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Building a Long Dory

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  • Don
    Hi everyone. I just joined this group and this is my first post. I am planning on building Bolger s long dory using plans from Payson s latest book. I have a
    Message 1 of 23 , Oct 1, 2007
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      Hi everyone. I just joined this group and this is my first post. I am
      planning on building Bolger's long dory using plans from Payson's
      latest book. I have a couple of questions that I hope someone can
      answer. I am considering using inside chine logs instead of stitch-and-
      tape. I have nothing against epoxy but I prefer to work with wood. Is
      there a downside to doing this? I think I would have to spring the
      logs into place after the sides were bent around the frames. Would
      there be any impact on boat longevity, given reasonable storage and
      maintenance?
      Any other tips/suggestions before I get started?

      Thanks, Don
    • GarthAB
      Hi Don -- Welcome to the group! Care to comment on water ballast? (Just kidding.) I ve heard that interior chine logs can trap dirt and moisture in the sharp
      Message 2 of 23 , Oct 1, 2007
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        Hi Don --

        Welcome to the group! Care to comment on water ballast? (Just kidding.)

        I've heard that interior chine logs can trap dirt and moisture in the
        sharp angles -- between the bottom and the chine long, and between the
        chine log and the side -- which might hasten rot. So even though
        you're not building S&G, you might want to run a thin fillet of
        thickened epoxy down those joints, to seal them, and shed the water
        and dirt.

        Garth
        (who has never built an interior chine log boat, and whose advice
        should be taken as speculative hearsay)



        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Don" <don.froese@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi everyone. I just joined this group and this is my first post. I am
        > planning on building Bolger's long dory using plans from Payson's
        > latest book. I have a couple of questions that I hope someone can
        > answer. I am considering using inside chine logs instead of stitch-and-
        > tape. I have nothing against epoxy but I prefer to work with wood. Is
        > there a downside to doing this? I think I would have to spring the
        > logs into place after the sides were bent around the frames. Would
        > there be any impact on boat longevity, given reasonable storage and
        > maintenance?
        > Any other tips/suggestions before I get started?
        >
        > Thanks, Don
        >
      • Bruce Hallman
        ... I have built more that a dozen Bolger boats, and my single most common regret is when I try to improve the plans. More often than not, my
        Message 3 of 23 , Oct 1, 2007
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          On 10/1/07, Don <don.froese@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > Any other tips/suggestions before I get started?

          I have built more that a dozen Bolger boats, and my single most common
          'regret' is when I try to 'improve' the plans. More often than not,
          my 'improvement' actually turns out to be not an improvement plus
          costly and time consuming.

          This is especially true with the Bolger designs which have been vetted
          and checked for buildability by Dynamite Payson. The Payson/Bolger
          collaborations were all verified in detail as 'easy build' boats.

          With the Long Dory, I recommend building one first, exactly per plan.
          If you then see things that can be improved, build a second boat.
          (And, actually, I recommend building a quick paper scale model before
          proceeding full size in wood.)

          And, I suspect you have already seen John Kolb's website about his Long Dory

          http://www.kolbsadventures.com/long_dory_1.htm

          P.S.S., does anyone have a scan of that design? If I could see it I
          would create a Freeship isometric model of the hull shape.
        • John and Kathy Trussell
          I m sure that you will get an array of answers. Here s mine. The Long Dory is a development of the Glouster Gull or Light Dory. The original Light Dory was
          Message 4 of 23 , Oct 1, 2007
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            I'm sure that you will get an array of answers. Here's mine.

            The Long Dory is a development of the Glouster Gull or Light Dory. The original Light Dory was what I call framed plywood. In this instance, the Light Dory had a center frame and used a wood chine and gunwales. When Payson published expanded dimensions for the Light Dory planks, a number of people converted the design to stitch and glue. PCB's mastery of the "Instant Boat"/stitch and glue boat allowed him to develop Long Dory plans in stitch and glue.

            In stitch and glue construction, planks are cut to a pre determined (more or less depending on the builder), laced together using temporary frames/molds, and the joints are bonded with a fillet and fiberglass tape. (Epoxy is the standard now, but many boats have been successfully built using less expensive polyester resin.) The curves on the edges of the panels spring the panels into the boat's shape.

            The advantages of stitch and glue are 1) there is no need for lofting (though laying out the planks is a lot like lofting), 2) no building frame is required, 3) there is no complex beveling, 4) due to the gap filling capabilites of resin and thickener, precise fits are not needed and 5) the fiberglass chine produces a cleaner interior.

            If you are going for framed plywood on a Long Dory, I would suggest that you get a copy of H H Payson's book 'How to Build a Light Dory' and study it. (Books and plans are cheaper then building the boat.) You will have to set up a ladder frame with molds and you will have to bevel the bottom of the chine by hand. It is possible that the angle between the bottom and the sides is constant (in which case you can cut the bevel with a table saw), but I doubt it. I would also cut the panels a little over size and plane to precise shape after the panels were on the boat.

            In regard to rot, a boat with flared sides and in internal chine will have a water trap between the side plank and the top of the chine. A solution is to cut a bevel on the top of the chine so it won't trap water. Since you are usually not trying to attach anything to the top of the chine, the bevel can be cut on a table saw.

            So long as you don't fiddle too much with the shape and scantlings of the boat, I don't think there is a right or wrong way to build a boat. Plywood will wick water into the end grain and this will cause rot and/or delamination. Therefore, I go to great lengths to seal the end grain with epoxy and, where appropriate, tape. If this offends your woodworker's preference, think of it as part of the finishing process!

            Hope this helps. Have fun.

            JohnT
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Don
            To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 12:02 PM
            Subject: [bolger] Building a Long Dory


            Hi everyone. I just joined this group and this is my first post. I am
            planning on building Bolger's long dory using plans from Payson's
            latest book. I have a couple of questions that I hope someone can
            answer. I am considering using inside chine logs instead of stitch-and-
            tape. I have nothing against epoxy but I prefer to work with wood. Is
            there a downside to doing this? I think I would have to spring the
            logs into place after the sides were bent around the frames. Would
            there be any impact on boat longevity, given reasonable storage and
            maintenance?
            Any other tips/suggestions before I get started?

            Thanks, Don






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          • David
            Don - I have experience with a chine log version of the Long Light Dory. RiversWest, a local small boat group, taught a class in boatbuilding recently to a
            Message 5 of 23 , Oct 1, 2007
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              Don - I have experience with a chine log version of the Long Light
              Dory. RiversWest, a local small boat group, taught a class in
              boatbuilding recently to a group of "at risk" youth. I was one of the
              instructors. The lead instructor was Dan Pence, who's built several
              Bolger boats (and who recently won the Shipyard Raid in a
              skin-on-frame boat of his own design, Conjure. Take a bow Dan!). He
              decided - because of increased speed and less mess - to do chine logs.

              It's too soon to talk about longevity, but the building part presented
              no problems. I've built both stitch&goo boats, and screw & glue (chine
              log) boats. I've also used lots of epoxy in my architectural millwork
              business. It's marvelous stuff, but the more I do, the less I enjoy
              suiting up for epoxy work, and the messiness of the cleanup -
              especially if I have inexperienced helpers.

              Bottom line: I'd see no problem - given the comments above about
              collecting water - with going with a chine log (what I call screw & glue).

              Cheers,
              David Graybeal
              Portland, OR

              "Good judgment comes from experience. The most useful experience comes
              from bad judgment"

              ***********

              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Don" <don.froese@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hi everyone. I just joined this group and this is my first post. I am
              > planning on building Bolger's long dory using plans from Payson's
              > latest book. I have a couple of questions that I hope someone can
              > answer. I am considering using inside chine logs instead of stitch-and-
              > tape. I have nothing against epoxy but I prefer to work with wood. Is
              > there a downside to doing this? I think I would have to spring the
              > logs into place after the sides were bent around the frames. Would
              > there be any impact on boat longevity, given reasonable storage and
              > maintenance?
              > Any other tips/suggestions before I get started?
              >
              > Thanks, Don
            • Don
              Thanks for the informative replies everyone. David: Did you spring in the chine logs after the sides were attached to the frames and stem/stern, or did you set
              Message 6 of 23 , Oct 1, 2007
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                Thanks for the informative replies everyone.

                David: Did you spring in the chine logs after the sides were attached
                to the frames and stem/stern, or did you set up forms to hold the
                chine in place before bending on the side panels? Seems the former
                would work and should be faster and easier. This is what I would like
                to do on my boat.
                > >
                > > Thanks, Don
                >
              • donm172001
                The chine logs should not cause any longevity problems. Just turn the boat over when you are done rowing and any water that may have collected will run out,
                Message 7 of 23 , Oct 1, 2007
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                  The chine logs should not cause any longevity problems. Just turn the
                  boat over when you are done rowing and any water that may have
                  collected will run out, plus it will not collect rainwater. If the
                  boat is going to live outside, the proper way to store it is upside
                  down, just like a canoe.


                  --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "David" <arbordg@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Don - I have experience with a chine log version of the Long Light
                  > Dory. RiversWest, a local small boat group, taught a class in
                  > boatbuilding recently to a group of "at risk" youth. I was one of
                  the
                  > instructors. The lead instructor was Dan Pence, who's built several
                  > Bolger boats (and who recently won the Shipyard Raid in a
                  > skin-on-frame boat of his own design, Conjure. Take a bow Dan!). He
                  > decided - because of increased speed and less mess - to do chine
                  logs.
                  >
                  > It's too soon to talk about longevity, but the building part
                  presented
                  > no problems. I've built both stitch&goo boats, and screw & glue
                  (chine
                  > log) boats. I've also used lots of epoxy in my architectural
                  millwork
                  > business. It's marvelous stuff, but the more I do, the less I enjoy
                  > suiting up for epoxy work, and the messiness of the cleanup -
                  > especially if I have inexperienced helpers.
                  >
                  > Bottom line: I'd see no problem - given the comments above about
                  > collecting water - with going with a chine log (what I call screw &
                  glue).
                  >
                  > Cheers,
                  > David Graybeal
                  > Portland, OR
                  >
                  > "Good judgment comes from experience. The most useful experience
                  comes
                  > from bad judgment"
                  >
                  > ***********
                  >
                  > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Don" <don.froese@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Hi everyone. I just joined this group and this is my first post.
                  I am
                  > > planning on building Bolger's long dory using plans from Payson's
                  > > latest book. I have a couple of questions that I hope someone can
                  > > answer. I am considering using inside chine logs instead of
                  stitch-and-
                  > > tape. I have nothing against epoxy but I prefer to work with
                  wood. Is
                  > > there a downside to doing this? I think I would have to spring
                  the
                  > > logs into place after the sides were bent around the frames.
                  Would
                  > > there be any impact on boat longevity, given reasonable storage
                  and
                  > > maintenance?
                  > > Any other tips/suggestions before I get started?
                  > >
                  > > Thanks, Don
                  >
                • adventures_in_astrophotography
                  Hi Don, ... am ... and- ... Is ... and ... You ve read all the other posts by now and they all make good points. I would add that you might have to scarf the
                  Message 8 of 23 , Oct 3, 2007
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                    Hi Don,

                    > Hi everyone. I just joined this group and this is my first post. I
                    am
                    > planning on building Bolger's long dory using plans from Payson's
                    > latest book. I have a couple of questions that I hope someone can
                    > answer. I am considering using inside chine logs instead of stitch-
                    and-
                    > tape. I have nothing against epoxy but I prefer to work with wood.
                    Is
                    > there a downside to doing this? I think I would have to spring the
                    > logs into place after the sides were bent around the frames. Would
                    > there be any impact on boat longevity, given reasonable storage
                    and
                    > maintenance?
                    > Any other tips/suggestions before I get started?

                    You've read all the other posts by now and they all make good
                    points. I would add that you might have to scarf the chine logs on
                    the boat in order to get a good fit at the stem and tombstone.
                    However, it might be possible to fit the chine logs to the side
                    panels, stem, and tombstone prior to springing the sides around the
                    frames, as long as you cut the stem and tombstone side bevels
                    accurately first. The bottom (and top) bevel on the chine logs
                    should be constant, or close enough not to matter.

                    If I were doing it again, I don't think I'd use a chine log on this
                    design. The side flare is considerable, which means fasteners on
                    the bottom have to go into the log at a steep angle, too, requiring
                    more countersink depth if you leave them in, or more goop to fill if
                    you take them out. Are you going to tape the frames in or frame
                    them with lumber also? If the latter, you're starting to add some
                    real weight with both the logs and the frames, and I think that will
                    hurt the boat's performance to some degree, especially if rowing
                    solo. I'd keep it as light as possible - as drawn.

                    Ultimately, I don't see any advantage to chine logs unless you just
                    like how it looks - which is of course a perfectly justifiable
                    reason to do it!

                    Jon Kolb
                    www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
                  • Bruce Hallman
                    ... And the looks I like about the stretched light dory is the exaggerated fan tail , which I don t think is just an affectation. That fan tail would be
                    Message 9 of 23 , Oct 3, 2007
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                      On 10/3/07, adventures_in_astrophotography <jon@...> wrote:

                      > Ultimately, ...unless you just
                      > like how it looks - which is of
                      > course a perfectly justifiable
                      > reason to do it!


                      And 'the looks' I like about the stretched light dory is the
                      exaggerated 'fan tail', which I don't think is just an affectation.
                      That fan tail would be beneficial, I figure, navigating the surf where
                      I live.

                      http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=1476751709&size=o

                      This URL Shows my 'mind's eye' interpretation of the shape of a Long
                      Dory with the fan tail pulled out some more. The panel layout of the
                      sides fits nicely on 2 and 1/2 sheets of 1/4" plywood and the bottom
                      cuts from a 12' x 2' piece of 1/2" plywood. If you were careful, I
                      bet this 19ft 10in hull could weight less than 100 lbs.
                    • adventures_in_astrophotography
                      Hi Bruce, ... where ... Nicely done as usual. I ll wager that the original will be slightly faster than your rendering, thanks to the slightly longer
                      Message 10 of 23 , Oct 3, 2007
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                        Hi Bruce,

                        > And 'the looks' I like about the stretched light dory is the
                        > exaggerated 'fan tail', which I don't think is just an affectation.
                        > That fan tail would be beneficial, I figure, navigating the surf
                        where
                        > I live.
                        >
                        > http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=1476751709&size=o
                        >
                        > This URL Shows my 'mind's eye' interpretation of the shape of a Long
                        > Dory with the fan tail pulled out some more. The panel layout of the
                        > sides fits nicely on 2 and 1/2 sheets of 1/4" plywood and the bottom
                        > cuts from a 12' x 2' piece of 1/2" plywood. If you were careful, I
                        > bet this 19ft 10in hull could weight less than 100 lbs.

                        Nicely done as usual. I'll wager that the original will be slightly
                        faster than your rendering, thanks to the slightly longer waterline
                        length, but I like the looks of your version, too.

                        The bottom can be had from one sheet of 1/2" ply by laying out half of
                        the bottom from each end of the sheet, offsetting the centerline of
                        each piece by about 2'. Payson shows one way to do this in his book,
                        offsetting the two halves diagonally, but it's easier to use the
                        factory edges for the butt joint.

                        If you make the seat bearers removable, or eliminate them altogether
                        and sit on a box, and use lightweight wood for the gunwales, I don't
                        doubt you can keep the weight under 100 lbs. I should probably weigh
                        mine sometime, but it's certainly no trouble to row solo, as I have
                        put up to ten non-stop miles under her a few times.

                        It's good to see this design getting some interest thanks to Payson's
                        book. I'll just add that if you make the gunwales two courses of 3/4"
                        x 1-1/2" material as called for in the plans (perhaps without the
                        fancy shaping and bronze half oval called for), the hull is so stiff
                        that you can make the seat bearers removable, which has some
                        advantages. For example, I was able to make a second set that only
                        use the forward half of the hull, leaving the after half of the
                        boat "open" for my dog to spread out. Payson shows the seat bearers
                        as permanent structure and used only one strip of material for the
                        gunwales. He also put the oarlocks on the inside of the hull, which
                        will almost surely result in cross-handed rowing with 7' oars from all
                        seating positions.

                        Jon Kolb
                        www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
                      • Bruce Hallman
                        ... Off line, here in physically in my hands, I have made some paper scale models of this exaggerated long dory and a per plans Gloucester Gull. Comparing
                        Message 11 of 23 , Oct 3, 2007
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                          On 10/3/07, adventures_in_astrophotography <jon@...> wrote:
                          > I'll wager that the original will be slightly
                          > faster than your rendering, thanks to the slightly longer waterline
                          > length, but I like the looks of your version, too.

                          Off line, here in physically in my hands, I have made some paper scale
                          models of this exaggerated long dory and a 'per plans' Gloucester
                          Gull. Comparing the two: Most notable I see that mine has more
                          curvy-ness, in the bottom (as the GGull has nearly a flat bottom), and
                          also in the sheerline. Speed isn't everything, (considering that
                          boats are also 'sculptures' of a sort.) Big long swoopy sheerlines
                          are pretty.

                          What I am thinking of is a 'pretty' boat to launch through the surf
                          near my home, and the higher ends from that exaggerated curvature, I
                          think, might be an improvement. Plus, it needs to be light weight
                          enough to drag a hundred yards from the car to the water.
                        • Don
                          Thanks for the information Jon. Your point about the chine logs being heavier is a good one. I intend to tape in the frames and am now thinking I will tape the
                          Message 12 of 23 , Oct 3, 2007
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                            Thanks for the information Jon. Your point about the chine logs being
                            heavier is a good one. I intend to tape in the frames and am now
                            thinking I will tape the chines as well.

                            Here is another question for you: I have some sheets of very nice 3/8
                            marine Meranti ply in my shop. Do you think this would work for the
                            bottom if I added a couple of layers of 6-ox. glass/epoxy on the bottom?

                            Also, did you use butt-blocks or scarphs on the bottom panel?

                            Cheers,

                            Don
                          • adventures_in_astrophotography
                            ... You need a boat-barrow! I need to get a good photo of mine and post it, but basically it s a lightweight, almost flimsy A-frame made from two 1x4 cedar
                            Message 13 of 23 , Oct 4, 2007
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                              ...snip...
                              > Plus, it needs to be light weight
                              > enough to drag a hundred yards from the car to the water.

                              You need a boat-barrow! I need to get a good photo of mine and post
                              it, but basically it's a lightweight, almost flimsy A-frame made from
                              two 1x4 cedar boards with a couple of 1x4 cross pieces. At the apex
                              is a plywood fork that mounts a single wheelbarrow wheel and tire. I
                              use it to carry my Michalak Robote upside-down. Less than $50
                              invested, much less if you use scrap lumber.

                              The barrow with boat slides right into the back of the pickup, handle
                              end forward, with the bow and wheel hanging out from the tailgate. I
                              suppose it could even be car-topped. It's a 10-second operation to
                              unstrap it, slide it out of the bed, and start heading for the water.
                              100 yards is no trouble at all, and the big wheelbarrow tire handles
                              any terrain I've encountered. I'm planning a slightly beefier two-
                              wheel version for the Long Light Dory.

                              Jon Kolb
                              www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
                            • adventures_in_astrophotography
                              Hi Don, ... I don t know if the glass will add much, if any stiffness to the bottom panel, but it would sure add some abrasion resistance. If the bottom turns
                              Message 14 of 23 , Oct 4, 2007
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                                Hi Don,

                                ...snip...
                                > Here is another question for you: I have some sheets of very nice 3/8
                                > marine Meranti ply in my shop. Do you think this would work for the
                                > bottom if I added a couple of layers of 6-ox. glass/epoxy on the
                                > bottom?

                                I don't know if the glass will add much, if any stiffness to the
                                bottom panel, but it would sure add some abrasion resistance. If the
                                bottom turns out to be a little spongy when you step into the boat,
                                you can always add a stiff shoe or a layer of doorskin to the bottom.
                                If it were me, I'd go for it.

                                > Also, did you use butt-blocks or scarphs on the bottom panel?

                                I used butt blocks. Fast, easy, only have to do one side of the
                                panel. If you scarf, you should probably make sure you can get both
                                ends of the bottom panel out of one sheet before you do it.

                                Jon Kolb
                                www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
                              • Bruce Hallman
                                ... Perhaps, but it would need a really fat tire to deal with our sand dunes and the loose sand. And then, where to keep it while out on the water? Keeping
                                Message 15 of 23 , Oct 4, 2007
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                                  On 10/4/07, adventures_in_astrophotography <jon@...> wrote:

                                  > You need a boat-barrow!

                                  Perhaps, but it would need a really fat tire to deal with our sand
                                  dunes and the loose sand.

                                  And then, where to keep it while out on the water? Keeping the boat
                                  light weight, enough to drag it across the sand might be the simpler
                                  option.
                                • Don Froese
                                  Thanks again Jon. I faxed PCB and he also confirmed the 3/8 ply for the bottom would be ok, especially with a double layer of glass. Cheers, Don
                                  Message 16 of 23 , Oct 4, 2007
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                                    Thanks again Jon. I faxed PCB and he also confirmed the 3/8 ply for the
                                    bottom would be ok, especially with a double layer of glass.



                                    Cheers,



                                    Don



                                    ________________________________

                                    From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                                    Of adventures_in_astrophotography
                                    Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2007 6:01 AM
                                    To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                                    Subject: [bolger] Re: Building a Long Dory



                                    Hi Don,

                                    ...snip...
                                    > Here is another question for you: I have some sheets of very nice 3/8
                                    > marine Meranti ply in my shop. Do you think this would work for the
                                    > bottom if I added a couple of layers of 6-ox. glass/epoxy on the
                                    > bottom?

                                    I don't know if the glass will add much, if any stiffness to the
                                    bottom panel, but it would sure add some abrasion resistance. If the
                                    bottom turns out to be a little spongy when you step into the boat,
                                    you can always add a stiff shoe or a layer of doorskin to the bottom.
                                    If it were me, I'd go for it.

                                    > Also, did you use butt-blocks or scarphs on the bottom panel?

                                    I used butt blocks. Fast, easy, only have to do one side of the
                                    panel. If you scarf, you should probably make sure you can get both
                                    ends of the bottom panel out of one sheet before you do it.

                                    Jon Kolb
                                    www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm





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                                  • Kristine Bennett
                                    Don if you are going to use the Dory a lot, you may want to think about putting a layer of 6 or 8 oz. cloth and epoxy on the bottom inside. The hull bottom
                                    Message 17 of 23 , Oct 4, 2007
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                                      Don if you are going to use the Dory a lot, you may want to think about putting a layer of 6 or 8 oz. cloth and epoxy on the bottom inside. The hull bottom will hold up better then just being painted.

                                      Blessings Krissie

                                      Don Froese <don.froese@...> wrote: Thanks again Jon. I faxed PCB and he also confirmed the 3/8 ply for the
                                      bottom would be ok, especially with a double layer of glass.

                                      Cheers,

                                      Don

                                      ________________________________








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                                    • Don Froese
                                      Thanks for the suggestion Krissie. I plan to coat the inside with a 2-part industrial epoxy paint. That stuff is very tough. Cheers, Don
                                      Message 18 of 23 , Oct 5, 2007
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                                        Thanks for the suggestion Krissie. I plan to coat the inside with a
                                        2-part industrial epoxy paint. That stuff is very tough.



                                        Cheers,



                                        Don



                                        ________________________________

                                        From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                                        Of Kristine Bennett
                                        Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2007 8:18 PM
                                        To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: RE: [bolger] Re: Building a Long Dory



                                        Don if you are going to use the Dory a lot, you may want to think about
                                        putting a layer of 6 or 8 oz. cloth and epoxy on the bottom inside. The
                                        hull bottom will hold up better then just being painted.

                                        Blessings Krissie

                                        Don Froese <don.froese@... <mailto:don.froese%40kodak.com> >
                                        wrote: Thanks again Jon. I faxed PCB and he also confirmed the 3/8 ply
                                        for the
                                        bottom would be ok, especially with a double layer of glass.

                                        Cheers,

                                        Don

                                        ________________________________


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                                      • dnjost
                                        Don - I concur with Krissie here as well. Had I glassed the inside bottom of my Diablo, I probably would be out fishing right now. Rain water has that sits
                                        Message 19 of 23 , Oct 5, 2007
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                                          Don -
                                          I concur with Krissie here as well. Had I glassed the inside bottom of
                                          my Diablo, I probably would be out fishing right now. Rain water has
                                          that sits on any painted surface somehow finds its way into the rest of
                                          the plywood and gets trapped. Particularly if the other face is
                                          glassed. I plan on glassing the bottom of the 18' skiff inside and out
                                          for longterm protection from clam rakes, anchors, dog nails (the
                                          labrador has meat hooks for claws), fishing tackle, crab pots, etc.

                                          The boat is so darned heavy to begin with, that I doubt a gallon
                                          of "goo on glass" is going to put the boat past the acceptable weight
                                          limits.

                                          Happy building.
                                          Only two more hours until the sawdust starts flying.
                                        • Kristine Bennett
                                          Don the paint is only as good as what it s being put on. Seeing how wood is soft and flexible, the paint is going to crack and let water in the wood. I have a
                                          Message 20 of 23 , Oct 5, 2007
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                                            Don the paint is only as good as what it's being put on. Seeing how wood is soft and flexible, the paint is going to crack and let water in the wood.

                                            I have a canopy for my truck that I sheathed with glass and epoxy on the front and top, and no spiders cracks. But on the sides I use Nexis cloth and epoxy and any place the side has been thumped there are spider cracks. I have had to patch a couple of places where the door skin had come apart. The Nexis cloth and epoxy are just over a 1/32nd of an inch. So I'll bet the epoxy paint will crack in time as well.

                                            I helped a friend glass the inside of his hull panels for the hull bottom before they went on the hull. As I remember we used 7781 and it gave a nice flat surface to glue to. He was happy with the boat after 10 years of hard use.

                                            Blessings Krissie


                                            Don Froese <don.froese@...> wrote: Thanks for the suggestion Krissie. I plan to coat the inside with a
                                            2-part industrial epoxy paint. That stuff is very tough.

                                            Cheers,

                                            Don

                                            ________________________________








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                                          • John and Kathy Trussell
                                            I recently finished a Michalak stitch and glue version of the Hereshoff Row Boat. I decided to coat the interior with epoxy after the hull was assembled and
                                            Message 21 of 23 , Oct 6, 2007
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                                              I recently finished a Michalak stitch and glue version of the Hereshoff Row Boat. I decided to coat the interior with epoxy after the hull was assembled and this turned out to be a big mistake. For awhile, I thought of naming the boat "Drips, Runs, and Errors". There were lots of drips and rums which had to be sanded out in narrow, inconvenient locations, and I hate sanding! Next time, I will do as much coating as I can before assembly with the various pieces of the boat supported at a comfortable working level. Gravity is going to exert its force and I figure that it can work for me as well as against me. Any sanding to required can likewise be done at a comfortable height without contortion.

                                              JohnT
                                              ----- Original Message -----
                                              From: Kristine Bennett
                                              To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                                              Sent: Friday, October 05, 2007 10:53 PM
                                              Subject: RE: [bolger] Re: Building a Long Dory


                                              Don the paint is only as good as what it's being put on. Seeing how wood is soft and flexible, the paint is going to crack and let water in the wood.

                                              I have a canopy for my truck that I sheathed with glass and epoxy on the front and top, and no spiders cracks. But on the sides I use Nexis cloth and epoxy and any place the side has been thumped there are spider cracks. I have had to patch a couple of places where the door skin had come apart. The Nexis cloth and epoxy are just over a 1/32nd of an inch. So I'll bet the epoxy paint will crack in time as well.

                                              I helped a friend glass the inside of his hull panels for the hull bottom before they went on the hull. As I remember we used 7781 and it gave a nice flat surface to glue to. He was happy with the boat after 10 years of hard use.

                                              Blessings Krissie

                                              Don Froese <don.froese@...> wrote: Thanks for the suggestion Krissie. I plan to coat the inside with a
                                              2-part industrial epoxy paint. That stuff is very tough.

                                              Cheers,

                                              Don

                                              ________________________________


                                              ---------------------------------
                                              Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows.
                                              Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.

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                                            • ANDREW AIREY
                                              What about a single pack polyurethane varnish.My recollection of using some years ago was that it was tough and quite flexible cheers Andy Airey Send instant
                                              Message 22 of 23 , Oct 7, 2007
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                                                What about a single pack polyurethane varnish.My
                                                recollection of using some years ago was that it was
                                                tough and quite flexible
                                                cheers
                                                Andy Airey

                                                Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
                                              • Don Froese
                                                Hi Andy: From my experience using single-pack polyurethane paint (not varnish), I have found that it does not stand up to abuse nearly as well as a 2-part
                                                Message 23 of 23 , Oct 8, 2007
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                                                  Hi Andy:



                                                  From my experience using single-pack polyurethane paint (not varnish), I
                                                  have found that it does not stand up to abuse nearly as well as a 2-part
                                                  epoxy paint. The polyurethane is much easier to apply and to get a nice
                                                  finish with though. I used epoxy paint on the cockpit sole of my
                                                  Bartender, where it gets lots of abuse. It seems to be holding up very
                                                  well so far. Time will tell I guess.



                                                  Cheers,



                                                  Don



                                                  ________________________________

                                                  From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                                                  Of ANDREW AIREY
                                                  Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2007 3:05 PM
                                                  To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Subject: [bolger] Re: Building a Long Dory



                                                  What about a single pack polyurethane varnish.My
                                                  recollection of using some years ago was that it was
                                                  tough and quite flexible
                                                  cheers
                                                  Andy Airey

                                                  Send instant messages to your online friends
                                                  http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com <http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com>





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