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Re: [borderpoint] Re: Federations

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  • Peter Smaardijk
    Apart from being the English name, Austria is also the Latin name. It may even be that the Latin one came into being first :-) Peter PS: The Austrians had a
    Message 1 of 17 , Feb 8, 2009
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      Apart from being the English name, Austria is also the Latin name. It may even be that the Latin one came into being first :-)
      Peter

      PS: The Austrians had a saying: AEIOU

      --- On Mon, 2/9/09, L. A. Nadybal <lnadybal@...> wrote:
      From: L. A. Nadybal <lnadybal@...>
      Subject: [borderpoint] Re: Federations
      To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
      Date: Monday, February 9, 2009, 5:16 AM

      Switzerland is an English sourced name.

      Schweiz (the colloquial name of the country in German) with "er" and
      "land" (State, land or country) after it, means our English term comes
      close to, I guess, "Schweizerland" , or land of the Swiss. Oddly, you
      now occasionally will see Austrian stamps with the English language
      name of the country on them instead of Österreich (for example, the
      recent Arnold Schwarzenegger commemorative) , and it doesn't appear
      that the Swiss (or the Germans, for that matter) are that liberal.
      That would be like the USA putting "Estados Unidos.." or "Vereinigten
      Staaten..." on it's stamps. Or trade out Shqiperia for ?? (guess) or
      "Zil Elwannyan Sesel for ?? (guess again).

      LN

      --- In borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com, "Roger McCutcheon"
      <rogerdwmac@ ...> wrote:
      >
      > Curiously there is no suggestion of the name "Switzerland" , in any
      of its
      > languages, on its postage stamps which identify it as "Helvetia" or
      in CH
      > (for Confederatia Helvetica) which identifies the nationality of its
      > vehicles. Roger & out.
      >


    • Joachim Duester
      AUSTRIA is the Latin name for Österreich, not an English word. Latin being the historical lingua franca of the educated classes in Europe, it is still
      Message 2 of 17 , Feb 8, 2009
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        AUSTRIA is the Latin name for Österreich, not an English word. Latin being the historical "lingua franca" of the educated classes in Europe, it is still particularly useful as if you are looking for neutral, unbiased language - especially since it is , unlike other linguae francae such as French or English, not the official language of any state (the Holy See uses Latin, but the language in the Vatican State is probably Italian?). The English have, I suppose, no English name for Österreich and therefore use the Latin name.

        Hence also "Helvetia" or "Confoederatio Helvetica" for Switzerland, especially when space is as limited as it is on postage stamps or coins, and when you cannot put the official name in all four official languages.

        Joachim

        --- On Mon, 2/9/09, L. A. Nadybal <lnadybal@...> wrote:
        From: L. A. Nadybal <lnadybal@...>
        Subject: [borderpoint] Re: Federations
        To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Monday, February 9, 2009, 5:16 AM



        Switzerland is an English sourced name.



        Schweiz (the colloquial name of the country in German) with "er" and

        "land" (State, land or country) after it, means our English term comes

        close to, I guess, "Schweizerland" , or land of the Swiss. Oddly, you

        now occasionally will see Austrian stamps with the English language

        name of the country on them instead of Österreich (for example, the

        recent Arnold Schwarzenegger commemorative) , and it doesn't appear

        that the Swiss (or the Germans, for that matter) are that liberal.

        That would be like the USA putting "Estados Unidos.." or "Vereinigten

        Staaten..." on it's stamps. Or trade out Shqiperia for ?? (guess) or

        "Zil Elwannyan Sesel for ?? (guess again).



        LN



        --- In borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com, "Roger McCutcheon"

        <rogerdwmac@ ...> wrote:

        >

        > Curiously there is no suggestion of the name "Switzerland" , in any

        of its

        > languages, on its postage stamps which identify it as "Helvetia" or

        in CH

        > (for Confederatia Helvetica) which identifies the nationality of its

        > vehicles. Roger & out.

        >
      • tiffa142f
        Switzerland has 4 official languages, German French, Italian and Romansch. The common name for the country is different in all 4: Schweiz, Suisse, Svizzera and
        Message 3 of 17 , Feb 8, 2009
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          Switzerland has 4 official languages, German French, Italian and
          Romansch. The common name for the country is different in all 4:
          Schweiz, Suisse, Svizzera and Svizra. The official name is:
          Schweizerische Eidgenossenschaft (or Swchweizer Bund), Confédération
          suisse, Confederazione Svizzera and Confederaziun svizra. All of which
          derive from the name of the town "Schwyz".
          Banknotes are in all 4 languages (see here:
          http://www.snb.ch/en/iabout/cash/current/design/id/cash_current_design_10).

          All 4 are shown on banknotes.

          There is not enough room to put 4 languages on coins or stamps, so
          they chose latin to be neutral: "Helvetica on the stamps,
          "Confederatio Helvetica" on the coins and "ch" as an abbreviation.
          Nowadays they often chose English as a neutral language, which is why
          the national airline is called "Swiss".

          Austria is Latin and English for Österreich. It was used as the
          official name for simialr reasons before 1919 in the multilingual
          Austrian empire. Now it has stuck, the official abbreviation is "at"
          (internet) or "A" (cars).

          To get back to borders.
          Switzerland is a confederation of 26 cantons. It has only been a
          confederation since 1848, prior to that it was an alliance of
          independent states. Many of the Swiss border markers pre-date 1848 and
          have the coat of arms of the Swiss canton on them, as that was the
          entity that agreed on the border. Border stones post 1848 have "CH" or
          "S" on them.

          --- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com, Peter Smaardijk <smaardijk@...> wrote:
          >
          > Apart from being the English name, Austria is also the Latin name.
          It may even be that the Latin one came into being first :-)
          > Peter
          >
          > PS: The Austrians had a saying: AEIOU
          >
          > --- On Mon, 2/9/09, L. A. Nadybal <lnadybal@...> wrote:
          > From: L. A. Nadybal <lnadybal@...>
          > Subject: [borderpoint] Re: Federations
          > To: borderpoint@yahoogroups.com
          > Date: Monday, February 9, 2009, 5:16 AM
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Switzerland is an English sourced name.
          >
          >
          >
          > Schweiz (the colloquial name of the country in German) with "er" and
          >
          > "land" (State, land or country) after it, means our English term comes
          >
          > close to, I guess, "Schweizerland" , or land of the Swiss. Oddly, you
          >
          > now occasionally will see Austrian stamps with the English language
          >
          > name of the country on them instead of Österreich (for example, the
          >
          > recent Arnold Schwarzenegger commemorative) , and it doesn't appear
          >
          > that the Swiss (or the Germans, for that matter) are that liberal.
          >
          > That would be like the USA putting "Estados Unidos.." or "Vereinigten
          >
          > Staaten..." on it's stamps. Or trade out Shqiperia for ?? (guess) or
          >
          > "Zil Elwannyan Sesel for ?? (guess again).
          >
          >
          >
          > LN
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In borderpoint@ yahoogroups. com, "Roger McCutcheon"
          >
          > <rogerdwmac@ ...> wrote:
          >
          > >
          >
          > > Curiously there is no suggestion of the name "Switzerland" , in any
          >
          > of its
          >
          > > languages, on its postage stamps which identify it as "Helvetia" or
          >
          > in CH
          >
          > > (for Confederatia Helvetica) which identifies the nationality of its
          >
          > > vehicles. Roger & out.
          >
          > >
          >
        • Roger McCutcheon
          I know that Shqiperia is Albania because I was there in 1968, but Zil, apart from being a Soviet era car, has me baffled. Rpger & out.
          Message 4 of 17 , Feb 9, 2009
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            I know that Shqiperia is Albania because I was there in 1968, but Zil, apart
            from being a Soviet era car, has me baffled. Rpger & out.
          • Goyta' F. Villela Jr.
            ... I had to look it up, but it s the Seychelles (one of those things that become obvious only after you give up trying - Sesel ). Is it a federation? With
            Message 5 of 17 , Feb 9, 2009
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              > I know that Shqiperia is Albania because I was there in 1968,
              > but Zil, apart from being a Soviet era car, has me baffled.
              > Rpger & out.

              I had to look it up, but it's the Seychelles (one of those things
              that become obvious only after you give up trying - "Sesel"). Is it a
              federation? With such tiny, sparsely inhabited islands?

              And Roger, you were in Albania in 1968? At the height of the Hoxha
              regime? When the country was hermetically sealed and going there was
              even more difficult than it is to go to North Korea today? Wow, that
              must have been interesting, a tale from a bygone world.

              This was just a quick message, I'm trying to catch up with piles of e-
              mail as the last days have been troubled here. I'll get back to you
              as soon as I can (especially to Alex).

              Regards,

              Goytá
            • Kevin Meynell
              ... I guess a direct translation of Eastern Realm would have not been specific enough, given that could have referred to a number of countries/empires from
              Message 6 of 17 , Feb 9, 2009
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                >The English have, I suppose, no English name for
                >Österreich and therefore use the Latin name.

                I guess a direct translation of 'Eastern Realm'
                would have not been specific enough, given that
                could have referred to a number of
                countries/empires from the English perspective.
                In addition, starting a word with an umlaut would
                have complicated spelling and pronunciation in English.

                Cheers,

                Kevin Meynell
              • lacomaco
                Goytá, although I do not see how the Seychelles got into this thread, but I can confirm that it is not a federation at all. It would be strange indeed for a
                Message 7 of 17 , Feb 9, 2009
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                  Goytá,

                  although I do not see how the Seychelles got into this thread, but I
                  can confirm that it is not a federation at all. It would be strange
                  indeed for a federation to have 85,000 inhabitants.

                  Laszlo Kiss
                  Victoria/Seychelles
                  Budapest/Hungary


                  --- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com, "Goyta' F. Villela Jr."
                  <goytabr@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > I know that Shqiperia is Albania because I was there in 1968,
                  > > but Zil, apart from being a Soviet era car, has me baffled.
                  > > Rpger & out.
                  >
                  > I had to look it up, but it's the Seychelles (one of those things
                  > that become obvious only after you give up trying - "Sesel"). Is it
                  a
                  > federation? With such tiny, sparsely inhabited islands?
                  >
                  > And Roger, you were in Albania in 1968? At the height of the Hoxha
                  > regime? When the country was hermetically sealed and going there was
                  > even more difficult than it is to go to North Korea today? Wow, that
                  > must have been interesting, a tale from a bygone world.
                  >
                  > This was just a quick message, I'm trying to catch up with piles of
                  e-
                  > mail as the last days have been troubled here. I'll get back to you
                  > as soon as I can (especially to Alex).
                  >
                  > Regards,
                  >
                  > Goytá
                  >
                • Anton Zeilinger
                  Incidentally, the Finnish name for Austria, Itävalta , is a direct translation of the literal meaning of Österreich ( Eastern Realms ). That s the only
                  Message 8 of 17 , Feb 9, 2009
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                    Incidentally, the Finnish name for Austria, "Itävalta", is a direct
                    translation of the literal meaning of "Österreich" ("Eastern Realms").

                    That's the only language I am aware of where such a direct
                    translation is used.

                    Austria has very different names in different languages, the most
                    common being "Austria", which is a Latin transcription of Österreich
                    (originally: Ostarrichi), or derivations thereof (Avstrija, Avusturya
                    etc.), plus derivations of "Österreich" (like Oostenrijk, Østrig or
                    Østerrike). Entirely different is "Rakousko" (in Czech).

                    Similar varieties can be found for many European countries of course,
                    though some tend to greater variations than others (Germany has a lot
                    of different, apparently unrelated names, whereas Italy sounds more
                    or less the same in all languages).

                    Anyway,
                    Cheerio,

                    Anton



                    --- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com, Kevin Meynell <knm@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    > >The English have, I suppose, no English name for
                    > >Österreich and therefore use the Latin name.
                    >
                    > I guess a direct translation of 'Eastern Realm'
                    > would have not been specific enough, given that
                    > could have referred to a number of
                    > countries/empires from the English perspective.
                    > In addition, starting a word with an umlaut would
                    > have complicated spelling and pronunciation in English.
                    >
                    > Cheers,
                    >
                    > Kevin Meynell
                    >
                  • Peter Smaardijk
                    ... (...) Similar varieties can be found for many European countries of course, though some tend to greater variations than others (Germany has a lot of
                    Message 9 of 17 , Feb 9, 2009
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                      --- On Mon, 2/9/09, Anton Zeilinger <anton_zeilinger@...> wrote:

                      (...)

                      Similar varieties can be found for many European countries of course,
                      though some tend to greater variations than others (Germany has a lot
                      of different, apparently unrelated names, whereas Italy sounds more
                      or less the same in all languages).

                      (...)


                      Try Italy in Polish.... Wlochy (with l-stroke). Etymologically, this has to do with the Wales-Wallonia-Wallachia-Walser etc. group of names. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_term_Vlach


                      Peter

                    • kubana2005
                      Comoros is a federetion, but those outlying islands of the Seychelles are considered different by MostTraveled and Traveled Century club because they are
                      Message 10 of 17 , Feb 9, 2009
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                        Comoros is a federetion, but those outlying islands of the Seychelles
                        are considered different by MostTraveled and Traveled Century club
                        because they are distanced from the Mahe island.

                        As for Russia, I didn't add it in my list of federetions, I used it in
                        my list of autonomous territories, because Russian republics are sort
                        of autonomies, while oblast-s and krai-s are not really federative.

                        What about Spain and Nigeria?
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