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Re: [borderpoint] alaska, 48 states, gibraltar, and french guiana

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  • Kevin Meynell
    ... It s a difficult problem, because where do you draw the line? The likes of the Travelers Century Club call non-contiguous parts of Greece countries which
    Message 1 of 39 , May 9 3:30 PM
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      >Alaska may be politically 1 of 50 states, but in everyday usage it
      >is a separate geopolitical entity.
      >I believe it is both more common and more useful to say that you have visited
      >Kaliningrad, because it is a non-contiguous portion of Russia.

      It's a difficult problem, because where do you draw the line? The
      likes of the Travelers Century Club call non-contiguous parts of
      Greece 'countries' which is patent nonsense, and I have trouble
      describing Alaska and Hawaii as different countries when they're
      clearly amongst the 50 states of the US.

      I've long decided that the ISO 3166-1 list is the definitive list,
      because that at least recognises dependent territories as separate
      political entities. It does have the odd anomaly (although less than
      it used to), but at least I don't have to make the decision about
      what is and what isn't a country or territory. If I had to make my
      own list, it wouldn't be much different anyway.

      I think in the end, you have to define four categories:

      1) Sovereign countries
      2) Dependent territories
      3) Ambiguous territories (e.g. Palestine, Western Sahara, Taiwan)
      4) No-mans land (Antarctica)

      Possibly you can add a fifth category of de-facto, but not de-jure
      states (e.g. Northern Cyprus, Somaliland).

      Cheers,

      Kevin Meynell
    • L. A. Nadybal
      I can appreciate the challenge of being objective in the current situation. The promotion of independence at this particular time only muddied the waters. I
      Message 39 of 39 , May 19 8:03 PM
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        I can appreciate the challenge of being objective in the current
        situation. The promotion of independence at this particular time only
        muddied the waters. I don't have any better solution, but I do wonder
        at the 40-153 ratio - how many countries are members of the UN - if
        you add the 40 plus the 153, that's 193 - I don't think there are that
        many member states (and maybe only a handful that aren't members). I
        don't think any country counts the occupied areas of Palestine to be
        part of Israel - even Israel handles it as occupied territory. Aland
        is clearly a part of Finland but with internal self government (autonomy)

        That 15% of Kosovo is still in Serbian hands, but patrolled by UNMIK
        is an interesting concepts, if you consider UNMIK to the de facto
        government, because then you have one country and two local
        administrations. What is Metohia?

        RE: Iran and the UAE, the moment the UAE sheiks agreed to unite, Iran
        occupied two islands off the coast of, I think, Abu Dhabi, and have
        apparently kept them up to now. US State Department maps show these
        islands and others in the gulf as disputed.

        Len



        --- In borderpoint@yahoogroups.com, "kubana2005" <kubana2005@...> wrote:
        >
        > Please don't think that I claim Kosovo as 'generaly unrecognized'
        > because I am Serbian. I am trying to be as objective as possible.
        >
        > Kosovo is recognized by 40 countries, while 153 countries 'claim' at
        > as beign part of Serbia. Not a lot of countries (unlike Kosovo) claim
        > Western Sahara (and Palestine) to be integral part of Morrocco (and
        > Israel), so it's not a best way to compare it.
        > Before Kosovo deaclered independence, I list it similarly to Aland,
        > Hong Kong, and Macau (same coutry, but two govorments, systems etc.).
        > Kosovo is de facto UN (UNMIK) protectorat, but it's de jure part of
        > Serbia (under the resolution UN 1244, which claimes that Kosovo and
        > Metohia is integral part of Serbia).
        > And just to add that 15% of Kosovo is controled by Serbia (indirectly).
        >
        > Somebody mentioned UAE, which reminds me of some sort of Iranian
        > controled land in UAE (not sure what it is exectly) ?
        >
        > cheers, Alex
        >
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