't
                        turned over their records to their diocesan archives.

                        So, even though the records held at gmina Bukowsko ARE more than 100
                        years old, they are still gmina records because that's where they are,
                        at the gmina.
                        Debbie

                        Philip Semanchuk wrote:
                        > On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 22:48, Debbie wrote:
                        > > Philip,
                        > > Personally, when I refer to gmina records, I don't consider them to be
                        > > "archived" records as they are "current" (less than 100 years old
                        > > supposedly) vital records. When gmina records get old, past 100, then
                        > > they "become" archives and they go to the "State Archive in______, the
                        > > appropriate woj. archive. At this point those records are part of the
                        > > Civil Archives in ______.
                        > >
                        > > What do you think? Did it make sense?
                        >
                        > Mmmmmmmmmmmm, dunno about that bit. What about all of the records > 100
                        > years old in the Bukowsko gmina archive?
                        > P

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                      • Debbie
                        Ian, Do you think this would only pertain to a specific family record or should we be allowed to make copies of a whole page(s)? Debbie
                        Message 11 of 15 , Sep 23, 2003
                          Ian,
                          Do you think this would only pertain to a specific family record or
                          should we be allowed to make copies of a whole page(s)?
                          Debbie

                          josdoc wrote:
                          > Dear Debbie
                          >
                          > I think that the important point is that any records which are over 100 years old may legally be copied,and even if still in their possession,they should/must allow copies to be made.
                          > Ian
                        • Jan Cesarczyk
                          Hi, Archivum Pan~stwowe means State Archive which in practice means that it is run by some governmental organisation. http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html
                          Message 12 of 15 , Sep 24, 2003
                            Hi,
                            "Archivum Pan~stwowe" means "State Archive" which in practice means that it is run by some governmental organisation.
                            http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html is the website of the archive of the city of Warsaw.

                            http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/index.eng.html is the website of the main central government archives with links to the local provincial archives.

                            Jan


                            Philip Semanchuk <philip@...> wrote:
                            On Mon, 2003-09-22 at 18:18, Debbie wrote:
                            > Philip,
                            > Civil, state, and national mean the same in the context of Poland's
                            > "Archiwum Pan~stwowe" Pan~stwowe means "of the people" sort of. Using
                            > the term civil though, merely points out that reference is not being
                            > made to the church records.

                            That's what I think too, with the exception that "civil" also covers
                            gmina archives like the one in Bukowsko. Which leaves me wondering what
                            the difference is between this site:
                            http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html
                            and this one:
                            http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/index.eng.html


                            P



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                          • Debbie
                            Jan, Is there an English page for http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html Thank you Debbie
                            Message 13 of 15 , Sep 24, 2003
                              Jan,
                              Is there an English page for http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html
                              Thank you
                              Debbie

                              Jan Cesarczyk wrote:
                              > Hi,
                              > "Archivum Pan~stwowe" means "State Archive" which in practice means that it is run by some governmental organisation.
                              > http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html is the website of the archive of the city of Warsaw.
                              >
                              > http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/index.eng.html is the website of the main central government archives with links to the local provincial archives.
                              > Jan
                            • Jan Cesarczyk
                              Debbie, I can t find one. This archive contains documents from a rather strange area which is shown on the map at: http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/mapa.html Jan
                              Message 14 of 15 , Sep 24, 2003
                                Debbie,
                                I can't find one. This archive contains documents from a rather strange area which is shown on the map at:

                                http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/mapa.html

                                Jan

                                Debbie <daveg@...> wrote:
                                Jan,
                                Is there an English page for http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html
                                Thank you
                                Debbie

                                Jan Cesarczyk wrote:
                                > Hi,
                                > "Archivum Pan~stwowe" means "State Archive" which in practice means that it is run by some governmental organisation.
                                > http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/intro.html is the website of the archive of the city of Warsaw.
                                >
                                > http://www.archiwa.gov.pl/index.eng.html is the website of the main central government archives with links to the local provincial archives.
                                > Jan


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                              • Debbie
                                Thanks, Jan. Debbie
                                Message 15 of 15 , Sep 24, 2003
                                  Thanks, Jan.
                                  Debbie

                                  Jan Cesarczyk wrote:
                                  > Debbie,
                                  > I can't find one. This archive contains documents from a rather strange area which is shown on the map at:
                                  >
                                  > http://warszawa.ap.gov.pl/mapa.html
                                  > Jan
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