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Re: Permission Slips

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  • JDG
    ... Precisely the opposite Dan. For one, John Kerry never articulated a consistent policy regarding the Iraq War. He went from opposing Gulf War I, to
    Message 1 of 137 , May 1, 2005
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      At 10:16 PM 5/1/2005 -0500, Dan Minette wrote:
      >> At 09:14 PM 5/1/2005 -0500, Dan Minette wrote:
      >> ><quote 2>
      >> >Senator Kerry denounces American action when other countries don't
      >approve
      >> >as if the whole object of our foreign policy were to please a few
      >> >persistent critics. In fact, in the global war on terror, as in
      >Afghanistan
      >> >and Iraq, President Bush has brought many allies to our side. But as the
      >> >President has made very clear, there is a difference between leading a
      >> >coalition of many, and submitting to the objections of a few. George W.
      >> >Bush will never seek a permission slip to defend the American people.
      >> ><end quote 2>
      >> >
      >> <snip>
      >> >
      >> >The second reference did discuss seriously considering the views of
      >other
      >> >countries, although obliquely. Kerry suggested we work more _with_
      >allies
      >> >to arrive at our objective. Cheney called that "denouncing when other
      >> >countries don't approve".
      >> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
      >>
      >> O.k. Dan, call me crazy, but doesn't the word "approve" imply, well,
      >> "approval?" And isn't that far more akin to "getting permission" than
      >to
      >> "serious consideration"?
      >
      >But, he was referring to Kerry's position which was "serious consideration.
      >It is Cheney who indicated no difference between the two.

      Precisely the opposite Dan. For one, John Kerry never articulated a
      consistent policy regarding the Iraq War. He went from opposing Gulf War
      I, to voting for the authorization of the use of force in Gulf War II
      (which he later sent was meant simply to threaten force, not to actually
      use it), to voting against fully funding the troops once they were over
      there, to who knows what position he takes on the war today.

      John Kerry, however, much like Nick and Dave have done on this list,
      however, very often made statements that conflated "serious consideration"
      with "approval." For example, they would set the bar so high for "serious
      consideration" that the only practical outcome of this would be "approval."
      Take also for example, the below quote of John Kerry:

      "I'm an internationalist. I'd like to see our troops dispersed through the
      world only at the directive of the United Nations."

      I remember others, but trying to follow Kerry's public pronouncements on
      Iraq is enough to make anyone dizzy. Suffice to say, your interpretation
      requires that Dick Cheney did not believe that John Kerry was one of the
      many Iraq War opponents who believed that explicit UNSC reauthorization
      should be a prerequisite before launching Gulf War II. I think that Dick
      Cheney, like many others, very legitimately believed that John Kerry did,
      in fact, hold that position - to the extent that he can be described as
      having had one.

      JDG

      P.S. and here's a quote that Dave Land should enjoy:
      "I've had one position, one consistent position, that Saddam Hussein was a
      threat. There was a right way to disarm him and a wrong way. And the
      president chose the wrong way. "

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    • Julia Thompson
      ... A fond memory of hearing that song. It might have been the first time I heard the song. My grandfather put the record on for me in the basement and then
      Message 137 of 137 , May 12, 2005
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        Doug Pensinger wrote:
        > On Thu, 12 May 2005 21:06:39 -0500, Julia Thompson <julia@...> wrote:
        >
        >> Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
        >>
        >>> You'll See Green Alligators And Long-Necked Geese Maru
        >>
        >>
        >> Humpy back camels and some chimpanzees....
        >>
        >> Julia
        >>
        >> Ask Me About Thanksgiving '75 Maru
        >
        >
        > What about Thanksgiving '75?

        A fond memory of hearing that song.

        It might have been the first time I heard the song. My grandfather put
        the record on for me in the basement and then went back upstairs to the
        kitchen where he had more work to do on Thanksgiving dinner. I was
        already all dressed up for dinner, in a dress, and dancing around to the
        music.

        Funny what sticks in your mind from childhood....

        (Of course, in high school, I got a cassette tape with it, and played
        that a lot. Not as much as I played, say, Beethoven's 6th Symphony, but
        still fairly frequently.)

        Julia
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