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Re: [bolger] Re: Largest "Bolger Box" how about triangle? Seaworthyness

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  • Douglas Pollard
    I don t think anyone has mentioned the faster the boat is the less supplies you have to carry. So a Warrem may not need the carrying capacity that a box does.
    Message 1 of 129 , Jan 6, 2010
      I don't think anyone has mentioned the faster the boat is the less
      supplies you have to carry. So a Warrem may not need the carrying
      capacity that a box does. The more supplies you put on board the slower
      the boat is, the more supplies you need and so on. If you don't take
      advantage of this advantage you are just as well of with a mono hull.
      proaconstrictor wrote:
      > There have been few if any examples of Wharrams being overturned. I am
      > not aware of any that would fit within the size range of the OP's
      > original question. I am also not aware of any Bolgers that have been
      > through hurricane conditions, except the row boat that was lost at
      > sea. I'm sure there are examples, I'm mostly ignorant of them.
      > However, I would not be surprised if there where individual Wharram
      > cats with more heavy seas experience in world cruising than all
      > Bolgers. Are there any 21 foot Wharram boxes that have been around the
      > world like Rory's Cookie? If it was a box it would have been probably
      > an 18 footer.
      > Some of the most irritating things about Wharrams all help you out in
      > the ultimate storm. They are built with too much material, and they
      > have small rigs. Bingo, there goes any real chance of capsize and they
      > can't easily be sunk since the structure has positive buoyancy. They
      > have points on both ends, which allow far more options for para
      > anchors and drogues. They have inefficient V shapes and full length
      > keels on most models, which are great for taking the waves etc...
      > Wharrams are among the most sea worthy ocean boats of any kind. They
      > just bobbed up and down in the tsunami a few years back. One did get
      > thrown on the shore with minimal damage.
      > I'm not saying Wharram good, Bolger bad. I own several small Bolgers
      > and no Wharrams. If I won a medium sized lottery I would move to Oz
      > and build an Oram, not a Wharram for a world cruise, and probably
      > still have a Bolger EP or GLD for commuting to shore. But as far as
      > world cruising is concerned, and the willingness to build big, one
      > would be nuts to build a Bolger and not a Wharram.
      > Details count. For instance how to survive the ultimate storm in a
      > Wharram is something where you can go on the net and get the formula
      > for para-anchoring from someone who has been cruising the oceans for
      > decades.
      > I'm aware of capacity differences, costs, traillering, and Flexy Space
      > vs enclosed space:
      > -I design small trailer sailers myself, and I don't think there is a
      > decent trailer sailing Wharram, though admittedly the standard for
      > multis is really high.
      > - Capacity wise multis loose by definition, but they are increasingly
      > the go to boat for long cruises because they take to shallow
      > anchorages, provide nice tropical living spaces, survive storms, and
      > are comfortable in anchorages with swells. They have gained a lot of
      > followers recently For those of us who signed on in the 70s, the idea
      > that they would be regularly featured on covers of traditional sailing
      > and cruising magazines was hard to believe.
      > - Cost of most multis is high because of the multiple parts, the good
      > bit is that there are less compromises to plywood multis than for
      > large boats of any other type. There are plywood multis that are
      > beating million dollar yachts out there in races. And for the builder,
      > all the parts are lighter to build and cheaper to build than for
      > monos, but there are more of them. My 24 foot tri was about 3K to
      > build add some fabrication, a Hobie rig, and a few 60 dollar winches.
      > My pal's Tiki 46 is going to cost over 100K. at least. Way more than
      > the cubed price. I think I could have built it for less, but maybe not.
      > To restate. Bolger good, but not my choice for a world cruise. I don't
      > even remember reading that proposal in his books.
      > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bolger%40yahoogroups.com>,
      > "loosemoosefilmworks" <loosemoosefilmworks@...> wrote:
      > >
      > > That's sort of an apples or oranges sort of question...
      > >
      > > They are both seaworthy and I'd rate their respective "comfort
      > factor" as equal.
      > >
      > > Bob
      > >
      > > http://boatbits.blogspot.com/ <http://boatbits.blogspot.com/>
      > > http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/
      > <http://fishingundersail.blogspot.com/>
      > > http://islandgourmand.blogspot.com/
      > <http://islandgourmand.blogspot.com/>
      > >
      > > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com <mailto:bolger%40yahoogroups.com>,
      > "Christopher C. Wetherill" <wetherillc@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Since you have experience of both types, what is your opinion of
      > which
      > > > would be better in a rough sea? I am guessing the cat would be harder
      > > > to knock over but less forgiving once it occurs.
      > > >
      > > > V/R
      > > > Chris
      > > >
    • Susanne@comcast.net
      Thanks for your understanding, Jeff ... From: Jeffery Measamer To: bolger@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 07, 2010 9:43 PM Subject: Re: [bolger] Buying
      Message 129 of 129 , Jul 7, 2010
        Thanks for your understanding, Jeff
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Wednesday, July 07, 2010 9:43 PM
        Subject: Re: [bolger] Buying Plans from PB&F


        Thanks Sussane, I am currently taking a week off visiting relatives but will try to get a check mailed off as soon as I get back home next week. I am glad to hear you are starting to feel better, my dad went through the same thing when my mom passed several years ago, it takes a while but hang in there.
        Jeff Measamer

        --- On Wed, 7/7/10, Susanne@comcast. net <philbolger@comcast. net> wrote:

        From: Susanne@comcast. net <philbolger@comcast. net>
        Subject: Re: [bolger] Buying Plans from PB&F
        To: bolger@yahoogroups. com
        Date: Wednesday, July 7, 2010, 4:32 PM

        Better late than never ??

        Jeff, I am in the process of tending to long undone correspondence and will offer you the info you requested ages ago.  Perhaps it is still useful to you:
        - Plans for Design #654 "BANTAM 16/20" on 8 sheet of 17"x22" format are available for US $200.- to build one boat, mailed in a tube, sent priority mail.
        - Plans for Design #606 "18-foot Clamskiff" on 5 sheets of 17"x22" format are available for US$125.- to same conditions.

        Progress of restructuring my life without Phil continues with periodic 'potholes' unpredictable but less in numbers.
        Thank you for your interest in our work.
        Susanne Altenburger   

        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 3:44 PM
        Subject: Re: [bolger] Buying Plans from PB&F

        Suzanne, very sorry to bother you but I saw you had posted on the forum and wanted to inquire on the price for plans for Bantam (power Trimaran) and the Cabin Clam Skiff.
        Jeff Measamer
        Houston, TX

        --- On Thu, 1/21/10, Susanne@comcast. net <philbolger@comcast. net> wrote:

        From: Susanne@comcast. net <philbolger@comcast. net>
        Subject: [bolger] Buying Plans from PB&F
        To: bolger@yahoogroups. com
        Date: Thursday, January 21, 2010, 3:19 AM

        A quick note from Gloucester,

        I am sleeping better, am busy in and around the house tending to matters much neglected over recent years - quite therapeutic - and continue to 'acclimate' to doing business without Phil.  

        Progress at last on a number of serious matters including sending out plans.  I've just sent a batch yesterday, including a set to Canada.  Tomorrow others will go out, with one set to the U.K. 

        The point is to let you all know that things are picking up here. 
        Much unanswered inquiries left to tackle though. 

        One day at a time.

        Susanne Altenburger
        Phil Bolger & Friends

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