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cedar paneling

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  • chadnn
    Has anyone use 8mm x 48 x 96 cedar paneling (see Home Depot) to build a boat ? Thanks
    Message 1 of 12 , Nov 14, 2013
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      Has anyone use 8mm x 48" x 96"  cedar paneling (see Home Depot) to build a boat ?


      Thanks
    • Roger Padvorac
      A critical issue is checking if the wood plies are heartwood or sapwood. This could vary from sheet to sheet, so people s experience with it could vary. While
      Message 2 of 12 , Nov 14, 2013
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        A critical issue is checking if the wood plies are heartwood or sapwood. This could vary from sheet to sheet, so people's experience with it could vary.
         
        While the heartwood of the western red cedar is more resistant to rot than the heartwood of Douglass fir, the sapwood of western red cedar rots faster than the heartwood of Douglass fir.
         
        Confusing this situation is that while the western red cedar is in the cypress family, in the genus Thuja, and cedars are in the pine family in the genus Cedrus.
         
        It seems possible that the difference in rot resistance between sapwood and heartwood is a common issue, and with the general lowering of standards, that there could be more sapwood in plywood than there used to be. As a general rule of thumb, the sapwood is lighter in color than the heartwood.
         
        It seems likely the sapwood of western red cedar is so vulnerable to rot in part because it is so soft. While its hardwood of western red cedar is also comparatively soft, it is also saturated with very toxic chemicals (unlike the sapwood), and so is very resistant to rot. These issues might affect other Thuja and Cedrus species.
         
        May your day be filled with clarity, grace, strength, insight, balance, cooperating, and warm laughter,
        Roger
         
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2013 5:53 AM
        Subject: [bolger] cedar paneling

        Has anyone use 8mm x 48" x 96"  cedar paneling (see Home Depot) to build a boat ?

        Thanks

        _,_.___
      • Christopher C. Wetherill
        There are also the questions of what species the non-display plies come from and what glue was used. Most paneling consists of a finish veneer laid over a
        Message 3 of 12 , Nov 14, 2013
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          There are also the questions of what species the non-display plies come from and what glue was used.  Most paneling consists of a finish veneer laid over a cheap core and a non-finish back skin with interior grade glue.  I would not want to bet my life on paneling.

          V/R
          Chris


          On 11/14/2013 11:59 AM, Roger Padvorac wrote:
          
          A critical issue is checking if the wood plies are heartwood or sapwood. This could vary from sheet to sheet, so people's experience with it could vary.
           
          While the heartwood of the western red cedar is more resistant to rot than the heartwood of Douglass fir, the sapwood of western red cedar rots faster than the heartwood of Douglass fir.
           
          Confusing this situation is that while the western red cedar is in the cypress family, in the genus Thuja, and cedars are in the pine family in the genus Cedrus.
           
          It seems possible that the difference in rot resistance between sapwood and heartwood is a common issue, and with the general lowering of standards, that there could be more sapwood in plywood than there used to be. As a general rule of thumb, the sapwood is lighter in color than the heartwood.
           
          It seems likely the sapwood of western red cedar is so vulnerable to rot in part because it is so soft. While its hardwood of western red cedar is also comparatively soft, it is also saturated with very toxic chemicals (unlike the sapwood), and so is very resistant to rot. These issues might affect other Thuja and Cedrus species.
           
          May your day be filled with clarity, grace, strength, insight, balance, cooperating, and warm laughter,
          Roger
           
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2013 5:53 AM
          Subject: [bolger] cedar paneling

          Has anyone use 8mm x 48" x 96"  cedar paneling (see Home Depot) to build a boat ?

          Thanks

          _,_.___

        • Chief Redelk
          I ve cut a lot of Cedar trees.. If it lays on the ground for very long the soft parts rot away like a pine tree, pretty fast.. All that will be left is the
          Message 4 of 12 , Nov 14, 2013
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            I've cut a lot of Cedar trees.. If it lays on the ground for very long
            the soft parts rot away like a pine tree, pretty fast.. All that will
            be left is the heart and it does not rot fast.. There is not much of
            it but it makes good kindling like the pine heart. I would not build a
            boat out of Cedar UNLESS..It were cedar strips cut out of a cedar
            board. ALSO.. IF I used cedar strips ( once they were used to build
            canoes ) I would make sure to cover it and keep water off the wood.
            Years ago cedar canoes were covered in Canvas and paint... SO.. the
            short answer is. NO..I simply would NOT use this stuff...I don't like
            it any better than Luan..

            Years ago I found some Luan that was decent and it did not check but
            over the years Luan has gotten so sorry it's almost usless... I did
            use some lately......Pine WILL check every time..No exceptions.....
            Most woods WILL check if used on a boat. The small cracks open the
            paint lets water seep under the paint into the wood and the wood
            swells further cracking the paint and water can soak into the wood
            causing rot..In winter the wet wood freezes and damages the boat even
            more... To stop Checking I laminate my wood with a fabric and
            paint.....

            On a cheap boat I use Titebond II to stop checking. I now use pine ply
            plywood for all my boats..So far this has worked well stopping
            Checking on all wood including Luan....I apply TB2 to the new wood
            then coat that with Exterior Latex house Paint so the two can cure as
            one....

            Apply TB2 with a brush and DO NOT miss one spot of new wood..Soak it
            into cracks etc. It will heal and seal...IF you could find the voids
            and fill them with this it will seal them as well. I have injected it
            into voids by drilling a small hole and using a syringe and
            needle...It takes a while to fill a void due to shrinkage..If you cut
            a bigger hole you can pack it with wet saw dust and TB2. Eventually it
            will fill and works well. I tape over that with FB..

            For an expensive boat I would use Epoxy and fiberglass..

            My next boat will be12 feet long. It will be heavier than a Luan boat
            but it will be trailered. It will be built out of 1/4 Ext. Glue Pine
            Plywood and 3/8. All wood will be sealed with TB2 and painted over
            with Latex Paint..It will be stored dry out of the sun and it will
            last a very long time. There is a benefit to a sort of heavy boat. It
            will move through a tack better and it may sail better.. In water
            weight is not as important ( up to a point ) was it is to a man
            handling the boat on land..

            The problem with 3 ply Ext Glue Pine plywood is Moisture causing
            WRINKLES or big long strips of bubbles where the top coat buckles due
            to a void beneath.. It looks ugly but if it's small and inside the
            hull it's seldom a real problem. Some of them open will crack and open
            and those I fix...The ones that do not open up I don't bother with if
            they are small and inside the hull. When the boat is fabric coated on
            the exterior I have never had the hull wrinkle. If not coated with
            fabric and the wood does wrinkly you can fix the wrinkle easy. Cut it
            out and glue in a strip or fill and epoxy and glass over.... .

            After a while you will have found all the weak spots and repaired
            them. In fact as my boats age they look better due to making repairs
            and adding more paint..In fact they are better..

            I wet sanded ( latex must be wet sanded ) and painted my old Skiff
            this year. She looks new is solid and better than the day she was
            born..I scarphed the mast making it longer and went from a Sprit sail
            to a Leg Of mutton..

            All my boats are dry stored.. In fact during winter I cover them with
            blankets inside the shed so moisture don't form on them as Frost..
            Frost can form on things rain and snow can't reach..

            Taking care of a boat is the life of a boat.. Wooden boats can last
            for a life time. I expect to die and leave some nice boats behind..
            Old but nice..

            If my grandsons take care of them these boats will be alive when they
            die and none of them are made out of expensive wood. ONLY 1 has Marine
            Grade Plywood. That MG ply checked like crazy until I put fabric on
            it.. Good luck, Chief...

            On 11/14/13, Christopher C. Wetherill <wetherillc@...> wrote:
            > There are also the questions of what species the non-display plies come
            > from and what glue was used. Most paneling consists of a finish veneer
            > laid over a cheap core and a non-finish back skin with interior grade
            > glue. I would not want to bet my life on paneling.
            >
            > V/R
            > Chris
            >
            >
            > On 11/14/2013 11:59 AM, Roger Padvorac wrote:
            >> ?
            >>
            >> A critical issue is checking if the wood plies are heartwood or
            >> sapwood. This could vary from sheet to sheet, so people's experience
            >> with it could vary.
            >> While the heartwood of the western red cedar is more resistant to rot
            >> than the heartwood of Douglass fir, the sapwood of western red cedar
            >> rots faster than the heartwood of Douglass fir.
            >> Confusing this situation is that while the western red cedar is in the
            >> cypress family, in the genus Thuja, and cedars are in the pine family
            >> in the genus Cedrus.
            >> It seems possible that the difference in rot resistance between
            >> sapwood and heartwood is a common issue, and with the general lowering
            >> of standards, that there could be more sapwood in plywood than there
            >> used to be. As a general rule of thumb, the sapwood is lighter in
            >> color than the heartwood.
            >> It seems likely the sapwood of western red cedar is so vulnerable to
            >> rot in part because it is so soft. While its hardwood of western red
            >> cedar is also comparatively soft, it is also saturated with very toxic
            >> chemicals (unlike the sapwood), and so is very resistant to rot. These
            >> issues might affect other Thuja and Cedrus species.
            >> May your day be filled with clarity, grace, strength, insight,
            >> balance, cooperating, and warm laughter,
            >> Roger
            >>
            >> ----- Original Message -----
            >> *From:* chadnn@... <mailto:chadnn@...>
            >> *To:* bolger@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com>
            >> *Sent:* Thursday, November 14, 2013 5:53 AM
            >> *Subject:* [bolger] cedar paneling
            >>
            >> Has anyone use 8mm x 48" x 96" cedar paneling (see Home Depot) to
            >> build a boat ?
            >>
            >> Thanks
            >>
            >> _,_.___
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >
            >
          • Roger Padvorac
            Chris, Your description reminded me of the fourth Cheech and Chong movie Things Are Tough All Over where they drive cross county. The car gradually falls
            Message 5 of 12 , Nov 14, 2013
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              Chris,
              Your description reminded me of the fourth Cheech and Chong movie "Things Are Tough All Over" where they drive cross county. The car gradually falls apart until there is nothing left of it and they are left sitting in the middle of the road.
               
              This skit wouldn't be so funny if this was a boat and you were a long away offshore in bad weather.
               
              Even cheap exterior plywood generally delaminates slowly enough that you have enough warning to head back to shore. A risk of quick massive delimitation sounds a bit scary, especially if its thin plywood.
               
              Recently I washed a pair of inexpensive running shoes, and the glue dissolved while they were being washed, so now I have a pile of shoe parts.
               
              * * * *
              I think we are on the downside of a peak in manufacturing quality, and need to be very cautious about glue quality.
               
              Since manufacturing standards can quickly shift, and different plants have different standards, when buying generic plywood it seems reasonable to buy only one sheet of plywood, cut out a piece and do a boil test on it. Then if it passes the boil test, quickly go back and buy more of that plywood, as long as its from the same lot that the boil test was done on.
               
              If stock isn't from the same lot, then start over with buying a single piece of plywood, do a boil test on part of it, and then if it passes, try to buy more of the same lot.
               
              * * * *
              I suppose an advantage of buying MDO, with markings on it from a known manufacturer, is that the main market for it is commercial firms creating outdoor signs, and so if the plywood delaminated before it rotted, then the manufacture would quickly loose their market share.
               
              Buying generic commodity plywood is seeming lots riskier now than it used to be.
               
              May your day be filled with clarity, grace, strength, insight, balance, cooperation, and warm laughter,
              Roger
               
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2013 10:44 AM
              Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [bolger] cedar paneling

              There are also the questions of what species the non-display plies come from and what glue was used.  Most paneling consists of a finish veneer laid over a cheap core and a non-finish back skin with interior grade glue.  I would not want to bet my life on paneling.

              V/R
              Chris


            • chadnn
              Thanks for the replies. Will check that off my list. ... Chris, Your description reminded me of the fourth Cheech and Chong movie Things Are Tough All Over
              Message 6 of 12 , Nov 14, 2013
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                Thanks for the replies.  Will check that off my list. 



                ---In bolger@yahoogroups.com, <roger@...> wrote:

                Chris,
                Your description reminded me of the fourth Cheech and Chong movie "Things Are Tough All Over" where they drive cross county. The car gradually falls apart until there is nothing left of it and they are left sitting in the middle of the road.
                 
                This skit wouldn't be so funny if this was a boat and you were a long away offshore in bad weather.
                 
                Even cheap exterior plywood generally delaminates slowly enough that you have enough warning to head back to shore. A risk of quick massive delimitation sounds a bit scary, especially if its thin plywood.
                 
                Recently I washed a pair of inexpensive running shoes, and the glue dissolved while they were being washed, so now I have a pile of shoe parts.
                 
                * * * *
                I think we are on the downside of a peak in manufacturing quality, and need to be very cautious about glue quality.
                 
                Since manufacturing standards can quickly shift, and different plants have different standards, when buying generic plywood it seems reasonable to buy only one sheet of plywood, cut out a piece and do a boil test on it. Then if it passes the boil test, quickly go back and buy more of that plywood, as long as its from the same lot that the boil test was done on.
                 
                If stock isn't from the same lot, then start over with buying a single piece of plywood, do a boil test on part of it, and then if it passes, try to buy more of the same lot.
                 
                * * * *
                I suppose an advantage of buying MDO, with markings on it from a known manufacturer, is that the main market for it is commercial firms creating outdoor signs, and so if the plywood delaminated before it rotted, then the manufacture would quickly loose their market share.
                 
                Buying generic commodity plywood is seeming lots riskier now than it used to be.
                 
                May your day be filled with clarity, grace, strength, insight, balance, cooperation, and warm laughter,
                Roger
                 
                ----- Original Message -----
                Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2013 10:44 AM
                Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [bolger] cedar paneling

                There are also the questions of what species the non-display plies come from and what glue was used.  Most paneling consists of a finish veneer laid over a cheap core and a non-finish back skin with interior grade glue.  I would not want to bet my life on paneling.

                V/R
                Chris


              • Roger Padvorac
                Chief, I m always curious about trees, do you know what kind of cedar it is you are referring to here? That is really interesting about pine and Titebond II.
                Message 7 of 12 , Nov 16, 2013
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                  Chief,
                  I'm always curious about trees, do you know what kind of cedar it is you are referring to here?
                   
                  That is really interesting about pine and Titebond II.
                   
                  Here in the land of Douglas fir, in the Pacific Northwest, we are seeing more and more pine. The nice Douglas fir wood came from old growth that is mostly gone now, and it takes that species a really long time to produce large trees with lots of clear heartwood. The pines in the south seem to grow faster, and so I think the pine tree farms there produce more wood per acre per year than the Douglas fir tree farms here do. So it seems likely we will be seeing more pine here as time moves on.
                   
                  When I grew up, pine was considered adequate for cheap disposable uses of wood. However I'm fond of pine and much of my furniture is made from pine. Part of the inside of the home I grew up in was paneled with tongue and grove pine. So I'm inclined to use pine, where it will work well.
                   
                  These days a lot of the "fir" here is actually hemlock, which I don't like as well as Douglass fir or pine.
                   
                  So its good to know you think well of pine for boats. I think I'd rather use high quality pine than trashy fir, especially if it isn't really fir in the first place. Also pine is lighter than fir, which is good for small boats you move around by hand.
                   
                  We have a lot of really damp cold weather here. If stuff in an unheated uninsulated shed gets really cold, and then a foggy drizzly warm front comes through, a layer of condensation will form on the cold surfaces inside the shed, and the tools tend to rust a bit from this.
                   
                  You would think that tools in sheaths would trap this moisture and rust worse than the exposed tools, but it doesn't work that way. I don't use rubber sheaths, they are either leather, fabric, or carpet and so are permeable to moisture and will dry out if the tool was wet when it was put into the sheath. The sheathed tools in my shed don't rust the way the exposed metal on other tools does.
                   
                  So whether the moisture condensing out on the boats is frozen or liquid, it seems like covering them with blankets would help protect the wood from picking up moisture from condensation when they are in storage.
                   
                  May your day be filled with clarity, grace, strength, insight, balance, cooperation, and warm laughter,
                  Roger
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: "Chief Redelk" <chiefredelk@...>
                  Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2013 11:45 AM
                  Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [bolger] cedar paneling

                  > I've cut a lot of Cedar trees.. If it lays on the ground for very long
                  > the soft parts rot away like a pine tree, pretty fast.. All
                  that will
                  > be left is the heart and it does not rot fast.. There is not
                  much of
                  > it but it makes good kindling like the pine heart. I would not
                  build a
                  > boat out of Cedar UNLESS..It were cedar strips cut out of a
                  cedar
                  > board. ALSO.. IF I used cedar strips ( once they were used to
                  build
                  > canoes ) I would make sure to cover it and keep water off the
                  wood.
                  > Years ago cedar canoes were covered in Canvas and paint... SO..
                  the
                  > short answer is. NO..I simply would NOT use this stuff...I don't
                  like
                  > it any better than Luan..
                  >
                  > Years ago I found some
                  Luan that was decent and it did not check but
                  > over the years Luan has
                  gotten so sorry it's almost usless... I did
                  > use some lately......Pine
                  WILL check every time..No exceptions.....
                  > Most woods WILL check if used
                  on a boat. The small cracks open the
                  > paint lets water seep under the
                  paint into the wood and the wood
                  > swells further cracking the paint and
                  water can soak into the wood
                  > causing rot..In winter the wet wood freezes
                  and damages the boat even
                  > more... To stop Checking I laminate my wood
                  with a fabric and
                  > paint.....
                  >
                  > On a cheap boat I use
                  Titebond II to stop checking. I now use pine ply
                  > plywood for all my
                  boats..So far this has worked well stopping
                  > Checking on all wood
                  including Luan....I apply TB2 to the new wood
                  > then coat that with
                  Exterior Latex house Paint so the two can cure as
                  > one....
                  >
                  > Apply TB2 with a brush and DO NOT miss one spot of new wood..Soak
                  it
                  > into cracks etc. It will heal and seal...IF you could find the
                  voids
                  > and fill them with this it will seal them as well. I have injected
                  it
                  > into voids by drilling a small hole and using a syringe and
                  >
                  needle...It takes a while to fill a void due to shrinkage..If you cut
                  > a
                  bigger hole you can pack it with wet saw dust and TB2. Eventually it
                  >
                  will fill and works well. I tape over that with FB..
                  >
                  > For an
                  expensive boat I would use Epoxy and fiberglass..
                  >
                  > My next boat
                  will be12 feet long. It will be heavier than a Luan boat
                  > but it will be
                  trailered. It will be built out of 1/4 Ext. Glue Pine
                  > Plywood and 3/8.
                  All wood will be sealed with TB2 and painted over
                  > with Latex Paint..It
                  will be stored dry out of the sun and it will
                  > last a very long time.
                  There is a benefit to a sort of heavy boat. It
                  > will move through a tack
                  better and it may sail better.. In water
                  > weight is not as important ( up
                  to a point ) was it is to a man
                  > handling the boat on land..
                  >
                  > The problem with 3 ply Ext Glue Pine plywood is Moisture
                  causing
                  > WRINKLES or big long strips of bubbles where the top coat
                  buckles due
                  > to a void beneath.. It looks ugly but if it's small and
                  inside the
                  > hull it's seldom a real problem. Some of them open will crack
                  and open
                  > and those I fix...The ones that do not open up I don't bother
                  with if
                  > they are small and inside the hull. When the boat is fabric
                  coated on
                  > the exterior I have never had the hull wrinkle. If not coated
                  with
                  > fabric and the wood does wrinkly you can fix the wrinkle easy. Cut
                  it
                  > out and glue in a strip or fill and epoxy and glass over....
                  .
                  >
                  > After a while you will have found all the weak spots and
                  repaired
                  > them. In fact as my boats age they look better due to making
                  repairs
                  > and adding more paint..In fact they are better..
                  >
                  > I wet sanded ( latex must be wet sanded ) and painted my old
                  Skiff
                  > this year. She looks new is solid and better than the day she
                  was
                  > born..I scarphed the mast making it longer and went from a Sprit
                  sail
                  > to a Leg Of mutton..
                  >
                  > All my boats are dry stored..
                  In fact during winter I cover them with
                  > blankets inside the shed so
                  moisture don't form on them as Frost..
                  > Frost can form on things rain and
                  snow can't reach..
                  >
                  > Taking care of a boat is the life of a
                  boat.. Wooden boats can last
                  > for a life time. I expect to die and leave
                  some nice boats behind..
                  > Old but nice..
                  >
                  > If my grandsons
                  take care of them these boats will be alive when they
                  > die and none of
                  them are made out of expensive wood. ONLY 1 has Marine
                  > Grade Plywood.
                  That MG ply checked like crazy until I put fabric on
                  > it.. Good luck,
                  Chief...
                  >
                  > On 11/14/13, Christopher C. Wetherill <
                  href="mailto:wetherillc@...">wetherillc@...> wrote:
                  >> There are also the questions of what species the non-display
                  plies come
                  >> from and what glue was used.  Most paneling consists
                  of a finish veneer
                  >> laid over a cheap core and a non-finish back skin
                  with interior grade
                  >> glue.  I would not want to bet my life on
                  paneling.
                  >>
                  >> V/R
                  >>
                  Chris
                  >>
                  >>
                  >> On 11/14/2013 11:59 AM, Roger Padvorac
                  wrote:
                  >>> ?
                  >>>
                  >>> A critical issue is
                  checking if the wood plies are heartwood or
                  >>> sapwood. This could
                  vary from sheet to sheet, so people's experience
                  >>> with it could
                  vary.
                  >>> While the heartwood of the western red cedar is more
                  resistant to rot
                  >>> than the heartwood of Douglass fir, the sapwood
                  of western red cedar
                  >>> rots faster than the heartwood of Douglass
                  fir.
                  >>> Confusing this situation is that while the western red
                  cedar is in the
                  >>> cypress family, in the genus Thuja, and cedars
                  are in the pine family
                  >>> in the genus Cedrus.
                  >>> It
                  seems possible that the difference in rot resistance between
                  >>>
                  sapwood and heartwood is a common issue, and with the general lowering
                  >>> of standards, that there could be more sapwood in
                  plywood than there
                  >>> used to be. As a general rule of thumb, the
                  sapwood is lighter in
                  >>> color than the heartwood.
                  >>>
                  It seems likely the sapwood of western red cedar is so vulnerable to
                  >>> rot in part because it is so soft. While its hardwood of
                  western red
                  >>> cedar is also comparatively soft, it is also
                  saturated with very toxic
                  >>> chemicals (unlike the sapwood), and so
                  is very resistant to rot. These
                  >>> issues might affect other Thuja
                  and Cedrus species.
                  >>> May your day be filled with clarity, grace,
                  strength, insight,
                  >>> balance, cooperating, and warm
                  laughter,
                  >>>
                  Roger
                  >>>
                  >>>     ----- Original
                  Message -----
                  >>>     *From:*
                  href="mailto:chadnn@...">chadnn@... <mailto:chadnn@...>
                  >>>     *To:*
                  href="mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com">bolger@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com>
                  >>>     *Sent:* Thursday,
                  November 14, 2013 5:53 AM
                  >>>     *Subject:*
                  [bolger] cedar paneling
                  >>>
                  >>>    
                  Has anyone use 8mm x 48" x 96"  cedar paneling (see Home Depot) to
                  >>>     build a boat
                  ?
                  >>>
                  >>>    
                  Thanks
                  >>>
                  >>>    
                  _,_.___
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------
                  >
                  > Bolger
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                • harryjak
                  I am away from my books at home. In one of Bolger s books he mentions an Admiral who was either Venetian or Spanish who won an impressiveness number of
                  Message 8 of 12 , Nov 16, 2013
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                    I am away from my books at home. In one of Bolger's books he mentions an Admiral
                    who was either Venetian or Spanish who won an impressiveness number of engagements.
                    Can any body give me the name and era of this individual?

                    HJ
                  • phil.bolger
                    Roger de Lauria ? From: welshman@ptialaska.net Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2013 1:52 PM To: bolger@yahoogroups.com Subject: [bolger] Admiral name? I am away
                    Message 9 of 12 , Nov 16, 2013
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                      Roger de Lauria ?
                       
                      Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2013 1:52 PM
                      Subject: [bolger] Admiral name?
                       
                       

                      I am away from my books at home. In one of Bolger's books he mentions an Admiral
                      who was either Venetian or Spanish who won an impressiveness number of engagements.
                      Can any body give me the name and era of this individual?

                      HJ

                    • Liam Hegarty
                      Andrea Doria? ... -- William Hegarty Reference Librarian Larchmont Public Library 121 Larchmont Ave. Larchmont, NY 10538 (914) 834-2281
                      Message 10 of 12 , Nov 16, 2013
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                        Andrea Doria?


                        On Sat, Nov 16, 2013 at 4:39 PM, <philbolger@...> wrote:
                         

                        Roger de Lauria ?
                         
                        Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2013 1:52 PM
                        Subject: [bolger] Admiral name?
                         
                         

                        I am away from my books at home. In one of Bolger's books he mentions an Admiral
                        who was either Venetian or Spanish who won an impressiveness number of engagements.
                        Can any body give me the name and era of this individual?

                        HJ




                        --
                        William Hegarty
                        Reference Librarian
                        Larchmont Public Library
                        121 Larchmont Ave.
                        Larchmont, NY 10538
                        (914) 834-2281
                      • harryjak
                        That s the guy. Thanks HJ Roger de Lauria ?
                        Message 11 of 12 , Nov 17, 2013
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                          That's the guy.

                          Thanks

                          HJ

                          Roger de Lauria ?
                          >
                          > From: welshman@...
                          > Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2013 1:52 PM
                          > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                          > Subject: [bolger] Admiral name?
                          >
                          >
                          > I am away from my books at home. In one of Bolger's books he mentions an Admiral
                          > who was either Venetian or Spanish who won an impressiveness number of engagements.
                          > Can any body give me the name and era of this individual?
                          >
                          > HJ
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                        • Roger Padvorac
                          HJ, My curiosity was stirred up by this so I took a look at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_of_Lauria Part of his strategy was highly trained, lightweight,
                          Message 12 of 12 , Nov 17, 2013
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                            HJ,
                            My curiosity was stirred up by this so I took a look at:
                             
                            Part of his strategy was highly trained, lightweight, and nimble crews with simple weapons. So its easy to see why Bolger thought the success of this admiral was significant - skillful use of simplicity.
                             
                            Thanks for brining this up.
                             
                            May your day be filled with clarity, grace, strength, insight, balance, cooperation, and warm laughter,
                            Roger
                             
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: <welshman@...>
                            Sent: Sunday, November 17, 2013 11:31 AM
                            Subject: Re: [bolger] Admiral name?

                            > That's the guy.
                            >
                            > Thanks
                            >
                            >
                            HJ
                            >
                            > Roger de Lauria ?
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