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Re: Micro Questions

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  • William
    Tom, 1. Interior pictures are difficult to take in a small boat. You cannot get far enough to one end to get a good picture of the other end. The Micro
    Message 1 of 26 , Mar 6, 2010
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      Tom,
      1. Interior pictures are difficult to take in a small boat. You cannot get far enough to one end to get a good picture of the other end. The Micro interior is simple; two bunk flats, a small space between, and a small counter-top area for cooking. The interior is larger in a plumb-sided sharpie than other 16 foot boats (boats with soft chines). But it's up to you how you want to store stuff in that interior. The primary storage is under the cockpit with some smaller storage areas under the counter-top and under the bunk flats.
      A benefit of the short external keel is that the interior is open and free of a centerboard trunk.
      2. Cruising. Peter Lenihan cruised Lestat extensively. Duckworks has a write-up of his trip (at least a week. Maybe two or three weeks?) to Lake Champlain. Roger Keyes, a 70+ year old gent from Oz has cruised for weeks on his LM (Paloma Blanco), and he has kept to sea for days on end. His tales are sitting in one of the Yahoo group folders and there are a couple pictures of his boat. The Ankes and their dogs lived in Zoon, their Long Micro for (a year?) in their driveway.
      3. I don't cruise in areas with extensive tides, so beaching my Long Micro has never been an option. Roger Keyes has beached his Micro. There's a great picture of Paloma Blanco drying out on a beach, her hull reflected in a pool of water. A framed version hangs in my living room.

      I have sailed my LM for three years now. I think my observations are in line with what Micro sailors would say. The boat is simple to rig, sail, and tend. The mizzen helps with self-steering to windward, reefing on the water, and stability at anchor. There is no standing rigging, so you can sheet the main well before the mast (or let it weather cock completely). These boats are deceptively fast off the wind (I have hit 7.2 knots in my LM, and have had hours of easy cruising at 6+ knots). I do not think M or LM goes well to windward in light winds (below about 6 knots), and they point "OK." If you
      prefer a boat which points high and want to race boats with deeper keels and headsails, you might be unhappy. The hull shape pound in the waves when motoring directly into the wind. The hull can slap a little in waves at anchor. Some people complain greatly about the latter- it hasn't bothered me much.

      Given your conditions (inland lakes), have you considered a Chebacco? I like many aspects of the Chebacco and would have built one, but chose an LM because of the heavily ballasted keel.

      Bill, in Texas
      Long Micro Pugnacious

      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Tom" <tomoll@...> wrote:
      >
      > Newbie here seriously considering a Micro build. I have read all I can find about the Micro, and although many comment favorably about the design, there seems to be little specific detail about what makes it good. I would like to hear what experienced Micro owners / sailors feel the virtues of the design are, and what the faults or shortcoming are.
      > Although it is described as a cruiser, I can't find many good pictures of the interior, and don't see any that appear to be set up for cruising for longer than a day sail. Curious - Why?
      > Is one advised not to beach a Micro? I like shoal draft, but this seems to be marginally greater than what some consider shoal draft. (yes/no??)
      > I would gladly buy the plans for a deeper dive, but like others have indicated here, I am frustrated by lack of response from FAX to PB&F. Are the plans from CSB the same in detail and quality?
      > Lastly (for now), are there any Micro owners in the Lake Norman NC or Smith Mountain Lake VA area? I'd love to see one in the flesh, or better yet, hitch a ride.
      > My use for the boat would be primarily on large inland lakes with occasional trip to coastal waters for long weekend to week long cruising. The boat would live in the (fresh) water year around moored at my dock.
      > Considering the age of the Micro design, these questions have probably been beat around endlessly, but there doesn't seem to be a good synopsis of such information that I can find. Thanks for your inputs and patience! more questions to follow :-)
      > Tom
      >
    • Dave Gentry
      I built one. The Micro is a micro cruiser, with spartan accommodations and good stowage for two - roomy, but without a lot of creature comforts. You don t need
      Message 2 of 26 , Mar 6, 2010
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        I built one. The Micro is a micro cruiser, with spartan accommodations and good stowage for two - roomy, but without a lot of creature comforts.
        You don't need a cabin, at all, for daysailing . . . .

        Beach it all you want. It has a salient keel, though, so it won't sit completely upright. Plus, of course, you risk damaging said keel if there's wave action and the ground isn't not soft mud or the like. That hold true with any boat's bottom, though.

        CSB is NOT affiliated with Phil Bolger and Friends - though they (as CSD) were, originally. Nowadays the new owner is just stealing Bolger designs and refuses to pay royalties, etc to PB&F. Phil asked, and it's the consensus here, that we not business with them. All plans can be had through PB&F (eventually).

        BTW, a number of years ago I did buy (non-Bolger) kayak plans from them, not knowing any better. I was very disappointed with the service, the plans and, ultimately, with the boat itself.


        The Micro sounds just dandy for your aspirations, in any case.

        D




        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Tom" <tomoll@...> wrote:
        >
        > Newbie here seriously considering a Micro build. I have read all I can find about the Micro, and although many comment favorably about the design, there seems to be little specific detail about what makes it good. I would like to hear what experienced Micro owners / sailors feel the virtues of the design are, and what the faults or shortcoming are.
        > Although it is described as a cruiser, I can't find many good pictures of the interior, and don't see any that appear to be set up for cruising for longer than a day sail. Curious - Why?
        > Is one advised not to beach a Micro? I like shoal draft, but this seems to be marginally greater than what some consider shoal draft. (yes/no??)
        > I would gladly buy the plans for a deeper dive, but like others have indicated here, I am frustrated by lack of response from FAX to PB&F. Are the plans from CSB the same in detail and quality?
        > Lastly (for now), are there any Micro owners in the Lake Norman NC or Smith Mountain Lake VA area? I'd love to see one in the flesh, or better yet, hitch a ride.
        > My use for the boat would be primarily on large inland lakes with occasional trip to coastal waters for long weekend to week long cruising. The boat would live in the (fresh) water year around moored at my dock.
        > Considering the age of the Micro design, these questions have probably been beat around endlessly, but there doesn't seem to be a good synopsis of such information that I can find. Thanks for your inputs and patience! more questions to follow :-)
        > Tom
        >
      • Bruce Hallman
        ... upside: 1) It is a big, small boat. You are free from all the headaches and expense of a big boat, while still having plenty of capability. 2) The Cat
        Message 3 of 26 , Mar 6, 2010
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          On Fri, Mar 5, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Tom <tomoll@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          >
          > Newbie here seriously considering a Micro build. I have read all I can find about the Micro, and although many comment favorably about the design, there seems to be little specific detail about what makes it good. I would like to hear what experienced Micro owners / sailors feel the virtues of the design are, and what the faults or shortcoming are.

          upside:

          1) It is a big, small boat. You are free from all the headaches and
          expense of a big boat, while still having plenty of capability.

          2) The Cat Yawl rig is simply better than a sloop when measured is
          cost and ease of handling.

          neutral:

          It is a cruiser not a racer. Good if you plan on cruising, bad if you
          plan on racing.

          downside:

          The 15'6" length has a theoretical limit of speed based on
          displacement hull waterline. Not really a problem if you are
          intending on having fun in a boat, but it would be a problem if your
          intention is to go somewhere fast.
        • prairiedog2332
          Photos of Micro LESTAT in the Bolger3 group with some of the interior. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bolger3/
          Message 4 of 26 , Mar 6, 2010
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            Photos of Micro LESTAT in the Bolger3 group with some of the interior.

            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bolger3/

            <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Bolger3/photos/album/1984533041/pic/list?\
            mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&count=20&dir=asc>

            Nels

            --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <hallman@...> wrote:
            >
            > On Fri, Mar 5, 2010 at 6:09 PM, Tom tomoll@... wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Newbie here seriously considering a Micro build. I have read all I
            can find about the Micro, and although many comment favorably about the
            design, there seems to be little specific detail about what makes it
            good. I would like to hear what experienced Micro owners / sailors feel
            the virtues of the design are, and what the faults or shortcoming are.
            >
            > upside:
            >
            > 1) It is a big, small boat. You are free from all the headaches and
            > expense of a big boat, while still having plenty of capability.
            >
            > 2) The Cat Yawl rig is simply better than a sloop when measured is
            > cost and ease of handling.
            >
            > neutral:
            >
            > It is a cruiser not a racer. Good if you plan on cruising, bad if you
            > plan on racing.
            >
            > downside:
            >
            > The 15'6" length has a theoretical limit of speed based on
            > displacement hull waterline. Not really a problem if you are
            > intending on having fun in a boat, but it would be a problem if your
            > intention is to go somewhere fast.
            >
          • Adirondack Goodboat
            Some things about the Micro that may not have been mentioned -- It is very seakindly, comfortable and well-behaved in seas. Some comparison studies have been
            Message 5 of 26 , Mar 7, 2010
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              Some things about the Micro that may not have been mentioned -- It is very seakindly, comfortable and well-behaved in seas. Some comparison studies have been done, I wish I could remember where, of various boats on factors contributing to comfort at sea, and Micro comes off wonderfully in these comparisons. She is an extremely easy and comfortable boat in use, I find. My family and I have enjoyed our Micro more than our Drascombe Luggers, our Dovekie, our two Birdwatchers. The only boat I've had that I think we'd have liked even more, though it's overlarge for our usual sailing, is the Whalewatcher.
              Micro is very stiff in puffs and very forgiving and calming. Some boats can rattle you. The famously seaworthy Drascombe Lugger can go op on its side and take on water over the rail with surprising suddenness; not so, Micro.
              The boat as designed is very comfortable to sleep and read in but for cruising you need to invent some practices and perhaps install some features to suit. I've done little in that way in mine, have just got along camping in it loosely, filling the space under the cockpit side to side to keep things in place. It's very rare that you'd heel more than 15 or 20 degrees in a Micro.
              You can practically beach the boat and step out on dry land over the bow, if the bottom doesn't shelve up too gradually. It's shoal enough for most anything. Cedar Key, in Florida, wouldn't be such good cruising ground for Micro as for a leeboard or centerboard boat because a lot of that water can suddenly be extremely thin. But everywhere else I've sailed the ballast keel would not be much of a penalty, and the open cabin's worth a lot. By the way, if your trailer has a drop axle as mine does, the keel doesn't keep the boat high on the trailer, and you can launch without getting your car's tires wet.
                  You need only a small car to haul Micro. Mine is an older Mercedes wagon, V6. That's my limit for haulers and keeps me to reasonable-size boats. Still it hauled the 29 foot Whalewatcher to Annapolis, on a single axle trailer. But I don't want to start up that discussion of tow vehicles again.
               
              What else. I sailed Micro 42 miles at 6+ knots on a single reach across the eastern end of Lake Ontario last summer and the next day overtook and passed a 30+ foot Toronto yawl with a big genoa and a mizzen staysail in 8 mph winds going down the St. Lawrence to Clayton. So I am content with Micro's speed. Not with her windward work in light airs, nor windward in very strong breezes; in those conditions she makes too much leeway; but she's fine in everything in between and she's very convenient to motor when needed. All in all she's a sweetie.
               
               
              ----- Original Message -----  .
              From: Tom
              Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 9:09 PM
              Subject: [bolger] Micro Questions

               

              Newbie here seriously considering a Micro build. I have read all I can find about the Micro, and although many comment favorably about the design, there seems to be little specific detail about what makes it good. I would like to hear what experienced Micro owners / sailors feel the virtues of the design are, and what the faults or shortcoming are.
              Although it is described as a cruiser, I can't find many good pictures of the interior, and don't see any that appear to be set up for cruising for longer than a day sail. Curious - Why?
              Is one advised not to beach a Micro? I like shoal draft, but this seems to be marginally greater than what some consider shoal draft. (yes/no??)
              I would gladly buy the plans for a deeper dive, but like others have indicated here, I am frustrated by lack of response from FAX to PB&F. Are the plans from CSB the same in detail and quality?
              Lastly (for now), are there any Micro owners in the Lake Norman NC or Smith Mountain Lake VA area? I'd love to see one in the flesh, or better yet, hitch a ride.
              My use for the boat would be primarily on large inland lakes with occasional trip to coastal waters for long weekend to week long cruising. The boat would live in the (fresh) water year around moored at my dock.
              Considering the age of the Micro design, these questions have probably been beat around endlessly, but there doesn't seem to be a good synopsis of such information that I can find. Thanks for your inputs and patience! more questions to follow :-)
              Tom

            • Bruce Hallman
              ... I will ditto that. There are certain conditions where the Micro will put to shame boats that cost 100x the price. Especially in reaching or running
              Message 6 of 26 , Mar 7, 2010
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                > the next day overtook and passed a 30+ foot Toronto yawl with a big genoa and a mizzen staysail

                I will ditto that. There are certain conditions where the Micro will
                put to shame boats that cost 100x the price. Especially in reaching
                or running situations. I recall casually sailing on a reach across
                the San Francisco waterfront sitting in my socks with my feet up warm
                and cozy drinking a cup of tea, and watching the crew of a 30+ foot
                Beneteau sloop dressed in foul weather gear go into panic mode
                tweaking their sails, spinnaker pole, and more to avoid being passed
                by a boxy looking backyard built 16 footer (when my Micro cost about
                as much as one of their deck winches).
              • daschultz2000
                Great word picture. Great fun.
                Message 7 of 26 , Mar 8, 2010
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                  Great word picture. Great fun.

                  --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <hallman@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >...watching the crew of a 30+ foot Beneteau sloop dressed in foul weather gear go into panic mode tweaking their sails, spinnaker pole, and more to avoid being passed...(when my Micro cost about
                  > as much as one of their deck winches).
                  >
                • Tom
                  Thanks to all who offered information and suggestions about the Micro - it is all very helpful in making a decision to build one. The tips on where to find
                  Message 8 of 26 , Mar 12, 2010
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                    Thanks to all who offered information and suggestions about the Micro - it is all very helpful in making a decision to build one. The tips on where to find additional pictures were also appreciated. It sounds like a great all around boat, suitable for my purposes. I'm looking for something that is comfortable to sail (my wife is not wild about sailing), and does not require constant gymnastics. If I want to go fast, I have other means of doing so. I would definitely like to outfit one with features to make a week long cruise possible. Now if I could only obtain a set of plans. I have a 30' X 40' shop just waiting for such a project, but at my age, I need to get started if I'm going to get it wet. Thanks again all.
                    Tom
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