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Re: Wandervogel

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  • oarmandt
    That is my model on the home page of Bolger 3. The model was built from a preliminary drawing. I am still waiting for the commission to get to the top of
    Message 1 of 11 , Feb 27 6:18 PM
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      That is my model on the home page of Bolger 3. The model was built
      from a preliminary drawing. I am still waiting for the commission to
      get to the top of PB&F's list. Fifteen months ago, I got tired of
      waiting for it, so went ahead and built a Birdwatcher. I still intend
      to follow through with Wandervogel though. I had a letter from them
      last fall responding to my report on the BW first outings. They had
      given priority to a couple of projects including a commercial fishing
      vessel that had grown beyond expectations. They were then returning
      to their backlog of commissions.

      The design started with cartoon 101 in 103 Sailing Rigs. It was a cat
      there, but has since grown a mizzen. Once you have the sheet staff,
      why not a yawl?

      In the book, the boat has leeboards. In the preliminary drawing, they
      propose bilgeboards encased in the seat backs of the settees. There
      is a touch of flare to this hull, so the bilgeboards angle inward at
      the bottom. I think I would rather have the leeboards. The hull
      bottom is flat side to side from about 40% to the transom. Forward,
      it has a vee section. I think the intent was to add on the vee below
      the rockered flat bottom.

      The preliminary drawing was pretty basic, so I did fill in details to
      make the model. This is a Chinese Gaff. That is a vang holding the
      boom down by holding up the extension forward of the mast. The intent
      is to have a disc attached to the mast with rollers on the boom
      bearing upward against the disc. The sailplan indicates a 295 square
      foot main with four battens and a 67 square foot mizzen, fully
      battened. There may or may not be a beam across the cabin slot top
      half way fore and aft. That is my interpretation from where the main
      sheet lands. Masts were intended to be aluminum pipe, but I requested
      a wooden design instead thinking this could be done lighter.

      The outboard will go right on the transom, between the two rudders.
      The mizzen tabernacle is a piece of work to hold the mizzen mast
      centered above the outboard.

      Water ballast was intended, but PB&F likes the armoured bottom concept
      a bit better I think.

      Doug


      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Nels" <arvent@...> wrote:
      >
      > The photos of the above model at Bolger 5 photos, are greatly enhanced
      > now that they are available for all to view in the larger size.
      >
      > I am curious about several features on this model, including the spar
      > design, the rudder set-up and what kind of keel it has? Also how one
      > fits a motor on that stern? (Must have a well like WDJ I assume.)
      >
      > There is a bit of background information starting with Message 45683
      > in this group showing the dimensions similar to Martha Jane. L 23'9" B
      > 6' 9" Draft 8" (?).
      >
      > It seems to be a shame this design is apparently still not available.
      > How long is it appropriate to wait I wonder, for a commission to be
      > completed? It must be very frustrating also for the others who have
      > been waiting up to two years or more it seems.
      >
      > In addition there are some of us who would like to make requests and
      > know it is fruitless.
      >
      > One has to wonder what is going on with that? Are there just too many
      > distractions in the PCB&F firm I wonder?
      >
      > Nels
      >
    • Nels
      ... to ... intend ... them ... had ... fishing ... returning ... cat ... staff, ... they ... There ... at ... Forward, ... below ... to ... the ... intent ...
      Message 2 of 11 , Feb 28 1:26 PM
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        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "oarmandt" <oarman89@...> wrote:
        >
        > That is my model on the home page of Bolger 3. The model was built
        > from a preliminary drawing. I am still waiting for the commission
        to
        > get to the top of PB&F's list. Fifteen months ago, I got tired of
        > waiting for it, so went ahead and built a Birdwatcher. I still
        intend
        > to follow through with Wandervogel though. I had a letter from
        them
        > last fall responding to my report on the BW first outings. They
        had
        > given priority to a couple of projects including a commercial
        fishing
        > vessel that had grown beyond expectations. They were then
        returning
        > to their backlog of commissions.
        >
        > The design started with cartoon 101 in 103 Sailing Rigs. It was a
        cat
        > there, but has since grown a mizzen. Once you have the sheet
        staff,
        > why not a yawl?
        >
        > In the book, the boat has leeboards. In the preliminary drawing,
        they
        > propose bilgeboards encased in the seat backs of the settees.
        There
        > is a touch of flare to this hull, so the bilgeboards angle inward
        at
        > the bottom. I think I would rather have the leeboards. The hull
        > bottom is flat side to side from about 40% to the transom.
        Forward,
        > it has a vee section. I think the intent was to add on the vee
        below
        > the rockered flat bottom.
        >
        > The preliminary drawing was pretty basic, so I did fill in details
        to
        > make the model. This is a Chinese Gaff. That is a vang holding
        the
        > boom down by holding up the extension forward of the mast. The
        intent
        > is to have a disc attached to the mast with rollers on the boom
        > bearing upward against the disc. The sailplan indicates a 295
        square
        > foot main with four battens and a 67 square foot mizzen, fully
        > battened. There may or may not be a beam across the cabin slot top
        > half way fore and aft. That is my interpretation from where the
        main
        > sheet lands. Masts were intended to be aluminum pipe, but I
        requested
        > a wooden design instead thinking this could be done lighter.
        >
        > The outboard will go right on the transom, between the two
        rudders.
        > The mizzen tabernacle is a piece of work to hold the mizzen mast
        > centered above the outboard.
        >
        > Water ballast was intended, but PB&F likes the armoured bottom
        concept
        > a bit better I think.
        >
        > Doug

        Hi Doug,

        Thank you for giving us an update. You did such a great job on the
        model I was certain that all the details were correct including the
        sail plan. I still prefer your version to the full Chinese gaf rig!
        Perhaps with flat battens inserted at the breaks in the sail cloth?
        (I am awaiting Don in KIWI land's response:-)

        I am sure you are aware that the hull shape resembles a smaller
        version of FIJI. Also similar in uderbody profile to SITKA EXPLORER.
        TAHITI, both off-shoots of TOPAZ

        http://journeyboats.com/photo_journal.htm

        In all those shapes (including YONDER) the forfoot is deeper than
        the mid-body hull profile. So in affect showing some "hogging" of
        the keel-line in profile. An older design BARNOWL also shows this to
        my eye. Sort of a "coke-bottle" shape in profile and which is
        explained further in the SITKA article. They also do not hesitate to
        introduce this deeper forfoot in the anti-kerphlumping mods to MICRO
        NAV, BWII and the AS29 upgrades.

        Also they seem to be leaning towards the armor plating on the bottom
        rather than water ballast or internal lead ballast in some of their
        updates. Matching up and connecting a steel plate to the bottom of a
        plywood/glass/epoxy matrix still seems a bit of mystery to me. But
        obviously it gives very strong protection to a hulL that is capable
        of runninG right up to the shore.

        I would have to wonder why WANDERVOGEL needs two cenerboards when
        FIJI and even LE CABATIN only have one? Perhaps only one is used
        depending on which tack you are taking? I would suggest that given a
        tight centerboard case, perhaps lined with UMHF would be more stable
        and stronger than leeboards?

        Did you build the earlier version of BIRDWATCHER? Of course I feel
        inclined to ask about photos and your experience with it.

        I have to wonder too about why the time spent by PCB&F to design a
        better fishing fleet is such a priority when the fishing is not
        really all that viable when there are so few fish anyway?

        Nels
      • saillips
        so went ahead and built a Birdwatcher. I still intend ... Would you mind sharing your BW sailing experiences? I d also like to ask you about how you applied
        Message 3 of 11 , Feb 28 1:40 PM
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          so went ahead and built a Birdwatcher. I still intend
          > to follow through with Wandervogel though. I had a letter from them
          > last fall responding to my report on the BW first outings.
          Would you mind sharing your BW sailing experiences? I'd also like to
          ask you about how you applied your lexan windows, and what rig did you
          use? It'll help motivate me to cast aside my resposibilities and spend
          a little time on something truly meaningful... working on my BW2.
          Thanks, David
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