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Re: To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?

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  • mhbowes11
    I think Corca Laiaodhe just refers to location. Our Files sections has the Eoghanacht Genealogies in .doc format. I pulled this from the internet long ago, so
    Message 1 of 10 , Feb 2, 2009
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      I think Corca Laiaodhe just refers to location. Our Files sections has the Eoghanacht
      Genealogies in .doc format. I pulled this from the internet long ago, so can't verify it
      detail by detail. O'Buadaigh falls in a "minor branch" of the O'Sullivans, so not sure why
      Woulfe says they're not related.

      I have a thought of making a gedcom of this document that is a lot easier to track and
      view reports from. Also thinking of starting a Family Tree DNA group specifically to study
      the names in the Eoghanacht Genealogies and see if the anglicized surnames correspond
      as they should by DNA. What better way to put the accuracy of this old text to the test
      and to learn the DNA signatures of this group? Unfortunately I can think of far more
      genealogy projects than I have time for and my hands are overfull. Do you think you'd be
      interested in administering such a group at FTDNA Jeff?

      --- In bowesgenealogy@yahoogroups.com, Allen Bowes <bowes2000@...> wrote:
      >
      > Bang-on Frank
      >  
      > O'Sullivan's are associated with the Eoghanacta indeed, not so sure about the O'
      Buadhaigh they (we??) are more closely linked with the Corca Laiaodhe.
      >
      > --- On Mon, 2/2/09, Frank Bowe <bowe_f@...> wrote:
      >
      > From: Frank Bowe <bowe_f@...>
      > Subject: Re: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
      > To: bowesgenealogy@yahoogroups.com
      > Date: Monday, 2 February, 2009, 12:43 PM
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > OSullivan, Suel in Gaelic means an Eye , so thoughtto mean one-eyed or Hawk-eye.Its
      from
      > a story of a conquerer requiring the eye of  his subject, and the deed being carried
      out.Vague I
      > Know , I'll gen up on it.But I'm sure the O Sullivans go back to Egonachta , Big Eoghans
      tribe asdo the McCarthys , O' Learys , O Callaghans,Flynns , Cullinanes , O Donovans .A
      son of
      > this tribe married a daughter of the King of the Picks in Scotland, and as Ryan Air
      wasnt flying
      > then the logistics are mind boggling , I think these tribes must have moved over great
      BRittain.
      > The Vikings saw off the Picts ,so the gene pool must be diverse.And Michael O Leary is
      one of THe Egonactha.The invading Irish tribes in Scotland called themselves
      Scotsaccording to
      > Great Migrations,Penquin History of The Vikings byDr. John Haywood.
      >  
      >  
      >
      >  
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > From: Allen Bowes <bowes2000@yahoo. co.uk>
      > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
      > Sent: Sunday, 1 February, 2009 22:27:26
      > Subject: Re: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > The O'Sullivan connection may indeed be spurious, as it was based upon a few 18th
      Century references naming some O'Sulivans who had adopted the name
      'Buadhach/Budhaigh' , almost as a 'first' name as we would now call it. The association
      with the Corca Laoidhe is earlier and perhaps more reliable.
      >
      > --- On Sun, 1/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ one-name. org> wrote:
      >
      > From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ one-name. org>
      > Subject: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
      > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
      > Date: Sunday, 1 February, 2009, 8:38 PM
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Had a fun time at the library yesterday. I'm discovering how great our local library is
      (gets
      > books from anywhere in the country if they circulate), and the local large university
      > libraries. Forgot how much I love libraries ... but I digress.
      >
      > In MacLysaght's 1960 Ed, "More irish Families," he states:
      >
      > "The sept was located in the Corca Laoidhe country (south-west of Cork) and
      O'Donovan
      > says that they considered themselves to be a branch of the O'Sullivans who had
      adopted
      > this alternative surname. Woulfe, however, states that there is no such kinship."
      >
      > Another assertion by Woulfe to keep in the back of our minds and hope for clarification
      > some day.
      >
      > I noted that MacLysaght and Woulfe both have extensive bibliographies in their works
      (but unfortunately did not use footnotes!), but while MacLysaught' s consist primarily of
      works on
      > specific families written by those families (hard to judge the accuracy of all those),
      Woulfe's
      > seem to consist more of historical documents. I need to focus in more on this
      difference.
      > They both appear to be respected researchers. O' Donovan is new to me.
      >
    • mhbowes11
      You ll see in the Eoghanacht Genealogies file that there are a number of first name Buadachs, but also O Buadaigh specifically appears. ... Century
      Message 2 of 10 , Feb 2, 2009
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        You'll see in the Eoghanacht Genealogies file that there are a number of "first" name
        Buadachs, but also O'Buadaigh specifically appears.

        --- In bowesgenealogy@yahoogroups.com, Allen Bowes <bowes2000@...> wrote:
        >
        > The O'Sullivan connection may indeed be spurious, as it was based upon a few 18th
        Century references naming some O'Sulivans who had adopted the name
        'Buadhach/Budhaigh', almost as a 'first' name as we would now call it. The association
        with the Corca Laoidhe is earlier and perhaps more reliable.
        >
        > --- On Sun, 1/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@...> wrote:
        >
        > From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@...>
        > Subject: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
        > To: bowesgenealogy@yahoogroups.com
        > Date: Sunday, 1 February, 2009, 8:38 PM
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Had a fun time at the library yesterday. I'm discovering how great our local library is
        (gets
        > books from anywhere in the country if they circulate), and the local large university
        > libraries. Forgot how much I love libraries ... but I digress.
        >
        > In MacLysaght's 1960 Ed, "More irish Families," he states:
        >
        > "The sept was located in the Corca Laoidhe country (south-west of Cork) and
        O'Donovan
        > says that they considered themselves to be a branch of the O'Sullivans who had
        adopted
        > this alternative surname. Woulfe, however, states that there is no such kinship."
        >
        > Another assertion by Woulfe to keep in the back of our minds and hope for clarification
        > some day.
        >
        > I noted that MacLysaght and Woulfe both have extensive bibliographies in their works
        (but unfortunately did not use footnotes!), but while MacLysaught' s consist primarily of
        works on
        > specific families written by those families (hard to judge the accuracy of all those),
        Woulfe's
        > seem to consist more of historical documents. I need to focus in more on this
        difference.
        > They both appear to be respected researchers. O' Donovan is new to me.
        >
      • Allen Bowes
        Corca Laiodhe was a grouping of peoples living in a specifci geogtraphic region, ie: SW Cork, the O Buadhaigh were linked with them long before the Irish
        Message 3 of 10 , Feb 2, 2009
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          Corca Laiodhe was a grouping of peoples living in a specifci geogtraphic region, ie: SW Cork, the O'Buadhaigh were linked with them long before the Irish Annals were composed and Woulfe arrived on the scene.

          --- On Mon, 2/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@...> wrote:
          From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@...>
          Subject: [bowesgenealogy] Re: To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
          To: bowesgenealogy@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Monday, 2 February, 2009, 3:10 PM

          I think Corca Laiaodhe just refers to location. Our Files sections has the Eoghanacht
          Genealogies in .doc format. I pulled this from the internet long ago, so can't verify it
          detail by detail. O'Buadaigh falls in a "minor branch" of the O'Sullivans, so not sure why
          Woulfe says they're not related.

          I have a thought of making a gedcom of this document that is a lot easier to track and
          view reports from. Also thinking of starting a Family Tree DNA group specifically to study
          the names in the Eoghanacht Genealogies and see if the anglicized surnames correspond
          as they should by DNA. What better way to put the accuracy of this old text to the test
          and to learn the DNA signatures of this group? Unfortunately I can think of far more
          genealogy projects than I have time for and my hands are overfull. Do you think you'd be
          interested in administering such a group at FTDNA Jeff?

          --- In bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com, Allen Bowes <bowes2000@. ..> wrote:
          >
          > Bang-on Frank
          >  
          > O'Sullivan's are associated with the Eoghanacta indeed, not so sure about the O'
          Buadhaigh they (we??) are more closely linked with the Corca Laiaodhe.
          >
          > --- On Mon, 2/2/09, Frank Bowe <bowe_f@...> wrote:
          >
          > From: Frank Bowe <bowe_f@...>
          > Subject: Re: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
          > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
          > Date: Monday, 2 February, 2009, 12:43 PM
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > OSullivan, Suel in Gaelic means an Eye , so thoughtto mean one-eyed or Hawk-eye.Its
          from
          > a story of a conquerer requiring the eye of  his subject, and the deed being carried
          out.Vague I
          > Know , I'll gen up on it.But I'm sure the O Sullivans go back to Egonachta , Big Eoghans
          tribe asdo the McCarthys , O' Learys , O Callaghans,Flynns , Cullinanes , O Donovans .A
          son of
          > this tribe married a daughter of the King of the Picks in Scotland, and as Ryan Air
          wasnt flying
          > then the logistics are mind boggling , I think these tribes must have moved over great
          BRittain.
          > The Vikings saw off the Picts ,so the gene pool must be diverse.And Michael O Leary is
          one of THe Egonactha.The invading Irish tribes in Scotland called themselves
          Scotsaccording to
          > Great Migrations,Penquin History of The Vikings byDr. John Haywood.
          >  
          >  
          >
          >  
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > From: Allen Bowes <bowes2000@yahoo. co.uk>
          > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
          > Sent: Sunday, 1 February, 2009 22:27:26
          > Subject: Re: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > The O'Sullivan connection may indeed be spurious, as it was based upon a few 18th
          Century references naming some O'Sulivans who had adopted the name
          'Buadhach/Budhaigh' , almost as a 'first' name as we would now call it. The association
          with the Corca Laoidhe is earlier and perhaps more reliable.
          >
          > --- On Sun, 1/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ one-name. org> wrote:
          >
          > From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ one-name. org>
          > Subject: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
          > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
          > Date: Sunday, 1 February, 2009, 8:38 PM
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Had a fun time at the library yesterday. I'm discovering how great our local library is
          (gets
          > books from anywhere in the country if they circulate), and the local large university
          > libraries. Forgot how much I love libraries ... but I digress.
          >
          > In MacLysaght's 1960 Ed, "More irish Families," he states:
          >
          > "The sept was located in the Corca Laoidhe country (south-west of Cork) and
          O'Donovan
          > says that they considered themselves to be a branch of the O'Sullivans who had
          adopted
          > this alternative surname. Woulfe, however, states that there is no such kinship."
          >
          > Another assertion by Woulfe to keep in the back of our minds and hope for clarification
          > some day.
          >
          > I noted that MacLysaght and Woulfe both have extensive bibliographies in their works
          (but unfortunately did not use footnotes!), but while MacLysaught' s consist primarily of
          works on
          > specific families written by those families (hard to judge the accuracy of all those),
          Woulfe's
          > seem to consist more of historical documents. I need to focus in more on this
          difference.
          > They both appear to be respected researchers. O' Donovan is new to me.
          >


        • Allen Bowes
          Please re-reads my previous posting, the OSullivans may have adopted the name Buadhach/Buadhaigh as it conferred the name victorious champion, that does not
          Message 4 of 10 , Feb 2, 2009
          • 0 Attachment
            Please re-reads my previous posting, the OSullivans may have adopted the name Buadhach/Buadhaigh as it conferred the name 'victorious' champion, that does not mean per-se that the O'Buadaigh/Buadhach 'sept' were related to the O'Sullivans. As to the Irish Annals/ Eoghonact Chronicles, these were 17/18th Century interpretations, that failed to note that an earlier 15th Century specifically text links Buadhaigh with the Corca Laoidhe.
            --- On Mon, 2/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@...> wrote:
            From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@...>
            Subject: [bowesgenealogy] Re: To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
            To: bowesgenealogy@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Monday, 2 February, 2009, 3:12 PM

            You'll see in the Eoghanacht Genealogies file that there are a number of "first" name
            Buadachs, but also O'Buadaigh specifically appears.

            --- In bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com, Allen Bowes <bowes2000@. ..> wrote:
            >
            > The O'Sullivan connection may indeed be spurious, as it was based upon a few 18th
            Century references naming some O'Sulivans who had adopted the name
            'Buadhach/Budhaigh' , almost as a 'first' name as we would now call it. The association
            with the Corca Laoidhe is earlier and perhaps more reliable.
            >
            > --- On Sun, 1/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ ...> wrote:
            >
            > From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ ...>
            > Subject: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
            > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
            > Date: Sunday, 1 February, 2009, 8:38 PM
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Had a fun time at the library yesterday. I'm discovering how great our local library is
            (gets
            > books from anywhere in the country if they circulate), and the local large university
            > libraries. Forgot how much I love libraries ... but I digress.
            >
            > In MacLysaght's 1960 Ed, "More irish Families," he states:
            >
            > "The sept was located in the Corca Laoidhe country (south-west of Cork) and
            O'Donovan
            > says that they considered themselves to be a branch of the O'Sullivans who had
            adopted
            > this alternative surname. Woulfe, however, states that there is no such kinship."
            >
            > Another assertion by Woulfe to keep in the back of our minds and hope for clarification
            > some day.
            >
            > I noted that MacLysaght and Woulfe both have extensive bibliographies in their works
            (but unfortunately did not use footnotes!), but while MacLysaught' s consist primarily of
            works on
            > specific families written by those families (hard to judge the accuracy of all those),
            Woulfe's
            > seem to consist more of historical documents. I need to focus in more on this
            difference.
            > They both appear to be respected researchers. O' Donovan is new to me.
            >


          • mhbowes11
            Thanks for the clarification. Whenever I ve seen Corca Laiodhe mentioned, it s always with (S.W. Cork) after, and never made it clear it referred to a group of
            Message 5 of 10 , Feb 2, 2009
            • 0 Attachment
              Thanks for the clarification. Whenever I've seen Corca Laiodhe mentioned, it's always with
              (S.W. Cork) after, and never made it clear it referred to a group of people, leading me for
              some time now to believe it was a place inhabited by some of the Eoghanacht, including
              the O'Buadaigh sept mentioned in the Eoghanacht Genealogies! In fact, I see now that
              MacLysaght's wording in "More Irish Families" (1960) is: "The sept was located in the
              Corca Laoidhe country (south-west of Cork)...," not at all indicating they were part of the
              original Corca Laoidhe people. Anyway, I googled the "Book of Ballymote," which must be
              the earlier reference you mention, but can't find any mention online of it mentioning
              Buadaigh. I'm not doubting it does, but if you come across a specific mention I'd like to
              store it away.

              As to "O'Sulivans who had adopted the name 'Buadhach/Budhaigh' , almost as a 'first'
              name as we would now call it." ... I see now you were including the O'Buadaigh part as
              one of the first name examples, while I saw it as distinct since it is presented as a
              Sullivan line adopting it as a surname: "Maolodhar son of Sealbach had five sons ... Buadhach, from whom the Ui Buadaigh." That's not to say it's an accurate account of
              what happened or the origin of any Gaelic Bowe-s.


              --- In bowesgenealogy@yahoogroups.com, Allen Bowes <bowes2000@...> wrote:
              >
              > Corca Laiodhe was a grouping of peoples living in a specifci geogtraphic region, ie: SW
              Cork, the O'Buadhaigh were linked with them long before the Irish Annals were
              composed and Woulfe arrived on the scene.
              >
              > --- On Mon, 2/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@...> wrote:
              >
              > From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@...>
              > Subject: [bowesgenealogy] Re: To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
              > To: bowesgenealogy@yahoogroups.com
              > Date: Monday, 2 February, 2009, 3:10 PM
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > I think Corca Laiaodhe just refers to location. Our Files sections has the Eoghanacht
              > Genealogies in .doc format. I pulled this from the internet long ago, so can't verify it
              > detail by detail. O'Buadaigh falls in a "minor branch" of the O'Sullivans, so not sure why
              > Woulfe says they're not related.
              >
              > I have a thought of making a gedcom of this document that is a lot easier to track and
              > view reports from. Also thinking of starting a Family Tree DNA group specifically to
              study
              > the names in the Eoghanacht Genealogies and see if the anglicized surnames
              correspond
              > as they should by DNA. What better way to put the accuracy of this old text to the test
              > and to learn the DNA signatures of this group? Unfortunately I can think of far more
              > genealogy projects than I have time for and my hands are overfull. Do you think you'd
              be
              > interested in administering such a group at FTDNA Jeff?
              >
              > --- In bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com, Allen Bowes <bowes2000@ ..> wrote:
              > >
              > > Bang-on Frank
              > >  
              > > O'Sullivan's are associated with the Eoghanacta indeed, not so sure about the O'
              > Buadhaigh they (we??) are more closely linked with the Corca Laiaodhe.
              > >
              > > --- On Mon, 2/2/09, Frank Bowe <bowe_f@> wrote:
              > >
              > > From: Frank Bowe <bowe_f@>
              > > Subject: Re: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
              > > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
              > > Date: Monday, 2 February, 2009, 12:43 PM
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > OSullivan, Suel in Gaelic means an Eye , so thoughtto mean one-eyed or Hawk-
              eye.Its
              > from
              > > a story of a conquerer requiring the eye of  his subject, and the deed being
              carried
              > out.Vague I
              > > Know , I'll gen up on it.But I'm sure the O Sullivans go back to Egonachta , Big
              Eoghans
              > tribe asdo the McCarthys , O' Learys , O Callaghans,Flynns , Cullinanes , O Donovans
              .A
              > son of
              > > this tribe married a daughter of the King of the Picks in Scotland, and as Ryan Air
              > wasnt flying
              > > then the logistics are mind boggling , I think these tribes must have moved over
              great
              > BRittain.
              > > The Vikings saw off the Picts ,so the gene pool must be diverse.And Michael O Leary
              is
              > one of THe Egonactha.The invading Irish tribes in Scotland called themselves
              > Scotsaccording to
              > > Great Migrations,Penquin History of The Vikings byDr. John Haywood.
              > >  
              > >  
              > >
              > >  
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > From: Allen Bowes <bowes2000@yahoo. co.uk>
              > > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
              > > Sent: Sunday, 1 February, 2009 22:27:26
              > > Subject: Re: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > The O'Sullivan connection may indeed be spurious, as it was based upon a few 18th
              > Century references naming some O'Sulivans who had adopted the name
              > 'Buadhach/Budhaigh' , almost as a 'first' name as we would now call it. The association
              > with the Corca Laoidhe is earlier and perhaps more reliable.
              > >
              > > --- On Sun, 1/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ one-name. org> wrote:
              > >
              > > From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ one-name. org>
              > > Subject: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
              > > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
              > > Date: Sunday, 1 February, 2009, 8:38 PM
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Had a fun time at the library yesterday. I'm discovering how great our local library is
              > (gets
              > > books from anywhere in the country if they circulate), and the local large university
              > > libraries. Forgot how much I love libraries ... but I digress.
              > >
              > > In MacLysaght's 1960 Ed, "More irish Families," he states:
              > >
              > > "The sept was located in the Corca Laoidhe country (south-west of Cork) and
              > O'Donovan
              > > says that they considered themselves to be a branch of the O'Sullivans who had
              > adopted
              > > this alternative surname. Woulfe, however, states that there is no such kinship."
              > >
              > > Another assertion by Woulfe to keep in the back of our minds and hope for
              clarification
              > > some day.
              > >
              > > I noted that MacLysaght and Woulfe both have extensive bibliographies in their
              works
              > (but unfortunately did not use footnotes!), but while MacLysaught' s consist primarily
              of
              > works on
              > > specific families written by those families (hard to judge the accuracy of all those),
              > Woulfe's
              > > seem to consist more of historical documents. I need to focus in more on this
              > difference.
              > > They both appear to be respected researchers. O' Donovan is new to me.
              > >
              >
            • Frank Bowe
              Corka accordong to story/legend was a male child hidden in some container when soldiers came seeking to kill the male child, a spark flew out of fire which was
              Message 6 of 10 , Feb 3, 2009
              • 0 Attachment
                Corka accordong to story/legend was a male child hidden in some container when soldiers came
                seeking to kill the male child, a spark flew out of fire which was purple , Corca means purple, and Laiodhe, has something to do with Oleary's or Donovan . I take it this Gang of Corca of the
                OLearys ,they were driven south by Dal Gais, who were connected and inhabited Tipperary and
                Limerick.There is too much to imagine its All fiction., a grain of truth must be assumed. The Penquin HIstorical History of The Vikings , and Cassels Atlas of World History by Doctor John
                Haywood, of Cambridge , states , Irish Tribes invaded Scotland and called themselves Scots.He
                is an acknowledged expert on the Dark Ages..
                I went to school with many O ' Sullivans, and never experience any that had not the prefix O , in fact to refer to them as Sullivan , one would have to be familar or gaging for a row , as  Cromwell
                sought to  make them conform by forcing them to drop the prefix O , meaning of , and Mac
                meaning son of, Corca probably gives its name to Cork. Corka I think had 11 sons , and another
                male 24 , so they were a prolific group , and no family Allowance.
                 


                From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@...>
                To: bowesgenealogy@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Monday, 2 February, 2009 22:07:48
                Subject: [bowesgenealogy] Re: To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?

                Thanks for the clarification. Whenever I've seen Corca Laiodhe mentioned, it's always with
                (S.W. Cork) after, and never made it clear it referred to a group of people, leading me for
                some time now to believe it was a place inhabited by some of the Eoghanacht, including
                the O'Buadaigh sept mentioned in the Eoghanacht Genealogies! In fact, I see now that
                MacLysaght's wording in "More Irish Families" (1960) is: "The sept was located in the
                Corca Laoidhe country (south-west of Cork)...," not at all indicating they were part of the
                original Corca Laoidhe people. Anyway, I googled the "Book of Ballymote," which must be
                the earlier reference you mention, but can't find any mention online of it mentioning
                Buadaigh. I'm not doubting it does, but if you come across a specific mention I'd like to
                store it away.

                As to "O'Sulivans who had adopted the name 'Buadhach/Budhaigh' , almost as a 'first'
                name as we would now call it." ... I see now you were including the O'Buadaigh part as
                one of the first name examples, while I saw it as distinct since it is presented as a
                Sullivan line adopting it as a surname: "Maolodhar son of Sealbach had five sons ... Buadhach, from whom the Ui Buadaigh." That's not to say it's an accurate account of
                what happened or the origin of any Gaelic Bowe-s.

                --- In bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com, Allen Bowes <bowes2000@. ..> wrote:
                >
                > Corca Laiodhe was a grouping of peoples living in a specifci geogtraphic region, ie: SW
                Cork, the O'Buadhaigh were linked with them long before the Irish Annals were
                composed and Woulfe arrived on the scene.
                >
                > --- On Mon, 2/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ ...> wrote:
                >
                > From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ ...>
                > Subject: [bowesgenealogy] Re: To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
                > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
                > Date: Monday, 2 February, 2009, 3:10 PM
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > I think Corca Laiaodhe just refers to location. Our Files sections has the Eoghanacht
                > Genealogies in .doc format. I pulled this from the internet long ago, so can't verify it
                > detail by detail. O'Buadaigh falls in a "minor branch" of the O'Sullivans, so not sure why
                > Woulfe says they're not related.
                >
                > I have a thought of making a gedcom of this document that is a lot easier to track and
                > view reports from. Also thinking of starting a Family Tree DNA group specifically to
                study
                > the names in the Eoghanacht Genealogies and see if the anglicized surnames
                correspond
                > as they should by DNA. What better way to put the accuracy of this old text to the test
                > and to learn the DNA signatures of this group? Unfortunately I can think of far more
                > genealogy projects than I have time for and my hands are overfull. Do you think you'd
                be
                > interested in administering such a group at FTDNA Jeff?
                >
                > --- In bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com, Allen Bowes <bowes2000@ ..> wrote:
                > >
                > > Bang-on Frank
                > >  
                > > O'Sullivan's are associated with the Eoghanacta indeed, not so sure about the O'
                > Buadhaigh they (we??) are more closely linked with the Corca Laiaodhe.
                > >
                > > --- On Mon, 2/2/09, Frank Bowe <bowe_f@> wrote:
                > >
                > > From: Frank Bowe <bowe_f@>
                > > Subject: Re: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
                > > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
                > > Date: Monday, 2 February, 2009, 12:43 PM
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > OSullivan, Suel in Gaelic means an Eye , so thoughtto mean one-eyed or Hawk-
                eye.Its
                > from
                > > a story of a conquerer requiring the eye of  his subject, and the deed being
                carried
                > out.Vague I
                > > Know , I'll gen up on it.But I'm sure the O Sullivans go back to Egonachta , Big
                Eoghans
                > tribe asdo the McCarthys , O' Learys , O Callaghans,Flynns , Cullinanes , O Donovans
                .A
                > son of
                > > this tribe married a daughter of the King of the Picks in Scotland, and as Ryan Air
                > wasnt flying
                > > then the logistics are mind boggling , I think these tribes must have moved over
                great
                > BRittain.
                > > The Vikings saw off the Picts ,so the gene pool must be diverse.And Michael O Leary
                is
                > one of THe Egonactha.The invading Irish tribes in Scotland called themselves
                > Scotsaccording to
                > > Great Migrations,Penquin History of The Vikings byDr. John Haywood.
                > >  
                > >  
                > >
                > >  
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > From: Allen Bowes <bowes2000@yahoo. co.uk>
                > > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
                > > Sent: Sunday, 1 February, 2009 22:27:26
                > > Subject: Re: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > The O'Sullivan connection may indeed be spurious, as it was based upon a few 18th
                > Century references naming some O'Sulivans who had adopted the name
                > 'Buadhach/Budhaigh' , almost as a 'first' name as we would now call it. The association
                > with the Corca Laoidhe is earlier and perhaps more reliable.
                > >
                > > --- On Sun, 1/2/09, mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ one-name. org> wrote:
                > >
                > > From: mhbowes11 <martha.bowes@ one-name. org>
                > > Subject: [bowesgenealogy] To Sullivan or Not To Sullivan?
                > > To: bowesgenealogy@ yahoogroups. com
                > > Date: Sunday, 1 February, 2009, 8:38 PM
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Had a fun time at the library yesterday. I'm discovering how great our local library is
                > (gets
                > > books from anywhere in the country if they circulate), and the local large university
                > > libraries. Forgot how much I love libraries ... but I digress.
                > >
                > > In MacLysaght's 1960 Ed, "More irish Families," he states:
                > >
                > > "The sept was located in the Corca Laoidhe country (south-west of Cork) and
                > O'Donovan
                > > says that they considered themselves to be a branch of the O'Sullivans who had
                > adopted
                > > this alternative surname. Woulfe, however, states that there is no such kinship."
                > >
                > > Another assertion by Woulfe to keep in the back of our minds and hope for
                clarification
                > > some day.
                > >
                > > I noted that MacLysaght and Woulfe both have extensive bibliographies in their
                works
                > (but unfortunately did not use footnotes!), but while MacLysaught' s consist primarily
                of
                > works on
                > > specific families written by those families (hard to judge the accuracy of all those),
                > Woulfe's
                > > seem to consist more of historical documents. I need to focus in more on this
                > difference.
                > > They both appear to be respected researchers. O' Donovan is new to me.
                > >
                >


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