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Re: A little help is needed

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  • wetherillc
    Puddle Duck Racer at PDRacer.com is based on Brick, not Tortoise as I posted previously (deleted post). Gross displacement is 650 pounds. LOA is 8 feet. V/R
    Message 1 of 9 , Dec 1, 2009
      Puddle Duck Racer at PDRacer.com is based on Brick, not Tortoise as I posted previously (deleted post). Gross displacement is 650 pounds. LOA is 8 feet.

      V/R
      Chris

      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "tlakin2002" <tlakin2002@...> wrote:
      >
      > i have no experience sailing or rowing any of these boats yet, i'm in the middle of an elegant punt build. it is proving much easier to build than i first thought it would be, with cracking a chine log being the only real mishap at this point. i have zero experience with woodworking and i'm not going for show quality, just build experience and something to do over the colder months, so the quality of my materials isn't exactly optimum. (http://www.flickr.com/photos/12235211@N02/sets/72157622785582418/)
      >
      > the tortoise is supposed to be even easier to build. i nearly built it instead of the EP. i also like the look of the lateen rig on the tortoise quite a bit. whatever you build, though, i suggest making a model first. even if it's just paper and scotch tape, it will help you visualize how the bigger version goes together.
      >
      > -trevor
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "haffdaddy" <haffdaddy@> wrote:
      > >
      > > A little help is needed. I'm 6'2" and around 275lbs, so is the Tortoise out of the question? A Brick seems to have a 1000 lb capacity but is almost as big as my car. The Elegant Punt would be a dream to build and seems to have a 600 lb capacity. Then there is the Apple Pie (not a Bolger design) 7 ft yacht tender. So what do you kind folks say?
      > >
      > > Thank you
      > >
      > > Greg Haff
      > >
      >
    • adventures_in_astrophotography
      Greg, ... In between Brick and Tortoise lies Big Tortoise, plans available from Payson. This is an 8 Tortoise on the same beam, so it s not as heavy or wide
      Message 2 of 9 , Dec 1, 2009
        Greg,

        > A little help is needed. I'm 6'2" and around 275lbs, so is the Tortoise out of the question? A Brick seems to have a 1000 lb capacity but is almost as big as my car. The Elegant Punt would be a dream to build and seems to have a 600 lb capacity. Then there is the Apple Pie (not a Bolger design) 7 ft yacht tender. So what do you kind folks say?


        In between Brick and Tortoise lies Big Tortoise, plans available from Payson. This is an 8' Tortoise on the same beam, so it's not as heavy or wide as a Brick, but has around 25% more capacity than the standard Tortoise. My dog and I total about 250 lbs. and it handles us just fine. The Rubens Nymph is another possibility, but the footprint of that one is close to a Brick, although it's a finer shape.

        Jon Kolb
        www.kolbsadventures.com
      • Bruce Hallman
        ... As capacity goes up with volume, not length, I suspect that the Big Tortoise has even more than 25% greater capacity. It might be a fine choice. Though,
        Message 3 of 9 , Dec 1, 2009
          > In between Brick and Tortoise lies Big Tortoise, plans available from Payson. This is an 8' Tortoise on the same beam, so it's not as heavy or wide as a Brick, but has around 25% more capacity than the standard Tortoise.

          As capacity goes up with volume, not length, I suspect that the Big
          Tortoise has even more than 25% greater capacity. It might be a fine
          choice. Though, I suggest being aware of the excellent advantage of a
          plain Tortoise, which is it being of light weight and compact shape
          making it extremely handy and portable. Bigger boats fail in that
          regard. I made my second Tortoise out of 1/8" plywood to exploit this
          'light weight' advantage, and it is very handy to have a boat that I
          can casually toss on top the car without needing surgery for a hernia.
        • adventures_in_astrophotography
          Hi Bruce, ... ...snip... Increasing length increases volume, even if breadth and depth are not changed. If the boat is scaled up in only one dimension, length
          Message 4 of 9 , Dec 2, 2009
            Hi Bruce,

            > As capacity goes up with volume, not length, I suspect that the Big
            > Tortoise has even more than 25% greater capacity.
            ...snip...

            Increasing length increases volume, even if breadth and depth are not changed.

            If the boat is scaled up in only one dimension, length being a good example, the increase in volume, and thus displacement, is proportional only to the change in that dimension. Big Tortoise is 23% longer than Tortoise on the same beam, but I'm not sure about depth. Assuming that depth is the same as the original, it's tempting to say that Big Tortoise would displace 23% more.

            However, that would imply pure lengthwise scaling, which would increase the rake of the bow transom and flatten the rocker of the bottom. I suspect that the rake of the transom was not increased on Big Tortoise, and so she's going to have a slightly fuller forward bottom volume than if she were simply scaled from the original. Thus, I said "around 25% more" as an estimate of the actual increase in capacity. Obviously if the depth was increased too, the increase in capacity will be greater still.

            Jon
          • Christopher C. Wetherill
            Displacement of Tortoise is given on plans as 300 lb at wl just below transoms. At the equivalent point on Brick, the displacement is given as 875 lb. See
            Message 5 of 9 , Dec 2, 2009
              Displacement of Tortoise is given on plans as 300 lb at wl just below transoms.  At the  equivalent point on Brick, the displacement is given as 875 lb.  See page 88 of Build The New Instant Boats for Tortoise and page 7 of Boats with an Open Mind for Brick.

              another point that may be worth mentioning is that the instant boats series are designed such that lofting is not necessary.

              V/R
              Chris


              adventures_in_astrophotography wrote:
              Hi Bruce,
              
                
              As capacity goes up with volume, not length, I suspect that the Big
              Tortoise has even more than 25% greater capacity.  
                  
              ...snip...
              
              Increasing length increases volume, even if breadth and depth are not changed.  
              
              If the boat is scaled up in only one dimension, length being a good example, the increase in volume, and thus displacement, is proportional only to the change in that dimension.  Big Tortoise is 23% longer than Tortoise on the same beam, but I'm not sure about depth.  Assuming that depth is the same as the original, it's tempting to say that Big Tortoise would displace 23% more.  
              
              However, that would imply pure lengthwise scaling, which would increase the rake of the bow transom and flatten the rocker of the bottom.  I suspect that the rake of the transom was not increased on Big Tortoise, and so she's going to have a slightly fuller forward bottom volume than if she were simply scaled from the original.  Thus, I said "around 25% more" as an estimate of the actual increase in capacity.  Obviously if the depth was increased too, the increase in capacity will be greater still.
              
              Jon  
              
              
              
                
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