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Re: Superbrick modification? was Class IV Ostar Racer

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  • Paul
    That is my plan, though someone else had contacted me (maybe it was a group post too) that they were looking at building one as well but I haven t heard
    Message 1 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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      That is my plan, though someone else had contacted me (maybe it was
      a group post too) that they were looking at building one as well but
      I haven't heard anymore from them and I'm not sure if they had even
      bought the plans.

      Its a boat that deserves a shot at reality.

      Paul H.

      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Harry James <welshman@...> wrote:
      >
      > This will be the prize winning first constructed Superbrick
      correct?
      >
      > HJ
      >
      > Paul wrote:
      > > Bruce,
      > > What was your idea for a superbrick modification? I have been
      building
      > > bits of mine over the winter and hope to have the lower hull
      assembled
      > > by the end of March. Cold weather and an unheated work shop
      slowed me
      > > down over the winter but now I am trying to make up for lost
      time.
      > >
      > > Paul H.
      > >
      > >
      >
    • Paul
      According to Bruce Hector s post in duckworks http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/03/r/articles/superbrick/index.htm To win the pledges the builder must; A: Build
      Message 2 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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        According to Bruce Hector's post in duckworks
        http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/03/r/articles/superbrick/index.htm

        To win the pledges the builder must;

        A: Build a recognizable Bolger Superbrick from Phil Bolger & Friends
        supplied plans (currently $200) that follows the spirit (as Phil
        says, exercise creativity ONLY above the waterline!).

        B: Sail or wallow (with or without the help of a motor, scull or
        oars!) around a 1 mile triangular course with the sail up.

        C: At the owners/builders convenience permit the pledgers to inspect
        and/or ride in the said Superbrick. Since making friends is the best
        part of owning a unique vessl (and a Superbrick will lead to MANY
        dockside conversations, believe me!) this should not be too onerous.

        Not too difficult a set of requirements and should lead to meeting
        some of ya'll for a few beers on the boat.

        Paul H.


        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Mark Albanese <marka@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > On Mar 3, 2007, at 10:31 PM, Harry James wrote:
        >
        > > This will be the prize winning first constructed Superbrick
        correct?
        > >
        > > HJ
        >
        >
        > Any rules beyond it must sail?
        >
      • Paul
        The plans do not specify lead but I had already figured that it will need substantial ballast. Have been accumulating large amounts of wheel weights from a
        Message 3 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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          The plans do not specify lead but I had already figured that it will
          need substantial ballast. Have been accumulating large amounts of
          wheel weights from a friend who runs a tire store for several months
          now. Both superbrick and my other boat project, a Sam Devlin Winter
          Wren started by Dave Lipsey will require a good bit of it and I am
          casting it into bricks that can be used in either project. Devlin's
          plans call for lead bricks and shot cast in epoxy rather than
          casting the entire keel and I will use this with superbrick as well.

          BTW, the boat will be named Irresponsible, the name taken from the
          last paragraph in Bolger's article on it in BWAOM:

          "Irresponsible. A gratuitous mockery of right-thinking boatmen and
          other snobs."

          Being one who has always been a little different that line was what
          clenched the deal for me on building her and seemed the perfect name.

          Paul H.


          --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Mark Albanese <marka@...> wrote:
          >
          > Bruce, I'm looking at the Superbrick drawings but cannot find the
          > lead. It isn't needed. The DWL is only at 3350#. Say a long ton
          on
          > the structure and a 1000 for a payload?
          > I really liked you own drawing, but didn't expect the step garvey
          > when you wrote "easing the chines". Just slicing them off be yet
          > another way to do it.
          >
          > Mark
          > > snip
          >
          > > the massive volume of the hull requires massive lead ballast to
          > > get the hull to float down on waterline.
          > >
          > > By 'easing' the chine, you can set between trailer wheels, plus
          you
          > > can reduce the amount of needed lead ballast.
          > >
          > > It has the problem that it complicates the cabin, especially
          impeding
          > > on the standing headroom in the toilet.
          > >
          > > http://hallman.org/bolger/Superbrick/AlternateSuperbrickHull.gif
          > >
          > > http://hallman.org/bolger/Superbrick/althull.gif
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
        • Bruce Hallman
          ... Reading from the Superbrick (design#559) building key, note #61: Ballast: There should be at least 500 pounds of ballast. It can be in lead slabs or
          Message 4 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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            On 3/4/07, Paul <p_hardy@...> wrote:
            >
            > The plans do not specify lead but I had already figured that it will
            > need substantial ballast.

            Reading from the Superbrick (design#559) building key, note #61:

            "Ballast: There should be at least 500 pounds of ballast. It can be
            in lead slabs or bricks across the boat under the floorboards, most if
            not all in the bay just ahead of the 'C' bulkhead. A lead slab 1 1/4"
            thick, 12" wide (fore and aft), and 7'0" across the boat, or the
            equivalent in smaller pieces, will weight 516 pounds. STeel ballast
            could be fittee by filling more bays forward and aft. It should be
            possible at first to move it around to find the best trim as usually
            loaded (use live ballast to try the effect), but as soon as possible
            it should be bolted down to keep it from sliding around and, ideally,
            not to gall out if the boat should get bottom-up as could happen in a
            big breaking wave."
          • Kristine Bennett
            I was looking at the rendering of the Superbrick and think a sheet of steel formed to the hull would give you some of the ballast needed and it would also help
            Message 5 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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              I was looking at the rendering of the Superbrick and
              think a sheet of steel formed to the hull would give
              you some of the ballast needed and it would also help
              with grounding.

              Yes I know you would need a bunch of counter sunk
              holes to bolt it on. But you could also drill and tape
              them and on the outside plug weld the holes to seal
              them.

              Blessings all Krissie

              --- Paul <p_hardy@...> wrote:

              > The plans do not specify lead but I had already
              > figured that it will
              > need substantial ballast. Have been accumulating
              > large amounts of
              > wheel weights from a friend who runs a tire store
              > for several months
              > now. Both superbrick and my other boat project, a
              > Sam Devlin Winter
              > Wren started by Dave Lipsey will require a good bit
              > of it and I am
              > casting it into bricks that can be used in either
              > project. Devlin's
              > plans call for lead bricks and shot cast in epoxy
              > rather than
              > casting the entire keel and I will use this with
              > superbrick as well.
              >
              > BTW, the boat will be named Irresponsible, the name
              > taken from the
              > last paragraph in Bolger's article on it in BWAOM:
              >
              > "Irresponsible. A gratuitous mockery of
              > right-thinking boatmen and
              > other snobs."
              >
              > Being one who has always been a little different
              > that line was what
              > clenched the deal for me on building her and seemed
              > the perfect name.
              >
              > Paul H.
              >
              >
              > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Mark Albanese
              > <marka@...> wrote:
              > >
              > > Bruce, I'm looking at the Superbrick drawings but
              > cannot find the
              > > lead. It isn't needed. The DWL is only at 3350#.
              > Say a long ton
              > on
              > > the structure and a 1000 for a payload?
              > > I really liked you own drawing, but didn't expect
              > the step garvey
              > > when you wrote "easing the chines". Just slicing
              > them off be yet
              > > another way to do it.
              > >
              > > Mark
              > > > snip
              > >
              > > > the massive volume of the hull requires massive
              > lead ballast to
              > > > get the hull to float down on waterline.
              > > >
              > > > By 'easing' the chine, you can set between
              > trailer wheels, plus
              > you
              > > > can reduce the amount of needed lead ballast.
              > > >
              > > > It has the problem that it complicates the
              > cabin, especially
              > impeding
              > > > on the standing headroom in the toilet.
              > > >
              > > >
              >
              http://hallman.org/bolger/Superbrick/AlternateSuperbrickHull.gif
              > > >
              > > > http://hallman.org/bolger/Superbrick/althull.gif
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > >
              >
              >
              >




              ____________________________________________________________________________________
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            • Mark Albanese
              Guess that s a draw, Bruce. 500 pounds ain t exactly massive ; but it is lead. Paul, if you re building this just to grab the prize money, guess you can count
              Message 6 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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                Guess that's a draw, Bruce. 500 pounds ain't exactly "massive"; but
                it is lead.
                Paul, if you're building this just to grab the prize money, guess you
                can count on my 20 bucks.
                Mark



                On Mar 4, 2007, at 9:36 AM, Bruce Hallman wrote:

                > On 3/4/07, Paul <p_hardy@...> wrote:
                >>
                >> The plans do not specify lead but I had already figured that it will
                >> need substantial ballast.
                >
                > Reading from the Superbrick (design#559) building key, note #61:
                >
                > "Ballast: There should be at least 500 pounds of ballast. It can be
                > in lead slabs or bricks across the boat under the floorboards, most if
                > not all in the bay just ahead of the 'C' bulkhead. A lead slab 1 1/4"
                > thick, 12" wide (fore and aft), and 7'0" across the boat, or the
                > equivalent in smaller pieces, will weight 516 pounds. STeel ballast
                > could be fittee by filling more bays forward and aft. It should be
                > possible at first to move it around to find the best trim as usually
                > loaded (use live ballast to try the effect), but as soon as possible
                > it should be bolted down to keep it from sliding around and, ideally,
                > not to gall out if the boat should get bottom-up as could happen in a
                > big breaking wave."
                >
              • Howard Stephenson
                Seeing Krissie s post and Bruce s idea of re-drawing it to reduce displacement made me wonder whether the whole hull and deck could be built of steel. But,
                Message 7 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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                  Seeing Krissie's post and Bruce's idea of re-drawing it to reduce
                  displacement made me wonder whether the whole hull and deck could be
                  built of steel.

                  But, with so many dead-flat panels, the shape is not really suitable
                  for steel and the displacement as drawn is only 3350 lb. You'd need
                  something like 40 sheets of plywood (3/8" ?) plus framing timber,
                  paint, glue, fasteners and fittings, outboard and fuel, sailing rig,
                  leeboard, water and tanks, soft furnishings, hatches, windows,
                  ground tackle, boat handling gear, dinghy, crew plus personal
                  effects, sink, Porta-potti, food, cooking utensils, crockery and
                  cutlery etc.

                  With all that and the ballast Bruce has told us about, there
                  wouldn't be much change left out of 3350 lb.

                  Howard

                  --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Kristine Bennett <femmpaws@...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > I was looking at the rendering of the Superbrick and
                  > think a sheet of steel formed to the hull would give
                  > you some of the ballast needed and it would also help
                  > with grounding.
                  >
                  > Yes I know you would need a bunch of counter sunk
                  > holes to bolt it on. But you could also drill and tape
                  > them and on the outside plug weld the holes to seal
                  > them.
                  >
                  > Blessings all Krissie
                  >
                  > --- Paul <p_hardy@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > The plans do not specify lead but I had already
                  > > figured that it will
                  > > need substantial ballast. Have been accumulating
                  > > large amounts of
                  > > wheel weights from a friend who runs a tire store
                  > > for several months
                  > > now. Both superbrick and my other boat project, a
                  > > Sam Devlin Winter
                  > > Wren started by Dave Lipsey will require a good bit
                  > > of it and I am
                  > > casting it into bricks that can be used in either
                  > > project. Devlin's
                  > > plans call for lead bricks and shot cast in epoxy
                  > > rather than
                  > > casting the entire keel and I will use this with
                  > > superbrick as well.
                  > >
                  > > BTW, the boat will be named Irresponsible, the name
                  > > taken from the
                  > > last paragraph in Bolger's article on it in BWAOM:
                  > >
                  > > "Irresponsible. A gratuitous mockery of
                  > > right-thinking boatmen and
                  > > other snobs."
                  > >
                  > > Being one who has always been a little different
                  > > that line was what
                  > > clenched the deal for me on building her and seemed
                  > > the perfect name.
                  > >
                  > > Paul H.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Mark Albanese
                  > > <marka@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > Bruce, I'm looking at the Superbrick drawings but
                  > > cannot find the
                  > > > lead. It isn't needed. The DWL is only at 3350#.
                  > > Say a long ton
                  > > on
                  > > > the structure and a 1000 for a payload?
                  > > > I really liked you own drawing, but didn't expect
                  > > the step garvey
                  > > > when you wrote "easing the chines". Just slicing
                  > > them off be yet
                  > > > another way to do it.
                  > > >
                  > > > Mark
                  > > > > snip
                  > > >
                  > > > > the massive volume of the hull requires massive
                  > > lead ballast to
                  > > > > get the hull to float down on waterline.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > By 'easing' the chine, you can set between
                  > > trailer wheels, plus
                  > > you
                  > > > > can reduce the amount of needed lead ballast.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > It has the problem that it complicates the
                  > > cabin, especially
                  > > impeding
                  > > > > on the standing headroom in the toilet.
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > >
                  > http://hallman.org/bolger/Superbrick/AlternateSuperbrickHull.gif
                  > > > >
                  > > > > http://hallman.org/bolger/Superbrick/althull.gif
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  _____________________________________________________________________
                  _______________
                  > We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love
                  > (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.
                  > http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/265
                  >
                • Paul
                  This is interesting, my copy of the plans ends with #57 on page 3 of the key, apparently I am missing a page. ... will ... be ... most if ... 1/4 ... ballast
                  Message 8 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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                    This is interesting, my copy of the plans ends with #57 on page 3 of
                    the key, apparently I am missing a page.

                    --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > On 3/4/07, Paul <p_hardy@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > The plans do not specify lead but I had already figured that it
                    will
                    > > need substantial ballast.
                    >
                    > Reading from the Superbrick (design#559) building key, note #61:
                    >
                    > "Ballast: There should be at least 500 pounds of ballast. It can
                    be
                    > in lead slabs or bricks across the boat under the floorboards,
                    most if
                    > not all in the bay just ahead of the 'C' bulkhead. A lead slab 1
                    1/4"
                    > thick, 12" wide (fore and aft), and 7'0" across the boat, or the
                    > equivalent in smaller pieces, will weight 516 pounds. STeel
                    ballast
                    > could be fittee by filling more bays forward and aft. It should be
                    > possible at first to move it around to find the best trim as
                    usually
                    > loaded (use live ballast to try the effect), but as soon as
                    possible
                    > it should be bolted down to keep it from sliding around and,
                    ideally,
                    > not to gall out if the boat should get bottom-up as could happen
                    in a
                    > big breaking wave."
                    >
                  • Paul Hardy
                    The bucks are only a bonus. I like the boat and mainly am building because it looks like it will suit my needs. Meeting others in the group when they come to
                    Message 9 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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                      The bucks are only a bonus. I like the boat and mainly am building because
                      it looks like it will suit my needs. Meeting others in the group when they
                      come to see it will be more important than any dollars.



                      Paul



                      _____

                      From: bolger@yahoogroups.com [mailto:bolger@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                      Mark Albanese
                      Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2007 3:47 PM
                      To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Superbrick modification? was Class IV Ostar Racer



                      Guess that's a draw, Bruce. 500 pounds ain't exactly "massive"; but
                      it is lead.
                      Paul, if you're building this just to grab the prize money, guess you
                      can count on my 20 bucks.
                      Mark

                      On Mar 4, 2007, at 9:36 AM, Bruce Hallman wrote:

                      > On 3/4/07, Paul <p_hardy@hotmail. <mailto:p_hardy%40hotmail.com> com>
                      wrote:
                      >>
                      >> The plans do not specify lead but I had already figured that it will
                      >> need substantial ballast.
                      >
                      > Reading from the Superbrick (design#559) building key, note #61:
                      >
                      > "Ballast: There should be at least 500 pounds of ballast. It can be
                      > in lead slabs or bricks across the boat under the floorboards, most if
                      > not all in the bay just ahead of the 'C' bulkhead. A lead slab 1 1/4"
                      > thick, 12" wide (fore and aft), and 7'0" across the boat, or the
                      > equivalent in smaller pieces, will weight 516 pounds. STeel ballast
                      > could be fittee by filling more bays forward and aft. It should be
                      > possible at first to move it around to find the best trim as usually
                      > loaded (use live ballast to try the effect), but as soon as possible
                      > it should be bolted down to keep it from sliding around and, ideally,
                      > not to gall out if the boat should get bottom-up as could happen in a
                      > big breaking wave."
                      >





                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Howard Stephenson
                      -- not forgetting a battery, electrics, electronics, icebox, stove and gas bottles. Howard
                      Message 10 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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                        -- not forgetting a battery, electrics, electronics, icebox, stove
                        and gas bottles.

                        Howard

                        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Howard Stephenson"
                        <howardstephenson@...> wrote:

                        > displacement as drawn is only 3350 lb. You'd need
                        > something like 40 sheets of plywood (3/8" ?) plus framing timber,
                        > paint, glue, fasteners and fittings, outboard and fuel, sailing rig,
                        > leeboard, water and tanks, soft furnishings, hatches, windows,
                        > ground tackle, boat handling gear, dinghy, crew plus personal
                        > effects, sink, Porta-potti, food, cooking utensils, crockery and
                        > cutlery etc.
                      • Kristine Bennett
                        One of the other ideas I had after seeing the shallow CAD drawings was put a little diesel with a straight shaft and gear in it, as just a slowpoke to beebop
                        Message 11 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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                          One of the other ideas I had after seeing the shallow
                          CAD drawings was put a little diesel with a straight
                          shaft and gear in it, as just a slowpoke to beebop
                          around the sound. And with a 12 to 18 Hp diesel you
                          would really have to run her hard to burn more then
                          3/4 gallon an hour. Then again the hull speed is
                          something around 6.5 knots.

                          The other thing is where are you going to get the
                          weight to set her down in the water?

                          OK so you have a small powerbarge that you can put a
                          lot of people on and not sink it.

                          Hey building her out of steel wouldn't be a bad way to
                          go. But you may have more draft then you want to have.

                          Blessings Krissie


                          --- Howard Stephenson <howardstephenson@...>
                          wrote:

                          > Seeing Krissie's post and Bruce's idea of re-drawing
                          > it to reduce
                          > displacement made me wonder whether the whole hull
                          > and deck could be
                          > built of steel.
                          >
                          > But, with so many dead-flat panels, the shape is not
                          > really suitable
                          > for steel and the displacement as drawn is only 3350
                          > lb. You'd need
                          > something like 40 sheets of plywood (3/8" ?) plus
                          > framing timber,
                          > paint, glue, fasteners and fittings, outboard and
                          > fuel, sailing rig,
                          > leeboard, water and tanks, soft furnishings,
                          > hatches, windows,
                          > ground tackle, boat handling gear, dinghy, crew plus
                          > personal
                          > effects, sink, Porta-potti, food, cooking utensils,
                          > crockery and
                          > cutlery etc.
                          >
                          > With all that and the ballast Bruce has told us
                          > about, there
                          > wouldn't be much change left out of 3350 lb.
                          >
                          > Howard




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                        • Bruce Hallman
                          ... Paraphrasing page 4 of the Key, (covers about 1/3 of the page) 57.cont.Stove recess to match stove. Drawers and cabinets to taste... 58.Dresser with
                          Message 12 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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                            > This is interesting, my copy of the plans ends with #57 on page 3 of
                            > the key, apparently I am missing a page.

                            Paraphrasing page 4 of the Key, (covers about 1/3 of the page)

                            57.cont.Stove recess to match stove. Drawers and cabinets to taste...
                            58.Dresser with legroom...to be used as desk.
                            59.Motor, ...5 1/2 knots max. with 6 hp motor, low pitch 3 or 4 blade propeller.
                            60.Fuel tanks as convenient, strapped in place.
                            61.Ballast...at least 500lbs, bolted down.
                          • Paul
                            Thanks Bruce. I faxed Phil this afternoon and asked for a replacement page. Paul H. ... 3 of ... taste... ... blade propeller.
                            Message 13 of 24 , Mar 4, 2007
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                              Thanks Bruce. I faxed Phil this afternoon and asked for a
                              replacement page.

                              Paul H.

                              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hallman" <bruce@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > > This is interesting, my copy of the plans ends with #57 on page
                              3 of
                              > > the key, apparently I am missing a page.
                              >
                              > Paraphrasing page 4 of the Key, (covers about 1/3 of the page)
                              >
                              > 57.cont.Stove recess to match stove. Drawers and cabinets to
                              taste...
                              > 58.Dresser with legroom...to be used as desk.
                              > 59.Motor, ...5 1/2 knots max. with 6 hp motor, low pitch 3 or 4
                              blade propeller.
                              > 60.Fuel tanks as convenient, strapped in place.
                              > 61.Ballast...at least 500lbs, bolted down.
                              >
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