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[bolger] Re: Idaho?

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  • GHC
    Don, I don t know, but I would have to guess that Tennessee is at LEAST 3/8 , since the Sneakeasy is. I think the rocker aft for planing should be less than 2
    Message 1 of 8 , Aug 2, 1999
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      Don,

      I don't know, but I would have to guess that Tennessee is at LEAST 3/8",
      since the Sneakeasy is.

      I think the rocker aft for planing should be less than 2 degrees, according
      to Dave Gerr. On something as long as the Tennessee, even less might be
      better.

      But, I get only about 20 mph on 25 hp on the Sneakeasy and thought about
      this last weekend. I think it's all skin friction - if you put any weight
      at all up forward, it will slow down. I think it drops the bow and puts
      more "skin" in the water. The bottom itself is not really very smooth and
      slick - I really need to turn it over, and fair and paint with something
      hard and slick like epoxy.

      Point is, on these boats, I think a good bottom is important.

      Gregg


      At 03:23 PM 8/2/99 -0500, you wrote:
      >I'm not sure whats going on with the "Common Sense" outfit, but last time I
      >looked, there was some Idaho material at www.common-sense-boats.com .
      >www.common-sense-designs.com is closed.
      >
      >Don Hodges
      >Lynn Haven, FL
      >
      >(BTW, Gregg, I'm taking another look at Tennesee as a project - do you know
      >if the side planks are 3/8? I'm looking into MDO and it doesn't come any
      >thinner than 3/8 inch. Also, any thoughts on taking out the rocker aft and
      >going to about 25 hp for Tennessee for maybe 15-18 mph?)
      >
      >----- Original Message -----
      >From: Joe Bradford <bradford@...>
      >To: <bolger@...>
      >Sent: Saturday, July 31, 1999 4:06 PM
      >Subject: [bolger] Idaho?
      >
      >
      >> I am trying to ind the plans, or the colection of plans that include, P.
      >> Bolger's "Idaho" design. Can anyone out there help me?
    • Donald Hodges
      I m certainly no expert, but I would guess wetted surface area is far more influential than finish, if finish is within reason. We are talking turbulent flow
      Message 2 of 8 , Aug 3, 1999
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        I'm certainly no expert, but I would guess wetted surface area is far more
        influential than finish, if finish is within reason. We are talking
        turbulent flow here - when I raced (much slower) sailboats, we were careful
        about the bottom finish and it made maybe 1/8 - 1/4 knot difference - quite
        a bit at 3-4 knots over 10 -12 miles, but not much if you are already going
        15-16 knots (and not racing).

        Don Hodges
        Lynn Haven, FL
        http://www.ecoastlife.com

        .
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: GHC <ghartc@...>
        To: <bolger@egroups.com>
        Sent: Monday, August 02, 1999 4:27 PM
        Subject: [bolger] Re: Idaho?


        > Don,
        >
        > I don't know, but I would have to guess that Tennessee is at LEAST 3/8",
        > since the Sneakeasy is.
        >
        > I think the rocker aft for planing should be less than 2 degrees,
        according
        > to Dave Gerr. On something as long as the Tennessee, even less might be
        > better.
        >
        > But, I get only about 20 mph on 25 hp on the Sneakeasy and thought about
        > this last weekend. I think it's all skin friction - if you put any weight
        > at all up forward, it will slow down. I think it drops the bow and puts
        > more "skin" in the water. The bottom itself is not really very smooth and
        > slick - I really need to turn it over, and fair and paint with something
        > hard and slick like epoxy.
        >
        > Point is, on these boats, I think a good bottom is important.
        >
        > Gregg
        >
        >
        > At 03:23 PM 8/2/99 -0500, you wrote:
        > >I'm not sure whats going on with the "Common Sense" outfit, but last time
        I
        > >looked, there was some Idaho material at www.common-sense-boats.com .
        > >www.common-sense-designs.com is closed.
        > >
        > >Don Hodges
        > >Lynn Haven, FL
        > >
        > >(BTW, Gregg, I'm taking another look at Tennesee as a project - do you
        know
        > >if the side planks are 3/8? I'm looking into MDO and it doesn't come any
        > >thinner than 3/8 inch. Also, any thoughts on taking out the rocker aft
        and
        > >going to about 25 hp for Tennessee for maybe 15-18 mph?)
        > >
        > >----- Original Message -----
        > >From: Joe Bradford <bradford@...>
        > >To: <bolger@...>
        > >Sent: Saturday, July 31, 1999 4:06 PM
        > >Subject: [bolger] Idaho?
        > >
        > >
        > >> I am trying to ind the plans, or the colection of plans that include,
        P.
        > >> Bolger's "Idaho" design. Can anyone out there help me?
        >
        >
        >
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      • GHC
        You are probably right, but it seems it ought to make some difference...?
        Message 3 of 8 , Aug 3, 1999
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          You are probably right, but it seems it ought to make some difference...?


          At 10:40 AM 8/3/99 -0500, you wrote:
          >I'm certainly no expert, but I would guess wetted surface area is far more
          >influential than finish, if finish is within reason. We are talking
          >turbulent flow here - when I raced (much slower) sailboats, we were careful
          >about the bottom finish and it made maybe 1/8 - 1/4 knot difference - quite
          >a bit at 3-4 knots over 10 -12 miles, but not much if you are already going
          >15-16 knots (and not racing).
          >
          >Don Hodges
          >Lynn Haven, FL
          >http://www.ecoastlife.com
          >
          >.
          >----- Original Message -----
          >From: GHC <ghartc@...>
          >To: <bolger@egroups.com>
          >Sent: Monday, August 02, 1999 4:27 PM
          >Subject: [bolger] Re: Idaho?
          >
          >
          >> Don,
          >>
          >> I don't know, but I would have to guess that Tennessee is at LEAST 3/8",
          >> since the Sneakeasy is.
          >>
          >> I think the rocker aft for planing should be less than 2 degrees,
          >according
          >> to Dave Gerr. On something as long as the Tennessee, even less might be
          >> better.
          >>
          >> But, I get only about 20 mph on 25 hp on the Sneakeasy and thought about
          >> this last weekend. I think it's all skin friction - if you put any weight
          >> at all up forward, it will slow down. I think it drops the bow and puts
          >> more "skin" in the water. The bottom itself is not really very smooth and
          >> slick - I really need to turn it over, and fair and paint with something
          >> hard and slick like epoxy.
          >>
          >> Point is, on these boats, I think a good bottom is important.
          >>
          >> Gregg
          >>
          >>
          >> At 03:23 PM 8/2/99 -0500, you wrote:
          >> >I'm not sure whats going on with the "Common Sense" outfit, but last time
          >I
          >> >looked, there was some Idaho material at www.common-sense-boats.com .
          >> >www.common-sense-designs.com is closed.
          >> >
          >> >Don Hodges
          >> >Lynn Haven, FL
          >> >
          >> >(BTW, Gregg, I'm taking another look at Tennesee as a project - do you
          >know
          >> >if the side planks are 3/8? I'm looking into MDO and it doesn't come any
          >> >thinner than 3/8 inch. Also, any thoughts on taking out the rocker aft
          >and
          >> >going to about 25 hp for Tennessee for maybe 15-18 mph?)
          >> >
          >> >----- Original Message -----
          >> >From: Joe Bradford <bradford@...>
          >> >To: <bolger@...>
          >> >Sent: Saturday, July 31, 1999 4:06 PM
          >> >Subject: [bolger] Idaho?
          >> >
          >> >
          >> >> I am trying to ind the plans, or the colection of plans that include,
          >P.
          >> >> Bolger's "Idaho" design. Can anyone out there help me?
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
          >> GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: DOUBLE Rewards points,
          >> NO annual fee & rates as low as 9.9% FIXED APR. Apply online today!
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          >>
          >>
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          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >
          >
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        • bradford@dynasty.net
          Thanks, Don, you ended my search! I also discvered that the beam of Idaho is only 63 . Limits your interior options, not to mention the aesthetics. I notice
          Message 4 of 8 , Aug 3, 1999
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            Thanks, Don, you ended my search! I also discvered that the beam of
            Idaho is only 63". Limits your interior options, not to mention the
            aesthetics.

            I notice Tennessee carries 72" of beam. What kind power/speed
            properties are expected as she's drawn? What's your goal in the bottom
            mod?

            Joe Bradford
            Henderson, KY


            <007e01bedd25$3b504f80$cbb14d0-@default> wrote:
            original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=70
            > I'm not sure whats going on with the "Common Sense" outfit, but last
            time I
            > looked, there was some Idaho material at www.common-sense-boats.com .
            > www.common-sense-designs.com is closed.
            >
            > Don Hodges
            > Lynn Haven, FL
            >
            > (BTW, Gregg, I'm taking another look at Tennesee as a project - do
            you know
            > if the side planks are 3/8? I'm looking into MDO and it doesn't come
            any
            > thinner than 3/8 inch. Also, any thoughts on taking out the rocker
            aft and
            > going to about 25 hp for Tennessee for maybe 15-18 mph?)
            >
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: Joe Bradford <bradford@...>
            > To: <bolger@...>
            > Sent: Saturday, July 31, 1999 4:06 PM
            > Subject: [bolger] Idaho?
            >
            >
            > > I am trying to ind the plans, or the colection of plans that
            include, P.
            > > Bolger's "Idaho" design. Can anyone out there help me?
            > >
            > >
          • Donald Hodges
            Joe, Chuck Leinweber (on this list) has built Tennessee, and may jump in and answer some of your questions... (help, Chuck!). I only know Tennessee has a bit
            Message 5 of 8 , Aug 4, 1999
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              Joe,

              Chuck Leinweber (on this list) has built Tennessee, and may jump in and
              answer some of your questions... (help, Chuck!).

              I only know Tennessee has a bit of rocker toward the stern, and is
              advertised for low-hp (9.9 typically) engines. This makes her pretty much a
              displacement boat with some extra speed potential for being light and
              narrow. That's 7 knots plus the light/narrow factor, I would guess 8.5-9.0
              knots (9.8 - 10.4 mph).

              I have built a few small boats (and bought or studied more than I will
              admit!), and a real planing hull is almost flat to even a bit "hooked" at
              the stern in order to keep them more level and minimize the bow-up plowing
              that precedes rising to plane. Big power boats use hydraulic trim plates to
              hook the bottom going up to plane, then trim toward flat for cruising on
              plane. For a simple boat like Tennessee, flat is probably close enough to
              give her some planing potential if enough power is installed. Rule of thumb
              here is one hp per 50 to 100 lb weight. If we assumed 75 lb/hp for
              Tennessee and 1500 lb, we are at 20 hp just to sustain planing, and probably
              35 hp needed to acheive planing initially. Based on Gregg's experience with
              the Sneakeasy (which is flat) I'm probably still a bit optimistic. BUT, I
              have said I would settle for 11-12 knots (12.6 - 13.8 mph) or so with two
              aboard if not redlining the engine and just plowing along.

              So, I'll just leave the question out here: has anyone clocked a Tennessee
              with 25 hp installed, "stock" or with a flat bottom?

              Don Hodges
              Lynn Haven, FL
              http://www.ecoastlife.com



              ----- Original Message -----
              From: <bradford@...>
              To: <bolger@...>
              Sent: Tuesday, August 03, 1999 11:08 PM
              Subject: [bolger] Re: Idaho?


              > Thanks, Don, you ended my search! I also discvered that the beam of
              > Idaho is only 63". Limits your interior options, not to mention the
              > aesthetics.
              >
              > I notice Tennessee carries 72" of beam. What kind power/speed
              > properties are expected as she's drawn? What's your goal in the bottom
              > mod?
              >
              > Joe Bradford
              > Henderson, KY
              >
              >
              > <007e01bedd25$3b504f80$cbb14d0-@default> wrote:
              > original article:http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger/?start=70
              > > I'm not sure whats going on with the "Common Sense" outfit, but last
              > time I
              > > looked, there was some Idaho material at www.common-sense-boats.com .
              > > www.common-sense-designs.com is closed.
              > >
              > > Don Hodges
              > > Lynn Haven, FL
              > >
              > > (BTW, Gregg, I'm taking another look at Tennesee as a project - do
              > you know
              > > if the side planks are 3/8? I'm looking into MDO and it doesn't come
              > any
              > > thinner than 3/8 inch. Also, any thoughts on taking out the rocker
              > aft and
              > > going to about 25 hp for Tennessee for maybe 15-18 mph?)
              > >
              > > ----- Original Message -----
              > > From: Joe Bradford <bradford@...>
              > > To: <bolger@...>
              > > Sent: Saturday, July 31, 1999 4:06 PM
              > > Subject: [bolger] Idaho?
              > >
              > >
              > > > I am trying to ind the plans, or the colection of plans that
              > include, P.
              > > > Bolger's "Idaho" design. Can anyone out there help me?
              > > >
              > > >
              >
              >
              > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
              > GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: DOUBLE Rewards points,
              > NO annual fee & rates as low as 9.9% FIXED APR. Apply online today!
              > http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/606
              >
              >
              > eGroups.com home: http://www.egroups.com/group/bolger
              > http://www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
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