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Re: Plywood question

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  • apraphett777
    not trying to hurt anyone s feeling but here in the SE part of the country the BC southern pine the big boxes are selling is pure crap most boats I have built
    Message 1 of 7 , Jan 10, 2013
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      not trying to hurt anyone's feeling but here in the SE part of the country the BC southern pine the big boxes are selling is pure crap most boats I have built have been small skiffs that lasted me 3-5 years the last pointy skiff I built the wood is rotting after a year and a little bit 2-4 months all were painted outside with oil based paint and painted inside with Latex even if I were building the smallest of skiffs I would pop for dougy fir marine and the luan here is even worse then the BC left it out in the weather and in 2 months it delaminated be careful guys :(

      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "John Trussell" wrote:
      >
      > There is a school of thought that suggests that 'common materials' are not
      > nearly as good as they used to be. While I'm not the man I used to be (and
      > probably never was), I think the quality of common plywood has deteriorated
      > over the past ten or 20 years. A long time ago, I built boats from AC fir
      > plywood. It was not Ideal in that it checked, had occasional voids, and the
      > 'footballs' would print through any finish including fiber glass set in
      > polyester resin (epoxy was unknown back then). But AC fir was made using 3
      > equal sized plies, was waterproof, fairly light, and the sheets were square.
      >
      >
      >
      > Around here, common fir plywood has been replaced with pine plywood. This
      > plywood is quite heavy and checks worse than fir. Some big box stores offer
      > a proprietary brand. In general, these have very thin exterior plies and
      > need to be tested to see if they will delaminate when exposed to water. I
      > have also found that a significant number of plywood sheets are no longer
      > square, and I now check each sheet.
      >
      >
      >
      > It is certainly possible to build a boat using 'common materials', including
      > big box materials, glues other than epoxy, polyester resin over fiber glass,
      > and latex house paint. The boat will float and give its users some pleasure,
      > but will not look good or last long. Given the fact that time spent building
      > a boat has value and that the value of the time probably exceeds the value
      > of the material, it doesn't make much sense to skimp on materials. To quote
      > Pete Culler, good things are expensive and a lot of us think boats are very
      > good things.
      >
      >
      >
      > JohnT
      >
      >
      >
      > _____
      >
      > From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
      > james fry
      > Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 11:58 PM
      > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Plywood question
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > I've built just three boats in my life; the first was a canvas covered canoe
      > I built with my Pop-pop when I was 14. While reskinning for the third time,
      > I gave it several coatings of W.E.S.T.
      >
      > The second was a Popular Mechanics plan called Maximus that I built when I
      > was 27. I used W.E.S.T. again and laid glass strips on the joints and along
      > the keel. Plywood used was 3/8 A/C fir EXT.
      >
      > The third was Mr. Redmond's WHISP. I was 29. Again I used W.E.S.T. and glass
      > strips on the joints. The plywood used was 1/4 A/C fir EXT.
      >
      > The canoe is still used at family reunions back in PA and the runabout and
      > Whisp I brought with me to S.W. Fla. They are also still being used. Oh, do
      > the math. I'm 61 years old. There's no reason to get plywood made of magical
      > trees that have been licked by a Wallaby or have the sweat off of a camel's
      > tail in its' grain. Common woods, used and prepared properly will last a
      > nice, long time.
      >
      > Jim
      >
      >
      >
      > From: Mason Smith
      > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
      > Sent: Wednesday, January 9, 2013 9:21 PM
      > Subject: RE: [bolger] Re: Plywood question
      >
      >
      >
      > My two cents on this plywood business is that I like to use oukoume (I don't
      > have experience with meranti but think it would be better than oukoume)
      > rather than fir for a couple of reasons. More laminations for a given
      > thickness, for one. But the main one is that I don't like to glass above the
      > waterline if I don't have to, and certainly not inside, and fir will check,
      > for sure, if you don't glass it. That operation throws out any saving in
      > buying fir. Buy oukoume or meranti and don't glass unless you must for
      > abrasion resistance on the bottom. Put some trust in a coat or two of epoxy
      > and two or three of good paint.
      >
      > Mason Smith
      >
      > Adirondack Goodboat
      >
      > 68 North Point Road
      >
      > Long Lake, NY 12847
      >
      > 518 624 6398
      >
      > www.adirondackgoodboat.com
      >
      > goodboat@...
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
      > dnjost
      > Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2013 4:39 PM
      > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: [bolger] Re: Plywood question
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > I haven't posted here for a while, but would add that my Workskiff 18 is
      > built out of a marine grade fir, but encapsulated inside and out with epoxy
      > set in glass. (I will also admit to treating it with antifreeze prior to
      > glassing). so far, 5 years later it is still in like new condition. I would
      > not want to put my blood and sweat into a project and then have it
      > delaminate. You could purchase a chunk and put it through the boil/dry cycle
      > a few times. That saved me a bundle over the years when dealing with various
      > grades of exterior plywood.
      >
      > Having said that, in these smaller boats I think it is worth the leap to
      > Joubert Merenti, or an okoume ply. The Merenti is seems worth the piece of
      > mind to know that your boat won't delaminate in the middle of a pond on a
      > cold winter's day, and that in itself seems worth the extra $80 bucks.
      >
      > My last build was not a Bolger boat, but I did use BS1088 Okoume for the
      > Michalak Vireo. It was beautiful, and came in very light at 56 pounds with
      > only the bottom glassed. It is subject to denting, but handles well. the
      > merenti splinters more when cutting but provides a harder surface. Better
      > for where glass won't be used.
      >
      > Ok group. FIRE AT IT!
      >
      > Happy building,
      > David Jost, Boston, MA
      >
      > --- In mailto:bolger%40yahoogroups.com, "steven_dantonio" wrote:
      > >
      > > Hello,
      > >
      > > I'm just about ready to start on a Mayfly 14 and was shopping around for
      > plywood. Has anyone used Georgia-Pacific's "Dry-Ply plywood". It looks like
      > it's treated so I'm a bit hesitant unless I can find out some good
      > information regarding it's gluing properties.
      > >
      > > Thanks,
      > > Steven
      > >
      >
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