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Re: Clear Coating alternatives

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  • Eric
    How do you apply and maintain Deks Olie? I have clear toe rails on risers that can also be used to tie off to, plus they get foot wear when people use them
    Message 1 of 29 , Mar 2, 2012
      How do you apply and maintain Deks Olie? I have clear toe rails on risers that can also be used to tie off to, plus they get foot wear when people use them for their intended purpose. I've also tried Cetol and not been satisfied with it. Penetrol may be the answer as some have suggested. I hadn't thought of using Tongue Oil because I didn't think it withstood wet. Anyway, I'm interested in ideas about what to use where there is wear and tear. Epoxi and hard varnish are not a good idea, though a willingness to carry and apply varnish immediately to damaged areas will get you past the problem. I'm just not that conscientious.

      As for epoxi under varnish, It works very well when maintained. ROGUE's transom is cherry finished bright with one or two ounce fiberglass laid in epoxy of I forget how many layers. At least five layers of captains varnish over that, sanded lightly and recoated each year. Damage is attended to immediately. I am willing to do this amount of maintenance (minimal).

      I concur that unless epoxy under varnish is well maintained it is a disaster. That is why I did not finish rub rails, spars, or toe rails with epoxy under varnish.

      Eric



      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Mason Smith" <masonsmith@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      >
      > I would vote against epoxy. Whatever you
      > do, let moisture come and go with
      > ambient conditions. Varnish will allow
      > this. But if you want less maintenance,
      > oil might be better. I don't know
      > spotted gum and will not pretend to say
      > what oil. I have been using tung oil of
      > late, both pure and thinned. I have long
      > used and liked Deks Olje. Have not used,
      > and don't really like (what I've seen of
      > it, on Drascombes) Cetol. ---Mason
      >
    • John and Kathy Trussell
      I used Deks Olje with great success about 20 years ago, but I can t seem to find it now. Anyone know a source? JohnT _____ From: bolger@yahoogroups.com
      Message 2 of 29 , Mar 2, 2012

        I used Deks Olje with great success about 20 years ago, but I can’t seem to find it now. Anyone know a source?

         

        JohnT

         


        From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto: bolger@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Eric
        Sent: Friday, March 02, 2012 6:58 PM
        To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [bolger] Re: Clear Coating alternatives

         

         

        How do you apply and maintain Deks Olie? I have clear toe rails on risers that can also be used to tie off to, plus they get foot wear when people use them for their intended purpose. I've also tried Cetol and not been satisfied with it. Penetrol may be the answer as some have suggested. I hadn't thought of using Tongue Oil because I didn't think it withstood wet. Anyway, I'm interested in ideas about what to use where there is wear and tear. Epoxi and hard varnish are not a good idea, though a willingness to carry and apply varnish immediately to damaged areas will get you past the problem. I'm just not that conscientious.

        As for epoxi under varnish, It works very well when maintained. ROGUE's transom is cherry finished bright with one or two ounce fiberglass laid in epoxy of I forget how many layers. At least five layers of captains varnish over that, sanded lightly and recoated each year. Damage is attended to immediately. I am willing to do this amount of maintenance (minimal).

        I concur that unless epoxy under varnish is well maintained it is a disaster. That is why I did not finish rub rails, spars, or toe rails with epoxy under varnish.

        Eric

        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Mason Smith" <masonsmith@...> wrote:

        >
        >
        >
        > I would vote against epoxy. Whatever you
        > do, let moisture come and go with
        > ambient conditions. Varnish will allow
        > this. But if you want less maintenance,
        > oil might be better. I don't know
        > spotted gum and will not pretend to say
        > what oil. I have been using tung oil of
        > late, both pure and thinned. I have long
        > used and liked Deks Olje. Have not used,
        > and don't really like (what I've seen of
        > it, on Drascombes) Cetol. ---Mason
        >

      • RSS
        That was my experience too; and a lot of work to get the peeling epoxy off. Then it was varnish, but that had to be done every year in northern latitudes.
        Message 3 of 29 , Mar 3, 2012
          That was my experience too; and a lot of work to get the peeling epoxy off. Then it was varnish, but that had to be done every year in northern latitudes. When getting ready to head to south I kept reading how in the tropics you could find yourself varnishing every three to four months. I had thought of trying some of those new (then) expensive varnishes with UV protectors in them, but by then I was getting to be a practical sailor so painted all wood surfaces, including the mast. I really hated varnishing that while hanging in a bosens chair! I followed the advice of "Do you want to be at anchor varnishing, or having fun?" I chose fun :) While I enjoy building, I have never enjoyed sanding, varnishing or painting and want to do as little of that as possible.
          Will always take function over useless beauty when it means work for me. Also, remember that "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder"; whether it be boats or women or art we all don't have to think alike LOL!
          Bob


          --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Eric" <eric14850@...> wrote:
          >
          > How do you apply and maintain Deks Olie? I have clear toe rails on risers that can also be used to tie off to, plus they get foot wear when people use them for their intended purpose. I've also tried Cetol and not been satisfied with it. Penetrol may be the answer as some have suggested. I hadn't thought of using Tongue Oil because I didn't think it withstood wet. Anyway, I'm interested in ideas about what to use where there is wear and tear. Epoxi and hard varnish are not a good idea, though a willingness to carry and apply varnish immediately to damaged areas will get you past the problem. I'm just not that conscientious.
          >
          > As for epoxi under varnish, It works very well when maintained. ROGUE's transom is cherry finished bright with one or two ounce fiberglass laid in epoxy of I forget how many layers. At least five layers of captains varnish over that, sanded lightly and recoated each year. Damage is attended to immediately. I am willing to do this amount of maintenance (minimal).
          >
          > I concur that unless epoxy under varnish is well maintained it is a disaster. That is why I did not finish rub rails, spars, or toe rails with epoxy under varnish.
          >
          > Eric
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Mason Smith" <masonsmith@> wrote:
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > I would vote against epoxy. Whatever you
          > > do, let moisture come and go with
          > > ambient conditions. Varnish will allow
          > > this. But if you want less maintenance,
          > > oil might be better. I don't know
          > > spotted gum and will not pretend to say
          > > what oil. I have been using tung oil of
          > > late, both pure and thinned. I have long
          > > used and liked Deks Olje. Have not used,
          > > and don't really like (what I've seen of
          > > it, on Drascombes) Cetol. ---Mason
          > >
          >
        • Mason Smith
          More on clear coatings, since Penetrol s been mentioned. I have heard that it is one of the ingredients of Deks Olje - for what that s worth, not much. I have
          Message 4 of 29 , Mar 3, 2012

            More on clear coatings, since Penetrol’s been mentioned. I have heard that it is one of the ingredients of Deks Olje – for what that’s worth, not much. I have friends who never liked Deks Olje (and I never liked that you could not find out what was in it) and preferred other marine penetrating finishes, which indeed seem to work fine, too. I have use the one-two punch of Deks I and II. It’s been especially good on a very old and still very hard-used Rushton Florida model Pleasure Rowboat. Minimum maintenance and easy maintenance, and awfully good for the wood.

            If anybody still wants a recommendation on clear coating with epoxy, I am sure there are other great products but I did, while I used it, admire System Three’s Clear Coat, all solids but penetrating and as brushable as varnish. And I’ll second the recommendation of Captain’s Varnish for general use. Epifanes on great antique boats and showboats. Also Interlux Schooner and its variants, which we’ve been using on the brightwork of the Sound Inter Club restorations (watch for the WB article). Over epoxy, if you must, use the best filter package you can get, i.e. Flagship over Captain’s. and still, revarnish early and often or rue the day.

          • Douglas Pollard
            ... I have used shellac instead of epoxy for clear coating. Shellac is less porous than epoxy. A couple of coats seals the wood well. Then a few coats of
            Message 5 of 29 , Mar 3, 2012
              On 03/03/2012 11:37 AM, Mason Smith wrote:  

              More on clear coatings, since Penetrol’s been mentioned. I have heard that it is one of the ingredients of Deks Olje – for what that’s worth, not much. I have friends who never liked Deks Olje (and I never liked that you could not find out what was in it) and preferred other marine penetrating finishes, which indeed seem to work fine, too. I have use the one-two punch of Deks I and II. It’s been especially good on a very old and still very hard-used Rushton Florida model Pleasure Rowboat. Minimum maintenance and easy maintenance, and awfully good for the wood.

              If anybody still wants a recommendation on clear coating with epoxy, I am sure there are other great products but I did, while I used it, admire System Three’s Clear Coat, all solids but penetrating and as brushable as varnish. And I’ll second the recommendation of Captain’s Varnish for general use. Epifanes on great antique boats and showboats. Also Interlux Schooner and its variants, which we’ve been using on the brightwork of the Sound Inter Club restorations (watch for the WB article). Over epoxy, if you must, use the best filter package you can get, i.e. Flagship over Captain’s. and still, revarnish early and often or rue the day.

              I have used shellac instead of epoxy for clear coating. Shellac is less porous than epoxy.  A couple of coats seals the wood well. Then a few coats of varnish over top gives it the UV protection it and epoxy require. So the wood is well protected and the Shellac is easy to remove when the time comes.  I have all the yellow pine bright work on my Elver canoe yawl fished with this process and though yellow pine is hard to keep varnish on this combination holds up well and is easy to redo.  On this pine I use orange shellac and it really brings out the beauty of the pine.  Clear is best for teak and Mahogany.        Doug
            • Andrew
              I have a can of Penetrol (made by Flood) but it doesn t mention anything about it being a treatment in it s own right. The can talks about mixing it with oil
              Message 6 of 29 , Mar 5, 2012
                I have a can of Penetrol (made by Flood) but it doesn't mention anything about it being a treatment in it's own right. The can talks about mixing it with oil based paint to make it stick to anything, or about painting it on rusty steel to make paint stick. Is this the same stuff?

                Andrew

                --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@...> wrote:
                >
                > Penitrol is good stuff. <snip>
              • mkriley48
                yes
                Message 7 of 29 , Mar 5, 2012
                  yes

                  --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Andrew" <a.c.l.yen@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > I have a can of Penetrol (made by Flood) but it doesn't mention anything about it being a treatment in it's own right. The can talks about mixing it with oil based paint to make it stick to anything, or about painting it on rusty steel to make paint stick. Is this the same stuff?
                  >
                  > Andrew
                  >
                  > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Penitrol is good stuff. <snip>
                  >
                • Douglas Pollard
                  I have part of a five gallon can of it that I bought years ago. I don t think I have ever read the label. All I know is most of us with old wooden boats have
                  Message 8 of 29 , Mar 5, 2012
                    I have part of a five gallon can of it that I bought years ago.  I don't think I have ever read the label. All I know is most of us with old wooden boats have been using it as far back as I can remember. My father used it.  It's been used as a finish with sometimes varnish added ,tung oil ,linseed oil. We used to mix pine tar with it to preseve wood.  Many Work boats had their spars finished with pine tar and linseed oil mixed and others used Penetrol. I have always used it in paint. WE used to buy cheap oilbased house paint and mix Penatrol with it and it worked and held up as good as the best marine finished for little money.  I guess I use it out of habbit now.
                        I likely have enough left to last my lifetime so I guess I will continue to use it. With the hazmat laws being what they are, it may be too expensive now days?                       Doug

                    On 03/05/2012 09:27 AM, mkriley48 wrote:
                     

                    yes

                    --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Andrew" <a.c.l.yen@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > I have a can of Penetrol (made by Flood) but it doesn't mention anything about it being a treatment in it's own right. The can talks about mixing it with oil based paint to make it stick to anything, or about painting it on rusty steel to make paint stick. Is this the same stuff?
                    >
                    > Andrew
                    >
                    > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > Penitrol is good stuff. <snip>
                    >


                  • Douglas Pollard
                    They may no longer promote it for the same reasons they don t promote lead paint on houses. I think it is hazardous and of course that,s the reason it prevents
                    Message 9 of 29 , Mar 5, 2012
                      They may no longer promote it for the same reasons they don't promote lead paint on houses. I think it is hazardous and of course that,s the reason it prevents rot.            Doug


                      On 03/05/2012 09:27 AM, mkriley48 wrote:
                       

                      yes

                      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Andrew" <a.c.l.yen@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I have a can of Penetrol (made by Flood) but it doesn't mention anything about it being a treatment in it's own right. The can talks about mixing it with oil based paint to make it stick to anything, or about painting it on rusty steel to make paint stick. Is this the same stuff?
                      >
                      > Andrew
                      >
                      > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Penitrol is good stuff. <snip>
                      >


                    • Tom Sorensen
                      The last time I bought Penetrol, I cant remember what the price was, but it didnt freak me out.  I use it with Miller marine spar enamel at @ 40% of the cost
                      Message 10 of 29 , Mar 5, 2012
                        The last time I bought Penetrol, I cant remember what the price was, but it didnt freak me out.  I use it with Miller marine spar enamel at @ 40% of the cost of interlux, and as far as i can tell Im giving up nothing in terms of finish or durability.  Buddy of mine is a professional paint contractor,, says he'd never pay the premium for "marine" paint.


                        From: Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@...>
                        To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Monday, March 5, 2012 6:47 AM
                        Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Clear Coating alternatives

                         
                        I have part of a five gallon can of it that I bought years ago.  I don't think I have ever read the label. All I know is most of us with old wooden boats have been using it as far back as I can remember. My father used it.  It's been used as a finish with sometimes varnish added ,tung oil ,linseed oil. We used to mix pine tar with it to preseve wood.  Many Work boats had their spars finished with pine tar and linseed oil mixed and others used Penetrol. I have always used it in paint. WE used to buy cheap oilbased house paint and mix Penatrol with it and it worked and held up as good as the best marine finished for little money.  I guess I use it out of habbit now.
                            I likely have enough left to last my lifetime so I guess I will continue to use it. With the hazmat laws being what they are, it may be too expensive now days?                       Doug

                        On 03/05/2012 09:27 AM, mkriley48 wrote:
                         
                        yes

                        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Andrew" <a.c.l.yen@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > I have a can of Penetrol (made by Flood) but it doesn't mention anything about it being a treatment in it's own right. The can talks about mixing it with oil based paint to make it stick to anything, or about painting it on rusty steel to make paint stick. Is this the same stuff?
                        >
                        > Andrew
                        >
                        > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Penitrol is good stuff. <snip>
                        >




                      • John Kohnen
                        Deks Olje disappeared for a while when the parent company got bought up by someone not interested in making it. But an outfit in Florida got ahold of
                        Message 11 of 29 , Mar 5, 2012
                          Deks Olje disappeared for a while when the parent company got bought up by
                          someone not interested in making it. <shrug> But an outfit in Florida got
                          ahold of the rights to it, and Deks Olje is again being made:

                          http://www.deksolje.com/

                          On Fri, 02 Mar 2012 16:09:53 -0800, John T wrote:

                          > I used Deks Olje with great success about 20 years ago, but I can't seem
                          > to
                          > find it now. Anyone know a source?

                          --
                          John (jkohnen@...)
                          A paranoid is a man who knows a little of what's going on.
                          (William Burroughs)
                        • John and Kathy Trussell
                          Thanks so much. Ain t the internet wonderful! John ... From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Kohnen Sent: Monday,
                          Message 12 of 29 , Mar 5, 2012
                            Thanks so much. Ain't the internet wonderful!

                            John

                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                            John Kohnen
                            Sent: Monday, March 05, 2012 5:54 PM
                            To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Clear Coating alternatives

                            Deks Olje disappeared for a while when the parent company got bought up by
                            someone not interested in making it. <shrug> But an outfit in Florida got
                            ahold of the rights to it, and Deks Olje is again being made:

                            http://www.deksolje.com/

                            On Fri, 02 Mar 2012 16:09:53 -0800, John T wrote:

                            > I used Deks Olje with great success about 20 years ago, but I can't seem
                            > to
                            > find it now. Anyone know a source?

                            --
                            John (jkohnen@...)
                            A paranoid is a man who knows a little of what's going on.
                            (William Burroughs)


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                          • Ford Walton
                            Deks Olje is also available from Jamestown Distributors in Rhode Island, www.JamestownDistributors.com ,800-423-0030. Ford Walton ... From: John Kohnen
                            Message 13 of 29 , Mar 6, 2012
                              Deks Olje is also available from Jamestown Distributors in Rhode Island, www.JamestownDistributors.com ,800-423-0030.

                              Ford Walton

                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: John Kohnen <jhkohnen@...>
                              To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                              Sent: Mon, 05 Mar 2012 17:53:55 -0500 (EST)
                              Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Clear Coating alternatives

                              Deks Olje disappeared for a while when the parent company got bought up by
                              someone not interested in making it. <shrug> But an outfit in Florida got
                              ahold of the rights to it, and Deks Olje is again being made:

                              http://www.deksolje.com/

                              On Fri, 02 Mar 2012 16:09:53 -0800, John T wrote:

                              > I used Deks Olje with great success about 20 years ago, but I can't seem
                              > to
                              > find it now. Anyone know a source?

                              --
                              John (jkohnen@...)
                              A paranoid is a man who knows a little of what's going on.
                              (William Burroughs)


                              ------------------------------------

                              Bolger rules!!!
                              - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                              - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                              - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                              - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                              - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                              - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                              - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links
                            • Eric
                              I ll second the lack of satisfaction with Cetol. It has an ugly orange ting, even over black walnut, doesn t preserve itself or the wood against fungus, and
                              Message 14 of 29 , May 22, 2012
                                I'll second the lack of satisfaction with Cetol. It has an ugly orange ting, even over black walnut, doesn't preserve itself or the wood against fungus, and does not hold up well. Cetol was the last thing I tried coating my toe rails and wooden cleats with. I started with Deks Ole and I may return. I am currently going through past posts looking for inspiration. At this point I am leaning toward Penetrol and Tung Oil. At least I won't have to sand it off. Thanks to all who posted their experiences.

                                Eric



                                --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Douglas Pollard <dougpol1@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Holly cow Mason, I thought I was about the only person in the world that
                                > used Tung oil any more. I like the looks off the finish above all
                                > other. Doug
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > On 03/01/2012 09:27 AM, Mason Smith wrote:
                                > >
                                > > I would vote against epoxy. Whatever you do, let moisture come and go
                                > > with ambient conditions. Varnish will allow this. But if you want less
                                > > maintenance, oil might be better. I don't know spotted gum and will
                                > > not pretend to say what oil. I have been using tung oil of late, both
                                > > pure and thinned. I have long used and liked Deks Olje. Have not used,
                                > > and don't really like (what I've seen of it, on Drascombes) Cetol.
                                > > ---Mason
                                > >
                                > >
                                >
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