Re: [bolger] Re: MICRO TRAWLER
- Yes in general modern one cylinder engines are noisy. My old 2cylinder Volvo though heavy which is a drawback is not noisy. The reason is the flywheel weighs about 200 lbs and when it is in motion it carries over the top dead center point where the firing takes place. When running at 1600 or 1800 rpm the engine runs very smooth and quiet and in fact sounds much like a steam engine. There is little vibration and very quiet at cruising speed. They are far better engines than the newer Kabota, Bata, Yanmar and other light weight engines that have very light flywheels so they don't smooth out the engine strokes.
Single cylinder gasoline engines are quiet as there is little detonation noise and the low compression makes them smooth. A small low compression single cylinder engine burns little fuel but there aren't any new ones.
As far as outboard engines are concerned there is hardly any motors that are smoother. The EPA did not like two cycle engines because of oil mixing. The truth is they could have for little money been made as fuel efficient as 4 stroke engines running at slower rpms and they can be build so there is no need to have oil in the gas. Two stroke engines only become inefficient at high rpms when they don't scavenge out exhaust gases as well as two stroke ones. They can be made to scavenge much better. A small turbo charger built right into the block is a very cheap solution to that problem.
Now all we need to do is convince someone to build them and then convince the Government that they are clean.
A good friend of mine put a 16 horse outboard on his sailboat. He put a high efficiency prop on the engine and never runs the motor above 2000 rpms. which I guess is about half throttle. He is likely only making about 8 or 9 horsepower or less He expects the motor to run 5000 hrs before rebuilding. It will be interesting to see how that works out? Doug
On 11/13/2012 04:33 AM, nezih wrote:
Sir,I respect your choice.But one cylinder engine is a little bit noisy,I think.----- Original Message -----From: Douglas PollardSent: Monday, November 12, 2012 10:10 PMSubject: Re: [bolger] Re: MICRO TRAWLERI guess some of where I am coming from is that I like old engines. I like the thump, thump. of a slow turning single cylinder engine. I grew up with one lung gasoline engines and some kerosene engines. My boat engine has a top speed of 2000 rpms and I never run it over 1800 for me that falls right in place with using sail. There was an old fireboat in the Bahamas about 20 years ago named O-ble -O
and that was the sound the old engine made. O-ble-O O-bLe- O- Oble-O. She was an old New York Fire boat about 70ft long and the single cylinder engine likely turned over about 150 rpms when cruising. I used to have a video sound but moisture and time go to it. Forever lost. Doug
On 11/12/2012 01:36 PM, JOHN WALLIS wrote:Hard to beat modern 4 stroke outboards (Honda, Tohatsu, etc.) for fuel economy, serviceability, power to weight ratio and reliability. Also no worries with bilge venting, through hulls and fuel tank placement. Another plus is portability to a different vessel in the future. I run a Tohatsu MFS 20 HP on a 15' Diablo and am quite happy with the quiet, reliable, powerful and efficient performance.
From: "philbolger@..." <philbolger@...>
Sent: Mon, November 12, 2012 10:10:42 AM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: MICRO TRAWLER
For what a Diesel inboard/outboard drive alone costs, the tax-man could be 'greased' for likely a decade or two...
Susanne Altenburger, PB&F
----- Original Message -----From: Douglas PollardSent: Monday, November 12, 2012 12:21 PMSubject: Re: [bolger] Re: MICRO TRAWLERWell I don't agree in principal. The present day inboard outboards may have problems but there is absolutely no reason why they should be less long lived than an outboard. The leg and shafting and gears as well as bearings and seals are about the same. The engine being inboard is well protected from the weather and should last longer than one out in the salt spray and rain. If they are less dependable it is because they are flawed not due to any advantage of outboard motors over inboards. I think inboards are the reliable, the easiest to work on big alternators are easily fitted. A good diesel is infinantly rebuildable. The small volvo in my boat is almost 40 years old. It is saltwater cooled and is still running and dependable. I would say the difference could be that people don't pull the inboard outboars off and have the underwater seals replaced . With the outboard that is easily done, so to me that means poor maintenance rather than more trouble prone? Doug
On 11/12/2012 11:51 AM, philbolger@... wrote:
Way too heavy anyway...
Susanne Altenburger, Phil Bolger & Friends----- Original Message -----From: captainrocky@...Sent: Monday, November 12, 2012 11:22 AMSubject: Re: [bolger] Re: MICRO TRAWLER
What ever you decide DO NOT USE A STERNDRIVE INBOARD !!!! I/O as they are known in the
USA are the worst choice for saltwater. I made a poem about them :
I O, IO,-- it will never work you know
It will,you think
and then it sinks
Too much to go wrong. Seals ,hydraulics,electrical,linkage,gages and saltwater corrosion and electrolysis. Save your money. In my opinion ,you can't beat a 4 stroke outboard . The smallest that will give you the performance you desire. Keep it as simple as possible. The main advantage of and outboard is there in no thru - hull fittings to worry about . Most boats sink at their docks with leaking thru - hull fittings. Capt. Rocky
From: "nezih" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2012 11:03:49 AM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: MICRO TRAWLER
Sir,Agree with you and I will calculate the weight of Dieel Engine and also shaft angle.Maybe stern drive inboard is OK.ThanksNezih----- Original Message -----From: Mark AlbaneseSent: Sunday, November 11, 2012 9:43 PMSubject: [bolger] Re: MICRO TRAWLER
Well, sir, okay. So Hawkeye seems one half meter too long. And the photo of Katie Z is irresistible!Further, I only suggest you watch the diesel's weight and shaft angle carefully.Best o' luck.MarkOn Nov 11, 2012, at 4:24 AM, nezih wrote:Dear Mr.Mark,Thanks for your below comments.You know why I want to build MT?Bcs it lenght is less than five metric meters.In my country,boat owners,more than five meters,paying taxes.MT is capable for trailer transportation easily andit is enough for me at he moment(for 62 years old man).It is also easy to maintain it.I mean,expectations after sixty is not so high!!!Thanks againNezihNezih<1.jpg>
- True Doug, Ford FE gas truck engines had larger diameter crankshafts and cam profiles designed more for low RPM torque, compared to the equivalent car engines. Some GMC truck gassers even had exhaust valve rotators and stellite valve seats, anticipating heavier engine load demands.Your Isuzu may have had oil starvation issues if the oilpan capacity was not increased and the pickup lowered. I have a marinized 1956 Packard V8 with the oilpan capacity increased from 5 quarts to 4 gallons and an integral oil cooler built in. Most working boats of 25-30 feet and up have gone diesel but that may not be a practical option for the MT being discussed. 4 cycle outboards have been around for several years now and have a good track record even in small commercial fishboats that get hard use.