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Re: Blog entry with interesting comment

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  • Julia Thompson
    ... It is very much not the end of the world; it is the beginning of figuring out what is going to work best for her in her life. ... I know relatively little
    Message 1 of 19 , May 3, 2006
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      PAT MATHEWS wrote:
      >> From: "Horn, John" <JHORN@...>
      >>
      >>> On Behalf Of Julia Thompson
      >>>
      >>> An essay criticizing skeptics is torn apart here:
      >>>
      >>> http://www.autismstreet.org/weblog/?p=39
      >>>
      >>> And the first commenter is James Randi. So I just had to share.
      >>
      >> A very interesting article. Even more interesting, for me, was the
      >> site itself. My daughter was just diagnosed with Asperger's
      >> Syndrome and ADHD (inattentive type). I know there are (or were)
      >> some on this list with AS or ADHD. Any recommended sites out there
      >> for a Mom and Dad struggling to put some order into all this
      >> chaos?
      >>
      >> - jmh
      >
      > This is going to be a long post of the "dump the load" variety, so
      > anyone not interested can either delete or skim, but here goes:
      >
      > 1) It's not the end of the world. I wouldn't advise her to become,
      > say, an accountant (big mistake on my part!) but we're talking one of
      > the two differences known to be associated with a creative upside.
      > (the other being 'being mildly bipolar')

      It is very much not the end of the world; it is the beginning of
      figuring out what is going to work best for her in her life.

      > 2) In my observation, the ADD books have a few coping tricks worth
      > mentioning, but 90% of their focus is on the sort of hyperactive boys
      > who are really, really good at grabbing opportunities and running
      > with them; and they all push for medication so hard you'd think they
      > were sponsored by Big Pharma. Get them from the library if you have
      > to bother at all.

      I know relatively little about ADD. Go with what Pat says. :)

      > 3) Again in my observation, Aspies come in roughly two flavors: the
      > organized, single-focused, linear mind; and the absent-minded
      > professor/free-spirited idea mill. Inattentive ADD goes with the
      > latter. If you have any use for the Myer-Briggs at all, these map
      > very roughly onto INTJ and INTP respectively. I mention this because
      > books on the Myer-Briggs (a system which is totally non-judgmental
      > and IMO the only system that does NOT make judgments) has a lot of
      > good tips for life, love, acreers, and living with your... in this
      > case, I'd say INTP --- which are quite useful even though they're
      > designed for the 'normal' end of the spectrum.

      It's a reasonable generalization, although a few come up as S on the S/N
      divide, or as F on the F/T divide. I've never seen an aspie declare
      their MBT as Exxx, though, even the ones who seek more social
      interaction. :) Generally figuring out what strengths and weaknesses
      are, which MBTI does for a number of things, is a Good Thing.

      > 4) Book: my all-time favorite is Liane Holliday Willey's "Pretending
      > to be Normal." And it's Dr. Willey; she has a PhD in, I think, some
      > branch of linguistics. And is happily married with children. But
      > there are others including some fictional characters I find quite
      > likeable, even loveable. (Terry Pratchett's Leonard of Quirm,
      > anyone?)

      OK, now I'm REALLY regretting I didn't buy it this morning.

      Next time I order from amazon. Next time.

      I may get to borrow it before then.

      Or I may go back to that bookstore sooner rather than later.

      > 5) The very first thing I'd do in your shoes is find out her
      > strengths and work from there. Also her obsessions if she has any.
      > Don't let her dismiss them as "Oh, that's EASY" the way some people
      > do, apparently thinking the only way to make a living is at something
      > you have to work on. Wrong. Then mildly correct her weaknesses
      > through *teaching.* A lot of stuff can be learned, I'm here to tell
      > you.

      And don't dismiss *anything* that anyone makes a career in as a possible
      career.

      Oh, and work on figuring out what her specific learning style is -- if
      you go with that way working on things at home, at least, it will make
      things a lot easier on her. It will probably be harder on her anyway
      with the ADHD, even if her "easiest" method is applied; don't make it
      harder for her than it has to be. (There was a post very recently on
      the "Processing in Parts" blog about this, and someone with ADD
      contributed some good stuff in a comment.)

      > 6) Beware doomsayers (Some on wrongplanet and other nets but also out
      > there among the medpros) who wail "It's a Horrible Disability! That
      > must be Cured! With Medication! And once she gets an official Dx, she
      > can Go On Welfare!" Grrrrrrrr............!@#$!!!!

      Anyone promising a cure should be shot.

      Any medication should be prescribed by a doctor with some expertise in
      the area. A pediatric neurologist would be good, if you're hooked up
      with one. I would not have my own kid getting brain-targeted meds from
      anyone but a neurologist.

      Oh, and http://crazymeds.org, very NSFW for language in spots (including
      the front page), has good info on meds. (A decent number of them have
      been used by the people running the site, and the site may be a better
      source of info on weird side effects than many.)

      > 7) Workarounds for inattentive ADD include one that's really useful
      > and really, really cheap. You get a hard-blacked flip-top pad down at
      > Walgreens and the associated input device. Make a To Do list of
      > whatever seems to be needed. Wild Ideas and For the Future on a back
      > page. Obvious but let's not lose track on the front page. If need be,
      > "Have done Today." Sounds anal, I know, but there are times it;s
      > really worthwhile to have a little list.

      Sounds like good advice. Does having a small pad and appropriate input
      device on hand most of the time help, as well? I've heard that for a
      lot of things. My problem is the size of the system; I've just started
      using a more expensive, more technologically advanced device that works
      while I'm driving, as well. (But I'm not ADHD, none of my children have
      a dx of that, so I have no idea how that part of the equation works into
      it from anything resembling a personal standpoint.)


      >
      > Well, enough rambling and babbling.
      >
      > Hope this helps,
      >
      > Pat

      You've given *me* a lot to think about, and I think you made an
      absolutely wonderful post.

      Julia

      _______________________________________________
      http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
    • PAT MATHEWS
      Role models, female: (on TV) Bones Role models, female: (in SF) Dr. Susan Calvin in I, Robot (linear & organized variety) More role models on TV: Adrian
      Message 2 of 19 , May 3, 2006
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        Role models, female: (on TV) Bones
        Role models, female: (in SF) Dr. Susan Calvin in "I, Robot" (linear &
        organized variety)\

        More role models on TV: Adrian Monk; Detective Goram on Law & Order CI; "The
        designated kid" on just about any CSI-type show; special attention to Dr.
        Reid on Criminal Minds and Bone's kid assistant on Bones.

        Role model in SF, male, that I'm madly in love with: in C.S. Friedman's THIS
        ALIEN SHORE, Dr Kio Masada, one of the organized kind again, quite
        reminiscent of Spock but more rounded out. A couple of very moving scenes
        when he's reminiscing about his late wife.

        And just for kicks & giggles: Carol O'Connell's JUDAS CHILD is set in a
        boarding school for the extremely gifted & unusual child; I swear to Ghod
        it's the same school Temple Grandin attended, only much improved & updated.




        http://idiotgrrl.livejournal.com/





        >From: Julia Thompson <julia@...>
        >Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <brin-l@...>
        >To: Killer Bs Discussion <brin-l@...>
        >Subject: Re: Blog entry with interesting comment
        >Date: Wed, 03 May 2006 17:37:50 -0500
        >
        >PAT MATHEWS wrote:
        >>>From: "Horn, John" <JHORN@...>
        >>>
        >>>>On Behalf Of Julia Thompson
        >>>>
        >>>>An essay criticizing skeptics is torn apart here:
        >>>>
        >>>>http://www.autismstreet.org/weblog/?p=39
        >>>>
        >>>>And the first commenter is James Randi. So I just had to share.
        >>>
        >>>A very interesting article. Even more interesting, for me, was the
        >>> site itself. My daughter was just diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome
        >>>and ADHD (inattentive type). I know there are (or were) some on this
        >>>list with AS or ADHD. Any recommended sites out there
        >>> for a Mom and Dad struggling to put some order into all this
        >>>chaos?
        >>>
        >>>- jmh
        >>
        >>This is going to be a long post of the "dump the load" variety, so anyone
        >>not interested can either delete or skim, but here goes:
        >>
        >>1) It's not the end of the world. I wouldn't advise her to become,
        >>say, an accountant (big mistake on my part!) but we're talking one of
        >>the two differences known to be associated with a creative upside.
        >>(the other being 'being mildly bipolar')
        >
        >It is very much not the end of the world; it is the beginning of
        >figuring out what is going to work best for her in her life.
        >
        >>2) In my observation, the ADD books have a few coping tricks worth
        >>mentioning, but 90% of their focus is on the sort of hyperactive boys
        >> who are really, really good at grabbing opportunities and running
        >>with them; and they all push for medication so hard you'd think they
        >>were sponsored by Big Pharma. Get them from the library if you have
        >>to bother at all.
        >
        >I know relatively little about ADD. Go with what Pat says. :)
        >
        >>3) Again in my observation, Aspies come in roughly two flavors: the
        >>organized, single-focused, linear mind; and the absent-minded
        >>professor/free-spirited idea mill. Inattentive ADD goes with the
        >>latter. If you have any use for the Myer-Briggs at all, these map
        >>very roughly onto INTJ and INTP respectively. I mention this because
        >>books on the Myer-Briggs (a system which is totally non-judgmental
        >>and IMO the only system that does NOT make judgments) has a lot of
        >>good tips for life, love, acreers, and living with your... in this
        >>case, I'd say INTP --- which are quite useful even though they're
        >>designed for the 'normal' end of the spectrum.
        >
        >It's a reasonable generalization, although a few come up as S on the S/N
        >divide, or as F on the F/T divide. I've never seen an aspie declare their
        >MBT as Exxx, though, even the ones who seek more social interaction. :)
        >Generally figuring out what strengths and weaknesses are, which MBTI does
        >for a number of things, is a Good Thing.
        >
        >>4) Book: my all-time favorite is Liane Holliday Willey's "Pretending
        >>to be Normal." And it's Dr. Willey; she has a PhD in, I think, some
        >>branch of linguistics. And is happily married with children. But
        >>there are others including some fictional characters I find quite
        >>likeable, even loveable. (Terry Pratchett's Leonard of Quirm,
        >>anyone?)
        >
        >OK, now I'm REALLY regretting I didn't buy it this morning.
        >
        >Next time I order from amazon. Next time.
        >
        >I may get to borrow it before then.
        >
        >Or I may go back to that bookstore sooner rather than later.
        >
        >>5) The very first thing I'd do in your shoes is find out her
        >>strengths and work from there. Also her obsessions if she has any.
        >>Don't let her dismiss them as "Oh, that's EASY" the way some people
        >>do, apparently thinking the only way to make a living is at something
        >>you have to work on. Wrong. Then mildly correct her weaknesses
        >>through *teaching.* A lot of stuff can be learned, I'm here to tell
        >>you.
        >
        >And don't dismiss *anything* that anyone makes a career in as a possible
        >career.
        >
        >Oh, and work on figuring out what her specific learning style is -- if you
        >go with that way working on things at home, at least, it will make things a
        >lot easier on her. It will probably be harder on her anyway with the ADHD,
        >even if her "easiest" method is applied; don't make it harder for her than
        >it has to be. (There was a post very recently on the "Processing in Parts"
        >blog about this, and someone with ADD contributed some good stuff in a
        >comment.)
        >
        >>6) Beware doomsayers (Some on wrongplanet and other nets but also out
        >> there among the medpros) who wail "It's a Horrible Disability! That
        >>must be Cured! With Medication! And once she gets an official Dx, she
        >>can Go On Welfare!" Grrrrrrrr............!@#$!!!!
        >
        >Anyone promising a cure should be shot.
        >
        >Any medication should be prescribed by a doctor with some expertise in the
        >area. A pediatric neurologist would be good, if you're hooked up with one.
        > I would not have my own kid getting brain-targeted meds from anyone but a
        >neurologist.
        >
        >Oh, and http://crazymeds.org, very NSFW for language in spots (including
        >the front page), has good info on meds. (A decent number of them have been
        >used by the people running the site, and the site may be a better source of
        >info on weird side effects than many.)
        >
        >>7) Workarounds for inattentive ADD include one that's really useful
        >>and really, really cheap. You get a hard-blacked flip-top pad down at
        >> Walgreens and the associated input device. Make a To Do list of
        >>whatever seems to be needed. Wild Ideas and For the Future on a back
        >>page. Obvious but let's not lose track on the front page. If need be,
        >>"Have done Today." Sounds anal, I know, but there are times it;s
        >>really worthwhile to have a little list.
        >
        >Sounds like good advice. Does having a small pad and appropriate input
        >device on hand most of the time help, as well? I've heard that for a lot
        >of things. My problem is the size of the system; I've just started using a
        >more expensive, more technologically advanced device that works while I'm
        >driving, as well. (But I'm not ADHD, none of my children have a dx of
        >that, so I have no idea how that part of the equation works into it from
        >anything resembling a personal standpoint.)
        >
        >
        >>
        >>Well, enough rambling and babbling.
        >>
        >>Hope this helps,
        >>
        >>Pat
        >
        >You've given *me* a lot to think about, and I think you made an absolutely
        >wonderful post.
        >
        > Julia
        >
        >_______________________________________________
        >http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l


        _______________________________________________
        http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
      • Dave Land
        ... I found the ideas of Thom Hartmann very helpful: http://www.thomhartmann.com/home-add.shtml Hartmann is the creator of the Hunter/Farmer metaphor that
        Message 3 of 19 , May 3, 2006
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          On May 3, 2006, at 12:52 PM, Horn, John wrote:

          > A very interesting article. Even more interesting, for me, was the
          > site itself. My daughter was just diagnosed with Asperger's
          > Syndrome and ADHD (inattentive type). I know there are (or were)
          > some on this list with AS or ADHD. Any recommended sites out there
          > for a Mom and Dad struggling to put some order into all this chaos?

          I found the ideas of Thom Hartmann very helpful:

          http://www.thomhartmann.com/home-add.shtml

          Hartmann is the creator of the "Hunter/Farmer" metaphor that
          describes those of us with various shades of ADHD as exhibiting the
          characteristics of "hunters" ("global" [as opposed to narrow]
          attention, preference for immediate rewards and short-term highly
          intense efforts, periods of hyperfocus, and so forth), while the
          majority of society exhibits the characteristics of "farmers". He
          describes it better than I...

          Hartmann is also apparently a liberal radio commentator.

          When I was really suffering from the effects of my ADHD (which may
          have been exacerbated by my brain tumor), I enjoyed the following
          site, which I found while researching the relationship between ADHD
          and Myers-Briggs types.

          NOTICE: This site apparently came under attack from some sort of
          spyware, so they installed a javascript that almost immediately
          redirects you to takebacktheweb.com. It's damned annoying, but on my
          Mac, I can prevent the redirect by immediately and repeatedly
          pressing the escape key once the page has loaded:

          http://borntoexplore.org/

          Sincerely,

          Dave "Oh look! An Owl!" Land

          _______________________________________________
          http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
        • Dave Land
          ... On the latter site is a page (not infected with the redirect script) that brings Hartmann s ideas with some others in a very succinct way:
          Message 4 of 19 , May 3, 2006
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            On May 3, 2006, at 5:26 PM, Dave Land wrote:

            > I found the ideas of Thom Hartmann very helpful:
            >
            > http://www.thomhartmann.com/home-add.shtml

            > http://borntoexplore.org/

            On the latter site is a page (not infected with the redirect
            script) that brings Hartmann's ideas with some others in a
            very succinct way:

            http://www.borntoexplore.org/hunter.htm

            Good stuff,

            Dave


            _______________________________________________
            http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
          • Kanandarqu@aol.com
            ... Combining both of the above, you may want to try Now, Discover Your Strengths: How to Develop Your Talents and Those of the People You Manage Marcus
            Message 5 of 19 , May 3, 2006
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              >>Pat

              >Julia

              >> 3) Again in my observation, Aspies come in roughly two flavors: the
              >> organized, single-focused, linear mind; and the absent-minded
              >> professor/free-spirited idea mill. Inattentive ADD goes with the
              >> latter. If you have any use for the Myer-Briggs at all, these map
              >> very roughly onto INTJ and INTP respectively. I mention this because
              >> books on the Myer-Briggs (a system which is totally non-judgmental
              >> and IMO the only system that does NOT make judgments) has a lot of
              >> good tips for life, love, acreers, and living with your... in this
              >> case, I'd say INTP --- which are quite useful even though they're
              >> designed for the 'normal' end of the spectrum.


              >Oh, and work on figuring out what her specific learning style is -- if
              >you go with that way working on things at home, at least, it will make
              >things a lot easier on her. It will probably be harder on her anyway
              >with the ADHD, even if her "easiest" method is applied; don't make it
              >harder for her than it has to be. (There was a post very recently on
              >the "Processing in Parts" blog about this, and someone with ADD
              >contributed some good stuff in a comment.)

              Combining both of the above, you may want to try

              Now, Discover Your Strengths: How to Develop Your Talents
              and Those of the People You Manage
              Marcus Buckingham, Donald O. Clifton

              Based on thousands of "leaders" from multiple backgrounds,
              this inventory looks at what your top 5 strengths out of 35
              distilled categories. As opposed to Myers-Briggs that implies
              the opposite of your strengths is your weakness, this profile
              doesn't imply weaknesses- only things that impede what you
              want to do are even considered near weaknesses that need to
              be addressed only if they get in your way. Really neat- there
              is another earlier book that talks about how an individual
              "Soars with strengths". There is a great beginning that
              relates strengths to kids in school, a bit unconventional
              from some of the schooling ideas that I grew up with, but I
              have to say it makes sense.

              I haven't looked in a while, but I recall finding some "online"
              references for 4MAT learning styles. Some schools are
              subcontracting special ed programs to Sylvan Learning
              so it might be worth investigating.

              Dee- handing in a final, then 2 weeks to catch up on the
              rest of life
              _______________________________________________
              http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
            • Nick Arnett
              ... There are people here with ADHD... what were we talking about? Oh, yes. Some books... You Mean I m not Lazy, Stupid or Crazy, anything by Thom Hartmann,
              Message 6 of 19 , May 3, 2006
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                On 5/3/06, Horn, John <JHORN@...> wrote:

                > Syndrome and ADHD (inattentive type). I know there are (or were)
                > some on this list with AS or ADHD. Any recommended sites out there
                > for a Mom and Dad struggling to put some order into all this chaos?


                There are people here with ADHD... what were we talking about?

                Oh, yes. Some books... "You Mean I'm not Lazy, Stupid or Crazy," anything
                by Thom Hartmann, "ADD and Creativity" by Weiss, "Change Your Brain, Change
                Your Life," by Amen.

                Look, an owl!

                Nick



                --
                Nick Arnett
                narnett@...
                Messages: 408-904-7198
                _______________________________________________
                http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
              • Nick Arnett
                ... And a former CompuServe sysop, back in the late 80s when I also was. Nick -- Nick Arnett narnett@mccmedia.com Messages: 408-904-7198
                Message 7 of 19 , May 3, 2006
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                  On 5/3/06, Dave Land <dland@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Hartmann is also apparently a liberal radio commentator.


                  And a former CompuServe sysop, back in the late '80s when I also was.

                  Nick


                  --
                  Nick Arnett
                  narnett@...
                  Messages: 408-904-7198
                  _______________________________________________
                  http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
                • Horn, John
                  ... Wow. Thanks very much (and everyone else who responded as well)!! Much more than I expected. ... I know it definitely isn t the end of the world. It
                  Message 8 of 19 , May 4, 2006
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                    > On Behalf Of PAT MATHEWS
                    >
                    > This is going to be a long post of the "dump the load"
                    > variety, so anyone not interested can either delete or skim,
                    > but here goes:

                    Wow. Thanks very much (and everyone else who responded as well)!!
                    Much more than I expected.

                    > 1) It's not the end of the world.

                    I know it definitely isn't the end of the world. It helps a lot to
                    finally know what is going on and have some answers to (previously)
                    bewildering behavior. And strategies for coping and dealing with
                    it. One of the most wonderful things is to finally have an answer
                    for the other parents who kept saying "Why don't you just spank
                    her/discipline more/etc?" We knew instinctively that that was
                    absolutely the wrong thing to do. Now we know why.

                    > I wouldn't advise her to become, say, an accountant

                    She's wanted to be a kindergarten teacher since she was in, well,
                    kindergarten. She's kinda obsessed with it. ;-)

                    > 2) In my observation, the ADD books have a few coping tricks
                    > worth mentioning, but 90% of their focus is on the sort of
                    > hyperactive boys who are really, really good at grabbing
                    > opportunities and running with them; and they all push for
                    > medication so hard you'd think they were sponsored by Big
                    > Pharma

                    All the books are aimed at boys. Both the AS and the ADD books. It
                    seems that AS presents itself differently in girls so that makes it
                    very difficult to pick good books. Speaking of medicine, she's been
                    on an anti-depressant for a bit which seems to be making a big
                    difference. She just started a stimulant a week ago. Too early to
                    see if it has had any effect at this point.

                    > 3) Again in my observation, Aspies come in roughly two
                    > flavors: the organized, single-focused, linear mind; and the
                    > absent-minded professor/free-spirited idea mill. Inattentive
                    > ADD goes with the latter. If you have any use for the
                    > Myer-Briggs at all, these map very roughly onto INTJ and INTP
                    > respectively. I mention this because books on the Myer-Briggs
                    > (a system which is totally non-judgmental and IMO the only
                    > system that does NOT make judgments) has a lot of good tips
                    > for life, love, acreers, and living with your... in this
                    > case, I'd say INTP --- which are quite useful even though
                    > they're designed for the 'normal' end of the spectrum.

                    The second one of those is definitely my daughter.

                    Wait a minute, *I'm" INTP!! Hmmm.... My wife and I are very into
                    Myers-Briggs. I'm not sure what my daughter is. I don't think it
                    is either one of those, though. I'll have to ask my wife.

                    > 7) Workarounds for inattentive ADD include one that's really
                    > useful and really, really cheap. You get a hard-blacked
                    > flip-top pad down at Walgreens and the associated input
                    > device. Make a To Do list of whatever seems to be needed.
                    > Wild Ideas and For the Future on a back page. Obvious but
                    > let's not lose track on the front page. If need be, "Have
                    > done Today." Sounds anal, I know, but there are times it;s
                    > really worthwhile to have a little list.

                    I'll have to keep that one in mind.

                    > Hope this helps,

                    Yes, it helps a lot!

                    - jmh
                    _______________________________________________
                    http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
                  • PAT MATHEWS
                    ... Glad to be of help. ... Wish my dad had had your instincts! ... Well, then - go for it! One of my close friends, Jay Bainbridge, is a painter who teaches
                    Message 9 of 19 , May 4, 2006
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                      >From: "Horn, John" <JHORN@...>
                      >
                      >Wow. Thanks very much (and everyone else who responded as well)!!
                      >Much more than I expected.

                      Glad to be of help.

                      >
                      > > 1) It's not the end of the world.
                      >
                      >I know it definitely isn't the end of the world. It helps a lot to
                      >finally know what is going on and have some answers to (previously)
                      >bewildering behavior. And strategies for coping and dealing with
                      >it. One of the most wonderful things is to finally have an answer
                      >for the other parents who kept saying "Why don't you just spank
                      >her/discipline more/etc?" We knew instinctively that that was
                      >absolutely the wrong thing to do. Now we know why.

                      Wish my dad had had your instincts!

                      >
                      > > I wouldn't advise her to become, say, an accountant
                      >
                      >She's wanted to be a kindergarten teacher since she was in, well,
                      >kindergarten. She's kinda obsessed with it. ;-)

                      Well, then - go for it! One of my close friends, Jay Bainbridge, is a
                      painter who teaches preschool - at a local synagogue. (Did they mind that
                      he's not Jewish? No, but he gets the High Holy Days off anyway.)

                      . It
                      >seems that AS presents itself differently in girls so that makes it
                      >very difficult to pick good books.

                      Autobiographies.

                      Gorilla Nation by Dawn Price-Hughes (or is it Hughes-Price?) Love her
                      observation that academic politics makes a lot more sense when you treat the
                      department heads and senior professors as if they were silverbacks.

                      Pretending to be Normal by Liane Holliday Willey. I was grabbed by the title
                      because it was my autobiography in two words. Excellent book; interesting
                      person. And ... DO watch BONES on TV.

                      Speaking of medicine, she's been
                      >on an anti-depressant for a bit which seems to be making a big
                      >difference. She just started a stimulant a week ago. Too early to
                      >see if it has had any effect at this point.

                      I've been on caffeine for 52 years. Self-medication seems to be part of it.

                      >
                      > > 3) Again in my observation, Aspies come in roughly two
                      > > flavors: the organized, single-focused, linear mind; and the
                      > > absent-minded professor/free-spirited idea mill. Inattentive
                      > > ADD goes with the latter. If you have any use for the
                      > > Myer-Briggs at all, these map very roughly onto INTJ and INTP
                      > > respectively. I mention this because books on the Myer-Briggs
                      > > (a system which is totally non-judgmental and IMO the only
                      > > system that does NOT make judgments) has a lot of good tips
                      > > for life, love, acreers, and living with your... in this
                      > > case, I'd say INTP --- which are quite useful even though
                      > > they're designed for the 'normal' end of the spectrum.
                      >
                      >The second one of those is definitely my daughter.
                      >
                      >Wait a minute, *I'm" INTP!! Hmmm.... My wife and I are very into
                      >Myers-Briggs. I'm not sure what my daughter is. I don't think it
                      >is either one of those, though. I'll have to ask my wife.

                      YEs, the "kindergarten teacher" interest isn't the usual INTP thing, is it?
                      However, whatever she is, go for it.

                      >
                      >I'll have to keep that one in mind.
                      >
                      > > Hope this helps,
                      >
                      >Yes, it helps a lot!
                      >
                      > - jmh
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                    • Nick Arnett
                      ... I think you may be mistaken about this. Many of the ADD books are written by women, many of whom are ADD themselves You Mean I m not Lazy Stupid or
                      Message 10 of 19 , May 5, 2006
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                        On 5/4/06, Horn, John <JHORN@...> wrote:

                        >
                        > All the books are aimed at boys. Both the AS and the ADD books. It
                        > seems that AS presents itself differently in girls so that makes it
                        > very difficult to pick good books.


                        I think you may be mistaken about this. Many of the ADD books are written
                        by women, many of whom are ADD themselves

                        "You Mean I'm not Lazy Stupid or Crazy" was written by two women. Lynn
                        Weiss, whose books I also appreciated, appears to be a woman, judging by her
                        photo.

                        This list on Amazon.com -- *ADD experience (by a woman) --* has a bunch of
                        books about ADD, many written by women :

                        http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/listmania/fullview/9WZ48993GPB2/104-0155161-9687918?%5Fencoding=UTF8

                        Nick

                        --
                        Nick Arnett
                        narnett@...
                        Messages: 408-904-7198
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                      • PAT MATHEWS
                        Thanks! http://idiotgrrl.livejournal.com/ ... _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
                        Message 11 of 19 , May 5, 2006
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                          Thanks!




                          http://idiotgrrl.livejournal.com/





                          >From: "Nick Arnett" <narnett@...>
                          >Reply-To: Killer Bs Discussion <brin-l@...>
                          >To: "Killer Bs Discussion" <brin-l@...>
                          >Subject: Re: Blog entry with interesting comment
                          >Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 07:00:19 -0700
                          >
                          >On 5/4/06, Horn, John <JHORN@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >>
                          >>All the books are aimed at boys. Both the AS and the ADD books. It
                          >>seems that AS presents itself differently in girls so that makes it
                          >>very difficult to pick good books.
                          >
                          >
                          >I think you may be mistaken about this. Many of the ADD books are written
                          >by women, many of whom are ADD themselves
                          >
                          >"You Mean I'm not Lazy Stupid or Crazy" was written by two women. Lynn
                          >Weiss, whose books I also appreciated, appears to be a woman, judging by
                          >her
                          >photo.
                          >
                          >This list on Amazon.com -- *ADD experience (by a woman) --* has a bunch of
                          >books about ADD, many written by women :
                          >
                          >http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/listmania/fullview/9WZ48993GPB2/104-0155161-9687918?%5Fencoding=UTF8
                          >
                          >Nick
                          >
                          >--
                          >Nick Arnett
                          >narnett@...
                          >Messages: 408-904-7198
                          >_______________________________________________
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                        • Deborah Harrell
                          I m combining posts here- ... ... Now I ll have to look that stuff back up -- I remember that I m INFJ, but don t recall all that that means
                          Message 12 of 19 , May 5, 2006
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                            I'm combining posts here-

                            > PAT MATHEWS <mathews55@...> wrote:

                            <snippage>
                            > 3) Again in my observation, Aspies come in roughly
                            > two flavors: the
                            > organized, single-focused, linear mind; and the
                            > absent-minded
                            > professor/free-spirited idea mill. Inattentive ADD
                            > goes with the latter. If
                            > you have any use for the Myer-Briggs at all, these
                            > map very roughly onto
                            > INTJ and INTP respectively. I mention this because
                            > books on the Myer-Briggs....
                            > ....has a lot of good tips for life....
                            > which are quite useful
                            > even though they're designed for the 'normal' end of
                            > the spectrum.

                            Now I'll have to look that stuff back up -- I remember
                            that I'm INFJ, but don't recall all that that means
                            (introvert, intuitive...feeling, judging?)

                            > 5) The very first thing I'd do in your shoes is find
                            > out her strengths and
                            > work from there. Also her obsessions if she has any.
                            > Don't let her dismiss
                            > them as "Oh, that's EASY" the way some people do,
                            > apparently thinking the
                            > only way to make a living is at something you have
                            > to work on. Wrong. Then
                            > mildly correct her weaknesses through *teaching.* A
                            > lot of stuff can be
                            > learned, I'm here to tell you.

                            Having a couple of 'traditional learning challenged'
                            students, I've learned to use multiple modalities to
                            get information across: verbal, tactile, visual (which
                            can be highly amusing, to judge by the laughter). Our
                            current schooling system is poorly equipped to deal
                            with these children's learning needs; one thing that
                            would really help is much smaller teacher/student
                            ratios. I have several teacher friends who are very
                            frustrated by knowing *how* to deal with their ADD or
                            ADHD kids, but they haven't got time or resources to
                            do so properly.

                            >For example, "I'm sorry, I have trouble recognizing
                            >even people I know across the room," (takes off
                            >glasses and cleans them), "would you mind
                            >letting me know you're here?"

                            <winces> I simply don't recognize people out of their
                            usual context in my universe, except for long-time
                            friends and co-workers. I explain it as resulting
                            from a closed-head injury, which most folk seem to
                            graciously accept.

                            Julia wrote:
                            "Any medication should be prescribed by a doctor with
                            some expertise in the area. A pediatric neurologist
                            would be good, if you're hooked up with one."

                            Amen. There are FPs and pediatricians who have made
                            'children with learning-difficulties' their unofficial
                            subspecialty by serious self-education, but the number
                            of children placed on psychoactive drugs by
                            unqualified (IMO) docs is staggering.

                            Debbi
                            Skeptical Believer Maru ;-)

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                          • Horn, John
                            ... it ... I didn t mean they were all written by men. In the case of the AS books, all of them seem aimed at boys or parent s of boys. Almost all of the
                            Message 13 of 19 , May 5, 2006
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                              > On Behalf Of Nick Arnett
                              > >
                              > > All the books are aimed at boys. Both the AS and the ADD
                              > books. It
                              > > seems that AS presents itself differently in girls so that makes
                              it
                              > > very difficult to pick good books.

                              > I think you may be mistaken about this. Many of the ADD
                              > books are written by women, many of whom are ADD themselves

                              I didn't mean they were all written by men. In the case of the AS
                              books, all of them seem aimed at boys or parent's of boys. Almost
                              all of the examples are of boys: the case studies, the
                              recommendations are aimed at boys. Maybe we just haven't stumbled
                              into the right ones yet.

                              - jmh
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