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Design 613, Paddling Skiff

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  • Bruce Hallman
    I was just looking at my old pile of MAIB s (15Mar94) and discovered a classic Bolger Instant-Boat design with which I was not familiar. 7 6 by 2 0 , a
    Message 1 of 8 , Aug 2, 2008
      I was just looking at my old pile of MAIB's (15Mar94) and discovered a
      'classic' Bolger Instant-Boat design with which I was not familiar.
      7'6" by 2'0", a simple "Paddling Skiff" canoe like boat, buildable in
      a weekend, the smallest in the Advanced Sharpie series I think. Made
      out of about 1 and a half sheets of 1/4" plywood, weighing about 40
      lbs. The waterline shown in the isometric is 200lbs.

      http://www.flickr.com/photos/hallman/2724590489/
    • Don Schultz
      Bolger has done scaled down versions to test a theory. Examples are Bee, the forerunner to Hawkeye, Microtrawler, and retriever. Also Eeek!, ahead of the AS
      Message 2 of 8 , Aug 2, 2008
        Bolger has done scaled down versions to test a theory. Examples are Bee,
        the forerunner to Hawkeye, Microtrawler, and retriever. Also Eeek!, ahead
        of the AS series, and a Brick with a flooded box keel, the name/number of
        which I've forgotten.

        They really weren't intended to be practical designs with a large following
        IE, Micro, or Sneakeasy

        Don't know the timing of this design, but I wonder if was intended to test a
        design.

        Don Schultz

        "If you don't know where you're going, you'll end up somewhere else." Yogi
        Berra


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Bruce Hallman
        ... Quoting PCB from the very brief write up in MAIB: Dr. Nathan asked me if I had a design easy and quick to build, for a couple of small children to play
        Message 3 of 8 , Aug 2, 2008
          > Don't know the timing of this design, but I wonder if was intended to test a
          > design.
          >
          > Don Schultz

          Quoting PCB from the very brief write up in MAIB: "Dr. Nathan asked
          me if I had a design easy and quick to build, for a couple of small
          children to play with. I didn't have quite what he had in mind, but I
          thought I could do it quickly if he could work from a rather informal
          plan. The design was done on a sheet of typewriter paper in 3 1/2
          hours...I hope he gets it done before the youngsters outgrow it..."

          Design 613 is a relatively high number I think, for instance, Advanced
          Sharpie 29 is design number 547.
        • Kenneth Grome
          The transom is below the waterline so it will drag when paddled, yet the boat still has a lot of rocker so it cannot benefit from having a straighter bottom
          Message 4 of 8 , Aug 2, 2008
            The transom is below the waterline so it will drag when
            paddled, yet the boat still has a lot of rocker so it
            cannot benefit from having a straighter bottom that is
            often easier to propel.

            In another forum some of us were debating the value of
            designing with more rocker (in an effort to get the transom
            above the waterline) vs. keeping the bottom straighter for
            easier propulsion.

            This trade-off makes me wonder if it actually makes sense to
            add enough rocker to get the transom completely out of the
            water? Obviously Bolger doesn't think so in this case ...

            Sincerely,
            Ken Grome
            Bagacay Boatworks
            www.bagacayboatworks.com






            > I was just looking at my old pile of MAIB's (15Mar94) and
            > discovered a 'classic' Bolger Instant-Boat design with
            > which I was not familiar. 7'6" by 2'0", a simple
            > "Paddling Skiff" canoe like boat, buildable in a weekend,
            > the smallest in the Advanced Sharpie series I think.
            > Made out of about 1 and a half sheets of 1/4" plywood,
            > weighing about 40 lbs. The waterline shown in the
            > isometric is 200lbs.
            >
            > http://www.flickr.com/photos/hallman/2724590489/
          • Giuliano Girometta
            Hi Ken, On which forum were such discussions? I will be very interested to go there and read such different opinions. As my personal opinion, by looking at
            Message 5 of 8 , Aug 2, 2008
              Hi Ken,
              On which forum were such discussions?
              I will be very interested to go there and read such different opinions.
              As my personal opinion, by looking at different classic hull shapes I found that the most logic shape is the way how Atkin was thinking. A deep v shaped stem and then a straight line from about 1/4 or 2/3 of the lenght from the stem to the transom that is just at the W.L..
              If you can not tell about other forums on this one please send message directly to me.
              ggboat1@...
               
              Giuliano

              --- On Sun, 8/3/08, Kenneth Grome <bagacayboatworks@...> wrote:

              From: Kenneth Grome <bagacayboatworks@...>
              Subject: Re: [bolger] Design 613, Paddling Skiff
              To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Sunday, August 3, 2008, 3:09 AM






              The transom is below the waterline so it will drag when
              paddled, yet the boat still has a lot of rocker so it
              cannot benefit from having a straighter bottom that is
              often easier to propel.

              In another forum some of us were debating the value of
              designing with more rocker (in an effort to get the transom
              above the waterline) vs. keeping the bottom straighter for
              easier propulsion.

              This trade-off makes me wonder if it actually makes sense to
              add enough rocker to get the transom completely out of the
              water? Obviously Bolger doesn't think so in this case ...

              Sincerely,
              Ken Grome
              Bagacay Boatworks
              www.bagacayboatwork s.com

              > I was just looking at my old pile of MAIB's (15Mar94) and
              > discovered a 'classic' Bolger Instant-Boat design with
              > which I was not familiar. 7'6" by 2'0", a simple
              > "Paddling Skiff" canoe like boat, buildable in a weekend,
              > the smallest in the Advanced Sharpie series I think.
              > Made out of about 1 and a half sheets of 1/4" plywood,
              > weighing about 40 lbs. The waterline shown in the
              > isometric is 200lbs.
              >
              > http://www.flickr com/photos/ hallman/27245904 89/


















              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Doug Pollard
              ON my boat Wolftrap, Bolger seemed to think that that the bottom unstead iof being v d with deadrise offered less drag if that vee was rolled up in a curve. I
              Message 6 of 8 , Aug 3, 2008
                ON my boat Wolftrap, Bolger seemed to think that that the bottom unstead
                iof being v'd with deadrise offered less drag if that vee was rolled up
                in a curve. I guess that made the amount of transom in the water very
                small. The amount of rocker was minamal. being only a few inches in 26ft.

                Doug


                Kenneth Grome wrote:
                >
                > The transom is below the waterline so it will drag when
                > paddled, yet the boat still has a lot of rocker so it
                > cannot benefit from having a straighter bottom that is
                > often easier to propel.
                >
                > In another forum some of us were debating the value of
                > designing with more rocker (in an effort to get the transom
                > above the waterline) vs. keeping the bottom straighter for
                > easier propulsion.
                >
                > This trade-off makes me wonder if it actually makes sense to
                > add enough rocker to get the transom completely out of the
                > water? Obviously Bolger doesn't think so in this case ...
                >
                > Sincerely,
                > Ken Grome
                > Bagacay Boatworks
                > www.bagacayboatworks.com
                >
                > > I was just looking at my old pile of MAIB's (15Mar94) and
                > > discovered a 'classic' Bolger Instant-Boat design with
                > > which I was not familiar. 7'6" by 2'0", a simple
                > > "Paddling Skiff" canoe like boat, buildable in a weekend,
                > > the smallest in the Advanced Sharpie series I think.
                > > Made out of about 1 and a half sheets of 1/4" plywood,
                > > weighing about 40 lbs. The waterline shown in the
                > > isometric is 200lbs.
                > >
                > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/hallman/2724590489/
                > <http://www.flickr.com/photos/hallman/2724590489/>
                >
                >
              • Bruce Hallman
                ... Actually, Bolger s waterline is drawn for two children, at 160 lbs. I modeled it in FreeShip because I wanted to get a better visualization of the 3D
                Message 7 of 8 , Aug 3, 2008
                  > This trade-off makes me wonder if it actually makes sense to
                  > add enough rocker to get the transom completely out of the
                  > water? Obviously Bolger doesn't think so in this case ...

                  Actually, Bolger's waterline is drawn for two children, at 160 lbs. I
                  modeled it in FreeShip because I wanted to get a better visualization
                  of the 3D shape of the hull and also because I was trying to evaluate
                  what it would be like if the boat was floating me personally, hence
                  the 200 pound waterline. It *is* a very small boat, and dragging a
                  inch or two of the transom would not cause a crisis I think.
                • graeme19121984
                  This design reminds of the divergent opinions on Eeek! and the 12 Pirogue (Peero) as to what might be considered good and what might be not much of a boat, &
                  Message 8 of 8 , Aug 6, 2008
                    This design reminds of the divergent opinions on Eeek! and the 12'
                    Pirogue (Peero) as to what might be considered good and what might be
                    not much of a boat, & etc. Yes, sinking the transom won't apply to
                    Eeek!, which with its pointy stern can accept a wide range of loading,
                    but that isn't the point - clearly Paddling Skiff has a specific load
                    in mind. More to the point is height. I'm not exactly sure of the
                    topsides height for Padddling Skiff, but from Bruce's depiction it
                    would seem greater than that of Peero.

                    A large part in PCB at one point saying that Peero was better than
                    Eeek! was, relatively, the quite low height of the sides that allowed
                    for acceptable use of a double paddle in Peero, but not in Eeek!

                    As Paddling Skiff was designed for paddling by small, quickly out-
                    growing children, the query arises as to why the topsides height was
                    not as low as that of Peero; nor as meant for little kids, then
                    relatively lower again?

                    Graeme


                    --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > This trade-off makes me wonder if it actually makes sense to
                    > > add enough rocker to get the transom completely out of the
                    > > water? Obviously Bolger doesn't think so in this case ...
                    >
                    > Actually, Bolger's waterline is drawn for two children, at 160 lbs. I
                    > modeled it in FreeShip because I wanted to get a better visualization
                    > of the 3D shape of the hull and also because I was trying to evaluate
                    > what it would be like if the boat was floating me personally, hence
                    > the 200 pound waterline. It *is* a very small boat, and dragging a
                    > inch or two of the transom would not cause a crisis I think.
                    >
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