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Whalewatcher plans

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  • m.jayjensen
    Thank you for this posting. It is very informative. M. Jay JENSEN ... For a time Bernie Wolfard sold Whalewatcher plans via his Common Sense Designs Bolger
    Message 1 of 14 , May 5, 2013
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      Thank you for this posting.
      It is very informative.
      M. Jay JENSEN


      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, mjpjensen@... wrote:
      > Everything seems to point to the fact that CSB is selling stolen
      > property.
      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, <philbolger@...> wrote:
      > - It is not clear to PB&F how CSB acquired copies of copies upon
      > which their ‘offerings’ are based.


      For a time Bernie Wolfard sold Whalewatcher plans via his Common Sense
      Designs Bolger plans marketing business.

      Late in his time with that business he also offered a range of 23 large
      and small "complex" Bolger designs, Barn Owl, Bright Thread, Kotick,
      Crystal, Harbinger, Victoria, Wisp, Moccasin, Sybil's Yawl, Shivaree,
      etc, etc, and various PCB and other article reprints.

      The criteria for selection to the Common Sense Complex Boats range was
      arrived at... "When I told Bolger of my plans to add a complex boats
      section to the Common Sense catalog he asked if I had anything like the
      Common Sense criteria to guide the selection as he has almost 600 designs
      from which to choose. I wrote him that I hadn't come up with any. Bolger
      suggested that we choose boats that he still liked after they were built
      and the owners were still friends with him. Sounded like a Common Sense
      criteria to me, so that is what we used to select the boats presented
      here. It goes without saying that each of these boats are worthy of study
      and contemplation as exemplary examples of the designers art. I hope you
      enjoy them as much as do (sic)" - Bernie Wolfard, Common Sense Design
      Book

      ____________________________________________________________
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    • daschultz8275@sbcglobal.net
      So according to PB&F, the mylars (high quality originals) were returned after BF passed. So it would seem the Canadian had paper dwgs scanned on a large
      Message 2 of 14 , May 8, 2013
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        So according to PB&F, the 'mylars' (high quality originals) were returned after BF passed.

        So it would seem the Canadian had paper dwgs scanned on a large format scanner. The files are used to generate pdfs that he sells. My guess is if somebody pays him for a paper version, he runs down to a local printer, and gets a copy made, though he may have his own printer. I am assuming the paper versions come in a large format, IE sizd D drawings.

        I don't know any history of how the current "Common Sense..." got started. Did the owner buy CSD from the Wolfard estate? He is now designing his own stuff. Some seem Bolger like in style.

        I suppose many could study Bolger's work and then sketch variations that look OK. But would they be structurally sound, and seaworthy?

        I agree that PB&F will continue to have a tough time stopping this abuse of their intellectual property.

        Several years ago I bought via the web what were called unused Bolger plans for Martha Jane, and Idaho. When they arrived, they were the CSD versions. Oh, and no key.

        I also bought Hawkeye plans from PB&F. With a key.
      • Dave Gentry
        ... Years ago, before I knew any better - and before I realized that the business no longer involved Bernie Wolfard - I bought plans for a sea kayak designed
        Message 3 of 14 , May 9, 2013
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          --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "daschultz8275@..." <daschultz8275@...> wrote:
          >
          > I don't know any history of how the current "Common Sense..." got >started. Did the owner buy CSD from the Wolfard estate? He is now >designing his own stuff.

          Years ago, before I knew any better - and before I realized that the business no longer involved Bernie Wolfard - I bought plans for a sea kayak "designed" by this guy.
          I did build it(although even back then I was looking askance at the plans), and it was, without a doubt,the worst kayak that I have ever had the displeasure to paddle. I ended up giving it away a month later, and would have been just as happy to burn it, despite having invested a lot of money and time in building it.

          Caveat emptor, indeed.
        • apraphett777
          the excellent keys that Phil put in his books has been why I have been able to build so many with just the books I am a builder of smallish skiffs if I were
          Message 4 of 14 , May 27, 2013
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            the excellent keys that Phil put in his books has been why I have been able to build so many with just the books I am a builder of smallish skiffs if I were attempt to build a larger boat I would order plans. At some point I am hoping to build Queen Mab :)

            --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "daschultz8275@..." <daschultz8275@...> wrote:
            >
            > So according to PB&F, the 'mylars' (high quality originals) were returned after BF passed.
            >
            > So it would seem the Canadian had paper dwgs scanned on a large format scanner. The files are used to generate pdfs that he sells. My guess is if somebody pays him for a paper version, he runs down to a local printer, and gets a copy made, though he may have his own printer. I am assuming the paper versions come in a large format, IE sizd D drawings.
            >
            > I don't know any history of how the current "Common Sense..." got started. Did the owner buy CSD from the Wolfard estate? He is now designing his own stuff. Some seem Bolger like in style.
            >
            > I suppose many could study Bolger's work and then sketch variations that look OK. But would they be structurally sound, and seaworthy?
            >
            > I agree that PB&F will continue to have a tough time stopping this abuse of their intellectual property.
            >
            > Several years ago I bought via the web what were called unused Bolger plans for Martha Jane, and Idaho. When they arrived, they were the CSD versions. Oh, and no key.
            >
            > I also bought Hawkeye plans from PB&F. With a key.
            >
          • mason smith
            What Phil and Susanne call keys are not in the books, to my knowledge. You have to get the plans to get the keys, which are instructions and measurements for
            Message 5 of 14 , May 27, 2013
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              What Phil and Susanne call keys are not in the books, to my knowledge. You have to get the plans to get the keys, which are instructions and measurements for every numbered part in the plans, plus some more general instructions.

               

              From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of apraphett777
              Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 11:52 AM
              To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [bolger] Re: Whalewatcher plans

               

               

              the excellent keys that Phil put in his books has been why I have been able to build so many with just the books I am a builder of smallish skiffs if I were attempt to build a larger boat I would order plans. At some point I am hoping to build Queen Mab :)

              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "daschultz8275@..." <daschultz8275@...> wrote:
              >
              > So according to PB&F, the 'mylars' (high quality originals) were returned after BF passed.
              >
              > So it would seem the Canadian had paper dwgs scanned on a large format scanner. The files are used to generate pdfs that he sells. My guess is if somebody pays him for a paper version, he runs down to a local printer, and gets a copy made, though he may have his own printer. I am assuming the paper versions come in a large format, IE sizd D drawings.
              >
              > I don't know any history of how the current "Common Sense..." got started. Did the owner buy CSD from the Wolfard estate? He is now designing his own stuff. Some seem Bolger like in style.
              >
              > I suppose many could study Bolger's work and then sketch variations that look OK. But would they be structurally sound, and seaworthy?
              >
              > I agree that PB&F will continue to have a tough time stopping this abuse of their intellectual property.
              >
              > Several years ago I bought via the web what were called unused Bolger plans for Martha Jane, and Idaho. When they arrived, they were the CSD versions. Oh, and no key.
              >
              > I also bought Hawkeye plans from PB&F. With a key.
              >

            • daschultz8275@sbcglobal.net
              Well, as it turns out some of the books have the key with some of the designs, but the majority certainly do not. Most of the designs with everything you need
              Message 6 of 14 , May 28, 2013
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                Well, as it turns out some of the books have the key with some of the designs, but the majority certainly do not.

                Most of the designs with everything you need are very simple, smaller boats. One of the larger more complex designs with a key is in "The Folding Schooner", a boat named "Utility for Homebuilders". I think everything is there for that design.

                Others include details in the chapter or MAIB article, like offset tables but are missing a key, and, I believe, entire sheets of the blueprints. I s'pose one could build from the tables and other partial info, but for the few $$ on a nearly 10k$ project, why take more risks?

                BTW stating not all the blueprints are recreated in the books is NOT a complaint. The Bolger books I have are groups of study plans with PBF's wonderful essays regarding each design. That's what I expected and received when buying the books.

                I think PB&F makes the most important point that the plans cost is a very small part of most any project. I also agree the upgrades and corrections are very very important. Martha Jane is a very good example. The upgraded boat with a Navigator cabin and those ugly sponsons is not just roomier, it is a much safer boat.

                Don Schultz


                --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "mason smith" <masonsmith@...> wrote:
                >
                > What Phil and Susanne call keys are not in the books, to my knowledge. You
                > have to get the plans to get the keys, which are instructions and
                > measurements for every numbered part in the plans, plus some more general instructions...
                >
              • apraphett777
                the same type of key that was in the Queen Mab plans, are in all the books I have by PhilI have all but the Novel a step by step numbering of the parts etc I
                Message 7 of 14 , May 28, 2013
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                  the same type of key that was in the Queen Mab plans, are in all the books I have by PhilI have all but the Novel a step by step numbering of the parts etc I also have the Payson books as well all a very good education in boat building Cheers Pal

                  --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "mason smith" <masonsmith@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > What Phil and Susanne call keys are not in the books, to my knowledge. You
                  > have to get the plans to get the keys, which are instructions and
                  > measurements for every numbered part in the plans, plus some more general
                  > instructions.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                  > apraphett777
                  > Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 11:52 AM
                  > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: [bolger] Re: Whalewatcher plans
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > the excellent keys that Phil put in his books has been why I have been able
                  > to build so many with just the books I am a builder of smallish skiffs if I
                  > were attempt to build a larger boat I would order plans. At some point I am
                  > hoping to build Queen Mab :)
                  >
                  > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bolger%40yahoogroups.com> ,
                  > "daschultz8275@" <daschultz8275@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > So according to PB&F, the 'mylars' (high quality originals) were returned
                  > after BF passed.
                  > >
                  > > So it would seem the Canadian had paper dwgs scanned on a large format
                  > scanner. The files are used to generate pdfs that he sells. My guess is if
                  > somebody pays him for a paper version, he runs down to a local printer, and
                  > gets a copy made, though he may have his own printer. I am assuming the
                  > paper versions come in a large format, IE sizd D drawings.
                  > >
                  > > I don't know any history of how the current "Common Sense..." got started.
                  > Did the owner buy CSD from the Wolfard estate? He is now designing his own
                  > stuff. Some seem Bolger like in style.
                  > >
                  > > I suppose many could study Bolger's work and then sketch variations that
                  > look OK. But would they be structurally sound, and seaworthy?
                  > >
                  > > I agree that PB&F will continue to have a tough time stopping this abuse
                  > of their intellectual property.
                  > >
                  > > Several years ago I bought via the web what were called unused Bolger
                  > plans for Martha Jane, and Idaho. When they arrived, they were the CSD
                  > versions. Oh, and no key.
                  > >
                  > > I also bought Hawkeye plans from PB&F. With a key.
                  > >
                  >
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