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Cloned mules' race times nearly identical

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  • Ronn!Blankenship
    _______________________________________________
    Message 1 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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    • Deborah Harrell
      ... But since one was 3rd and the other 7th, several other mules had closer
      Message 2 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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        > Ronn!Blankenship <ronn_blankenship@...>
        wrote:

        >
        <<http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/science/06/04/cloned.mule.races.ap/index.html>>

        But since one was 3rd and the other 7th, several other
        mules had closer times.

        http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/5048860.stm
        ...Idaho Gem was the first clone of any animal in the
        horse family, and the first clone of an animal which
        cannot normally reproduce. Mules are hybrids - the
        product of the union of a female horse and a male
        donkey - and are generally sterile. Gem and his
        brothers - Star and Utah Pioneer (which did not race)
        - were all cloned from the same skin cell line taken
        from a 45-day-old mule foetus...

        Well, that sort of negates the ability to judge an
        animal as desirable, doesn't it? I mean, a 45 day old
        fetus (in an animal that gestates for 11 months) can
        hardly run a sprint. <wrinkles nose> While
        cloning equines for cancer research purposes might be
        valuable/worthwhile, cloning for racing is just a
        publicity stunt.

        ...The first cloned horse, called Prometea, was born
        in 2003. Thoroughbred racing is strictly controlled -
        it does not permit artificial insemination or any kind
        of fertility treatment...

        Personally, I find the notion of cloning pets
        repugnant: it is disrespectful to that special animal
        companion, and will not reproduce that one's
        intrauterine and infant existance, so the adult mihgt
        be quite different. In the case of calico cats, frex,
        coat pattern *will not* be the same, as those cells
        migrate during fetal growth. It'll be calico, but not
        with the black blotch on the right ear and brown
        streak over the shoulder like ol' Patches.

        Debbi
        who never did comment on the horse that broke its leg
        in the Preakness, therefore: Subjecting 2- and 3-
        year old half-ton+ animals -- whose bones don't finish
        growing until they're 4 or 5 years of age -- to the
        tremendous stresses of running, at speeds of up to
        45mph, is stupid. Smarty Jones, B-whatever -- tossed
        upon the altar of greed. Silly, perhaps, to even
        think of such, when children are dying for want of a
        mosquito net, but waste of life really pisses me off.

        __________________________________________________
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      • Ronn!Blankenship
        ... I haven t heard if he is healing well or not. Have you? The last I heard was that the surgery seemed to be a success but it was too early to tell if he
        Message 3 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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          At 04:48 PM Monday 6/5/2006, Deborah Harrell wrote:
          > > Ronn!Blankenship <ronn_blankenship@...>
          >wrote:
          >
          > >
          ><<http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/science/06/04/cloned.mule.races.ap/index.html>>
          >
          >But since one was 3rd and the other 7th, several other
          >mules had closer times.
          >
          >http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/5048860.stm
          >...Idaho Gem was the first clone of any animal in the
          >horse family, and the first clone of an animal which
          >cannot normally reproduce. Mules are hybrids - the
          >product of the union of a female horse and a male
          >donkey - and are generally sterile. Gem and his
          >brothers - Star and Utah Pioneer (which did not race)
          >- were all cloned from the same skin cell line taken
          >from a 45-day-old mule foetus...
          >
          >Well, that sort of negates the ability to judge an
          >animal as desirable, doesn't it? I mean, a 45 day old
          >fetus (in an animal that gestates for 11 months) can
          >hardly run a sprint. <wrinkles nose> While
          >cloning equines for cancer research purposes might be
          >valuable/worthwhile, cloning for racing is just a
          >publicity stunt.
          >
          >...The first cloned horse, called Prometea, was born
          >in 2003. Thoroughbred racing is strictly controlled -
          >it does not permit artificial insemination or any kind
          >of fertility treatment...
          >
          >Personally, I find the notion of cloning pets
          >repugnant: it is disrespectful to that special animal
          >companion, and will not reproduce that one's
          >intrauterine and infant existance, so the adult mihgt
          >be quite different. In the case of calico cats, frex,
          >coat pattern *will not* be the same, as those cells
          >migrate during fetal growth. It'll be calico, but not
          >with the black blotch on the right ear and brown
          >streak over the shoulder like ol' Patches.
          >
          >Debbi
          >who never did comment on the horse that broke its leg
          >in the Preakness, therefore: Subjecting 2- and 3-
          >year old half-ton+ animals -- whose bones don't finish
          >growing until they're 4 or 5 years of age -- to the
          >tremendous stresses of running, at speeds of up to
          >45mph, is stupid. Smarty Jones, B-whatever -- tossed
          >upon the altar of greed. Silly, perhaps, to even
          >think of such, when children are dying for want of a
          >mosquito net, but waste of life really pisses me off.


          I haven't heard if he is healing well or not. Have you? The last I
          heard was that the surgery seemed to be a success but it was too
          early to tell if he would heal well enough to perform at stud (and I
          am carefully withholding all the comments which come to mind . . . )


          --Ronn! :)

          "Since I was a small boy, two states have been added to our country
          and two words have been added to the pledge of Allegiance... UNDER
          GOD. Wouldn't it be a pity if someone said that is a prayer and that
          would be eliminated from schools too?"
          -- Red Skelton

          (Someone asked me to change my .sig quote back, so I did.)




          _______________________________________________
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        • Deborah Harrell
          ... ... 3- ... Since there s no AI with Thoroughbreds, he s got to be able to stand on his own two (hind) feet, eh?
          Message 4 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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            > Ronn!Blankenship <ronn_blankenship@...>
            wrote:
            > At 04:48 PM Monday 6/5/2006, Deborah Harrell wrote:
            <snip>

            > >Debbi
            > >who never did comment on the horse that broke its
            > leg in the Preakness, therefore: Subjecting 2- and
            3-
            > >year old half-ton+ animals -- whose bones don't
            > finish
            > >growing until they're 4 or 5 years of age -- to the
            > >tremendous stresses of running, at speeds of up to
            > >45mph, is stupid. Smarty Jones, B-whatever --
            > tossed
            > >upon the altar of greed. Silly, perhaps <snip>

            > I haven't heard if he is healing well or not. Have
            > you? The last I
            > heard was that the surgery seemed to be a success
            > but it was too
            > early to tell if he would heal well enough to
            > perform at stud (and I
            > am carefully withholding all the comments which come
            > to mind . . . )

            <snort-n-grin>
            Since there's no AI with Thoroughbreds, he's got to be
            able to stand on his own two (hind) feet, eh?

            http://horseracing.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?zi=1/XJ&sdn=horseracing&zu=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vet.upenn.edu%2Fnewsandevents%2Fnews%2FBarbaro.htm
            or
            http://makeashorterlink.com/?E5CB2473D

            June 2 , 2006
            KENNETT SQUARE, PA – Kentucky Derby winner Barbaro
            continues to improve daily as he recovers from a
            shattered hind leg sustained at the Preakness on May
            20. “I’m very pleased with the progress Barbaro is
            making,” said Chief of Surgery Dean W. Richardson.
            “Everything is fine.”

            Barbaro remains in intensive care at the George D.
            Widener Hospital for Large Animals at the University
            of Pennsylvania School of Veterinary Medicine’s New
            Bolton Center. New Bolton Center has received many
            inquiries about Barbaro; below are the answers to some
            of those most frequently asked:

            No mention of studly duties, though... ;)

            Debbi
            whose Cezanne 'turned the corner' last month, and is
            now officially a riding horse, though still unreliable
            for any but people she truly trusts (3)

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          • Dan Minette
            ... On that subject, my daughter Neli has had malaria several times and might die the next time she gets it. She s smart enough to use mosquito nets, but they
            Message 5 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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              >Silly, perhaps, to even
              > think of such, when children are dying for want of a
              > mosquito net, but waste of life really pisses me off.

              On that subject, my daughter Neli has had malaria several times and might
              die the next time she gets it. She's smart enough to use mosquito nets, but
              they still find her.

              What is really bothersome to me is that people have successfully lobbied
              against very effective and cheap treatment, because they cannot be convinced
              by the facts that it works. All that has to be done is spay the walls of
              the house with DDT, and there is a far lower chance of getting malaria
              carrying mosquitoes in the house. The exposure is modest, and clearly poses
              a far lower risk of death than malaria. Mosquito nets help, but they
              require daily proper use. A kid going potty in the middle of the night can
              open the door to problems.

              Dan M.


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            • Charlie Bell
              ... There are other effective insecticides, and programs in Mexico in particular have shown that a coordinated and integrated antimalarial programme can be
              Message 6 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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                On 06/06/2006, at 1:19 AM, Dan Minette wrote:
                >
                >> Silly, perhaps, to even
                >> think of such, when children are dying for want of a
                >> mosquito net, but waste of life really pisses me off.
                >
                > On that subject, my daughter Neli has had malaria several times and
                > might
                > die the next time she gets it. She's smart enough to use mosquito
                > nets, but
                > they still find her.
                >
                > What is really bothersome to me is that people have successfully
                > lobbied
                > against very effective and cheap treatment, because they cannot be
                > convinced
                > by the facts that it works. All that has to be done is spay the
                > walls of
                > the house with DDT, and there is a far lower chance of getting malaria
                > carrying mosquitoes in the house.

                There are other effective insecticides, and programs in Mexico in
                particular have shown that a coordinated and integrated antimalarial
                programme can be very effective.

                > The exposure is modest, and clearly poses
                > a far lower risk of death than malaria.

                DDT isn't that toxic in that way - while some studies have suggested
                a carcinogenic effect especially in some animals, plenty of others
                showed none in humans. . It's the food chain that's the problem -
                spraying it near waterways to kill the larvae is all well and good,
                but then the DDT is in the food chain, and concentrates in top
                carnivores. It also kills fish and crustaceans pretty well...

                DDT still could have a role to play - but not in spraying. Soak the
                bednets and bedding in a solution of DDT, so it fully impregnates.
                Dry, and you've got 12 - 24 months protection. Plus it's also highly
                effective in slashing the risks of other insect-borne disease like
                Chaga's.

                Charlie
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              • Deborah Harrell
                ... IIRC, there are meds she ought to take when she visits her former home (?assuming she still lives in the US). I should have been clearer; I was thinking of
                Message 7 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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                  Dan Minette <dsummersminet@...> wrote:
                  > > [I wrote:]

                  > >Silly, perhaps, to even
                  > > think of such, when children are dying for want of
                  > > a mosquito net, but waste of life really pisses me
                  > off.

                  > On that subject, my daughter Neli has had malaria
                  > several times and might
                  > die the next time she gets it. She's smart enough
                  > to use mosquito nets, but they still find her.

                  IIRC, there are meds she ought to take when she visits
                  her former home (?assuming she still lives in the US).
                  I should have been clearer; I was thinking of
                  insecticide-treated nets, which seem to repel them in
                  addition to blocking them physically;

                  http://unstats.un.org/unsd/mi/mi_dict_xrxx.asp?def_code=474
                  malaria prevention [code 474]
                  Mosquito nets, if properly used and maintained, can
                  provide a physical barrier to hungry mosquitos. If
                  treated with insecticide, the effectiveness of nets is
                  greatly improved, generating a chemical halo that
                  extends beyond the mosquito net itself. This tends to
                  repel or deter mosquitos from biting or shorten the
                  mosquito's life span so that she cannot transmit
                  malaria infection.The Roll Back Malaria global
                  partnership promotes the use of ITNs for everyone at
                  risk of malaria, especially children and pregnant
                  women. One of the targets set at the Abuja Summit in
                  April, 2000 was to have 60% of populations at risk
                  sleeping under ITNs by 2005. This will require 32
                  million mosquito nets and a similar number of
                  insecticide re-treatments each year.

                  > What is really bothersome to me is that people have
                  > successfully lobbied
                  > against very effective and cheap treatment, because
                  > they cannot be convinced
                  > by the facts that it works. All that has to be done
                  > is spay the walls of
                  > the house with DDT, and there is a far lower chance
                  > of getting malaria
                  > carrying mosquitoes in the house. The exposure is
                  > modest, and clearly poses
                  > a far lower risk of death than malaria. Mosquito
                  > nets help, but they
                  > require daily proper use. A kid going potty in the
                  > middle of the night can open the door to problems.

                  Localized micro-use is certainly justifiable; who has
                  lobbied and what nations have denied their people this
                  use?

                  >From the Solomon Islands, a 2003 abstract:
                  http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=636406
                  The incidence of malaria in Solomon Islands has been
                  declining since 1992, but there is a large
                  geographical variation between areas in the incidence
                  level and the rate of decline...The results showed
                  that DDT house spraying, insecticide treatment of
                  nets, and education about malaria were all
                  independently associated with reduction in incident
                  cases of malaria or fever, while larviciding with
                  temephos was not. This was true for confirmed malaria
                  cases even when a variable representing the passage of
                  time was included in the models. The results show how
                  much each method used was contributing to malaria
                  control in Solomon Islands and how it can be used to
                  design the most cost-effective package of
                  interventions. The evidence suggests that impregnated
                  bednets cannot easily replace DDT spraying without
                  substantial increase in incidence, but impregnated
                  nets do permit a substantial reduction in the amount
                  of DDT spraying.

                  Temephos is a type of larvicidal pesticide which usage
                  seems to be in the process of being phased out, as it
                  hits non-target species and seems to be less effective
                  than other means, as this 2000 Brazilian paper notes:

                  http://www.bioline.org.br/request?oc00183
                  ...Bacillus spp. based larvides are increasingly
                  replacing, with numerous advantages, chemical
                  insecticides in programmes for controlling black fly
                  and mosquito populations. Brazil was among the
                  pioneers in adopting Bacillus thuringiensis
                  israelensis (B.t.i) to control black flies. However,
                  the major current mosquito control programme in
                  Brazil, the Programme for Eradication of Aedes aegypti
                  launched in 1997, only recently decided to replace
                  temephos by B.t.i based larvicides, in the State of
                  Rio de Janeiro. In the last decade, works developed by
                  research groups in Brazilian institutions have
                  generated a significant contribution to this subject
                  through the isolation of B. sphaericus new strains,
                  the development of new products and the implementation
                  of field trials of Bacillus efficacy against mosquito
                  species under different environmental conditions...

                  ...the discovery, in 1964, of a mosquitocidal strain
                  of Bacillus sphaericus (B.s) (Kellen & Meyers 1964)
                  followed by the identification of several more active
                  strains and by the isolation of a new variety of B.
                  thuringiensis (B.t) (Goldberg & Margalit 1977)
                  designated as B. t. israelensis (B.t.i) (de Barjac
                  1978), toxic to mosquito and black flies larvae.
                  Highly toxic to the target organisms, these spore
                  forming bacteria are able to be mass produced, stored,
                  easily transported and applied. Their larvicidal
                  activity is due to large amounts of crystal proteins
                  produced during sporulation and transformed into
                  toxins under specific conditions after ingestion by
                  larvae of certain insect species. Their selectivity is
                  determined by both the structure of the proteins
                  produced by the bacterium strain and the presence of
                  proteolytic enzymes and receptor in the host larvae
                  midgut. The importance of these findings was prompted
                  recognized by scientists and a vast increase in
                  publications relating to these bacteria has been seen
                  since 1980.

                  Only two years after its discovery B.t.i was tested
                  against the Simulium damnosum complex and appeared as
                  a solution to the problem of Simulium populations
                  resistance to organophosphate larvicides in the
                  Onchocerciasis Control Program (OCP) in West Africa
                  (Guillet et al. 1990). A commercial formulation was
                  already available in 1981 (Guillet et al. 1982). Some
                  factors can explain fast development of the use of
                  B.t.i, which was introduced in routine larviciding
                  against black flies and mosquitoes in the large
                  programs OCP (Hougard & Back 1992) and KABS (Becker
                  1997), respectively, only five years after its
                  discovery: (a) high efficacy against target species,
                  causing catastrophic larval mortality in 24 h; (b)
                  selectivity; (c) ability to be produced in large scale
                  by fermentation; (d) a large knowledge base due not
                  only to the previous use of B.t against agricultural
                  pests but also to the recognition of its advantages
                  for vector control by scientists; (e) the urgent need
                  of an alternative, safe larvicide for use in the OCP,
                  and collaboration between World Health Organization
                  and industry for the development of commercial
                  formulations (Back & Barbazan 1994)...

                  ...More selective than B.t.i, B.s is specially toxic
                  to Culex and Anopheles larvae, and is very tolerant to
                  high levels of organic pollution. Its efficacy as a
                  biological control agent has been confirmed in several
                  programs and large scale trials in tropical and
                  temperate countries (Karch et al. 1992, Hougard et al.
                  1993, Sinègre et al. 1993, Kumar et al. 1994, Barbazan
                  et al. 1997, Yadav et al. 1997)...

                  ...Based on the knowledge available after two decades
                  of research and operational use of B.s and B.t.i
                  worldwide, these products are able to replace with
                  advantages synthetic insecticides wherever the use of
                  a larvicide is recommended for mosquito control. This
                  includes situations where a rapid response is needed,
                  as in the recent outbreak of the West Nile virus
                  transmitted by C. pipiens in New York city, where a
                  B.s formulation was used, following aerial
                  adulticiding (Ninivaggi 1999). Of course, larviciding
                  is only one of the intervention measures to be
                  integrated within environmental management, physical
                  measures (such as polystyrene bead layers in cesspits)
                  and classical biocontrol agents. In programmes based
                  on B.s as larvicide, other control agents should be
                  associated to avoid resistance development (Charles et
                  al. 2000, Regis & Nielsen-LeRoux 2000). The choice of
                  efficient and safe tools is not enough; control
                  interventions must be sustained if the population is
                  to be prevented from recovering.

                  Recently, the health authorities responsible for the
                  PEAa decided to replace temephos by B.t.i aiming to
                  manage A. aegypti resistance detected in the State of
                  Rio de Janeiro. On the other hand, B.s was the chosen
                  larvicide for vector control to be launched this year
                  by the Brazilian Programme for Elimination of
                  Lymphatic Filariasis.


                  Debbi
                  Damned Parasites Maru

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                • Deborah Harrell
                  ... IIRC, there are meds she ought to take when she visits her former home (?assuming she still lives in the US). I should have been clearer; I was thinking of
                  Message 8 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Dan Minette <dsummersminet@...> wrote:
                    > > [I wrote:]

                    > >Silly, perhaps, to even
                    > > think of such, when children are dying for want of
                    > > a mosquito net, but waste of life really pisses me
                    > off.

                    > On that subject, my daughter Neli has had malaria
                    > several times and might
                    > die the next time she gets it. She's smart enough
                    > to use mosquito nets, but they still find her.

                    IIRC, there are meds she ought to take when she visits
                    her former home (?assuming she still lives in the US).
                    I should have been clearer; I was thinking of
                    insecticide-treated nets, which seem to repel them in
                    addition to blocking them physically;

                    http://unstats.un.org/unsd/mi/mi_dict_xrxx.asp?def_code=474
                    malaria prevention [code 474]
                    Mosquito nets, if properly used and maintained, can
                    provide a physical barrier to hungry mosquitos. If
                    treated with insecticide, the effectiveness of nets is
                    greatly improved, generating a chemical halo that
                    extends beyond the mosquito net itself. This tends to
                    repel or deter mosquitos from biting or shorten the
                    mosquito's life span so that she cannot transmit
                    malaria infection.The Roll Back Malaria global
                    partnership promotes the use of ITNs for everyone at
                    risk of malaria, especially children and pregnant
                    women. One of the targets set at the Abuja Summit in
                    April, 2000 was to have 60% of populations at risk
                    sleeping under ITNs by 2005. This will require 32
                    million mosquito nets and a similar number of
                    insecticide re-treatments each year.

                    > What is really bothersome to me is that people have
                    > successfully lobbied
                    > against very effective and cheap treatment, because
                    > they cannot be convinced
                    > by the facts that it works. All that has to be done
                    > is spay the walls of
                    > the house with DDT, and there is a far lower chance
                    > of getting malaria
                    > carrying mosquitoes in the house. The exposure is
                    > modest, and clearly poses
                    > a far lower risk of death than malaria. Mosquito
                    > nets help, but they
                    > require daily proper use. A kid going potty in the
                    > middle of the night can open the door to problems.

                    Localized micro-use is certainly justifiable; who has
                    lobbied and what nations have denied their people this
                    use?

                    >From the Solomon Islands, a 2003 abstract:
                    http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=636406
                    The incidence of malaria in Solomon Islands has been
                    declining since 1992, but there is a large
                    geographical variation between areas in the incidence
                    level and the rate of decline...The results showed
                    that DDT house spraying, insecticide treatment of
                    nets, and education about malaria were all
                    independently associated with reduction in incident
                    cases of malaria or fever, while larviciding with
                    temephos was not. This was true for confirmed malaria
                    cases even when a variable representing the passage of
                    time was included in the models. The results show how
                    much each method used was contributing to malaria
                    control in Solomon Islands and how it can be used to
                    design the most cost-effective package of
                    interventions. The evidence suggests that impregnated
                    bednets cannot easily replace DDT spraying without
                    substantial increase in incidence, but impregnated
                    nets do permit a substantial reduction in the amount
                    of DDT spraying.

                    Temephos is a type of larvicidal pesticide which usage
                    seems to be in the process of being phased out, as it
                    hits non-target species and seems to be less effective
                    than other means, as this 2000 Brazilian paper notes:

                    http://www.bioline.org.br/request?oc00183
                    ...Bacillus spp. based larvides are increasingly
                    replacing, with numerous advantages, chemical
                    insecticides in programmes for controlling black fly
                    and mosquito populations. Brazil was among the
                    pioneers in adopting Bacillus thuringiensis
                    israelensis (B.t.i) to control black flies. However,
                    the major current mosquito control programme in
                    Brazil, the Programme for Eradication of Aedes aegypti
                    launched in 1997, only recently decided to replace
                    temephos by B.t.i based larvicides, in the State of
                    Rio de Janeiro. In the last decade, works developed by
                    research groups in Brazilian institutions have
                    generated a significant contribution to this subject
                    through the isolation of B. sphaericus new strains,
                    the development of new products and the implementation
                    of field trials of Bacillus efficacy against mosquito
                    species under different environmental conditions...

                    ...the discovery, in 1964, of a mosquitocidal strain
                    of Bacillus sphaericus (B.s) (Kellen & Meyers 1964)
                    followed by the identification of several more active
                    strains and by the isolation of a new variety of B.
                    thuringiensis (B.t) (Goldberg & Margalit 1977)
                    designated as B. t. israelensis (B.t.i) (de Barjac
                    1978), toxic to mosquito and black flies larvae.
                    Highly toxic to the target organisms, these spore
                    forming bacteria are able to be mass produced, stored,
                    easily transported and applied. Their larvicidal
                    activity is due to large amounts of crystal proteins
                    produced during sporulation and transformed into
                    toxins under specific conditions after ingestion by
                    larvae of certain insect species. Their selectivity is
                    determined by both the structure of the proteins
                    produced by the bacterium strain and the presence of
                    proteolytic enzymes and receptor in the host larvae
                    midgut. The importance of these findings was prompted
                    recognized by scientists and a vast increase in
                    publications relating to these bacteria has been seen
                    since 1980.

                    Only two years after its discovery B.t.i was tested
                    against the Simulium damnosum complex and appeared as
                    a solution to the problem of Simulium populations
                    resistance to organophosphate larvicides in the
                    Onchocerciasis Control Program (OCP) in West Africa
                    (Guillet et al. 1990). A commercial formulation was
                    already available in 1981 (Guillet et al. 1982). Some
                    factors can explain fast development of the use of
                    B.t.i, which was introduced in routine larviciding
                    against black flies and mosquitoes in the large
                    programs OCP (Hougard & Back 1992) and KABS (Becker
                    1997), respectively, only five years after its
                    discovery: (a) high efficacy against target species,
                    causing catastrophic larval mortality in 24 h; (b)
                    selectivity; (c) ability to be produced in large scale
                    by fermentation; (d) a large knowledge base due not
                    only to the previous use of B.t against agricultural
                    pests but also to the recognition of its advantages
                    for vector control by scientists; (e) the urgent need
                    of an alternative, safe larvicide for use in the OCP,
                    and collaboration between World Health Organization
                    and industry for the development of commercial
                    formulations (Back & Barbazan 1994)...

                    ...More selective than B.t.i, B.s is specially toxic
                    to Culex and Anopheles larvae, and is very tolerant to
                    high levels of organic pollution. Its efficacy as a
                    biological control agent has been confirmed in several
                    programs and large scale trials in tropical and
                    temperate countries (Karch et al. 1992, Hougard et al.
                    1993, Sinègre et al. 1993, Kumar et al. 1994, Barbazan
                    et al. 1997, Yadav et al. 1997)...

                    ...Based on the knowledge available after two decades
                    of research and operational use of B.s and B.t.i
                    worldwide, these products are able to replace with
                    advantages synthetic insecticides wherever the use of
                    a larvicide is recommended for mosquito control. This
                    includes situations where a rapid response is needed,
                    as in the recent outbreak of the West Nile virus
                    transmitted by C. pipiens in New York city, where a
                    B.s formulation was used, following aerial
                    adulticiding (Ninivaggi 1999). Of course, larviciding
                    is only one of the intervention measures to be
                    integrated within environmental management, physical
                    measures (such as polystyrene bead layers in cesspits)
                    and classical biocontrol agents. In programmes based
                    on B.s as larvicide, other control agents should be
                    associated to avoid resistance development (Charles et
                    al. 2000, Regis & Nielsen-LeRoux 2000). The choice of
                    efficient and safe tools is not enough; control
                    interventions must be sustained if the population is
                    to be prevented from recovering.

                    Recently, the health authorities responsible for the
                    PEAa decided to replace temephos by B.t.i aiming to
                    manage A. aegypti resistance detected in the State of
                    Rio de Janeiro. On the other hand, B.s was the chosen
                    larvicide for vector control to be launched this year
                    by the Brazilian Programme for Elimination of
                    Lymphatic Filariasis.


                    Debbi
                    Damned Parasites Maru

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                  • Deborah Harrell
                    Sorry for the double-send - I was trying to save it, not resend! Debbi who simply does not get along with computers!
                    Message 9 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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                      Sorry for the double-send - I was trying to save it,
                      not resend!

                      Debbi
                      who simply does not get along with computers!

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                    • Deborah Harrell
                      ... ... I came across this, from Mexico 1996, in my searching:
                      Message 10 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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                        > Charlie Bell <charlie@...> wrote:

                        <snippage>
                        > There are other effective insecticides, and programs
                        > in Mexico in
                        > particular have shown that a coordinated and
                        > integrated antimalarial
                        > programme can be very effective.

                        > DDT isn't that toxic in that way - while some
                        > studies have suggested
                        > a carcinogenic effect especially in some animals,
                        > plenty of others
                        > showed none in humans. . It's the food chain that's
                        > the problem -
                        > spraying it near waterways to kill the larvae is all
                        > well and good,
                        > but then the DDT is in the food chain, and
                        > concentrates in top
                        > carnivores. It also kills fish and crustaceans
                        > pretty well...

                        I came across this, from Mexico 1996, in my searching:
                        http://www.ibiblio.org/intergarden/agriculture/forums/sustainable-agriculture2/msg01518.html

                        ...Malaria was among the top ten causes of death in
                        Mexico in the 1950s, but there have been no deaths
                        attributed to the disease since 1982, according to Mr.
                        Sanchez. In order to reduce reliance on DDT, the
                        Mexican government will improve efforts to treat
                        people infected with the disease, monitor changes in
                        the quantity and location of
                        malaria cases and eliminate breeding sites through
                        drainage
                        and other methods. In addition, anti-malaria campaigns
                        will
                        use other insecticides such as malathion, temephos,
                        bendiocarb and fenitrothion...

                        ...Food contamination could account for the occurance
                        of
                        unexpectedly high levels of DDE, a breakdown product
                        of DDT,
                        in breast milk of women in Mexico City, where DDT has
                        not
                        been used in malaria campaigns. The Environmental
                        Health
                        Perspectives report found that DDT levels in breast
                        milk
                        ranged from 0.594 mg/kg in women in Mexico City to
                        5.02 mg/kg
                        in women living in tropical Mexico, where anti-malaria

                        campaigns using DDT continue. Since the late 1970s,
                        levels of
                        DDE in breast milk in Mexico have been two to three
                        times
                        greater than corresponding levels in samples analyzed
                        in the
                        U.S. during that same period.

                        According to the Environmental Health Perspectives
                        report,
                        breast cancer is the second leading cause of death
                        among
                        Mexican women, with a rate of breast cancer deaths in
                        1994 of
                        2.8 per 100,000. The report points out that, despite
                        limitations in the studies linking DDT to breast
                        cancer, many
                        recent studies have shown a dose-response
                        relationship: the
                        higher the levels of DDT and DDT breakdown products in
                        women,
                        the more likely that they will have breast cancer.


                        Of course, such chemical contamination could be a
                        marker for other, unmeasured, exposures which are the
                        'real' cause of a cancer.

                        Debbi
                        whose cocoa intake does *not* correlate with Velveeta
                        intake, irregardless of the statistics! ;)

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                      • Dan Minette
                        ... Both statements are true. The problem, from what I understand, is that there are not other effective, very cheap insecticides...DDT is far cheaper than
                        Message 11 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > From: brin-l-bounces@... [mailto:brin-l-bounces@...] On
                          > Behalf Of Charlie Bell
                          > Sent: Monday, June 05, 2006 5:40 PM
                          > To: Killer Bs Discussion
                          > Subject: Re: Malaria
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > There are other effective insecticides, and programs in Mexico in
                          > particular have shown that a coordinated and integrated antimalarial
                          > programme can be very effective.

                          Both statements are true. The problem, from what I understand, is that
                          there are not other effective, very cheap insecticides...DDT is far cheaper
                          than the alternatives...as far as I understand.


                          > > The exposure is modest, and clearly poses
                          > > a far lower risk of death than malaria.
                          >
                          > DDT isn't that toxic in that way - while some studies have suggested
                          > a carcinogenic effect especially in some animals, plenty of others
                          > showed none in humans. . It's the food chain that's the problem -
                          > spraying it near waterways to kill the larvae is all well and good,
                          > but then the DDT is in the food chain, and concentrates in top
                          > carnivores. It also kills fish and crustaceans pretty well...

                          I won't argue with that statement...it matches what I know.

                          > DDT still could have a role to play - but not in spraying. Soak the
                          > bednets and bedding in a solution of DDT, so it fully impregnates.
                          > Dry, and you've got 12 - 24 months protection. Plus it's also highly
                          > effective in slashing the risks of other insect-borne disease like
                          > Chaga's.

                          Our only point of difference may be whether spraying the walls of a house is
                          problematic. Debbie's post indicates that its effectiveness has been
                          documented, along with education and treatment of bedding. If it is the
                          cheapest and easiest way to have an impact, then it should give the biggest
                          bang for the buck right out of the gate. That's why I want it included and
                          the first money available spent on it.

                          Dan M.




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                        • Charlie Bell
                          ... The problem is - who s doing the spraying, and who s monitoring the use of the DDT. I d far rather see it *painted* on in some form (maybe an actual
                          Message 12 of 12 , Jun 5, 2006
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                            On 06/06/2006, at 4:58 AM, Dan Minette wrote:
                            >
                            > Our only point of difference may be whether spraying the walls of a
                            > house is
                            > problematic. Debbie's post indicates that its effectiveness has been
                            > documented, along with education and treatment of bedding. If it
                            > is the
                            > cheapest and easiest way to have an impact, then it should give the
                            > biggest
                            > bang for the buck right out of the gate. That's why I want it
                            > included and
                            > the first money available spent on it.

                            The problem is - who's doing the spraying, and who's monitoring the
                            use of the DDT. I'd far rather see it *painted* on in some form
                            (maybe an actual paint-like substance? Spruce up your house and fight
                            malaria! Strength through Interior Decoration!) , because as soon as
                            people get it in their heads that spraying it in the house is OK,
                            some muppet will make the leap back to "let's spray it outside" or
                            worse "let's spray it in the waterways" and we're back where we started.

                            Had long discussions with my boss about this when I worked in the
                            malaria lab at Imperial College.

                            Charlie


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