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Re: ALMERS

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  • aletheia kallos
    jesper i am still playing without benefit of google earth tho i expect to regain it soon but i can contribute this first known pic of tromedja peak on which
    Message 1 of 16 , Oct 1, 2008
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      jesper
      i am still playing without benefit of google earth
      tho i expect to regain it soon

      but i can contribute this first known pic of tromedja peak
      on which the almers tripoint is the summit point
      http://www.summitpost.org/images/medium/354900.jpg
      as lifted from
      http://www.summitpost.org/area/range/354583/bogi-263-evica-bogi-231-evica.html
      about halfway down the page

      the data in the table there suggest tromedja is the second highest peak in the photo frame
      so most probably the one just left of center
      with bogicaj being its slightly higher mate
      & maja e ram arucit the other tall peak much farther to the right
      since the camera evidently faces north from albania
      judging from this clear map confirming the relationship of the 3 peaks
      http://www.avijacijabezgranica.com/karte/CG/Bogicevica.jpg
      & the fact that the ravno brdo ridge carrying the mers boundary
      is not claimed to be shown by the common photo in the table

      --- In boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com, aletheia kallos <aletheiak@...> wrote:
      >
      > am out playing at the beach in maine so i cant check my google earth
      > but
      > the present resolution at google maps at least does not appear to change the position predicted by the tripoint stretcher at bottom here
      > http://article.gmane.org/gmane.culture.discuss.boundary-point/9226
      > & later confirmed here
      > http://article.gmane.org/gmane.culture.discuss.boundary-point-point/448
      >  
      > but can you show or tell if or how you would change from the tromedja summit position
      >
      > --- On Thu, 6/12/08, Jesper Nielsen/Borderbase jesper@... wrote:
      >
      > From: Jesper Nielsen/Borderbase jesper@...
      > Subject: [boundarypointpoint] ALMERS
      > To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com
      > Date: Thursday, June 12, 2008, 5:00 PM
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Is now higher resolution on GE.
      >  
      > Haven¢t had time to replace pinpoint yet.
      >  
      > Jesper
      >
    • Jesper Nielsen
      http://www.360cities.net/image/view-on-border-between-montenegro-kosovo-and- albania-from-maja-bogicaj-europe#-188.88,79.24,70.0 Jesper Ps who was 220 km from
      Message 2 of 16 , Oct 31, 2010
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      • aletheia kallos
        flying blind here without adobe flash 10 but if it is the same or a similar scene as this one http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2102156330062955329iVBeQU
        Message 3 of 16 , Oct 31, 2010
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          flying blind here without adobe flash 10

          but if it is the same or a similar scene as this one
          then there is at least half a chance you have got it 
          because there is still reason to wonder which of the 2 similarly marked twin summits is the true tripoint

          if it is a panoramic view of the entire mountaintop as i surmise then there is a very good chance you have it at least class d

          but anyway tell us what you see there if you would

          --- On Sun, 10/31/10, Jesper Nielsen <jesper@...> wrote:

          From: Jesper Nielsen <jesper@...>
          Subject: [boundarypointpoint] ALMERS
          To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Sunday, October 31, 2010, 6:24 PM

        • Jesper
          What do you base your B28/2 guess on rather than B28/4. B28/4 has the extra circumstantial evidence as it is called Tromeda. However, I do have an x-yu
          Message 4 of 16 , Nov 3, 2010
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            What do you base your B28/2 guess on rather than B28/4.
            B28/4 has the extra circumstantial evidence as it is called Tromeda.

            However, I do have an x-yu colleague, who believe Tromeda rather means summit (so similiar).

            Canaries it was. Did investigate possibility for short trip to EHMA (or just EH), but they don't come easy.

            Jesper
            --- In boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com, aletheia kallos <aletheiak@...> wrote:
            >
            > flying blind here without adobe flash 10
            >
            > but if it is the same or a similar scene as this one
            > http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2102156330062955329iVBeQU
            > then there is at least half a chance you have got it
            > because there is still reason to wonder which of the 2 similarly marked twin
            > summits is the true tripoint
            >
            > if it is a panoramic view of the entire mountaintop as i surmise then there
            > is a very good chance you have it at least class d
            >
            > but anyway tell us what you see there if you would
            >
            > --- On *Sun, 10/31/10, Jesper Nielsen <jesper@...>* wrote:
            >
            >
            > From: Jesper Nielsen <jesper@...>
            > Subject: [boundarypointpoint] ALMERS
            > To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com
            > Date: Sunday, October 31, 2010, 6:24 PM
            >
            > http://www.360cities.net/image/view-on-border-between-montenegro-kosovo-and-albania-from-maja-bogicaj-europe#-188.88,79.24,70.0
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Jesper
            >
            > Ps who was 220 km from EHMA yesterday
            >
            > sounds like the canaries
            >
          • aletheia kallos
            again i am still flying blind here so it might help if you would tell me what you see but anyway to answer your question in the meantime i am not at all
            Message 5 of 16 , Nov 3, 2010
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              again 
              i am still flying blind here
              so it might help if you would tell me what you see

              but anyway 
              to answer your question in the meantime
              i am not at all suggesting b28ii
              & i dont know where you got that idea 

              rather my uncertainty is between b28iv & b28v as shown on this best known map
              both of which are on the peak that is labeled tromedja 
              which i am pretty sure means tripoint
              & both apparently at elev 2366m
              so i cant decide which of these 2 apparently identical twin summits of tromedja peak might be the correct one

              the kid in my photo
              which is labeled tromedja
              is clearly at some b28 marker 
              so presumably one of the 2 shown at tromedja peak on the topo
              but it is also not clear if this kid is at marker b28iv or b28v

              apparently you have a preference for b28iv rather than b28v

              you might well be right

              but again i cant see what you are looking at

              --- On Wed, 11/3/10, Jesper <jesper@...> wrote:

              From: Jesper <jesper@...>
              Subject: [boundarypointpoint] Re: ALMERS
              To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Wednesday, November 3, 2010, 11:53 AM

              What do you base your B28/2 guess on rather than B28/4.
              B28/4 has the extra circumstantial evidence as it is called Tromeda.

              However, I do have an x-yu colleague, who believe Tromeda rather means summit (so similiar).

              Canaries it was. Did investigate possibility for short trip to EHMA (or just EH), but they don't come easy.

              Jesper
              --- In boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com, aletheia kallos <aletheiak@...> wrote:
              >
              > flying blind here without adobe flash 10

              > but if it is the same or a similar scene as this one
              http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2102156330062955329iVBeQU
              > then there is at least half a chance you have got it
              > because there is still reason to wonder which of the 2 similarly marked twin
              > summits is the true tripoint

              > if it is a panoramic view of the entire mountaintop as i surmise then there
              > is a very good chance you have it at least class d

              > but anyway tell us what you see there if you would

              > --- On *Sun, 10/31/10, Jesper Nielsen <jesper@...>* wrote:


              > From: Jesper Nielsen <jesper@...>
              > Subject: [boundarypointpoint] ALMERS
              > To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com
              > Date: Sunday, October 31, 2010, 6:24 PM

              http://www.360cities.net/image/view-on-border-between-montenegro-kosovo-and-albania-from-maja-bogicaj-europe#-188.88,79.24,70.0





              > Jesper

              > Ps who was 220 km from EHMA yesterday

              > sounds like the canaries

            • Jesper
              Kid s marker seem to be 28 only. Serbian GIS site at http://www.geosrbija.rs/rga/default.aspx?gui=1&lang=1 gives coords at 42 33.3222, 20 4.7478. This is
              Message 6 of 16 , Nov 3, 2010
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                Kid's marker seem to be 28 only.

                Serbian GIS site at http://www.geosrbija.rs/rga/default.aspx?gui=1&lang=1 gives coords at 42 33.3222, 20 4.7478.

                This is closest to the eastern peak.

                What's the legal status of MERS anyway?

                Jesper

                --- In boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com, aletheia kallos <aletheiak@...> wrote:
                >
                > again
                > i am still flying blind here
                > so it might help if you would tell me what you see
                >
                > but anyway
                > to answer your question in the meantime
                > i am not at all suggesting b28ii
                > & i dont know where you got that idea
                >
                > rather my uncertainty is between b28iv & b28v as shown on this best known
                > map
                > http://mapy.mk.cvut.cz/data/Jugoslavie-Yugoslavia/Cerna_Hora-Montenegro/Bogicevica.jpg
                > both of which are on the peak that is labeled tromedja
                > which i am pretty sure means tripoint
                > & both apparently at elev 2366m
                > so i cant decide which of these 2 apparently identical twin summits of
                > tromedja peak might be the correct one
                >
                > the kid in my photo
                > which is labeled tromedja
                > is clearly at some b28 marker
                > so presumably one of the 2 shown at tromedja peak on the topo
                > but it is also not clear if this kid is at marker b28iv or b28v
                >
                > apparently you have a preference for b28iv rather than b28v
                >
                > you might well be right
                >
                > but again i cant see what you are looking at
                >
                > --- On *Wed, 11/3/10, Jesper <jesper@...>* wrote:
                >
                >
                > From: Jesper <jesper@...>
                > Subject: [boundarypointpoint] Re: ALMERS
                > To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com
                > Date: Wednesday, November 3, 2010, 11:53 AM
                >
                > What do you base your B28/2 guess on rather than B28/4.
                > B28/4 has the extra circumstantial evidence as it is called Tromeda.
                >
                > However, I do have an x-yu colleague, who believe Tromeda rather means
                > summit (so similiar).
                >
                > Canaries it was. Did investigate possibility for short trip to EHMA (or just
                > EH), but they don't come easy.
                >
                > Jesper
                > --- In boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com</mc/compose?to=boundarypointpoint%40yahoogroups.com>,
                > aletheia kallos <aletheiak@> wrote:
                > >
                > > flying blind here without adobe flash 10
                > >
                > > but if it is the same or a similar scene as this one
                > > http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2102156330062955329iVBeQU
                > > then there is at least half a chance you have got it
                > > because there is still reason to wonder which of the 2 similarly marked
                > twin
                > > summits is the true tripoint
                > >
                > > if it is a panoramic view of the entire mountaintop as i surmise then
                > there
                > > is a very good chance you have it at least class d
                > >
                > > but anyway tell us what you see there if you would
                > >
                > > --- On *Sun, 10/31/10, Jesper Nielsen <jesper@>* wrote:
                > >
                > >
                > > From: Jesper Nielsen <jesper@>
                > > Subject: [boundarypointpoint] ALMERS
                > > To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com</mc/compose?to=boundarypointpoint%40yahoogroups.com>
                > > Date: Sunday, October 31, 2010, 6:24 PM
                > >
                > >
                > http://www.360cities.net/image/view-on-border-between-montenegro-kosovo-and-albania-from-maja-bogicaj-europe#-188.88,79.24,70.0
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Jesper
                > >
                > > Ps who was 220 km from EHMA yesterday
                > >
                > > sounds like the canaries
                >
              • aletheia kallos
                yes the kids marker shows b28 only  but that may only be because the following number has been obliterated by the weathering for me the claim of tromedja on
                Message 7 of 16 , Nov 3, 2010
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                • 178 KB
                yes the kids marker shows b28 only 

                but that may only be because the following number has been obliterated by the weathering

                for me the claim of tromedja on the pix is harder to disregard than the missing or unknown subscript on the marker


                & thats an awfully nice serbian zoomable you found

                both from the topographical details & the number crunching i agree it looks like a lock on the eastern summit or b28v

                i even found my old pushpins shown in the attached sky pic were right on too


                the legal status of mers may be no better than the other post yugo borders
                i dont know
                & of course we are really talking about new alksme here rather than old almers besides
                so thats an extra problem

                but this sector of it right here seems to be a ridge line ending at a peak named tromedja
                yes
                which makes it hard to argue with as the border no matter what kosovo is considered to be

                so 
                my sense is that the tripoint is pretty well locked in right here
                & also that the kid got it right

                vee

                & youve done it again maestro as far as i am concerned
                & tho you may not be able to read it in the tricountry yearbook it will be there along with your bdinmm finding & all your other great plays of 2010


                but you still havent told me what you see in the picture

                so maybe someone else who has followed this can see the picture & would say

                or maybe i will just have to get an adobe flash 10
                 

                --- On Wed, 11/3/10, Jesper <jesper@...> wrote:

                From: Jesper <jesper@...>
                Subject: [boundarypointpoint] Re: ALMERS
                To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Wednesday, November 3, 2010, 4:41 PM

                 

                Kid's marker seem to be 28 only.

                Serbian GIS site at http://www.geosrbija.rs/rga/default.aspx?gui=1&lang=1 gives coords at 42 33.3222, 20 4.7478.

                This is closest to the eastern peak.

                What's the legal status of MERS anyway?

                Jesper

                --- In boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com, aletheia kallos <aletheiak@...> wrote:
                >
                > again
                > i am still flying blind here
                > so it might help if you would tell me what you see
                >
                > but anyway
                > to answer your question in the meantime
                > i am not at all suggesting b28ii
                > & i dont know where you got that idea
                >
                > rather my uncertainty is between b28iv & b28v as shown on this best known
                > map
                > http://mapy.mk.cvut.cz/data/Jugoslavie-Yugoslavia/Cerna_Hora-Montenegro/Bogicevica.jpg
                > both of which are on the peak that is labeled tromedja
                > which i am pretty sure means tripoint
                > & both apparently at elev 2366m
                > so i cant decide which of these 2 apparently identical twin summits of
                > tromedja peak might be the correct one
                >
                > the kid in my photo
                > which is labeled tromedja
                > is clearly at some b28 marker
                > so presumably one of the 2 shown at tromedja peak on the topo
                > but it is also not clear if this kid is at marker b28iv or b28v
                >
                > apparently you have a preference for b28iv rather than b28v
                >
                > you might well be right
                >
                > but again i cant see what you are looking at
                >
                > --- On *Wed, 11/3/10, Jesper <jesper@...>* wrote:
                >
                >
                > From: Jesper <jesper@...>
                > Subject: [boundarypointpoint] Re: ALMERS
                > To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com
                > Date: Wednesday, November 3, 2010, 11:53 AM
                >
                > What do you base your B28/2 guess on rather than B28/4.
                > B28/4 has the extra circumstantial evidence as it is called Tromeda.
                >
                > However, I do have an x-yu colleague, who believe Tromeda rather means
                > summit (so similiar).
                >
                > Canaries it was. Did investigate possibility for short trip to EHMA (or just
                > EH), but they don't come easy.
                >
                > Jesper
                > --- In boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com</mc/compose?to=boundarypointpoint%40yahoogroups.com>,
                > aletheia kallos <aletheiak@> wrote:
                > >
                > > flying blind here without adobe flash 10
                > >
                > > but if it is the same or a similar scene as this one
                > > http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2102156330062955329iVBeQU
                > > then there is at least half a chance you have got it
                > > because there is still reason to wonder which of the 2 similarly marked
                > twin
                > > summits is the true tripoint
                > >
                > > if it is a panoramic view of the entire mountaintop as i surmise then
                > there
                > > is a very good chance you have it at least class d
                > >
                > > but anyway tell us what you see there if you would
                > >
                > > --- On *Sun, 10/31/10, Jesper Nielsen <jesper@>* wrote:
                > >
                > >
                > > From: Jesper Nielsen <jesper@>
                > > Subject: [boundarypointpoint] ALMERS
                > > To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com</mc/compose?to=boundarypointpoint%40yahoogroups.com>
                > > Date: Sunday, October 31, 2010, 6:24 PM
                > >
                > >
                > http://www.360cities.net/image/view-on-border-between-montenegro-kosovo-and-albania-from-maja-bogicaj-europe#-188.88,79.24,70.0
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Jesper
                > >
                > > Ps who was 220 km from EHMA yesterday
                > >
                > > sounds like the canaries
                >


              • Jesper
                Can this really be ALMERS since there is no marker B28 visuable: http://www.panoramio.com/photo/43528499 Actually all ALMERS photos on Panoramio don t clearly
                Message 8 of 16 , Dec 25, 2011
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                  Can this really be ALMERS since there is no marker B28 visuable: http://www.panoramio.com/photo/43528499

                  Actually all ALMERS photos on Panoramio don't clearly show markers.

                  Jesper
                • Roger McCutcheon
                  Crna Gora is the local name for Montenegro. Roger & out.
                  Message 9 of 16 , Dec 25, 2011
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                    Crna Gora is the local name for Montenegro.  Roger & out.
                  • Aletheia Kallos
                    from the same source a zoomable celebration & full panorama or maybe just a rest stop but with the purported elevation stated exactly right
                    Message 10 of 16 , Dec 25, 2011
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                      from the same source a zoomable celebration & full panorama 
                      or maybe just a rest stop 
                      but with the purported elevation stated exactly right
                      2366m if you scroll down
                      & then it mentions the viewing point of maja bogicaj 830 meters away correctly too

                      & the degminsecs they keep giving also seem about right

                      yet i am still wondering 
                      because the tromedja peak we have been expecting thereabouts 
                      based on yugo & serbian topos
                      has a twin peak 
                      separated by a ridge saddle of about 100 meters
                      & supposedly with a numbered marker on each peak
                      possibly one we have seen claimed elsewhere
                      with the young boy standing by it

                      for a while it was a question of which of the twin peaks would prove to be the correct one
                      as they were both believed to be marked 
                      by old alyu markers b28 over iv & b28 over v respectively

                      but i think the serbian topo makes it the southeasterly one
                      which is the latter marker number btw 
                      if the above data are not mistaken

                      so for the moment it is a question of whom & what to believe

                      i still like the kid because he at least has a rock to stand with
                      & this rock is at least from the b28 series
                      however obliterated its subscript 
                      if indeed it ever had one
                      but there appear to have been as many as 10 roman numbered variants along the alyu ridge between primary markers b28 & b29

                      so why are all these new people not seeing or showing or reporting any at all

                      tis a mystery 

                      On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 3:09 PM, Jesper <jesper@...> wrote:
                       

                      Can this really be ALMERS since there is no marker B28 visuable: http://www.panoramio.com/photo/43528499

                      Actually all ALMERS photos on Panoramio don't clearly show markers.

                      Jesper


                    • Jesper
                      This is probably taken from eastern twin peak http://www.panoramio.com/photo/62313975 There is something on top. Jesper
                      Message 11 of 16 , Dec 26, 2011
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                        This is probably taken from eastern twin peak
                        http://www.panoramio.com/photo/62313975

                        There is something on top.

                        Jesper

                        --- In boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com, Aletheia Kallos <aletheiak@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > from the same source a zoomable celebration & full panorama
                        > or maybe just a rest stop
                        > but with the purported elevation stated exactly right
                        > http://www.360cities.net/image/border-between-albania-montenegro-and-kosovo-tromedja-europe#335.01,-1.18,32.6
                        > 2366m if you scroll down
                        > & then it mentions the viewing point of maja bogicaj 830 meters away
                        > correctly too
                        >
                        > & the degminsecs they keep giving also seem about right
                        >
                        > yet i am still wondering
                        > because the tromedja peak we have been expecting thereabouts
                        > based on yugo & serbian topos
                        > http://mapy.mk.cvut.cz/data/Jugoslavie-Yugoslavia/Cerna_Hora-Montenegro/Bogicevica.jpg
                        > http://www.geosrbija.rs/rga/default.aspx?gui=1&lang=1
                        > has a twin peak
                        > separated by a ridge saddle of about 100 meters
                        > & supposedly with a numbered marker on each peak
                        > possibly one we have seen claimed elsewhere
                        > with the young boy standing by it
                        > http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2102156330062955329iVBeQU
                        >
                        > for a while it was a question of which of the twin peaks would prove to be
                        > the correct one
                        > as they were both believed to be marked
                        > by old alyu markers b28 over iv & b28 over v respectively
                        >
                        > but i think the serbian topo makes it the southeasterly one
                        > which is the latter marker number btw
                        > if the above data are not mistaken
                        >
                        > so for the moment it is a question of whom & what to believe
                        >
                        > i still like the kid because he at least has a rock to stand with
                        > & this rock is at least from the b28 series
                        > however obliterated its subscript
                        > if indeed it ever had one
                        > but there appear to have been as many as 10 roman numbered variants along
                        > the alyu ridge between primary markers b28 & b29
                        >
                        > so why are all these new people not seeing or showing or reporting any at
                        > all
                        >
                        > tis a mystery
                        >
                        > On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 3:09 PM, Jesper <jesper@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > > **
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > Can this really be ALMERS since there is no marker B28 visuable:
                        > > http://www.panoramio.com/photo/43528499
                        > >
                        > > Actually all ALMERS photos on Panoramio don't clearly show markers.
                        > >
                        > > Jesper
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        >
                      • Aletheia Kallos
                        it is hard to come to any conclusions about anything here the ibs indicated in 1971 that alyu had been thoroughly marked with numbered intervisible markers by
                        Message 12 of 16 , Dec 26, 2011
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                          it is hard to come to any conclusions about anything here

                          the ibs indicated in 1971 that alyu had been thoroughly marked with numbered intervisible markers by the mid1920s 
                          & was later densified further with unnumbered ones in between all those

                          & our yugo topo sheet revised in 1980 shows every alyu peak on the sheet running from the b23 rocks thru the b29 rocks had been assigned at least an implicit & often an explicit roman numeral subscript 
                          in seemingly complete & continuous subseries

                          & we have seen a photo taken as recently as 2008 of either the main b28 rock or else one of its perhaps 10 interval peak rocks possibly also numbered b28 
                          albeit perhaps with some lost roman subscript
                          etc 
                          etc


                          so what is going on here

                          is it possible that ethnic albanian revanchists could have removed & or pulverized all the alyu border stones in the neighborhood between 2008 & the present

                          maybe

                          they are practically all albanians in every direction around there

                          anyway that is the only explanation i can think of 
                          for this total absence & silence about the rocks today

                          or else people just havent been looking for the rocks carefully enough yet

                          but in any case i still think we are still looking for a singular ridge & or watershed trijunction point

                          so 
                          planning to visit during spring runoff may be a good idea
                          the better to see the actual drainage for ourselves
                          at least until we are sure that some actual 3way demarcation will be found 
                          on this otherwise rather uncertain bump




                          On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 9:52 AM, Jesper <jesper@...> wrote:
                           

                          This is probably taken from eastern twin peak
                          http://www.panoramio.com/photo/62313975

                          There is something on top.

                          Jesper



                          --- In boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com, Aletheia Kallos <aletheiak@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > from the same source a zoomable celebration & full panorama
                          > or maybe just a rest stop
                          > but with the purported elevation stated exactly right
                          > http://www.360cities.net/image/border-between-albania-montenegro-and-kosovo-tromedja-europe#335.01,-1.18,32.6
                          > 2366m if you scroll down
                          > & then it mentions the viewing point of maja bogicaj 830 meters away
                          > correctly too
                          >
                          > & the degminsecs they keep giving also seem about right
                          >
                          > yet i am still wondering
                          > because the tromedja peak we have been expecting thereabouts
                          > based on yugo & serbian topos
                          > http://mapy.mk.cvut.cz/data/Jugoslavie-Yugoslavia/Cerna_Hora-Montenegro/Bogicevica.jpg
                          > http://www.geosrbija.rs/rga/default.aspx?gui=1&lang=1
                          > has a twin peak
                          > separated by a ridge saddle of about 100 meters
                          > & supposedly with a numbered marker on each peak
                          > possibly one we have seen claimed elsewhere
                          > with the young boy standing by it
                          > http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2102156330062955329iVBeQU
                          >
                          > for a while it was a question of which of the twin peaks would prove to be
                          > the correct one
                          > as they were both believed to be marked
                          > by old alyu markers b28 over iv & b28 over v respectively
                          >
                          > but i think the serbian topo makes it the southeasterly one
                          > which is the latter marker number btw
                          > if the above data are not mistaken
                          >
                          > so for the moment it is a question of whom & what to believe
                          >
                          > i still like the kid because he at least has a rock to stand with
                          > & this rock is at least from the b28 series
                          > however obliterated its subscript
                          > if indeed it ever had one
                          > but there appear to have been as many as 10 roman numbered variants along
                          > the alyu ridge between primary markers b28 & b29
                          >
                          > so why are all these new people not seeing or showing or reporting any at
                          > all
                          >
                          > tis a mystery
                          >
                          > On Sun, Dec 25, 2011 at 3:09 PM, Jesper <jesper@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > > **

                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Can this really be ALMERS since there is no marker B28 visuable:
                          > > http://www.panoramio.com/photo/43528499
                          > >
                          > > Actually all ALMERS photos on Panoramio don't clearly show markers.
                          > >
                          > > Jesper
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          >


                        • Jesper Nielsen
                          ALMERS 25.000 AL 1980
                          Message 13 of 16 , Jun 26, 2012
                          • 1 Attachment
                          • 765 KB

                          ALMERS 25.000 AL 1980

                           

                           

                        • aletheia kallos
                          interesting despite having less border detail than the yugo version http://mapy.mk.cvut.cz/data/Jugoslavie-Yugoslavia/Cerna_Hora-Montenegro/Bogicevica.jpg &
                          Message 14 of 16 , Jun 26, 2012
                          • 0 Attachment
                            interesting despite having less border detail than the yugo version 
                            http://mapy.mk.cvut.cz/data/Jugoslavie-Yugoslavia/Cerna_Hora-Montenegro/Bogicevica.jpg
                            & despite missing the twinning & the name of the tromedja summit entirely
                            because it appears to confirm the suspected or rumored albanian disregard for the markers 
                            by ignoring all the intermediate points or secondary markers between numbers 28 & 29 etc 
                            except 
                            for some reason 
                            the albanians have forgotten to ignore the curious marker numbered 25 over 6 
                            thus apparently giving their game away in doing so
                            & have even placed this one in a slightly different position than the serbian version shows 
                            yikes
                            but the net net is 
                            we are no closer to finally determining which of the undepicted twin peaks 
                            28 over 4 or 28 over 5 
                            is the correct tripoint
                            & it would be better to look to serbia & montenegro than to albania for that anyway

                            --- On
                            Tue, 6/26/12, Jesper Nielsen <jesper@...> wrote:

                            From: Jesper Nielsen <jesper@...>
                            Subject: [boundarypointpoint] ALMERS [1 Attachment]
                            To: boundarypointpoint@yahoogroups.com
                            Date: Tuesday, June 26, 2012, 4:28 PM

                             

                            ALMERS 25.000 AL 1980

                             

                             

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