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Re: [bukowsko_triangle] Sarna

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  • Pj Riggs
    Philip, I believe I have looked it up and have not found any information of them coming in....I am not sure that all the records are available online...I have
    Message 1 of 8 , Aug 27, 2013
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      Philip,
      I believe I have looked it up and have not found any information of them coming in....I am not sure that all the records are available online...I have no date of arrival and it seem to have conflicting on dates on the cences 1900-1940...I am not sure if I search all the avenues of Ellis Island or Philly...I am wondering if they came in through Canada?  I have search that too but I have not found any matches...some close but not sure. I am trying to search from living europe to see if I can find them getting on the boat...
      I found a Victoria Sarna age 27
      Ship Gellert ~ Hamburg Passnger
      Departed may 22 1887  and Arrived June 3 1887
      with a child son Wisidor age 3 
      reside Sendziszow, Osterreich (Austria)
      I have not been able to see the records here on the arrivial - it seems that ship never had a record of arrival on the US side.
      I am not sure if this is her she is 10 years older.  I also can not find her anywhere else or the son once arrived.
       
      thanks
      Pam


      ________________________________
      From: Philip Semanchuk <philip@...>
      To: bukowsko_triangle@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Monday, August 26, 2013 8:56 PM
      Subject: Re: [bukowsko_triangle] Sarna


       


      On Aug 26, 2013, at 12:40 PM, Pj Riggs wrote:

      > I am still at a lost: I came across my great mother cerificate of death... I am searching where she came from. I beleive Victoria (Sarna) Zaborowski came from the lower area of Poland. She had a brother who came with her and then return to Europe somewhere (was told and letters are gone or lost) and perhaps a sister but I have no names or records of them.
      > These are the facts stated on death certificate:
      > Name: Victoria (Wiktorja) Zaborowski
      > Date of birth: May 10, 1878;
      > age 71;
      > Died May 22, 1949; Cleveland, Ohio
      > married: Frank Zaborowski in Cleveland, OH (1898 ~ checking on the information on that through church records as to establish correct information)
      > Occupation: housewife
      > Born: Poland
      > Father name: Joseph Sarna
      > Mother name: Anna Dominik
      >
      > Now looking for the parents Joseph and Anna of Poland. I know Sarna a big name both Jewish and Catholic in the 1800's. My Great Grandmother was Catholic here in America. At least the children all grew up Catholic.
      >
      > Thanks for any more information you can provide me with.

      Hi Pam,
      Refresh my memory -- have you search Ellis Island and Philly port records to see if you can find them there?

      bye
      P


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Debbie Greenlee
      Pam, You need to start with what you know and work backwards. Do not skip a step and try to locate information in Europe. You will get very frustrated. Once
      Message 2 of 8 , Aug 27, 2013
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        Pam,

        You need to start with what you know and work backwards. Do not skip a
        step and try to locate information in Europe. You will get very
        frustrated.

        Once you locate Wiktorja Sarna and Frank Zaborowski's church marriage
        record, see if you can locate the baptismal records of their children.
        Do no accept marriage or baptismal certificates. You want a photocopy
        of the original records.

        Did Victoria live in New York in 1940?
        Did she have an older son who lived with her at that time?

        Debbie

        Pj Riggs wrote:
        > I am still at a lost: I came across my great mother cerificate of
        death... I am searching where she came from. I beleive Victoria
        (Sarna) Zaborowski came from the lower area of Poland. She had a
        brother who came with her and then return to Europe somewhere (was
        told and letters are gone or lost) and perhaps a sister but I have no
        names or records of them.

        > These are the facts stated on death certificate:
        > Name: Victoria (Wiktorja) Zaborowski
        > Date of birth: May 10, 1878;
        > age 71;
        > Died May 22, 1949; Cleveland, Ohio
        > married: Frank Zaborowski in Cleveland, OH (1898 ~ checking on the
        information on that through church records as to establish correct
        information)
        > Occupation: housewife
        > Born: Poland
        > Father name: Joseph Sarna
        > Mother name: Anna Dominik
        >
        > Now looking for the parents Joseph and Anna of Poland. I know Sarna
        a big name both Jewish and Catholic in the 1800's. My Great
        Grandmother was Catholic here in America. At least the children all
        grew up Catholic.
        >
        > Thanks for any more information you can provide me with.
        >
        > Pam


        >Philip,
        I believe I have looked it up and have not found any information of
        them coming in....I am not sure that all the records are available
        online...I have no date of arrival and it seem to have conflicting on
        dates on the cences 1900-1940...I am not sure if I search all the
        avenues of Ellis Island or Philly...I am wondering if they came in
        through Canada? I have search that too but I have not found any
        matches...some close but not sure. I am trying to search from living
        europe to see if I can find them getting on the boat...
        I found a Victoria Sarna age 27
        Ship Gellert ~ Hamburg Passnger
        Departed may 22 1887 and Arrived June 3 1887
        with a child son Wisidor age 3
        reside Sendziszow, Osterreich (Austria)
        I have not been able to see the records here on the arrivial - it
        seems that ship never had a record of arrival on the US side.
        I am not sure if this is her she is 10 years older. I also can not
        find her anywhere else or the son once arrived.

        thanks
        Pam
      • Debbie Greenlee
        Pam, I found Frank and Victoria Zaborowski on the 1930 US federal census for Ohio. They lived at 3421 East 76th St. in Cleveland, Ohio. Frank was 56 (DOB 1874)
        Message 3 of 8 , Aug 27, 2013
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          Pam,

          I found Frank and Victoria Zaborowski on the 1930 US federal census
          for Ohio. They lived at 3421 East 76th St. in Cleveland, Ohio.

          Frank was 56 (DOB 1874) and Victoria was 51 (DOB 1879). They were
          married in 1898.
          Their children, all of whom were born in Ohio:
          Michael age 27 (DOB 1903)
          Helen age 22 (DOB 1908)
          Stella age 21 (DOB 1909)
          Olga age 17 (DOB 1913)

          Frank immigrated in 1885 and both he and Victoria were naturalized.

          Since Frank was only 11 when he immigrated, he probably came over with
          his parents. Victoria does not list her year of arrival.

          **************************************************************
          I found them in the 1920 census living in Colebrook, Ashtabula County,
          Ohio.
          All of their children are listed.
          Frank states he arrived in 1896.
          Victoria states she arrived in 1898.
          This census states that they were naturalized in 1902.
          They lived on a farm which means there is a 1920 Farm Schedule you can
          locate which might have some interesting information. Farm Schedules
          can be found in LDS microfilms or through NARA.

          **************************************************************
          I found them in the 1910 census living in Cleveland, Ohio.

          There is a son, Joe age 4 (DOB 1906) who probably died prior to 1920.
          There is also a daughter, Mary age 9 (DOB 1901) who was either married
          by the time of the 1920 census or she died.
          Olga is not listed since she was born in 1913.

          Frank states he arrived in 1894 and was a citizen by this time.
          Victoria states she arrived in 1896.

          Frank owned a dairy when this census was taken.
          **************************************************************
          I found them in the 1900 census living in Cleveland, Ohio.

          Frank states he was born in 1872 in RUSSIAN controlled Poland and that
          he immigrated in 1894 and he is still an alien. This means he became a
          citizen between 1900 and 1910.

          Victoria states she was born in 1877 in RUSSIAN controlled Poland.
          This means she was not from southern Poland (Bukowsko).
          Victoria states she immigrated in 1895.

          Only one daughter, Anna age 1 (DOB 1899) is listed. She didn't show-up
          on the 1910 census so she must have died before that census.

          Victoria also states that she had two children as of 1900, with one
          (Anna) living. This means Victoria's first child died prior to June
          1900, the date the census was taken.
          **************************************************************
          I couldn't find a Passenger Arrival Record for either Frank or Victoria.

          I would suggest that you locate Frank Zaborowski's Declaration of
          Intent and Petition for Naturalization. These documents might be in
          the courts or the archives of Cuyahoga County, Ohio.
          It is also possible that LDS or NARA has filmed these records but I
          think you should check with the county first.

          Hopefully Wiktorja Sarna Zaborowski's place of birth will be listed.

          You might also try to locate an obituary to see if any other family
          members were listed.

          BTW How do you know that Wiktorja's maiden name was Sarna?

          Debbie

          Pj Riggs wrote:

          Philip,
          I believe I have looked it up and have not found any information of
          them coming in....I am not sure that all the records are available
          online...I have no date of arrival and it seem to have conflicting on
          dates on the cences 1900-1940...I am not sure if I search all the
          avenues of Ellis Island or Philly...I am wondering if they came in
          through Canada? I have search that too but I have not found any
          matches...some close but not sure. I am trying to search from living
          europe to see if I can find them getting on the boat...
          I found a Victoria Sarna age 27
          Ship Gellert ~ Hamburg Passnger
          Departed may 22 1887 and Arrived June 3 1887
          with a child son Wisidor age 3
          reside Sendziszow, Osterreich (Austria)
          I have not been able to see the records here on the arrivial - it
          seems that ship never had a record of arrival on the US side.
          I am not sure if this is her she is 10 years older. I also can not
          find her anywhere else or the son once arrived.

          thanks
          Pam

          > I am still at a lost: I came across my great mother cerificate of
          death... I am searching where she came from. I beleive Victoria
          (Sarna) Zaborowski came from the lower area of Poland. She had a
          brother who came with her and then return to Europe somewhere (was
          told and letters are gone or lost) and perhaps a sister but I have
          no names or records of them.
          > These are the facts stated on death certificate:
          > Name: Victoria (Wiktorja) Zaborowski
          > Date of birth: May 10, 1878;
          > age 71;
          > Died May 22, 1949; Cleveland, Ohio
          > married: Frank Zaborowski in Cleveland, OH (1898 ~ checking on the
          information on that through church records as to establish correct
          information)
          > Occupation: housewife
          > Born: Poland
          > Father name: Joseph Sarna
          > Mother name: Anna Dominik
          >
          > Now looking for the parents Joseph and Anna of Poland. I know Sarna
          a big name both Jewish and Catholic in the 1800's. My Great
          Grandmother was Catholic here in America. At least the children all
          grew up Catholic.

          > Thanks for any more information you can provide me with.
          >
          > Pam
          >
        • Pj Riggs
          Thanks Debbie I have all that information....I can t find anything pass the marriage report.  I have sent letter off to the church to see if they have more
          Message 4 of 8 , Aug 28, 2013
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            Thanks Debbie I have all that information....I can't find anything pass the marriage report.  I have sent letter off to the church to see if they have more information and have her death cerifitcate.  That is where I have the parents name...but they are listed as Poland no town or area and her birth the same.   I am good from 1898-1949.  That why I am searching from the the other side...because I cannot find any more records on her here....I did find a Julianne Sarna...age 18 who came over with seems to be two other girlfriends...I am wondering if this might be her...the one girl name was also find in the Cleveland area... I am just trying anything now....Julianne might been her first name and victoria a second name...who knows.... I am hoping to find the connection...I am searching all angles.  Makes one head spin.
             
            Pam


            ________________________________
            From: Debbie Greenlee <daveg@...>
            To: bukowsko_triangle@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 4:25 PM
            Subject: Re: [bukowsko_triangle] Sarna


             

            Pam,

            I found Frank and Victoria Zaborowski on the 1930 US federal census
            for Ohio. They lived at 3421 East 76th St. in Cleveland, Ohio.

            Frank was 56 (DOB 1874) and Victoria was 51 (DOB 1879). They were
            married in 1898.
            Their children, all of whom were born in Ohio:
            Michael age 27 (DOB 1903)
            Helen age 22 (DOB 1908)
            Stella age 21 (DOB 1909)
            Olga age 17 (DOB 1913)

            Frank immigrated in 1885 and both he and Victoria were naturalized.

            Since Frank was only 11 when he immigrated, he probably came over with
            his parents. Victoria does not list her year of arrival.

            **************************************************************
            I found them in the 1920 census living in Colebrook, Ashtabula County,
            Ohio.
            All of their children are listed.
            Frank states he arrived in 1896.
            Victoria states she arrived in 1898.
            This census states that they were naturalized in 1902.
            They lived on a farm which means there is a 1920 Farm Schedule you can
            locate which might have some interesting information. Farm Schedules
            can be found in LDS microfilms or through NARA.

            **************************************************************
            I found them in the 1910 census living in Cleveland, Ohio.

            There is a son, Joe age 4 (DOB 1906) who probably died prior to 1920.
            There is also a daughter, Mary age 9 (DOB 1901) who was either married
            by the time of the 1920 census or she died.
            Olga is not listed since she was born in 1913.

            Frank states he arrived in 1894 and was a citizen by this time.
            Victoria states she arrived in 1896.

            Frank owned a dairy when this census was taken.
            **************************************************************
            I found them in the 1900 census living in Cleveland, Ohio.

            Frank states he was born in 1872 in RUSSIAN controlled Poland and that
            he immigrated in 1894 and he is still an alien. This means he became a
            citizen between 1900 and 1910.

            Victoria states she was born in 1877 in RUSSIAN controlled Poland.
            This means she was not from southern Poland (Bukowsko).
            Victoria states she immigrated in 1895.

            Only one daughter, Anna age 1 (DOB 1899) is listed. She didn't show-up
            on the 1910 census so she must have died before that census.

            Victoria also states that she had two children as of 1900, with one
            (Anna) living. This means Victoria's first child died prior to June
            1900, the date the census was taken.
            **************************************************************
            I couldn't find a Passenger Arrival Record for either Frank or Victoria.

            I would suggest that you locate Frank Zaborowski's Declaration of
            Intent and Petition for Naturalization. These documents might be in
            the courts or the archives of Cuyahoga County, Ohio.
            It is also possible that LDS or NARA has filmed these records but I
            think you should check with the county first.

            Hopefully Wiktorja Sarna Zaborowski's place of birth will be listed.

            You might also try to locate an obituary to see if any other family
            members were listed.

            BTW How do you know that Wiktorja's maiden name was Sarna?

            Debbie

            Pj Riggs wrote:

            Philip,
            I believe I have looked it up and have not found any information of
            them coming in....I am not sure that all the records are available
            online...I have no date of arrival and it seem to have conflicting on
            dates on the cences 1900-1940...I am not sure if I search all the
            avenues of Ellis Island or Philly...I am wondering if they came in
            through Canada? I have search that too but I have not found any
            matches...some close but not sure. I am trying to search from living
            europe to see if I can find them getting on the boat...
            I found a Victoria Sarna age 27
            Ship Gellert ~ Hamburg Passnger
            Departed may 22 1887 and Arrived June 3 1887
            with a child son Wisidor age 3
            reside Sendziszow, Osterreich (Austria)
            I have not been able to see the records here on the arrivial - it
            seems that ship never had a record of arrival on the US side.
            I am not sure if this is her she is 10 years older. I also can not
            find her anywhere else or the son once arrived.

            thanks
            Pam

            > I am still at a lost: I came across my great mother cerificate of
            death... I am searching where she came from. I beleive Victoria
            (Sarna) Zaborowski came from the lower area of Poland. She had a
            brother who came with her and then return to Europe somewhere (was
            told and letters are gone or lost) and perhaps a sister but I have
            no names or records of them.
            > These are the facts stated on death certificate:
            > Name: Victoria (Wiktorja) Zaborowski
            > Date of birth: May 10, 1878;
            > age 71;
            > Died May 22, 1949; Cleveland, Ohio
            > married: Frank Zaborowski in Cleveland, OH (1898 ~ checking on the
            information on that through church records as to establish correct
            information)
            > Occupation: housewife
            > Born: Poland
            > Father name: Joseph Sarna
            > Mother name: Anna Dominik
            >
            > Now looking for the parents Joseph and Anna of Poland. I know Sarna
            a big name both Jewish and Catholic in the 1800's. My Great
            Grandmother was Catholic here in America. At least the children all
            grew up Catholic.

            > Thanks for any more information you can provide me with.
            >
            > Pam
            >



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Philip Semanchuk
            ... Hi Pam, I agree with Debbie s recommendation that you focus on finding either US-based records or port-of-entry records for Victoria and/or Frank.
            Message 5 of 8 , Aug 28, 2013
            • 0 Attachment
              On Aug 28, 2013, at 4:08 PM, Pj Riggs wrote:

              > Thanks Debbie I have all that information....I can't find anything pass the marriage report. I have sent letter off to the church to see if they have more information and have her death cerifitcate. That is where I have the parents name...but they are listed as Poland no town or area and her birth the same. I am good from 1898-1949. That why I am searching from the the other side...because I cannot find any more records on her here....I did find a Julianne Sarna...age 18 who came over with seems to be two other girlfriends...I am wondering if this might be her...the one girl name was also find in the Cleveland area... I am just trying anything now....Julianne might been her first name and victoria a second name...who knows.... I am hoping to find the connection...I am searching all angles. Makes one head spin.

              Hi Pam,
              I agree with Debbie's recommendation that you focus on finding either US-based records or port-of-entry records for Victoria and/or Frank. Searching all of "Poland" (which was a nebulous concept in that day and age) is really shooting in the dark. I know you're frustrated, but I think searching in Europe without more details is going to be even more frustrating than continuing to search over here.

              > I believe I have looked it up and have not found any information of
              > them coming in....I am not sure that all the records are available
              > online...I have no date of arrival and it seem to have conflicting on
              > dates on the cences 1900-1940...I am not sure if I search all the
              > avenues of Ellis Island or Philly...I am wondering if they came in
              > through Canada?

              You sound a little unsure whether or not you've conducted a thorough, imaginative search through the records of the most likely ports of entry (Philly and Ellis Island). Have you searched on "Larna" instead of "Sarna", for example? I found a Semanczyk mis-transcribed as Lemanczyk as a result of overly flowerly handwriting. Also, you *do* have an approximate arrival year, which is not too bad.

              I think it's unlikely that they came through Canada but if there's a Canadian equivalent of ellisisland.org (or anything close) it would certainly be worth having a look.


              Good luck
              Philip




              > _______________________________
              > From: Debbie Greenlee <daveg@...>
              > To: bukowsko_triangle@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 4:25 PM
              > Subject: Re: [bukowsko_triangle] Sarna
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Pam,
              >
              > I found Frank and Victoria Zaborowski on the 1930 US federal census
              > for Ohio. They lived at 3421 East 76th St. in Cleveland, Ohio.
              >
              > Frank was 56 (DOB 1874) and Victoria was 51 (DOB 1879). They were
              > married in 1898.
              > Their children, all of whom were born in Ohio:
              > Michael age 27 (DOB 1903)
              > Helen age 22 (DOB 1908)
              > Stella age 21 (DOB 1909)
              > Olga age 17 (DOB 1913)
              >
              > Frank immigrated in 1885 and both he and Victoria were naturalized.
              >
              > Since Frank was only 11 when he immigrated, he probably came over with
              > his parents. Victoria does not list her year of arrival.
              >
              > **************************************************************
              > I found them in the 1920 census living in Colebrook, Ashtabula County,
              > Ohio.
              > All of their children are listed.
              > Frank states he arrived in 1896.
              > Victoria states she arrived in 1898.
              > This census states that they were naturalized in 1902.
              > They lived on a farm which means there is a 1920 Farm Schedule you can
              > locate which might have some interesting information. Farm Schedules
              > can be found in LDS microfilms or through NARA.
              >
              > **************************************************************
              > I found them in the 1910 census living in Cleveland, Ohio.
              >
              > There is a son, Joe age 4 (DOB 1906) who probably died prior to 1920.
              > There is also a daughter, Mary age 9 (DOB 1901) who was either married
              > by the time of the 1920 census or she died.
              > Olga is not listed since she was born in 1913.
              >
              > Frank states he arrived in 1894 and was a citizen by this time.
              > Victoria states she arrived in 1896.
              >
              > Frank owned a dairy when this census was taken.
              > **************************************************************
              > I found them in the 1900 census living in Cleveland, Ohio.
              >
              > Frank states he was born in 1872 in RUSSIAN controlled Poland and that
              > he immigrated in 1894 and he is still an alien. This means he became a
              > citizen between 1900 and 1910.
              >
              > Victoria states she was born in 1877 in RUSSIAN controlled Poland.
              > This means she was not from southern Poland (Bukowsko).
              > Victoria states she immigrated in 1895.
              >
              > Only one daughter, Anna age 1 (DOB 1899) is listed. She didn't show-up
              > on the 1910 census so she must have died before that census.
              >
              > Victoria also states that she had two children as of 1900, with one
              > (Anna) living. This means Victoria's first child died prior to June
              > 1900, the date the census was taken.
              > **************************************************************
              > I couldn't find a Passenger Arrival Record for either Frank or Victoria.
              >
              > I would suggest that you locate Frank Zaborowski's Declaration of
              > Intent and Petition for Naturalization. These documents might be in
              > the courts or the archives of Cuyahoga County, Ohio.
              > It is also possible that LDS or NARA has filmed these records but I
              > think you should check with the county first.
              >
              > Hopefully Wiktorja Sarna Zaborowski's place of birth will be listed.
              >
              > You might also try to locate an obituary to see if any other family
              > members were listed.
              >
              > BTW How do you know that Wiktorja's maiden name was Sarna?
              >
              > Debbie
              >
              > Pj Riggs wrote:
              >
              > Philip,
              > I believe I have looked it up and have not found any information of
              > them coming in....I am not sure that all the records are available
              > online...I have no date of arrival and it seem to have conflicting on
              > dates on the cences 1900-1940...I am not sure if I search all the
              > avenues of Ellis Island or Philly...I am wondering if they came in
              > through Canada? I have search that too but I have not found any
              > matches...some close but not sure. I am trying to search from living
              > europe to see if I can find them getting on the boat...
              > I found a Victoria Sarna age 27
              > Ship Gellert ~ Hamburg Passnger
              > Departed may 22 1887 and Arrived June 3 1887
              > with a child son Wisidor age 3
              > reside Sendziszow, Osterreich (Austria)
              > I have not been able to see the records here on the arrivial - it
              > seems that ship never had a record of arrival on the US side.
              > I am not sure if this is her she is 10 years older. I also can not
              > find her anywhere else or the son once arrived.
              >
              > thanks
              > Pam
              >
              >> I am still at a lost: I came across my great mother cerificate of
              > death... I am searching where she came from. I beleive Victoria
              > (Sarna) Zaborowski came from the lower area of Poland. She had a
              > brother who came with her and then return to Europe somewhere (was
              > told and letters are gone or lost) and perhaps a sister but I have
              > no names or records of them.
              >> These are the facts stated on death certificate:
              >> Name: Victoria (Wiktorja) Zaborowski
              >> Date of birth: May 10, 1878;
              >> age 71;
              >> Died May 22, 1949; Cleveland, Ohio
              >> married: Frank Zaborowski in Cleveland, OH (1898 ~ checking on the
              > information on that through church records as to establish correct
              > information)
              >> Occupation: housewife
              >> Born: Poland
              >> Father name: Joseph Sarna
              >> Mother name: Anna Dominik
              >>
              >> Now looking for the parents Joseph and Anna of Poland. I know Sarna
              > a big name both Jewish and Catholic in the 1800's. My Great
              > Grandmother was Catholic here in America. At least the children all
              > grew up Catholic.
              >
              >> Thanks for any more information you can provide me with.
              >>
              >> Pam
              >>
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • Carol
              fOLKS, ancestry has free access to immigration and travel records until sept 2nd... some of you might find this useful... happy hunting... carol ... --
              Message 6 of 8 , Aug 29, 2013
              • 0 Attachment
                fOLKS, ancestry has free access to immigration and travel records until
                sept 2nd... some of you might find this useful... happy hunting...
                carol


                On Wed, Aug 28, 2013 at 11:51 PM, Philip Semanchuk <philip@...>wrote:

                > **
                >
                >
                >
                > On Aug 28, 2013, at 4:08 PM, Pj Riggs wrote:
                >
                > > Thanks Debbie I have all that information....I can't find anything pass
                > the marriage report. I have sent letter off to the church to see if they
                > have more information and have her death cerifitcate. That is where I have
                > the parents name...but they are listed as Poland no town or area and her
                > birth the same. I am good from 1898-1949. That why I am searching from the
                > the other side...because I cannot find any more records on her here....I
                > did find a Julianne Sarna...age 18 who came over with seems to be two other
                > girlfriends...I am wondering if this might be her...the one girl name was
                > also find in the Cleveland area... I am just trying anything
                > now....Julianne might been her first name and victoria a second name...who
                > knows.... I am hoping to find the connection...I am searching all angles.
                > Makes one head spin.
                >
                > Hi Pam,
                > I agree with Debbie's recommendation that you focus on finding either
                > US-based records or port-of-entry records for Victoria and/or Frank.
                > Searching all of "Poland" (which was a nebulous concept in that day and
                > age) is really shooting in the dark. I know you're frustrated, but I think
                > searching in Europe without more details is going to be even more
                > frustrating than continuing to search over here.
                >
                >
                > > I believe I have looked it up and have not found any information of
                > > them coming in....I am not sure that all the records are available
                > > online...I have no date of arrival and it seem to have conflicting on
                > > dates on the cences 1900-1940...I am not sure if I search all the
                > > avenues of Ellis Island or Philly...I am wondering if they came in
                > > through Canada?
                >
                > You sound a little unsure whether or not you've conducted a thorough,
                > imaginative search through the records of the most likely ports of entry
                > (Philly and Ellis Island). Have you searched on "Larna" instead of "Sarna",
                > for example? I found a Semanczyk mis-transcribed as Lemanczyk as a result
                > of overly flowerly handwriting. Also, you *do* have an approximate arrival
                > year, which is not too bad.
                >
                > I think it's unlikely that they came through Canada but if there's a
                > Canadian equivalent of ellisisland.org (or anything close) it would
                > certainly be worth having a look.
                >
                > Good luck
                > Philip
                >
                >
                > > _______________________________
                > > From: Debbie Greenlee <daveg@...>
                > > To: bukowsko_triangle@yahoogroups.com
                > > Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 4:25 PM
                > > Subject: Re: [bukowsko_triangle] Sarna
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Pam,
                > >
                > > I found Frank and Victoria Zaborowski on the 1930 US federal census
                > > for Ohio. They lived at 3421 East 76th St. in Cleveland, Ohio.
                > >
                > > Frank was 56 (DOB 1874) and Victoria was 51 (DOB 1879). They were
                > > married in 1898.
                > > Their children, all of whom were born in Ohio:
                > > Michael age 27 (DOB 1903)
                > > Helen age 22 (DOB 1908)
                > > Stella age 21 (DOB 1909)
                > > Olga age 17 (DOB 1913)
                > >
                > > Frank immigrated in 1885 and both he and Victoria were naturalized.
                > >
                > > Since Frank was only 11 when he immigrated, he probably came over with
                > > his parents. Victoria does not list her year of arrival.
                > >
                > > **************************************************************
                > > I found them in the 1920 census living in Colebrook, Ashtabula County,
                > > Ohio.
                > > All of their children are listed.
                > > Frank states he arrived in 1896.
                > > Victoria states she arrived in 1898.
                > > This census states that they were naturalized in 1902.
                > > They lived on a farm which means there is a 1920 Farm Schedule you can
                > > locate which might have some interesting information. Farm Schedules
                > > can be found in LDS microfilms or through NARA.
                > >
                > > **************************************************************
                > > I found them in the 1910 census living in Cleveland, Ohio.
                > >
                > > There is a son, Joe age 4 (DOB 1906) who probably died prior to 1920.
                > > There is also a daughter, Mary age 9 (DOB 1901) who was either married
                > > by the time of the 1920 census or she died.
                > > Olga is not listed since she was born in 1913.
                > >
                > > Frank states he arrived in 1894 and was a citizen by this time.
                > > Victoria states she arrived in 1896.
                > >
                > > Frank owned a dairy when this census was taken.
                > > **************************************************************
                > > I found them in the 1900 census living in Cleveland, Ohio.
                > >
                > > Frank states he was born in 1872 in RUSSIAN controlled Poland and that
                > > he immigrated in 1894 and he is still an alien. This means he became a
                > > citizen between 1900 and 1910.
                > >
                > > Victoria states she was born in 1877 in RUSSIAN controlled Poland.
                > > This means she was not from southern Poland (Bukowsko).
                > > Victoria states she immigrated in 1895.
                > >
                > > Only one daughter, Anna age 1 (DOB 1899) is listed. She didn't show-up
                > > on the 1910 census so she must have died before that census.
                > >
                > > Victoria also states that she had two children as of 1900, with one
                > > (Anna) living. This means Victoria's first child died prior to June
                > > 1900, the date the census was taken.
                > > **************************************************************
                > > I couldn't find a Passenger Arrival Record for either Frank or Victoria.
                > >
                > > I would suggest that you locate Frank Zaborowski's Declaration of
                > > Intent and Petition for Naturalization. These documents might be in
                > > the courts or the archives of Cuyahoga County, Ohio.
                > > It is also possible that LDS or NARA has filmed these records but I
                > > think you should check with the county first.
                > >
                > > Hopefully Wiktorja Sarna Zaborowski's place of birth will be listed.
                > >
                > > You might also try to locate an obituary to see if any other family
                > > members were listed.
                > >
                > > BTW How do you know that Wiktorja's maiden name was Sarna?
                > >
                > > Debbie
                > >
                > > Pj Riggs wrote:
                > >
                > > Philip,
                > > I believe I have looked it up and have not found any information of
                > > them coming in....I am not sure that all the records are available
                > > online...I have no date of arrival and it seem to have conflicting on
                > > dates on the cences 1900-1940...I am not sure if I search all the
                > > avenues of Ellis Island or Philly...I am wondering if they came in
                > > through Canada? I have search that too but I have not found any
                > > matches...some close but not sure. I am trying to search from living
                > > europe to see if I can find them getting on the boat...
                > > I found a Victoria Sarna age 27
                > > Ship Gellert ~ Hamburg Passnger
                > > Departed may 22 1887 and Arrived June 3 1887
                > > with a child son Wisidor age 3
                > > reside Sendziszow, Osterreich (Austria)
                > > I have not been able to see the records here on the arrivial - it
                > > seems that ship never had a record of arrival on the US side.
                > > I am not sure if this is her she is 10 years older. I also can not
                > > find her anywhere else or the son once arrived.
                > >
                > > thanks
                > > Pam
                > >
                > >> I am still at a lost: I came across my great mother cerificate of
                > > death... I am searching where she came from. I beleive Victoria
                > > (Sarna) Zaborowski came from the lower area of Poland. She had a
                > > brother who came with her and then return to Europe somewhere (was
                > > told and letters are gone or lost) and perhaps a sister but I have
                > > no names or records of them.
                > >> These are the facts stated on death certificate:
                > >> Name: Victoria (Wiktorja) Zaborowski
                > >> Date of birth: May 10, 1878;
                > >> age 71;
                > >> Died May 22, 1949; Cleveland, Ohio
                > >> married: Frank Zaborowski in Cleveland, OH (1898 ~ checking on the
                > > information on that through church records as to establish correct
                > > information)
                > >> Occupation: housewife
                > >> Born: Poland
                > >> Father name: Joseph Sarna
                > >> Mother name: Anna Dominik
                > >>
                > >> Now looking for the parents Joseph and Anna of Poland. I know Sarna
                > > a big name both Jewish and Catholic in the 1800's. My Great
                > > Grandmother was Catholic here in America. At least the children all
                > > grew up Catholic.
                > >
                > >> Thanks for any more information you can provide me with.
                > >>
                > >> Pam
                > >>
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                >
                >
                >



                --
                cvp

                "Finally, my dear Lou, it's the same old profound and heartfelt
                plea: Become the one you are! In this regard it is necessary,
                first of all, that we emancipate ourselves from our chains; but
                then, in the end, we must also emancipate ourselves from this
                emancipation! Every one of us, each in his or her own way,
                has to labor over this malady of chains, even after we have
                shattered them.
                ----Friedrich Nietzsche to Lou von Salomé , August 1882

                ~Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of
                our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable
                views of (wo)men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little
                corner of the earth all one's lifetime. ~ Mark Twain


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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