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Re: Tender for classic yacht

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  • sirdarnell
    How long can it be and fit in the space available?
    Message 1 of 16 , Nov 1, 2009
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      How long can it be and fit in the space available?

      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
      >
      > Anybody got any recommendations for a tender out of the Bolger
      > repertoire for a classic 65 footer. I crew on it and may be skippering
      > it soon. The current hard bottom zodiac with 15 hp just doesn't look
      > right. It needs to go ashore over crappy beaches, be easy to get in and
      > out of for old creaky folks. Having the ability to pack a pot puller and
      > downriggers would be a plus. It goes on and off the aft cabin with a
      > boom lift powered by hydraulics weight isn't to big an issue. It should
      > look good. It would operate under power. My son thinks the boys launch
      > would be the ticket, but he has wanted to build one since before being a
      > teenager. Here is a couple of links to the host boat "Princeton Hall"
      >
      > http://www.dv.com/dv/magazine/2005/0105/DV0501whalesFig06.jpg
      >
      > http://www.intersea.org/images/prhall.jpg
      >
    • Harry James
      I am going to say 14-16 feet, I should have measured the spot before I asked the question. Will do so today or tomorrow. HJ
      Message 2 of 16 , Nov 1, 2009
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        I am going to say 14-16 feet, I should have measured the spot before I asked the question. Will do so today or tomorrow.

        HJ

        sirdarnell wrote:
        How long can it be and fit in the space available?
        
        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
          
        Anybody got any recommendations for a tender out of the Bolger 
        repertoire for a classic 65 footer. I crew on it and may be skippering 
        it soon. The current hard bottom zodiac with 15 hp just doesn't look 
        right. It needs to go ashore over crappy beaches, be easy to get in and 
        out of for old creaky folks. Having the ability to pack a pot puller and 
        downriggers would be a plus.  It goes on and off the aft cabin with a 
        boom lift powered by hydraulics weight isn't to big an issue. It should 
        look good. It would operate under power.  My son thinks the boys launch 
        would be the ticket, but he has wanted to build one since before being a 
        teenager. Here is a couple of links to the host boat "Princeton Hall"
        
        http://www.dv.com/dv/magazine/2005/0105/DV0501whalesFig06.jpg
        
        http://www.intersea.org/images/prhall.jpg
        
            
        
        
        
        ------------------------------------
        
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      • PAUL MCLELLAN
        You could look at the small clam skiff. It is in boats with an open mind and also Dynamite Paysons new book. It is a great geriatric boat and beaches well.
        Message 3 of 16 , Nov 2, 2009
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          You could look at the small clam skiff.  It is in boats with an open mind and also Dynamite Paysons new book.  It is a great geriatric boat and beaches well.  The ample storage means you are always ready to go with you safety and fishing gear well stowed.  The 15 will push it very well.  It is an easy build and really tough to take what you can give it.  The flat bottom is a dream to get in and out at dock, beside the mother craft or on the beach. With an imaginative paint job it could be very attractive.  The lines in the drawings do not do it justice.  regards Paul
        • Peter
          Shivaree, hands down. Check with SA to see if it has enough stability for the pot puller. PCB designed a small fleet of powerboats in the 12 to 20 foot range.
          Message 4 of 16 , Nov 2, 2009
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            Shivaree, hands down. Check with SA to see if it has enough stability for the pot puller.

            PCB designed a small fleet of powerboats in the 12 to 20 foot range. Shivaree is the last in a line of development that began in the 1950's.
            PCB had Shivaree at his dock for some years at the end of his life, and didn't see a clear way to improve it. Some of the earlier ones might be of interest. IIRC, one is Hope, which is in the book Small Boats.

            I take it for granted that you want a planning boat. A displacement boat that will fit in the designed area would be limited to 5Kts or so.
          • Harry James
            I didn t know about the small Clam skiff, we thought about the regular one but it is too long. Think I will order up the plans from Payson. Good call HJ
            Message 5 of 16 , Nov 2, 2009
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              I didn't know about the small Clam skiff, we thought about the regular
              one but it is too long. Think I will order up the plans from Payson.
              Good call

              HJ

              PAUL MCLELLAN wrote:
              >
              >
              > You could look at the small clam skiff. It is in boats with an open
              > mind and also Dynamite Paysons new book. It is a great geriatric boat
              > and beaches well. The ample storage means you are always ready to go
              > with you safety and fishing gear well stowed. The 15 will push it
              > very well. It is an easy build and really tough to take what you can
              > give it. The flat bottom is a dream to get in and out at dock, beside
              > the mother craft or on the beach. With an imaginative paint job it
              > could be very attractive. The lines in the drawings do not do it
              > justice. regards Paul
              >
              >
            • Harry James
              Shivaree has the looks but I think it is to much boat. If I remember correctly Phil s had a 50 HP on it when I saw it at the memorial. Hope definitely has the
              Message 6 of 16 , Nov 2, 2009
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                Shivaree has the looks but I think it is to much boat. If I remember
                correctly Phil's had a 50 HP on it when I saw it at the memorial. Hope
                definitely has the looks also and is much smaller.

                HJ

                Peter wrote:
                > Shivaree, hands down. Check with SA to see if it has enough stability for the pot puller.
                >
                > PCB designed a small fleet of powerboats in the 12 to 20 foot range. Shivaree is the last in a line of development that began in the 1950's.
                > PCB had Shivaree at his dock for some years at the end of his life, and didn't see a clear way to improve it. Some of the earlier ones might be of interest. IIRC, one is Hope, which is in the book Small Boats.
                >
                > I take it for granted that you want a planning boat. A displacement boat that will fit in the designed area would be limited to 5Kts or so.
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Bolger rules!!!
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                > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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              • david johnson
                I was going to suggest a fishermans skiff but it is only a 12 footer nice little boat though I have 2 freinds that built them use them to fish the lakes around
                Message 7 of 16 , Nov 2, 2009
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                  I was going to suggest
                  a fishermans skiff but it is only a 12 footer nice little boat though I have 2 freinds that built them use them to fish the lakes around here . I shortened a short clam skiff ( 14 feet I took it off the back end ) recently just have to get her in the water and see what she does . just a few random thoughts :)
                  On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 2:19 PM, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
                   

                  Shivaree has the looks but I think it is to much boat. If I remember
                  correctly Phil's had a 50 HP on it when I saw it at the memorial. Hope
                  definitely has the looks also and is much smaller.

                  HJ



                  Peter wrote:
                  > Shivaree, hands down. Check with SA to see if it has enough stability for the pot puller.
                  >
                  > PCB designed a small fleet of powerboats in the 12 to 20 foot range. Shivaree is the last in a line of development that began in the 1950's.
                  > PCB had Shivaree at his dock for some years at the end of his life, and didn't see a clear way to improve it. Some of the earlier ones might be of interest. IIRC, one is Hope, which is in the book Small Boats.
                  >
                  > I take it for granted that you want a planning boat. A displacement boat that will fit in the designed area would be limited to 5Kts or so.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------

                  >
                  > Bolger rules!!!
                  > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                  > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                  > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                  > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                  > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                  > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >


                • GBroadlick@aol.com
                  you have a power boat, i suggest sweat pea, she rows nice, will hull a load, sails sweet and will go forever with a 2 hp motor. ... From: david johnson
                  Message 8 of 16 , Nov 2, 2009
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                    you have a power boat, i suggest sweat pea, she rows nice, will hull a load, sails sweet and will go forever with a 2 hp motor.


                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: david johnson <djsaprophet@...>
                    To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Mon, Nov 2, 2009 7:01 pm
                    Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Tender for classic yacht

                     
                    I was going to suggest
                    a fishermans skiff but it is only a 12 footer nice little boat though I have 2 freinds that built them use them to fish the lakes around here . I shortened a short clam skiff ( 14 feet I took it off the back end ) recently just have to get her in the water and see what she does . just a few random thoughts :)
                    On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 2:19 PM, Harry James <welshman@ptialaska. net> wrote:
                     
                    Shivaree has the looks but I think it is to much boat. If I remember
                    correctly Phil's had a 50 HP on it when I saw it at the memorial. Hope
                    definitely has the looks also and is much smaller.

                    HJ


                    Peter wrote:
                    > Shivaree, hands down. Check with SA to see if it has enough stability for the pot puller.
                    >
                    > PCB designed a small fleet of powerboats in the 12 to 20 foot range. Shivaree is the last in a line of development that began in the 1950's.
                    > PCB had Shivaree at his dock for some years at the end of his life, and didn't see a clear way to improve it. Some of the earlier ones might be of interest. IIRC, one is Hope, which is in the book Small Boats.
                    >
                    > I take it for granted that you want a planning boat. A displacement boat that will fit in the designed area would be limited to 5Kts or so.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------ --------- --------- ------

                    >
                    > Bolger rules!!!
                    > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                    > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                    > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                    > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                    > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                    > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. com
                    > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_ lounge-subscribe @yahoogroups. com Yahoo! Groups Links
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                  • Walter
                    ... I suggest Bolger s Diablo- it will run with a 15 HP motor, has a lot of reserve stability for pulling pots, fishing, etc, and you could easily reinforce
                    Message 9 of 16 , Nov 3, 2009
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                      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Anybody got any recommendations for a tender out of the Bolger
                      > repertoire for a classic 65 footer. I crew on it and may be skippering
                      > it soon. The current hard bottom zodiac with 15 hp just doesn't look
                      > right. It needs to go ashore over crappy beaches, be easy to get in and
                      > out of for old creaky folks. Having the ability to pack a pot puller and
                      > downriggers would be a plus. It goes on and off the aft cabin with a
                      > boom lift powered by hydraulics weight isn't to big an issue. It should
                      > look good. It would operate under power. My son thinks the boys launch
                      > would be the ticket, but he has wanted to build one since before being a
                      > teenager. Here is a couple of links to the host boat "Princeton Hall"
                      >
                      > http://www.dv.com/dv/magazine/2005/0105/DV0501whalesFig06.jpg
                      >
                      > http://www.intersea.org/images/prhall.jpg
                      >


                      I suggest Bolger's Diablo- it will run with a 15 HP motor, has a lot of reserve stability for pulling pots, fishing, etc, and you could easily reinforce the bottom for landing on rough beaches.
                    • Mark Mirski
                      GBroadlick@aol.com wrote: -- You have a power boat, i suggest sweat pea, she rows nice, will hull a load, sails sweet and will go forever with a 2 hp
                      Message 10 of 16 , Nov 3, 2009
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                        GBroadlick@... wrote:

                        --> 'You have a power boat, i suggest sweat pea, she rows nice, will
                        hull a load, sails sweet and will go forever with a 2 hp motor."



                        I have plans for a Bolger Sweet Pea but have been dragging my heels on
                        beginning the project because I haven't been able to figure out the
                        optimum way to mount my 2hp Honda.

                        I had been attempting to think of ways That I might modify the stern end
                        of the slipping keel, through hull area, to drop in the outboard as well.

                        Any thoughts out there on the matter?

                        Any one with a motor on or in a sweet pea interested in sharing their
                        experiences???

                        I may go to an alternate Bolger skiff design.

                        Best to all.

                        Mark Mirski anshin@...
                      • Harry James
                        I hadn t thought about the Diablo, how stable is for boarding by creaky old guys. It would be over a boarding step across the transom HJ
                        Message 11 of 16 , Nov 3, 2009
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                          I hadn't thought about the Diablo, how stable is for boarding by creaky
                          old guys. It would be over a boarding step across the transom

                          HJ

                          Walter wrote:
                          > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >> Anybody got any recommendations for a tender out of the Bolger
                          >> repertoire for a classic 65 footer. I crew on it and may be skippering
                          >> it soon. The current hard bottom zodiac with 15 hp just doesn't look
                          >> right. It needs to go ashore over crappy beaches, be easy to get in and
                          >> out of for old creaky folks. Having the ability to pack a pot puller and
                          >> downriggers would be a plus. It goes on and off the aft cabin with a
                          >> boom lift powered by hydraulics weight isn't to big an issue. It should
                          >> look good. It would operate under power. My son thinks the boys launch
                          >> would be the ticket, but he has wanted to build one since before being a
                          >> teenager. Here is a couple of links to the host boat "Princeton Hall"
                          >>
                          >> http://www.dv.com/dv/magazine/2005/0105/DV0501whalesFig06.jpg
                          >>
                          >> http://www.intersea.org/images/prhall.jpg
                          >>
                          >>
                          >
                          >
                          > I suggest Bolger's Diablo- it will run with a 15 HP motor, has a lot of reserve stability for pulling pots, fishing, etc, and you could easily reinforce the bottom for landing on rough beaches.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > ------------------------------------
                          >
                          > Bolger rules!!!
                          > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                          > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                          > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                          > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                          > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                          > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                          > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                        • dnjost
                          I second the motion for Diablo. I ran mine for 15+ years with a 10 HP longshaft 2 cycle Johnson. It would do an honest 12 kts with two people aboard. It was
                          Message 12 of 16 , Nov 3, 2009
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                            I second the motion for Diablo. I ran mine for 15+ years with a 10 HP longshaft 2 cycle Johnson. It would do an honest 12 kts with two people aboard. It was pretty good in most stuff except steep chop.

                            We used to swim right off the transom or bow platform and I used it for flyfishing regularly. If I used better quality ply I would still be using it.

                            It is a light boat and has a tendency to blow around when going slow, and if alone will do some scary stuff heading into the chop if the bow is not weighted down (put the battery up front).

                            It is a cheap build and put good cloth with epoxy on the bottom. Perhaps 10 oz and you should be set. The 18' work skiff is much more boat in every way. Perhaps too much for the use you suggest.

                            David Jost


                            > > ------------------------------------
                            > >
                            > > Bolger rules!!!
                            > > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                            > > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                            > > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                            > > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                            > > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                            > > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            > > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links
                            > >
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                          • Christopher C. Wetherill
                            Harry, I think the real question is to see if the pot hoist ( I interpreted the original post to be referring to lifting something like a lobster pot) will
                            Message 13 of 16 , Nov 3, 2009
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                              Harry,

                              I think the real question is to see if the pot hoist ( I interpreted the original post to be referring to lifting something like a lobster pot) will cause problems.  It may be necessary to have a pad to absorb the impact of the pot on the side.

                              Bear in mind also that the true effect of the weight of the boat is to raise the center of gravity of the host and increse the severity of any tendency to roll.

                              I think also that the best approach may be to do a low cost build and replace it when the bottom abrades.

                              V/R
                              Chris

                              Harry James wrote:
                              I hadn't thought about the Diablo, how stable is for boarding by creaky 
                              old guys. It would be over a boarding step across the transom
                              
                              HJ
                              
                              Walter wrote:
                                
                              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
                                
                                  
                              Anybody got any recommendations for a tender out of the Bolger 
                              repertoire for a classic 65 footer. I crew on it and may be skippering 
                              it soon. The current hard bottom zodiac with 15 hp just doesn't look 
                              right. It needs to go ashore over crappy beaches, be easy to get in and 
                              out of for old creaky folks. Having the ability to pack a pot puller and 
                              downriggers would be a plus.  It goes on and off the aft cabin with a 
                              boom lift powered by hydraulics weight isn't to big an issue. It should 
                              look good. It would operate under power.  My son thinks the boys launch 
                              would be the ticket, but he has wanted to build one since before being a 
                              teenager. Here is a couple of links to the host boat "Princeton Hall"
                              
                              http://www.dv.com/dv/magazine/2005/0105/DV0501whalesFig06.jpg
                              
                              http://www.intersea.org/images/prhall.jpg
                              
                                  
                                    
                              I suggest Bolger's Diablo- it will run with a 15 HP motor, has a lot of reserve stability for pulling pots, fishing, etc, and you could easily reinforce the bottom for landing on rough beaches. 
                              
                              
                              
                              ------------------------------------
                              
                              Bolger rules!!!
                              - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!!  Please!
                              - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                              - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts 
                              - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                              - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                              - Unsubscribe:  bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                              - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links
                              
                              
                              
                              
                                
                                  
                              
                              ------------------------------------
                              
                              Bolger rules!!!
                              - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!!  Please!
                              - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                              - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts 
                              - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                              - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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                            • adventures_in_astrophotography
                              Hi Harry, ... The deadrise of Diablo s bilge panels makes it best to step onto the center of a thwart when boarding, in my experience. I like mine, but it s
                              Message 14 of 16 , Nov 4, 2009
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                                Hi Harry,

                                > I hadn't thought about the Diablo, how stable is for boarding by creaky
                                > old guys. It would be over a boarding step across the transom

                                The deadrise of Diablo's bilge panels makes it best to step onto the center of a thwart when boarding, in my experience. I like mine, but it's not the best boat for fishing. She's tippy once you start fighting or landing a fish, and anything left on the seats quickly winds up on the bottom of the boat. The deadrise and high freeboard could also make it awkward to reboard from a beach, although I've never tried it.

                                Like someone else said, it tends to blow around, and this is especially true when I'm trolling at low speed with little weight forward. The 9.9 Honda I use is not enough to plane the boat, but I can get 11 mph or so at full throttle. My problem is the high elevation where I use the boat (8600').

                                Diablo is a fine boat, but I think the work skiffs, with their heavy flat bottoms, would be better for boarding, fishing, and hauling pots aboard. They're also likely to pound more and be wetter. I'd like to try one sometime.

                                Jon
                              • david johnson
                                I had a cousin who crabbed out of a bolger sea hawk for a couple of years a dory type skiff he had her loaded hard most of the time I thought she was pretty
                                Message 15 of 16 , Nov 4, 2009
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                                  I had a cousin who crabbed out of a bolger sea hawk  for a couple of years  a dory type skiff he had her loaded hard most of the time I thought she was pretty stable not an instant boat but not that hard a couple of crabbers built one :) He had a two stroke johnnyrude 15 hp she would scoot

                                  On Wed, Nov 4, 2009 at 10:54 AM, adventures_in_astrophotography <jon@...> wrote:
                                   

                                  Hi Harry,

                                  > I hadn't thought about the Diablo, how stable is for boarding by creaky
                                  > old guys. It would be over a boarding step across the transom

                                  The deadrise of Diablo's bilge panels makes it best to step onto the center of a thwart when boarding, in my experience. I like mine, but it's not the best boat for fishing. She's tippy once you start fighting or landing a fish, and anything left on the seats quickly winds up on the bottom of the boat. The deadrise and high freeboard could also make it awkward to reboard from a beach, although I've never tried it.

                                  Like someone else said, it tends to blow around, and this is especially true when I'm trolling at low speed with little weight forward. The 9.9 Honda I use is not enough to plane the boat, but I can get 11 mph or so at full throttle. My problem is the high elevation where I use the boat (8600').

                                  Diablo is a fine boat, but I think the work skiffs, with their heavy flat bottoms, would be better for boarding, fishing, and hauling pots aboard. They're also likely to pound more and be wetter. I'd like to try one sometime.

                                  Jon


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