RE: Car free London?
> -----Original Message-----I thought it would be obvious...trips that require several transfers. Let
> From: brin-l-bounces@... [mailto:brin-l-bounces@...]
> On Behalf Of Charlie Bell
> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 9:25 AM
> To: Killer Bs Discussion
> Subject: Re: Car free London?
> On 30/09/2007, at 8:50 PM, Gary Nunn wrote:
> > Holy Cow!!
> > I make a post and step away for a few weeks and find this topic ran
> > rampant
> > - and I missed it!
> Yep. I'm still wondering what bits of London are 20 mins apart by car
> and hours apart by public transport (apart from at 3am, at which time
> most of London is 20 mins by car and unreachable at all by public
me give you a specific example from the western part of London. I'll use
street corners because I don't have addresses....I took a while in answering
because I knew that I'd have to prove it with a specific example...and it
wasn't trivial for me to do the bus routes, schedules, etc...and be sure I
stay within London proper with my example.
Anyways, the example is Exmouth Rd. and Appledore Ave to Balmoral and
Waverly and back on a Sunday afternoon....about 4 miles each way. It takes
several changes of bus on each end, plus about a half mile walk each side.
I am not _that_ familiar with London traffic, but my memory is that it's not
terrible on the weekends, except for special occasions. So, 20 minutes for
the 8 mile round trip by car sounds reasonable by me....but it might take
As far as I can see, several busses would have to be taken each way. Adding
the time it takes to wait, along with the added time to take the bus routes
(with stops) instead of the direct routes, that would be 40-60 minutes each
way...nearest bus stop to nearest bus stop. Including the time it takes to
walk a total of two miles, for someone who is not walking briskly...say 20
minute miles), and that gives us 2 hours to 2 hours 40 minutes for the trip.
FWIW, the frequency of the outlying busses was a bit more than I would have
On 03/10/2007, at 11:07 AM, Dan Minettte wrote:
>> Yep. I'm still wondering what bits of London are 20 mins apart by car
>> and hours apart by public transport (apart from at 3am, at which time
>> most of London is 20 mins by car and unreachable at all by public
> I thought it would be obvious...trips that require several transfers.
Maybe, but I'm having trouble thinking of real-world examples within
inner or outer London, and certainly had no trouble getting from
Hammersmith to Acton or whatever (which is radial...). Took an hour
on the bus instead of 40 mins in the car.
> Anyways, the example is Exmouth Rd. and Appledore Ave to Balmoral and
> Waverly and back on a Sunday afternoon....
I like the way you sneak the "and back" in there, as I was figuring
on two places 20 mins apart, not two place 20 mins there and back,
which obviously changes things drastically by adding extra waiting
time for the turnaround, along with specifying Sunday when traffic is
at its best and public transport on its worst day (and people would
be making different sorts of journey to a weekday).
Also, not giving the proper road names - "Balmoral and Waverly" means
*nothing* to a Brit - and no suburbs makes it way harder than it
needed to for me to look. There are over 30 streets called Balmoral
something inside the M25 London Orbital. There are none called
Waverly something. There are 40-ish called "Waverley" something. In
fact, I can't find where there are two roads intersecting called
those things, and I've looked. I found the junction of "Exmouth and
Appledore" at http://tinyurl.com/3xoy4y but the other one eludes me.
You're also talking "Greater London", which is out beyond "outer
London" as referred to in the original article. Places like Harrow,
Kingston and Ruislip aren't considered London proper (they don't have
This is called "stacking the deck"...
> FWIW, the frequency of the outlying busses was a bit more than I
> would have
It's pretty good in the UK. And, as I pointed out, any limitation on
private transport would lead to an increase in routes and frequency
of public transport.
If you actually point out where you were talking about (try a google
maps pointer) and I'll check your work against the public transport