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Sprits, Wishbones and Dovkies

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  • Mike French
    I have been fortunate to own a Dovkie, as well as her bigger sister Shearwater and a Nonsuch 26 catboat with a wishbone. The performances of the first two were
    Message 1 of 12 , Mar 29, 2006
      I have been fortunate to own a Dovkie, as well as her bigger sister
      Shearwater and a Nonsuch 26 catboat with a wishbone. The performances
      of the first two were so sedate, to windward or otherwise that the
      aerodynamic inadequacies of a straight sprit held sail on one tack vs.
      the other were not obvious.
      The Nonsuch had a loaded displacement 3X and sail area 2.5X times the
      Shearwater on the same LWL. The 2X taller luff with full wishbone
      generated a really efficient shape, and she left the Shearwater for
      dead on all points and in any windstrength.

      Mike
    • Nels
      ... wrote: The 2X taller luff with full wishbone ... What were the mast heights of the two boats? Nels
      Message 2 of 12 , Mar 29, 2006
        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Mike French" <frenchwheatley@...>
        wrote:
        The 2X taller luff with full wishbone
        > generated a really efficient shape, and she left the Shearwater for
        > dead on all points and in any windstrength.
        >
        > Mike

        What were the mast heights of the two boats?

        Nels
      • Mike French
        ... The Shearwater mast was probably 25 ft long deck stepped, and the Nonsuch mast was 45 ft but keel stepped. The ability to reach up into stronger truer wind
        Message 3 of 12 , Mar 29, 2006
          --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Nels" <arvent@...> wrote:
          >
          > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Mike French" <frenchwheatley@>
          > wrote:
          > The 2X taller luff with full wishbone
          > > generated a really efficient shape, and she left the Shearwater for
          > > dead on all points and in any windstrength.
          > >
          > > Mike
          >
          > What were the mast heights of the two boats?
          >
          > Nels
          >
          The Shearwater mast was probably 25 ft long deck stepped, and the
          Nonsuch mast was 45 ft but keel stepped. The ability to reach up into
          stronger truer wind pressure is a big advantage that a taller mast
          brings, especially in light air.

          Mike
        • Bruce Hallman
          A Dovekie is cool, but a Shearwater is a rare thing! With only just a few ever built. This is a broken record, of course, but I (we) would love to see
          Message 4 of 12 , Apr 2, 2006
            A Dovekie is cool, but a Shearwater is a rare thing! With only just a
            few ever built. This is a broken record, of course, but I (we) would
            love to see photos.
          • Eric OHiggins
            As usual, watching this space has caused my brain cells to break hibernation. Thanks to all for the thots. The brainwave here concerns wishbones --
            Message 5 of 12 , Apr 3, 2006
              As usual, watching this space has caused my brain
              cells to break hibernation. Thanks to all for the
              thots.
              The brainwave here concerns wishbones -- specifically
              on the Bolger Solent rig which doesn't have any lacing
              or masthoops or anything else to clutter up the mast.
              I am filing away the idea of rigging two snotters
              instead of one, each snotter rigged to the end of a
              sprit one on each side of the sail.
              The wishbone becomes a very lightly loaded spacer, if
              you see what I mean, and there's no need of heavy
              structure to withstand wishbone style loads. The
              snotter would have to be tacked, of course, but there
              should be a marked improvement in sail shape and the
              leeward sprit should be held up out of the way of the
              sail by the 'spacer' and leeward snotter.
              I'll start out with a simple single sprit per plans
              and see how badly that ugly sail shape bothers me.
              Eric


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            • Mike French
              A wishbone that mimics a symmetrical airfoil ie a fully rounded leading edge need not be particularly strong. The snotter attaches to the inside of the curve
              Message 6 of 12 , Apr 3, 2006
                A wishbone that mimics a symmetrical airfoil ie a fully rounded
                leading edge need not be particularly strong. The snotter attaches to
                the inside of the curve at the centre and leads back to a block on the
                leading edge of the mast, thence down to a deck block and to a cleat.
                The wishbone loads are mostly compression.
                The snotter also functions as an outhaul and a cunningham, driving the
                wishbone aft and down to flatten the sail and tighten the leach and
                foot simultaneously. A 420 sq. ft. Nonsuch sail could be adjusted
                without a winch by simply luffing. Its wishbone was 25 feet long of
                2.5-3 inch dia. aluminum and probably weighed close to 80 lbs. it hung
                from 2 fixed length wire pennnants attached to each side of the mast.

                Mike

                --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Eric OHiggins <chaemeocyparis@...> wrote:
                >
                >
                > As usual, watching this space has caused my brain
                > cells to break hibernation. Thanks to all for the
                > thots.
                > The brainwave here concerns wishbones -- specifically
                > on the Bolger Solent rig which doesn't have any lacing
                > or masthoops or anything else to clutter up the mast.
                > I am filing away the idea of rigging two snotters
                > instead of one, each snotter rigged to the end of a
                > sprit one on each side of the sail.
                > The wishbone becomes a very lightly loaded spacer, if
                > you see what I mean, and there's no need of heavy
                > structure to withstand wishbone style loads. The
                > snotter would have to be tacked, of course, but there
                > should be a marked improvement in sail shape and the
                > leeward sprit should be held up out of the way of the
                > sail by the 'spacer' and leeward snotter.
                > I'll start out with a simple single sprit per plans
                > and see how badly that ugly sail shape bothers me.
                > Eric
                >
                >
                > __________________________________________________
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              • John and Kathy Trussell
                I really think that you are trying to correct a problem which either doesn t exist or, if it does, is so insignificant that it isn t worth fooling with. I
                Message 7 of 12 , Apr 3, 2006
                  I really think that you are trying to correct a problem which either doesn't exist or, if it does, is so insignificant that it isn't worth fooling with. I owned a Dovekie for several years and couldn't tell any difference between the "good" tack and the "bad"tack. I would suggest that you try it as PCB drew it and, if it bothers you, implement a fix. Periodically when I build a boat I figure that I'm smarter than the designer. Sometimes I'm right, but not often. And sometimes the shortcomings of my solution are major :<) Still, we who build our own boats are entitled to have things the way we like them. Nonetheless, I think I'd try PCB's way first.

                  John T
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Eric OHiggins
                  To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Monday, April 03, 2006 1:10 PM
                  Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Sprits, Wishbones and Dovkies



                  As usual, watching this space has caused my brain
                  cells to break hibernation. Thanks to all for the
                  thots.
                  The brainwave here concerns wishbones -- specifically
                  on the Bolger Solent rig which doesn't have any lacing
                  or masthoops or anything else to clutter up the mast.
                  I am filing away the idea of rigging two snotters
                  instead of one, each snotter rigged to the end of a
                  sprit one on each side of the sail.
                  The wishbone becomes a very lightly loaded spacer, if
                  you see what I mean, and there's no need of heavy
                  structure to withstand wishbone style loads. The
                  snotter would have to be tacked, of course, but there
                  should be a marked improvement in sail shape and the
                  leeward sprit should be held up out of the way of the
                  sail by the 'spacer' and leeward snotter.
                  I'll start out with a simple single sprit per plans
                  and see how badly that ugly sail shape bothers me.
                  Eric


                  __________________________________________________
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                  - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                  - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                  - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                  - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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                • Douglas Pollard
                  A straight sprit can be about 1/2 the diameter and weight of a curved sprit. Since most of the load is compression. The curved boom on Wolftrap weighed 16 lbs
                  Message 8 of 12 , Apr 3, 2006
                    A straight sprit can be about 1/2 the diameter and weight of a curved sprit. Since most of the load is compression. The curved boom on Wolftrap weighed 16 lbs was 21/2 dia. and the straight sprit was about 1 3/4 in. in diameter it was 1/16 thick and weighed 7 lb. The main was 425 sq Ft. There was a 16 ft top yard that stuck 10 ft above the top of the mast it only weighed 6 lbs. The loads are pretty light on the spars other than the mast on a sprit rig. I find it amazing and I had no idea that the bow weighs 80 lbs on a Nonsuch. That's 40 pounds per side and that is almost 3 times the weight of the curved sprit on Wolftrap. Seems like huge overkill to me.
                    Doug
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: John and Kathy Trussell
                    To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Monday, April 03, 2006 8:03 PM
                    Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Sprits, Wishbones and Dovkies


                    I really think that you are trying to correct a problem which either doesn't exist or, if it does, is so insignificant that it isn't worth fooling with. I owned a Dovekie for several years and couldn't tell any difference between the "good" tack and the "bad"tack. I would suggest that you try it as PCB drew it and, if it bothers you, implement a fix. Periodically when I build a boat I figure that I'm smarter than the designer. Sometimes I'm right, but not often. And sometimes the shortcomings of my solution are major :<) Still, we who build our own boats are entitled to have things the way we like them. Nonetheless, I think I'd try PCB's way first.

                    John T
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Eric OHiggins
                    To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Monday, April 03, 2006 1:10 PM
                    Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Sprits, Wishbones and Dovkies



                    As usual, watching this space has caused my brain
                    cells to break hibernation. Thanks to all for the
                    thots.
                    The brainwave here concerns wishbones -- specifically
                    on the Bolger Solent rig which doesn't have any lacing
                    or masthoops or anything else to clutter up the mast.
                    I am filing away the idea of rigging two snotters
                    instead of one, each snotter rigged to the end of a
                    sprit one on each side of the sail.
                    The wishbone becomes a very lightly loaded spacer, if
                    you see what I mean, and there's no need of heavy
                    structure to withstand wishbone style loads. The
                    snotter would have to be tacked, of course, but there
                    should be a marked improvement in sail shape and the
                    leeward sprit should be held up out of the way of the
                    sail by the 'spacer' and leeward snotter.
                    I'll start out with a simple single sprit per plans
                    and see how badly that ugly sail shape bothers me.
                    Eric


                    __________________________________________________
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                    Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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                    Bolger rules!!!
                    - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                    - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                    - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                    - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                    - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                    - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com



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                    Great outdoors


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                    a.. Visit your group "bolger" on the web.

                    b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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                    Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                    Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.3.4/299 - Release Date: 3/31/2006


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                    Bolger rules!!!
                    - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                    - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                    - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                    - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                    - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                    - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com



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                    a.. Visit your group "bolger" on the web.

                    b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Peter Lenihan
                    ... either doesn t exist or, if it does, is so insignificant that it isn t worth fooling with. I owned a Dovekie for several years and couldn t tell any
                    Message 9 of 12 , Apr 4, 2006
                      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "John and Kathy Trussell"
                      <jtrussell2@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I really think that you are trying to correct a problem which
                      either doesn't exist or, if it does, is so insignificant that it
                      isn't worth fooling with. I owned a Dovekie for several years and
                      couldn't tell any difference between the "good" tack and
                      the "bad"tack. I would suggest that you try it as PCB drew it and,
                      if it bothers you, implement a fix. Periodically when I build a
                      boat I figure that I'm smarter than the designer. Sometimes I'm
                      right, but not often. And sometimes the shortcomings of my solution
                      are major :<) Still, we who build our own boats are entitled to
                      have things the way we like them. Nonetheless, I think I'd try
                      PCB's way first.


                      I'll second that(!) and add that on my ex-Micro,LESTAT, I can't
                      recall ever noticing a deficiency on one tack or the other over
                      several years of sailing in all sorts of weather but made a point of
                      keeping the mizzen sprit-boom rigged on the opposite side,relative
                      to the main sprit-boom...just is case there was a difference :-)
                      Besides,only multi-millionaire-winning-is-EVERYTHING-die-hard-racers
                      really ever care about the 1/100th of a knot difference such-n-such
                      a gadget may or may not provide when out sailing/racing.
                      Considering that most of us are limited in the number of hours worth
                      of leisure time we have to burn,it would appear better to introduce
                      devices which will actually keep us "out there" longer.....as in the
                      cell phone call to our spouse,"Hi honey,it looks like I'm gonna be a
                      bit late coming home since the wind is slowly dying and is coming
                      over the "wrong" side of the sprit-boom.....again.....love ya,bye!"
                      Beyond that,most of us have as our destination,when we head out for
                      a sail,the very same point of departure! Why rush to get back
                      there,unless your really do not like spending time on the water! :-D


                      Sincerely,

                      Peter Lenihan,looking forward to the day when I can call work and
                      say,"Hi boss,can't come in today,there is hardly any wind,not a
                      cloud in the sky,lots-o-beer left in the cooler,girlfriend gettin'
                      frisky and the darn motor won't shut itself off!"...from along the
                      shores of the rainy St.Lawrence...............
                    • Lincoln Ross
                      Tech dinghy racers on the Charles River very often have no money but care a lot about 1/100th of a knot. Given my abilities, I needed at least 1/10 knot. Saw a
                      Message 10 of 12 , Apr 4, 2006
                        Tech dinghy racers on the Charles River very often have no money but
                        care a lot about 1/100th of a knot. Given my abilities, I needed at
                        least 1/10 knot. Saw a lot of transoms racing with that crowd.

                        If you plotted the courses of those who crossed the line just after
                        the signal, it would look like a diagram of how to knit a sweater.
                        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Peter Lenihan" <peterlenihan@...> wrote:
                        snip
                        > Besides,only multi-millionaire-winning-is-EVERYTHING-die-hard-racers
                        > really ever care about the 1/100th of a knot difference such-n-such
                        > a gadget may or may not provide when out sailing/racing.
                        snip
                      • skiffsalor2000
                        Sailors, I agree with John and built PCB Gypsy to plan including the sail plan. The boat has been in storage for a couple of years but I am ready now to get
                        Message 11 of 12 , May 14 5:41 AM
                          Sailors,

                          I agree with John and built PCB Gypsy to plan including the sail plan.
                          The boat has been in storage for a couple of years but I am ready now to
                          get back into it. My question - what is a simple approach to improving
                          the sheet? Hanging on to that line - there has to be a good simple way
                          to rig the sheet so that it can be quickly released saving disaster. I
                          bought a couple of simple blocks but not real sure what to do with them.

                          Mike




                          --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "John and Kathy Trussell"
                          <jtrussell2@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > I really think that you are trying to correct a problem which either
                          doesn't exist or, if it does, is so insignificant that it isn't worth
                          fooling with. I owned a Dovekie for several years and couldn't tell any
                          difference between the "good" tack and the "bad"tack. I would suggest
                          that you try it as PCB drew it and, if it bothers you, implement a fix.
                          Periodically when I build a boat I figure that I'm smarter than the
                          designer. Sometimes I'm right, but not often. And sometimes the
                          shortcomings of my solution are major :<) Still, we who build our own
                          boats are entitled to have things the way we like them. Nonetheless, I
                          think I'd try PCB's way first.
                          >
                          > John T
                          > ----- Original Message -----
                          > From: Eric OHiggins
                          > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                          > Sent: Monday, April 03, 2006 1:10 PM
                          > Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Sprits, Wishbones and Dovkies
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > As usual, watching this space has caused my brain
                          > cells to break hibernation. Thanks to all for the
                          > thots.
                          > The brainwave here concerns wishbones -- specifically
                          > on the Bolger Solent rig which doesn't have any lacing
                          > or masthoops or anything else to clutter up the mast.
                          > I am filing away the idea of rigging two snotters
                          > instead of one, each snotter rigged to the end of a
                          > sprit one on each side of the sail.
                          > The wishbone becomes a very lightly loaded spacer, if
                          > you see what I mean, and there's no need of heavy
                          > structure to withstand wishbone style loads. The
                          > snotter would have to be tacked, of course, but there
                          > should be a marked improvement in sail shape and the
                          > leeward sprit should be held up out of the way of the
                          > sail by the 'spacer' and leeward snotter.
                          > I'll start out with a simple single sprit per plans
                          > and see how badly that ugly sail shape bothers me.
                          > Eric
                          >
                          >
                          > __________________________________________________
                          > Do You Yahoo!?
                          > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
                          > http://mail.yahoo.com
                          >
                          >
                          > Bolger rules!!!
                          > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                          > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging
                          dead horses
                          > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
                          posts
                          > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                          > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930,
                          Fax: (978) 282-1349
                          > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                          > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > SPONSORED LINKS Boating safety Boating magazine Alaska outdoors
                          > Great outdoors
                          >
                          >
                          >
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                          >
                          > a.. Visit your group "bolger" on the web.
                          >
                          > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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                          >
                          > No virus found in this incoming message.
                          > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                          > Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.3.4/299 - Release Date:
                          3/31/2006
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                        • John and Kathy Trussell
                          Mike, PCB frequently leaves details up to the builder, and I m not sure how you have the sheet rigged now. A traditional approach is to install a rack with a
                          Message 12 of 12 , May 14 6:10 AM
                            Mike,

                            PCB frequently leaves details up to the builder, and I'm not sure how you have the sheet rigged now.

                            A traditional approach is to install a rack with a pin or hook on the inboard side of either gunwale. The sheet is hooked around the pin and the pin takes the strain of the sheet. It is, of course, necessary to move the sheet to the opposite pin on each tack. The location of the pin fore and aft has some impact on sail performance, so some experimentation is needed.

                            Another approach is to mount a block on the rudder head. Run the sheet through the block and wind it a turn or two around the tiller (you want a spiral effect). Hold the sheet with the hand you are steering with--squeezing the sheet against the tiller. Friction between the sheet and the tiller takes the strain, but the sheet can be released instantly by relaxing your hand. NOTE: Sheeting to the rudder head can exert an upward force on the rudder; perhaps enough to unship it. This is a really bad thing when you are under sail. The solution is to make or buy a metal clip which will keep the pintle from rising.

                            If you really want to get complicated, check out local one design sailboats (Lightnings are about the most Rube Goldberg arangements, but they work) and copy what you think might work for you.

                            With a fairly small sail, I would try to keep it simple first.

                            John T

                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: skiffsalor2000
                            To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2006 8:41 AM
                            Subject: [bolger] Re: Sprits, Wishbones and Dovkies



                            Sailors,

                            I agree with John and built PCB Gypsy to plan including the sail plan.
                            The boat has been in storage for a couple of years but I am ready now to
                            get back into it. My question - what is a simple approach to improving
                            the sheet? Hanging on to that line - there has to be a good simple way
                            to rig the sheet so that it can be quickly released saving disaster. I
                            bought a couple of simple blocks but not real sure what to do with them.

                            Mike




                            --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "John and Kathy Trussell"
                            <jtrussell2@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > I really think that you are trying to correct a problem which either
                            doesn't exist or, if it does, is so insignificant that it isn't worth
                            fooling with. I owned a Dovekie for several years and couldn't tell any
                            difference between the "good" tack and the "bad"tack. I would suggest
                            that you try it as PCB drew it and, if it bothers you, implement a fix.
                            Periodically when I build a boat I figure that I'm smarter than the
                            designer. Sometimes I'm right, but not often. And sometimes the
                            shortcomings of my solution are major :<) Still, we who build our own
                            boats are entitled to have things the way we like them. Nonetheless, I
                            think I'd try PCB's way first.
                            >
                            > John T
                            > ----- Original Message -----
                            > From: Eric OHiggins
                            > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                            > Sent: Monday, April 03, 2006 1:10 PM
                            > Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: Sprits, Wishbones and Dovkies
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > As usual, watching this space has caused my brain
                            > cells to break hibernation. Thanks to all for the
                            > thots.
                            > The brainwave here concerns wishbones -- specifically
                            > on the Bolger Solent rig which doesn't have any lacing
                            > or masthoops or anything else to clutter up the mast.
                            > I am filing away the idea of rigging two snotters
                            > instead of one, each snotter rigged to the end of a
                            > sprit one on each side of the sail.
                            > The wishbone becomes a very lightly loaded spacer, if
                            > you see what I mean, and there's no need of heavy
                            > structure to withstand wishbone style loads. The
                            > snotter would have to be tacked, of course, but there
                            > should be a marked improvement in sail shape and the
                            > leeward sprit should be held up out of the way of the
                            > sail by the 'spacer' and leeward snotter.
                            > I'll start out with a simple single sprit per plans
                            > and see how badly that ugly sail shape bothers me.
                            > Eric
                            >
                            >
                            > __________________________________________________
                            > Do You Yahoo!?
                            > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
                            > http://mail.yahoo.com
                            >
                            >
                            > Bolger rules!!!
                            > - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                            > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging
                            dead horses
                            > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred'
                            posts
                            > - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                            > - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930,
                            Fax: (978) 282-1349
                            > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > SPONSORED LINKS Boating safety Boating magazine Alaska outdoors
                            > Great outdoors
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            ------------------------------------------------------------------------\
                            ------
                            > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
                            >
                            > a.. Visit your group "bolger" on the web.
                            >
                            > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                            > bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            >
                            > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                            Service.
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            ------------------------------------------------------------------------\
                            ------
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            ------------------------------------------------------------------------\
                            ------
                            >
                            >
                            > No virus found in this incoming message.
                            > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                            > Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.3.4/299 - Release Date:
                            3/31/2006
                            >
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >








                            Bolger rules!!!
                            - NO "GO AWAY SPAMMER!" posts!!! Please!
                            - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, respamming, or flogging dead horses
                            - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                            - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                            - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                            - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com



                            SPONSORED LINKS Boating magazine Alaska outdoors Boating safety
                            Great outdoors


                            ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

                            a.. Visit your group "bolger" on the web.

                            b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                            bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

                            c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


                            ------------------------------------------------------------------------------




                            ------------------------------------------------------------------------------


                            No virus found in this incoming message.
                            Checked by AVG Free Edition.
                            Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.5.6/338 - Release Date: 5/12/2006


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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