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Tennessee Build.

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  • my48cj2a
    I am going to build the Tennessee. I like the shallow draft. It will be perfect for the Indian river lagoon Where I live. That old time look is great. While I
    Message 1 of 25 , Feb 3, 2009
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      I am going to build the Tennessee. I like the shallow draft. It will be
      perfect for the Indian river lagoon Where I live. That old time look is
      great. While I have been talking about other boat builds this one will
      be first in line.
      I had thought about building the Atkins "Gwen O' the river" but the
      Atkin & Co people have not been able to answer any of my questions
      about it. And when they did it was one sentence and that was it. ???.
      If I am not worth the time as a paying customer why build the boat?
      Besides,I have seen pictures of the Tennessee in action. Nice looking
      boat. I can't find any of the Gwen O' The River. If it could be a
      trailerd boat we would see more of them(their loss). The Tennessee can
      be,and it is a fine looking boat in and out of the water. What got me
      hooked was the EstherMae and the Mangrove Mistress. Is anyone else
      building one out there right now? If so please let me know I am looking
      for all the info I can get. Any built of foam? Sternwheel? Pictures?
      Thanks all.I will post the build.
    • captjbturtle
      Message 2 of 25 , Feb 3, 2009
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        --- In hi there, where do you live along the indian river, john
      • my48cj2a
        Palm Bay
        Message 3 of 25 , Feb 3, 2009
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          Palm Bay
        • my48cj2a
          ... Well I do not live on the river.Just in Palm Bay It is a straight line to the river though. Just to south of Goat creek
          Message 4 of 25 , Feb 3, 2009
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            --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
            >
            > Palm Bay
            >
            Well I do not live on the river.Just in Palm Bay It is a straight line
            to the river though. Just to south of Goat creek
          • adventures_in_astrophotography
            If you like Gwen O The River , then you might try contacting PB&F about the Captain Rebecca Thatcher design. It appeared in MAIB a couple of years back,
            Message 5 of 25 , Feb 3, 2009
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              If you like "Gwen O The River", then you might try contacting PB&F
              about the "Captain Rebecca Thatcher" design. It appeared in MAIB a
              couple of years back, but I don't know if it's actually a finished
              design. If it is, it would be much more like Gwen than Tennessee.

              With respect to limited information about the Atkin design, I got the
              sense that the current business is run by a widow or other relative
              of one of the Atkins who may not have much additional information to
              provide. Perhaps someone else on this forum can provide more details.

              Jon

              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
              >
              > I am going to build the Tennessee. I like the shallow draft. It
              will be
              > perfect for the Indian river lagoon Where I live. That old time
              look is
              > great. While I have been talking about other boat builds this one
              will
              > be first in line.
              > I had thought about building the Atkins "Gwen O' the river" but
              the
              > Atkin & Co people have not been able to answer any of my questions
              > about it. And when they did it was one sentence and that was
              it. ???.
              > If I am not worth the time as a paying customer why build the boat?
              > Besides,I have seen pictures of the Tennessee in action. Nice
              looking
              > boat. I can't find any of the Gwen O' The River. If it could be a
              > trailerd boat we would see more of them(their loss). The Tennessee
              can
              > be,and it is a fine looking boat in and out of the water. What got
              me
              > hooked was the EstherMae and the Mangrove Mistress. Is anyone else
              > building one out there right now? If so please let me know I am
              looking
              > for all the info I can get. Any built of foam? Sternwheel?
              Pictures?
              > Thanks all.I will post the build.
              >
            • pesterle@comcast.net
              The name Atkin has long been associated with the best in basic boats. If you are looking for the right little boat to build -- or s. have built -- or if you
              Message 6 of 25 , Feb 3, 2009
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                The name Atkin has long been associated with the best in basic boats. If you are looking for "the right little boat" to build -- or
                s. have built -- or if you just like to dream over boat plans -- you'll be delighted with the design collections of John (1918-1999) and William (1882-1962) Atkin, which are now being sold by John's widow, Pat.


                Paul Esterle


                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "adventures_in_astrophotography" <jon@...>
                To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2009 3:50:09 PM (GMT-0500) Auto-Detected
                Subject: [bolger] Re: Tennessee Build.






                If you like "Gwen O The River", then you might try contacting PB&F
                about the "Captain Rebecca Thatcher" design. It appeared in MAIB a
                couple of years back, but I don't know if it's actually a finished
                design. If it is, it would be much more like Gwen than Tennessee.

                With respect to limited information about the Atkin design, I got the
                sense that the current business is run by a widow or other relative
                of one of the Atkins who may not have much additional information to
                provide. Perhaps someone else on this forum can provide more details.

                Jon

                --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com , "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                >
                > I am going to build the Tennessee. I like the shallow draft. It
                will be
                > perfect for the Indian river lagoon Where I live. That old time
                look is
                > great. While I have been talking about other boat builds this one
                will
                > be first in line.
                > I had thought about building the Atkins "Gwen O' the river" but
                the
                > Atkin & Co people have not been able to answer any of my questions
                > about it. And when they did it was one sentence and that was
                it. ???.
                > If I am not worth the time as a paying customer why build the boat?
                > Besides,I have seen pictures of the Tennessee in action. Nice
                looking
                > boat. I can't find any of the Gwen O' The River. If it could be a
                > trailerd boat we would see more of them(their loss). The Tennessee
                can
                > be,and it is a fine looking boat in and out of the water. What got
                me
                > hooked was the EstherMae and the Mangrove Mistress. Is anyone else
                > building one out there right now? If so please let me know I am
                looking
                > for all the info I can get. Any built of foam? Sternwheel?
                Pictures?
                > Thanks all.I will post the build.
                >



                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Bruce Hallman
                ... Another shallow draft Bolger boat almost identical in draft, size and complexity as the Tennessee is the Topaz. The difference is that Topaz uses the
                Message 7 of 25 , Feb 3, 2009
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                  On Tue, Feb 3, 2009 at 8:54 AM, my48cj2a <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                  > I am going to build the Tennessee. I like the shallow draft. It will be
                  > perfect...

                  Another shallow draft Bolger boat almost identical in draft, size and
                  complexity as the Tennessee is the Topaz. The difference is that
                  Topaz uses the 'twisted panel' forefoot bow technique found on Bolgers
                  more modern designs. Also, there is the "Blackfish" which is similar
                  to Topaz but has a wider stern compared with the narrowing Topaz
                  stern. I am guessing that if you asked Bolger, he would try to steer
                  you towards his more recent designs because they reflect his most
                  recent ideas of what is "good". The blunter Tennessee bow might not
                  cut as cleanly through choppy water as the twisted panel. My guess
                  would be these boats all would take about the same amount of time to
                  build. (variables+/-, of course, but building time correlates closely
                  with total displacement, and these three boats have nearly identical
                  displacements.)

                  Here are some 3D renderings of Tennessee.

                  http://www.flickr.com/search/?s=int&ss=2&w=86125870%40N00&q=tennessee&m=text

                  I will try to put up isometric renderings of the Topaz later...
                • graeme19121984
                  ... John Kohnen posted on this group just the other day - I m sure he could point you in the right direction for info, if any is available. Also there s the
                  Message 8 of 25 , Feb 4, 2009
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                    --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@...> wrote:

                    > I had thought about building the Atkins "Gwen O' the river" but the
                    > Atkin & Co people have not been able to answer any of my questions
                    > about it. And when they did it was one sentence and that was it. ???.
                    > If I am not worth the time as a paying customer why build the boat?

                    John Kohnen posted on this group just the other day - I'm sure he could
                    point you in the right direction for info, if any is available. Also
                    there's the AtkinBoats group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AtkinBoats/
                    ah, I see you already know... good luck then
                  • Chris Feller
                    I did a search for information on Tennessee at Duckworks and came up with these links. http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/building/index.htm
                    Message 9 of 25 , Feb 4, 2009
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                      I did a search for information on Tennessee at Duckworks and came up
                      with these links.

                      http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/building/index.htm

                      http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/tennessee/index.htm

                      http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/04/s/projects/tennessee/index.cfm

                      Here is one of Topaz
                      http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/topaz/index.htm

                      Nice boats. I wish I had a building space large enough. I would
                      build a Tennessee if I did.

                      Chris Feller
                      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I am going to build the Tennessee. I like the shallow draft. It will be
                      > perfect for the Indian river lagoon Where I live. That old time look is
                      > great. While I have been talking about other boat builds this one will
                      > be first in line.
                      > I had thought about building the Atkins "Gwen O' the river" but the
                      > Atkin & Co people have not been able to answer any of my questions
                      > about it. And when they did it was one sentence and that was it. ???.
                      > If I am not worth the time as a paying customer why build the boat?
                      > Besides,I have seen pictures of the Tennessee in action. Nice looking
                      > boat. I can't find any of the Gwen O' The River. If it could be a
                      > trailerd boat we would see more of them(their loss). The Tennessee can
                      > be,and it is a fine looking boat in and out of the water. What got me
                      > hooked was the EstherMae and the Mangrove Mistress. Is anyone else
                      > building one out there right now? If so please let me know I am looking
                      > for all the info I can get. Any built of foam? Sternwheel? Pictures?
                      > Thanks all.I will post the build.
                      >
                    • Harry James
                      Do you have the link to Dick Welch s Tennessee? http://www.boatdesign.com/jumps/dixtenn/Page.html HJ ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      Message 10 of 25 , Feb 4, 2009
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                        Do you have the link to Dick Welch's Tennessee?

                        http://www.boatdesign.com/jumps/dixtenn/Page.html

                        HJ

                        Chris Feller wrote:
                        > I did a search for information on Tennessee at Duckworks and came up
                        > with these links.
                        >
                        > http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/building/index.htm
                        >
                        > http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/tennessee/index.htm
                        >
                        > http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/04/s/projects/tennessee/index.cfm
                        >
                        > Here is one of Topaz
                        > http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/topaz/index.htm
                        >
                        > Nice boats. I wish I had a building space large enough. I would
                        > build a Tennessee if I did.
                        >
                        > Chris Feller
                        > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >> I am going to build the Tennessee. I like the shallow draft. It will be
                        >> perfect for the Indian river lagoon Where I live. That old time look is
                        >> great. While I have been talking about other boat builds this one will
                        >> be first in line.
                        >> I had thought about building the Atkins "Gwen O' the river" but the
                        >> Atkin & Co people have not been able to answer any of my questions
                        >> about it. And when they did it was one sentence and that was it. ???.
                        >> If I am not worth the time as a paying customer why build the boat?
                        >> Besides,I have seen pictures of the Tennessee in action. Nice looking
                        >> boat. I can't find any of the Gwen O' The River. If it could be a
                        >> trailerd boat we would see more of them(their loss). The Tennessee can
                        >> be,and it is a fine looking boat in and out of the water. What got me
                        >> hooked was the EstherMae and the Mangrove Mistress. Is anyone else
                        >> building one out there right now? If so please let me know I am looking
                        >> for all the info I can get. Any built of foam? Sternwheel? Pictures?
                        >> Thanks all.I will post the build.
                        >>
                        >>
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------------------------------
                        >
                        > Bolger rules!!!
                        > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                        > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                        > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                        > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                        > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                        > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • John Kohnen
                        The Atkin designs are being sold by John s widow, Pat, with some help from me. I don t recall being asked if Gwen o the River is trailerable, and the curt
                        Message 11 of 25 , Feb 6, 2009
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                          The Atkin designs are being sold by John's widow, Pat, with some help from
                          me. I don't recall being asked if Gwen o' the River is trailerable, and
                          the curt reply sounds more like Pat. Her one sentence answer was correct
                          (I'm kind of surprised it wasn't one word <g>), but I probably would have
                          explained it a bit more. Built as designed, Gwen o' the River is not
                          trailerable. If the construction was changed to plywood planking, which'd
                          require some rengineering, she'd be "trailerable" in the sense that you
                          could put her on a trailer and take her somewhere, or store her on a
                          trailer, but the process wouldn't be for the faint of heart, and you
                          couldn't just trundle her down to the river for an afternoon on the water.

                          Selling boat plans isn't like selling donuts. We'd like to sell lots of
                          plans, but we're not interested in selling plans to someone if the boat
                          won't serve their purpose.

                          On Tue, 03 Feb 2009 12:50:09 -0800, Jon K wrote:

                          > ...
                          > With respect to limited information about the Atkin design, I got the
                          > sense that the current business is run by a widow or other relative
                          > of one of the Atkins who may not have much additional information to
                          > provide. Perhaps someone else on this forum can provide more details.
                          >
                          > Jon
                          >
                          > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                          >> ...
                          >> I had thought about building the Atkins "Gwen O' the river" but
                          > the
                          >> Atkin & Co people have not been able to answer any of my questions
                          >> about it. And when they did it was one sentence and that was
                          > it. ???.
                          >> If I am not worth the time as a paying customer why build the boat?
                          >> Besides,I have seen pictures of the Tennessee in action. Nice
                          > looking
                          >> boat. I can't find any of the Gwen O' The River. If it could be a
                          >> trailerd boat we would see more of them(their loss).
                          > ...

                          --
                          John <jkohnen@...>
                          As for myself, the wonderful sea charmed me from the first.
                          <Joshua Slocum>
                        • captjbturtle
                          -hi again I m in Fort pierce for a couple more weeks and have built ba bolger power sharpie and am very familiar with the Tenessee, one used to be based in the
                          Message 12 of 25 , Feb 6, 2009
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                            -hi again I'm in Fort pierce for a couple more weeks and have built ba
                            bolger power sharpie and am very familiar with the Tenessee, one used
                            to be based in the area, I think it is the onewhich was sold across the
                            state.Think I'll be cruising the Sebastian river next week in my Bolger
                            Bantam, if you want to talk Tenessee give me a call john bartlett 772
                            979 4293 be glad to point you to the local supplies etc, looking
                            forward to meting you--
                          • Bruce Hallman
                            ... http://www.flickr.com/search/?s=int&ss=2&w=86125870%40N00&q=topazspyder
                            Message 13 of 25 , Feb 11, 2009
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                              > I will try to put up isometric renderings of the Topaz later...

                              http://www.flickr.com/search/?s=int&ss=2&w=86125870%40N00&q=topazspyder
                            • Harry James
                              Bruce I have been mulling over your comment a while back about the Topaz and the Tennessee having equal building times. I have a great deal of respect for your
                              Message 14 of 25 , Feb 11, 2009
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                                Bruce

                                I have been mulling over your comment a while back about the Topaz and
                                the Tennessee having equal building times. I have a great deal of
                                respect for your opinions as they are based on actual experience and you
                                have had some amazing fast builds. However I have always thought of the
                                Topaz as a great deal more complex than a Tennessee. I have always
                                thought the Topaz's more complex shape would make it harder to build.
                                You of course are deep in actually building one. In short I think of the
                                Tennessee as a boat I could build in a winter of spare time and the
                                Topaz as a two winter and maybe more boat.

                                HJ

                                Bruce Hallman wrote:
                                >> I will try to put up isometric renderings of the Topaz later...
                                >>
                                >
                                > http://www.flickr.com/search/?s=int&ss=2&w=86125870%40N00&q=topazspyder
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                              • Bruce Hallman
                                ... Having modeled both boats, and having built 95% of a Topaz Spyder, I think they are very similar in scope. They both have basically the same number of
                                Message 15 of 25 , Feb 11, 2009
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                                  On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 11:54 AM, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
                                  > Bruce
                                  >
                                  > I have been mulling over your comment a while back about the Topaz and
                                  > the Tennessee having equal building times. I have a great deal of
                                  > respect for your opinions as they are based on actual experience and you
                                  > have had some amazing fast builds. However I have always thought of the
                                  > Topaz as a great deal more complex than a Tennessee. I have always
                                  > thought the Topaz's more complex shape would make it harder to build.
                                  > You of course are deep in actually building one. In short I think of the
                                  > Tennessee as a boat I could build in a winter of spare time and the
                                  > Topaz as a two winter and maybe more boat.
                                  >
                                  > HJ

                                  Having modeled both boats, and having built 95% of a Topaz Spyder, I
                                  think they are very similar in scope. They both have basically the
                                  same number of pieces, and very close to the same amount of wood,
                                  finishing surface and painting. I would bet that the two boats have
                                  nearly identical displacements.

                                  The Topaz Spyder does have the twisted panels applied to the forefoot,
                                  while the Tennessee has more complexity in the cabin work. The
                                  twisted panels are not very much of a big deal to build, just one
                                  piece of 1/4" plywood split longway and cutout to the shape on the
                                  plans, sprung and nailed in place.

                                  And in the end, I think that the Topaz Spyder looks more "boat like"
                                  which would have a big $$$ difference on the resale market for used
                                  boats. (While the boxy Tennessee has that "backyard plywood box boat"
                                  look that evokes doubt and dogma among the "right minded boatsman" who
                                  buy used boats. Also, my hunch is that the Topaz Spyder is a bit more
                                  seaworthy. I suspect that the blunt bow of the Tennessee might dig,
                                  broach and generally get in the way in rough water while crossing the
                                  bar, etc. Both of the boats would have astonishing efficiency
                                  cruising flat water.
                                • my48cj2a
                                  Is Bolgers Office open this time of year? I have faxed them for three days and have not gotten a response. Is there other places to buy the plans? ... up ...
                                  Message 16 of 25 , Feb 26, 2009
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                                    Is Bolgers Office open this time of year? I have faxed them for three
                                    days and have not gotten a response. Is there other places to buy the
                                    plans?



                                    --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Do you have the link to Dick Welch's Tennessee?
                                    >
                                    > http://www.boatdesign.com/jumps/dixtenn/Page.html
                                    >
                                    > HJ
                                    >
                                    > Chris Feller wrote:
                                    > > I did a search for information on Tennessee at Duckworks and came
                                    up
                                    > > with these links.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/building/index.htm
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/tennessee/index.ht
                                    m
                                    > >
                                    > > http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/04/s/projects/tennessee/index.cfm
                                    > >
                                    > > Here is one of Topaz
                                    > >
                                    http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/00/DM1999/articles/topaz/index.htm
                                    > >
                                    > > Nice boats. I wish I had a building space large enough. I would
                                    > > build a Tennessee if I did.
                                    > >
                                    > > Chris Feller
                                    > > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > >> I am going to build the Tennessee. I like the shallow draft. It
                                    will be
                                    > >> perfect for the Indian river lagoon Where I live. That old time
                                    look is
                                    > >> great. While I have been talking about other boat builds this
                                    one will
                                    > >> be first in line.
                                    > >> I had thought about building the Atkins "Gwen O' the river" but
                                    the
                                    > >> Atkin & Co people have not been able to answer any of my
                                    questions
                                    > >> about it. And when they did it was one sentence and that was
                                    it. ???.
                                    > >> If I am not worth the time as a paying customer why build the
                                    boat?
                                    > >> Besides,I have seen pictures of the Tennessee in action. Nice
                                    looking
                                    > >> boat. I can't find any of the Gwen O' The River. If it could be
                                    a
                                    > >> trailerd boat we would see more of them(their loss). The
                                    Tennessee can
                                    > >> be,and it is a fine looking boat in and out of the water. What
                                    got me
                                    > >> hooked was the EstherMae and the Mangrove Mistress. Is anyone
                                    else
                                    > >> building one out there right now? If so please let me know I am
                                    looking
                                    > >> for all the info I can get. Any built of foam? Sternwheel?
                                    Pictures?
                                    > >> Thanks all.I will post the build.
                                    > >>
                                    > >>
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > ------------------------------------
                                    > >
                                    > > Bolger rules!!!
                                    > > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                                    > > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or
                                    flogging dead horses
                                    > > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
                                    posts
                                    > > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                                    > > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
                                    01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                                    > > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                    > > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                    Yahoo! Groups Links
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >
                                  • Ben
                                    I tried back in fall and couldn t get them.I also wrote them and never had a return response.I was looking at the Tenny as well.
                                    Message 17 of 25 , Feb 26, 2009
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                                      I tried back in fall and couldn't get them.I also wrote them and never
                                      had a return response.I was looking at the Tenny as well.


                                      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Is Bolgers Office open this time of year? I have faxed them for three
                                      > days and have not gotten a response. Is there other places to buy the
                                      > plans?
                                      >
                                      >
                                    • my48cj2a
                                      So how do we go about getting plans? Does the moderator know? What if we need help with them? I have to have it built in a certain amount of time. I might have
                                      Message 18 of 25 , Feb 27, 2009
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                                        So how do we go about getting plans? Does the moderator know? What if
                                        we need help with them? I have to have it built in a certain amount of
                                        time. I might have to go with something where the plans are easier to
                                        get. When do the customers count?




                                        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ben" <ben_2_go@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > I tried back in fall and couldn't get them.I also wrote them and never
                                        > had a return response.I was looking at the Tenny as well.
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@> wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > > Is Bolgers Office open this time of year? I have faxed them for
                                        three
                                        > > days and have not gotten a response. Is there other places to buy
                                        the
                                        > > plans?
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        >
                                      • Bruce Hallman
                                        ... I know from experience that obtaining the plans is about 10% of the joy and 0.001% pain of the process called building a boat. If you are in a hurry to
                                        Message 19 of 25 , Feb 27, 2009
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                                          On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 8:15 AM, my48cj2a <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                                          > So how do we go about getting plans? Does the moderator know? What if
                                          > we need help with them? I have to have it built in a certain amount of
                                          > time. I might have to go with something where the plans are easier to
                                          > get. When do the customers count?

                                          I know from experience that obtaining the plans is about 10% of the
                                          joy and 0.001% pain of the process called building a boat.

                                          If you are in a hurry to get a boat, building a boat is almost
                                          certainly not the fastest way (or cheapest way) to get a boat.

                                          Phil Bolger is 82 years old, and he may be doing something else at the
                                          moment. Though, historically he has a reputation of quick reply.
                                          Another thing that happens occasionally is that he gets a question via
                                          fax (but with no return fax #), or he gets a letter via postal mail
                                          (with no return address). Also, if your question is complex,
                                          sometimes he needs time to think of the answer. Or, if rude, he has
                                          the option of ignoring you.

                                          Buying plans gives you some right to ask questions about the design,
                                          and to a lesser extent to ask questions about the building process.
                                          But Bolger is a designer, not a builder, so questions about building
                                          boats are better directed towards experienced boat builders.

                                          If you are planning to build a boat, I strongly recommend building
                                          scale boat models first. That way you can figure out the details
                                          cheaply and quickly before embarking on the bigger and more expensive
                                          full size project. This could even start not, while waiting for the
                                          plans.
                                        • Gene Tehansky
                                          Anon, I just checked instantboats.com and biggest they have is Sneakeasy. ... so you would be sure not to miss it at the bottom of the message. Not many people
                                          Message 20 of 25 , Feb 27, 2009
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                                            Anon,
                                            I just checked instantboats.com and biggest they have is Sneakeasy.
                                            You will need to go to Bolger directly. I pasted the information here:
                                            > Bolger rules!!!
                                            > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                                            > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging
                                            > dead horses
                                            > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
                                            > posts
                                            > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                                            > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
                                            > 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                                            > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                            > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                            so you would be sure not to miss it at the bottom of the message.
                                            Not many people scroll down there...

                                            Mail has worked best for me although that gets lost also. He may be
                                            spry but he ain't young...

                                            Sincerely,
                                            Gene T.


                                            On 27 Feb, 2009, at 11:15 AM, my48cj2a wrote:

                                            > So how do we go about getting plans? Does the moderator know? What if
                                            > we need help with them? I have to have it built in a certain amount of
                                            > time. I might have to go with something where the plans are easier to
                                            > get. When do the customers count?
                                            >
                                            > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Ben" <ben_2_go@...> wrote:
                                            > >
                                            > > I tried back in fall and couldn't get them.I also wrote them and
                                            > never
                                            > > had a return response.I was looking at the Tenny as well.
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "my48cj2a" <my48cj2a@> wrote:
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Is Bolgers Office open this time of year? I have faxed them for
                                            > three
                                            > > > days and have not gotten a response. Is there other places to buy
                                            > the
                                            > > > plans?
                                            > > >
                                            > > >
                                            > >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >



                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • my48cj2a
                                            I am not trying to sound rude. If I did offend I am sorry. That was not the intention. I am to used to my vendors jumping at the chance to sell a product
                                            Message 21 of 25 , Feb 27, 2009
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                                              I am not trying to sound rude. If I did offend I am sorry. That was
                                              not the intention. I am to used to my vendors jumping at the chance
                                              to sell a product during the hard times now. I am a fabricator I run
                                              with strict guidelines at my shop. My job is to get the job done now.
                                              That is why I am still in buisness and the others around me are
                                              folding up. I have to set aside time for my stuff between jobs. That
                                              time is on the way. I have to do something now or wait another year
                                              to get started. The other gentleman said he has been waiting since
                                              last fall for info.I left a fax number and 2 seperate e-mails. I
                                              can't bring myself to just send money without any information.Plus I
                                              do not know how much or what I get with the plans. Everything is one
                                              big question mark right now.



                                              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              > On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 8:15 AM, my48cj2a <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                                              > > So how do we go about getting plans? Does the moderator know?
                                              What if
                                              > > we need help with them? I have to have it built in a certain
                                              amount of
                                              > > time. I might have to go with something where the plans are
                                              easier to
                                              > > get. When do the customers count?
                                              >
                                              > I know from experience that obtaining the plans is about 10% of the
                                              > joy and 0.001% pain of the process called building a boat.
                                              >
                                              > If you are in a hurry to get a boat, building a boat is almost
                                              > certainly not the fastest way (or cheapest way) to get a boat.
                                              >
                                              > Phil Bolger is 82 years old, and he may be doing something else at
                                              the
                                              > moment. Though, historically he has a reputation of quick reply.
                                              > Another thing that happens occasionally is that he gets a question
                                              via
                                              > fax (but with no return fax #), or he gets a letter via postal mail
                                              > (with no return address). Also, if your question is complex,
                                              > sometimes he needs time to think of the answer. Or, if rude, he has
                                              > the option of ignoring you.
                                              >
                                              > Buying plans gives you some right to ask questions about the design,
                                              > and to a lesser extent to ask questions about the building process.
                                              > But Bolger is a designer, not a builder, so questions about building
                                              > boats are better directed towards experienced boat builders.
                                              >
                                              > If you are planning to build a boat, I strongly recommend building
                                              > scale boat models first. That way you can figure out the details
                                              > cheaply and quickly before embarking on the bigger and more
                                              expensive
                                              > full size project. This could even start not, while waiting for the
                                              > plans.
                                              >
                                            • Bruce Hallman
                                              ... Fair enough. If you sent Phil Bolger 2 emails, don t hold your breath, as I don t think he uses email. Bolger doesn t really fit into a standard
                                              Message 22 of 25 , Feb 27, 2009
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                                                On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 1:17 PM, my48cj2a <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > I am not trying to sound rude. If I did offend I am sorry. That was
                                                > not the intention. I am to used to my vendors jumping at the chance
                                                > to sell a product during the hard times now. I am a fabricator I run
                                                > with strict guidelines at my shop. My job is to get the job done now.
                                                > That is why I am still in buisness and the others around me are
                                                > folding up. I have to set aside time for my stuff between jobs. That
                                                > time is on the way. I have to do something now or wait another year
                                                > to get started. The other gentleman said he has been waiting since
                                                > last fall for info.I left a fax number and 2 seperate e-mails. I
                                                > can't bring myself to just send money without any information.Plus I
                                                > do not know how much or what I get with the plans. Everything is one
                                                > big question mark right now.


                                                Fair enough. If you sent Phil Bolger 2 emails, don't hold your
                                                breath, as I don't think he uses email. Bolger doesn't really fit
                                                into a standard "vendor" model.

                                                It also is true that at least two people have been waiting years for
                                                commissioned designs, which is a shame of course. Commissions involve
                                                creativity, and sometimes finding the creative spark doesn't come
                                                easy. Especially if you are 82 years old making decisions about too
                                                many things to do and too little time to do it. I can see both sides
                                                of the issue, the buyers and the designers.

                                                If you have access to a library, the out of print 1980 book by Phil
                                                Bolger "Different Boats" has a chapter on the Tennessee design, which
                                                includes reduced sized images of the plans. ISBN 0-87742-134-X.
                                                Indeed, there is enough information shown in that book to build the
                                                boat.
                                              • gbship
                                                Was just relistening to the interview with Bolger from last fall, including the part that hasn t been posted on furledsails.com yet. He acknowledged they are
                                                Message 23 of 25 , Feb 28, 2009
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                                                  Was just relistening to the interview with Bolger from last fall,
                                                  including the part that hasn't been posted on furledsails.com yet. He
                                                  acknowledged they are sometimes tardy in responding to
                                                  correspondence, especially if they are travelling or caught up in
                                                  something else. There apparently is a rather thick stack of
                                                  correspondence from past years (I suspect from when they were tied up
                                                  with the Navy project) that he said will never be answered because
                                                  there isn't time. But he said they were keeping up with the current
                                                  contacts except for delays from attending conferences, etc. I
                                                  wouldn't count on a response to e-mail; I think they have it but may
                                                  only rarely look at it. The preferred method of contact is a fax,
                                                  with a promiment return fax number included. Apparently they get a
                                                  fair amount of correspondence without adequate return contact
                                                  information included. Don't count on the automatic return number that
                                                  most fax machines include; I'm not sure theirs does that and Bolger
                                                  was quite insistent about being redundant with contact information.
                                                  (This is not a new phenomenon. When I first wrote him more 25 years
                                                  about about doing what became design #459, I didn't hear anything
                                                  back, having relied on the return address on the envelope as
                                                  sufficient. I was about ready to buy another design when I wrote
                                                  again, and got a very quick reply expressing interest in the project,
                                                  saying he had lost my address, and including a mild admonition to be
                                                  more repetitive with contact information.)

                                                  Their priority in replying is to favor those who inquire about a
                                                  specific design or a query on whether one of Bolger's existing
                                                  designs will meet a certain set of requirements. It also helps if
                                                  there's an indication that the boat will be built, and not just an
                                                  idle inquiry about some feature or nuance. Phil and Susanne are not
                                                  accepting any new design commissions at the moment, and may not
                                                  respond to an inquiry for one; at least that's the impression I got.

                                                  If you sent an inquiry and didn't hear back, or sent several over a
                                                  short period, my advice is to wait a week or so and try again. You
                                                  may have caught them out of town. They are certainly interested in
                                                  selling from Bolger's extensive catalog of existing designs.

                                                  Gary

                                                  P.S. I think Bolger is 81, not 82. My recollection is his birthday
                                                  was in November 1927. In the interview, done in early October, he
                                                  referred to himself as 80 . . .


                                                  --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@...> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 1:17 PM, my48cj2a <my48cj2a@...> wrote:
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > I am not trying to sound rude. If I did offend I am sorry. That
                                                  was
                                                  > > not the intention. I am to used to my vendors jumping at the
                                                  chance
                                                  > > to sell a product during the hard times now. I am a fabricator I
                                                  run
                                                  > > with strict guidelines at my shop. My job is to get the job done
                                                  now.
                                                  > > That is why I am still in buisness and the others around me are
                                                  > > folding up. I have to set aside time for my stuff between jobs.
                                                  That
                                                  > > time is on the way. I have to do something now or wait another
                                                  year
                                                  > > to get started. The other gentleman said he has been waiting since
                                                  > > last fall for info.I left a fax number and 2 seperate e-mails. I
                                                  > > can't bring myself to just send money without any
                                                  information.Plus I
                                                  > > do not know how much or what I get with the plans. Everything is
                                                  one
                                                  > > big question mark right now.
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > Fair enough. If you sent Phil Bolger 2 emails, don't hold your
                                                  > breath, as I don't think he uses email. Bolger doesn't really fit
                                                  > into a standard "vendor" model.
                                                  >
                                                  > It also is true that at least two people have been waiting years
                                                  for
                                                  > commissioned designs, which is a shame of course. Commissions
                                                  involve
                                                  > creativity, and sometimes finding the creative spark doesn't come
                                                  > easy. Especially if you are 82 years old making decisions about too
                                                  > many things to do and too little time to do it. I can see both
                                                  sides
                                                  > of the issue, the buyers and the designers.
                                                  >
                                                  > If you have access to a library, the out of print 1980 book by Phil
                                                  > Bolger "Different Boats" has a chapter on the Tennessee design,
                                                  which
                                                  > includes reduced sized images of the plans. ISBN 0-87742-134-X.
                                                  > Indeed, there is enough information shown in that book to build the
                                                  > boat.
                                                  >
                                                • stephen neal
                                                  Write to him snail mail. Be brief and clear, put your return info in the letter. My experience has been that he always responds.
                                                  Message 24 of 25 , Mar 3, 2009
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                                                    Write to him snail mail. Be brief and clear, put your return info in the letter.
                                                    My experience has been that he always responds.
                                                  • David Darnell
                                                    Duck Works Mundoo River cruiser was originally based on the Tennessee.
                                                    Message 25 of 25 , Mar 4, 2009
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                                                      Duck Works Mundoo River cruiser was originally based on the Tennessee.

                                                      http://www.duckflatwoodenboats.com/mainpages/mundoo.php?PHPSESSID=5a2168fb42f2ef64899db8011ff61761
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