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hull fairing sequence

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  • Bruce Erney
    I m getting a hull ready for glass and paint, using peel ply to save sanding. I am longboarding the hull and can t decide wether to fair with filler then glass
    Message 1 of 23 , Jun 1 5:42 AM
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      I'm getting a hull ready for glass and paint, using peel ply to save
      sanding. I am longboarding the hull and can't decide wether to fair
      with filler then glass or glass then fair with microlight filler.
      This is so much fun, I really enjoy the work and the results.
      Thanks,
      Bruce in NJ
    • Douglas Pollard
      Here is a suggestion based on my own experience. It is really hard to see the imperfections in the hull with the boat inside a shed and it s equally hard to
      Message 2 of 23 , Jun 1 8:26 AM
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        Here is a suggestion based on my own experience. It is really hard to
        see the imperfections in the hull with the boat inside a shed and it's
        equally hard to feel any long gentle waves there. If before you paint
        you take her out into the bright sunlight you may be surprised just how
        unfair she is. With diligence and a long board you will likely get it
        all. The problem comes when say that is pretty good but not perfect then
        take it outside and find that it's much worse than you thought. I
        recently built my Elver in a plastic covered bow shed. Nice place to
        work, but nearly impossible to see imperfections because there are
        absolutely no shadows at all. This thing of no shadows though is
        wonderful when you are assembling a boat, or are underneath of it.

        Doug


        Bruce Erney wrote:
        >
        > I'm getting a hull ready for glass and paint, using peel ply to save
        > sanding. I am longboarding the hull and can't decide wether to fair
        > with filler then glass or glass then fair with microlight filler.
        > This is so much fun, I really enjoy the work and the results.
        > Thanks,
        > Bruce in NJ
        >
        >
      • echo172@comcast.net
        I m building outside in sunlight. I cover it over for rain and night. My preference is to sand, epoxy/glass the hull, fill the waves, sand, epoxy last coat,
        Message 3 of 23 , Jun 1 9:44 AM
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          I'm building outside in sunlight. I cover it over for rain and night.
          My preference is to sand, epoxy/glass the hull, fill the waves, sand, epoxy last coat, sand then primer and paint. Flip and do the inside same way. I'm just not certain about microlight filler, West 410, because it seems soft when cured. I think it might be best between coats rather than under the cloth.


          -------------- Original message ----------------------
          From: Douglas Pollard <Dougpol1@...>
          > Here is a suggestion based on my own experience. It is really hard to
          > see the imperfections in the hull with the boat inside a shed and it's
          > equally hard to feel any long gentle waves there. If before you paint
          > you take her out into the bright sunlight you may be surprised just how
          > unfair she is. With diligence and a long board you will likely get it
          > all. The problem comes when say that is pretty good but not perfect then
          > take it outside and find that it's much worse than you thought. I
          > recently built my Elver in a plastic covered bow shed. Nice place to
          > work, but nearly impossible to see imperfections because there are
          > absolutely no shadows at all. This thing of no shadows though is
          > wonderful when you are assembling a boat, or are underneath of it.
          >
          > Doug
          >
          >
          > Bruce Erney wrote:
          > >
          > > I'm getting a hull ready for glass and paint, using peel ply to save
          > > sanding. I am longboarding the hull and can't decide wether to fair
          > > with filler then glass or glass then fair with microlight filler.
          > > This is so much fun, I really enjoy the work and the results.
          > > Thanks,
          > > Bruce in NJ
          > >
          > >
          >




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Kristine Bennett
          Bruce when I was working at Uniflite I worked on the tooling shop for a bit and the rules there were get the plug as close to what they wanted before the skin
          Message 4 of 23 , Jun 1 9:56 AM
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            Bruce when I was working at Uniflite I worked on the tooling shop for a bit and the rules there were get the plug as close to what they wanted before the skin coat was put on and faired.

            I would get the hull as fair as you can before glassing it. But you will still have a few places to fair after you have glassed it anyway.

            I have spent a few hours with a long board in my hands.... That thing is hard on the shoulders!

            Blessings Krissie

            Bruce Erney <echo172@...> wrote: I'm getting a hull ready for glass and paint, using peel ply to save
            sanding. I am longboarding the hull and can't decide wether to fair
            with filler then glass or glass then fair with microlight filler.
            This is so much fun, I really enjoy the work and the results.
            Thanks,
            Bruce in NJ


            _





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • echo172@comcast.net
            That s what I m going to do. I checked West Systems site and they suggest the same thing. I guess I m anxious to hit the water and looking for a short cut. I
            Message 5 of 23 , Jun 1 11:05 AM
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              That's what I'm going to do. I checked West Systems site and they suggest the same thing. I guess I'm anxious to hit the water and looking for a short cut. I started this May 1st and thought a few weeks tops to complete. It's rained here more than ever this month. I guess I have about 2 weeks of working days into it so it's not that bad but never again without a shelter.
              Thanks,
              Bruce

              -------------- Original message ----------------------
              From: Kristine Bennett <femmpaws@...>
              > Bruce when I was working at Uniflite I worked on the tooling shop for a bit and
              > the rules there were get the plug as close to what they wanted before the skin
              > coat was put on and faired.
              >
              > I would get the hull as fair as you can before glassing it. But you will still
              > have a few places to fair after you have glassed it anyway.
              >
              > I have spent a few hours with a long board in my hands.... That thing is hard on
              > the shoulders!
              >
              > Blessings Krissie



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • saillips
              Sorry for the non-Bolger references, but here are 2 examples of using stiff plastic film to achieve a significant savings in finishing labor and time. One is a
              Message 6 of 23 , Jun 1 12:24 PM
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                Sorry for the non-Bolger references, but here are 2 examples of using
                stiff plastic film to achieve a significant savings in finishing labor
                and time. One is a web site called Electric boat consruction. Scroll
                about halfway down to the part about finishing the hull.

                http://www.pbase.com/dr_dichro/electric_boat


                The other from Garth Batista who built a 32' boat (I think ) by Jim
                Michalak, and it was on Jim's news letter archives.This is a copy of a
                message he posted to this group about where to locate the film.

                -Hi Harry --

                Here's what John Blazy has posted on his website
                (http://www.pbase.com/dr_dichro/electric_boat):

                ATTENTION ALL WHO HAVE BEEN DYING TO KNOW WHERE I GET .030" POLYESTER
                FILM: ANY PLASTICS DISTRIBUTOR LIKE GE POLYMERSHAPES (FORMERLY
                CADILLAC PLASTICS), CURBELL, OR LOCAL SHEET/FILM PLASTICS SUPPLIERS IN
                YOUR AREA - USE THE YELLOW PAGES. TRY SIGNAGE / GRAPHICS / LAMINATORS
                TOO. OTHER FILMS LIKE LEXAN IN .020 - .030 SHOULD WORK AS WELL, EVEN
                WITH THE PRE-MASKING CLING FILM LEFT ON, TO ENSURE REMOVAL. AND YES,
                YOU HAVE TO SCARF PIECES FOR LONGER LENGTHS UNLESS YOU CAN GET ROLL
                STOCK. IT SCARFS EASILY WITH SOLVENT CEMENT.

                Now that we've brought the subject up and my memory has been slowly
                rewarmed like a TV dinner from the back of the freezer, I recall that
                what I bought from GE Polyshapes was 20 mil Lexan. It came in a roll,
                which was very essential for doing big panels -- you can't roll the
                bubbles out after it's on that big an area, so you roll them out as
                you go.

                I think it was about $200 for the 40' x 4' roll. Not cheap, but in
                doing a big boat, I was able to hide it from my accountant (that is,
                the side of my brain atempting to actually keep costs under control .
                . . ).

                I cut off 8' of it in 6 sections sized 16" x 4' for making perfectly
                smooth glass butt joints, sandwiched between MDO pieces of the same
                size and screwed down -- with the screw holes filled in later. And the
                remaining 32' was just right for four ply sheets end-to-end.

                The really cool thing about this film technique is that you can have
                varying layers of fiberglass -- like overlapping pieces, or tape
                running under cloth, or extra scraps laid in at random -- and once the
                film goes over it, it all comes out glass smooth on the surface. You
                can do things like running an extra tape down the middle of a side
                panel, for instance, to reinforce it where it will be farthest from
                any framing -- but it'll be completely undetectable, with no fairing, etc.

                Good luck finding film that'll work for you. What are you building?

                Garth


                I can't find the original article by Garth, which is too bad because
                the pictures tell the story. But Garth built the full length panels
                for his boat,laid them out on a flat floor, rolled out the cloth,
                squeegeed and spread the epoxy, then he proceeded to take a roll of
                this stiff film, and starting at one end unroll it over the panel
                while applying his body weight which pushed all the air and bubbles
                out ahead of the roll. He left the film on until the next day when it
                had cured , peeled the film to reveal a mirror finish.
                David
              • Harry James
                My father a Master Shipwright, used a low angle light to profile the imperfections, I find that works as well or better than taking outside. You will find high
                Message 7 of 23 , Jun 1 3:03 PM
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                  My father a Master Shipwright, used a low angle light to profile the
                  imperfections, I find that works as well or better than taking outside.
                  You will find high quality sheet rocker/tapers do the same thing.

                  HJ

                  Douglas Pollard wrote:
                  > Here is a suggestion based on my own experience. It is really hard to
                  > see the imperfections in the hull with the boat inside a shed and it's
                  > equally hard to feel any long gentle waves there. If before you paint
                  > you take her out into the bright sunlight you may be surprised just how
                  > unfair she is. With diligence and a long board you will likely get it
                  > all. The problem comes when say that is pretty good but not perfect then
                  > take it outside and find that it's much worse than you thought. I
                  > recently built my Elver in a plastic covered bow shed. Nice place to
                  > work, but nearly impossible to see imperfections because there are
                  > absolutely no shadows at all. This thing of no shadows though is
                  > wonderful when you are assembling a boat, or are underneath of it.
                  >
                  > Doug
                  >
                  >
                  > Bruce Erney wrote:
                  >
                  >> I'm getting a hull ready for glass and paint, using peel ply to save
                  >> sanding. I am longboarding the hull and can't decide wether to fair
                  >> with filler then glass or glass then fair with microlight filler.
                  >> This is so much fun, I really enjoy the work and the results.
                  >> Thanks,
                  >> Bruce in NJ
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------
                  >
                  > Bolger rules!!!
                  > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                  > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                  > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                  > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                  > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                  > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                • .Randy Powell
                  I have faired many a kayak and we most always fair first then glass, you end up with a greater chance of a uniform surface coating and the chance of cutting
                  Message 8 of 23 , Jun 1 5:56 PM
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                    I have faired many a kayak and we most always fair first then glass, you end up with a greater chance of a uniform surface coating and the chance of cutting through the glass by sanding is greatly minimized and you just focas on filling the glass weave. If you have a goodly sized commpressor try using an inline board sander like one found in an autobody shop, I love them, fast and kinder on your shoulders.
                    Randy

                    --- On Sun, 6/1/08, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:

                    From: Harry James <welshman@...>
                    Subject: Re: [bolger] hull fairing sequence
                    To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                    Received: Sunday, June 1, 2008, 10:03 PM






                    My father a Master Shipwright, used a low angle light to profile the
                    imperfections, I find that works as well or better than taking outside.
                    You will find high quality sheet rocker/tapers do the same thing.

                    HJ

                    Douglas Pollard wrote:
                    > Here is a suggestion based on my own experience. It is really hard to
                    > see the imperfections in the hull with the boat inside a shed and it's
                    > equally hard to feel any long gentle waves there. If before you paint
                    > you take her out into the bright sunlight you may be surprised just how
                    > unfair she is. With diligence and a long board you will likely get it
                    > all. The problem comes when say that is pretty good but not perfect then
                    > take it outside and find that it's much worse than you thought. I
                    > recently built my Elver in a plastic covered bow shed. Nice place to
                    > work, but nearly impossible to see imperfections because there are
                    > absolutely no shadows at all. This thing of no shadows though is
                    > wonderful when you are assembling a boat, or are underneath of it.
                    >
                    > Doug
                    >
                    >
                    > Bruce Erney wrote:
                    >
                    >> I'm getting a hull ready for glass and paint, using peel ply to save
                    >> sanding. I am longboarding the hull and can't decide wether to fair
                    >> with filler then glass or glass then fair with microlight filler.
                    >> This is so much fun, I really enjoy the work and the results.
                    >> Thanks,
                    >> Bruce in NJ
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------ --------- --------- ------
                    >
                    > Bolger rules!!!
                    > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                    > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                    > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                    > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                    > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                    > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@ yahoogroups. com
                    > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_ lounge-subscribe @yahoogroups. com Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >















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