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More dipping lugger (probably too much...)

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  • gbship
    Having just just rejoined the list after a hiatus, I saw the thread on dipping lugs and thought to throw in my two cents; well more than two cents since we
    Message 1 of 21 , Mar 1, 2005
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      Having just just rejoined the list after a hiatus, I saw the thread
      on dipping lugs and thought to throw in my two cents; well more than
      two cents since we have a Bolger-designed 30-footer originally rigged
      as a dipping lugger, and designed for single-handed ocean racing.

      BTW, I don't know if he ever sailed Resolution alone using the
      dipping lug sail, but Bolger certainly would have been capable. He
      had the 450 square foot mainsail made out of fairly light material
      (he thought 6.5 ounce) and could raise and lower it by himself
      without a winch. He designed my 385-square foot sails to do the same,
      but I had them made out of 8 ounce cloth and I needed a winch to get
      them up.

      The boat was designed with one sail on each side of the mast. so it
      was drop one and raise one every tack or gybe. I also experimented
      with dipping and shifting one sail, using lines to guide the tack
      around the mast. Unfortunately, there was a V-shaped area formed
      where the mast went through the deck just forward of where the from
      of the cabin angled to the deck. The sail tended to get hung up in
      there and had to be helped through. Anyway, it took about three and a
      half minutes to tack with either two sails or one. I did a lot by
      myself, but of course had an autopilot steering.

      I eventually rerigged as a balanced lugger, using the existing sail.
      The boat reached as well and ran better, since the boom held the foot
      out when going downwind. But at first it was just about dead on the
      wind. Bolger's book, 100 Small Boat Rigs had the key, If you compare
      the drawings for dipping and balanced lugs, you'll see that a lot
      more of the foot of the dipping lug is forward of the mast than the
      balanced lug. The boom downhaul on the balanced rig was slid forward
      a couple feet and the windward performance improved dramatically. The
      dipping lug, though, was faster on the wind and my impression was it
      was closer-winded as well.

      The dipping lug would sail to windward on the bad tack but the speed
      was cut in half. But the boat remained in control and would tack back
      without difficulty. Bolger had the sail tacks on a traveler, so the
      tack could be hauled up to the windward edge of the deck, which was
      also done to flatten the sail when it was on the bad back.

      That, in a nutshell, was my experience. The boat is still rigged as a
      balanced lugger, and the sail can be raised, lowered and up to triple
      reefed from the cockpit. It's much easier to deal with than the
      dipping lugger. But (in my objective, unbiased, and strictly neutral
      opinion ;-)) there isn't any other rig in the world that will match
      the hypnotic beauty of a dipping lug under sail, expecially hard on
      the wind or close reaching.

      Some additional thoughts, observtions, and provocations:

      -- While the dipping lugger goes dead on the bad tack, there's isn't
      any appreciable difference with the balanced lugger. In fact,
      sometimes the "bad" tack seems faster. That makes me wonder if the
      tack of the dipping lugger were moved aft a bit and to the windward
      rail, if it would perform better on the bad tack. Obviously, if
      you're short tacking in crowded waters the last thing you need is to
      move the tack for and aft (and side to side) on each tack. You would
      also have a different helm balance on each tack, and I can't see any
      way to shift the foot easily, but it is an interesting thought . . .

      -- Someone mentioned using the balanced lug as a standing lug in
      crowded waters, bringing the tack back to the mast. That could be a
      problem on a sail cut to be a dipping lug. If you bring the tack back
      to the mast, the clew is going to get awfully high in the air -- it
      would probably be over 10 feet in my boat. Plus the yard will get
      cocked up at a too steep angle and could present control problems and
      allow twist. Finally, you will have radically shifted your center of
      effort aft, increasing weather helm. (I got away with this when I
      went to the balanced lug because the shift wasn't as radical, the
      boat came out with a neutral helm on the wind and some weather helm
      was a good thing.) It might work if you added a triangular reef, with
      the base along the luff and the apex at the clew. Tie in the reef,
      and the sail would set lower solving the high clew problem, and the
      yard wouldn't cock up so much and the balance wouldn't change quite
      as much. It would cost some sail area though. Just a thought. . .

      -- BTW, Bolger had a neat way to control the sail while raising and
      lowering. Instead of a parrel, he designed a jackstay, a wire stay
      that's fastened to a tang at the top of the mast and is lashed with a
      rope to a padeye that's through-bolted to the deck a couple inches
      from the base of the mast. It does not have to be more than lashed
      because it does not support the mast, it guides the yard. One of
      theose tear-drop shaped rope thimbles goes around the wire and a rope
      is spliced to that and then tied to the yard, getting the yard as
      close the wire (and hence the mast) as possible. It's tied at the
      same place where the halyard if fastened. The advantage to this is it
      never binds like a parrel, and the sail can be raised or lowered on
      any point of sail. In fact, I make it a point not to be heading
      straight into the wind when raising or lowering the sail (although
      easing the sheet to let the sail luff does help). Keeps me away from
      the flapping sail and the gyrating yard. There is also a line to help
      control the yard.

      Fellow lug-nuts, take this FWIW...

      Gary Blankenship
    • Bruce Hallman
      ... Which 30 footer is that? Thanks a million for the dipping lug first hand report, it makes me want to try one more than ever!
      Message 2 of 21 , Mar 1, 2005
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        gbship <gbship@...> wrote:
        > on dipping lugs and thought to throw in my two cents; well more than
        > two cents since we have a Bolger-designed 30-footer originally rigged
        > as a dipping lugger, and designed for single-handed ocean racing.

        Which 30 footer is that?

        Thanks a million for the dipping lug first hand report,
        it makes me want to try one more than ever!
      • captreed48
        The boat is still rigged as a ... triple ... Hi Gary, Not too much at all. Fascinating, actually. I was curious how you managed to reef the balanced lug from
        Message 3 of 21 , Mar 1, 2005
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          The boat is still rigged as a
          > balanced lugger, and the sail can be raised, lowered and up to
          triple
          > reefed from the cockpit.

          Hi Gary,

          Not too much at all. Fascinating, actually.

          I was curious how you managed to reef the balanced lug from the
          cockpit.

          Reed
        • craig o'donnell
          ... I m trying to picture this and I m not succeeding. You mean simply pivoting the boom further forward, or physically sliding the whole sail forward? Or
          Message 4 of 21 , Mar 2, 2005
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            >If you compare
            >the drawings for dipping and balanced lugs, you'll see that a lot
            >more of the foot of the dipping lug is forward of the mast than the
            >balanced lug. The boom downhaul on the balanced rig was slid forward
            >a couple feet and the windward performance improved dramatically. The
            >dipping lug, though, was faster on the wind and my impression was it
            >was closer-winded as well.

            I'm trying to picture this and I'm not succeeding. You mean simply
            "pivoting" the boom further forward, or physically sliding the whole sail
            forward? Or ... ?
            --
            Craig O'Donnell
            Sinepuxent Ancestors & Boats
            <http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~fassitt/>
            The Proa FAQ <http://boat-links.com/proafaq.html>
            The Cheap Pages <http://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/>
            Sailing Canoes, Polytarp Sails, Bamboo, Chinese Junks,
            American Proas, the Bolger Boat Honor Roll,
            Plywood Boats, Bamboo Rafts, &c.
            _________________________________

            -- Professor of Boatology -- Junkomologist
            -- Macintosh kinda guy
            Friend of Wanda the Wonder Cat, 1991-1997.
            _________________________________
          • gbship
            Reed & Bruce: The boat is a custom design from Bolger. It s basically a doubled Gypsy, about twice as long and not quite twice as wide. Originally it had a
            Message 5 of 21 , Mar 2, 2005
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              Reed & Bruce:
              The boat is a custom design from Bolger. It's basically a doubled
              Gypsy, about twice as long and not quite twice as wide. Originally it
              had a deep fixed fin keel; it now has a shorter keel with wings.

              On reefing, lines are rigged at the luff and leech like conventional
              jiffy reefing lines, only they are led through turning blocks at the
              mast, and then back to the cockpit. There's a couple cleats at the
              mast where the boom downhaul the block (I use three sets of double
              blocks) have a rope tail and are fastened to those cleats. It might
              be better to fastened them to the boom at the pivot point, but that's
              a lot of blocks on a not very wide boom. BTW, the reefing lines led
              this way become the boom downhaul when the sail is reefed. The third
              reef is my substitute for a security blanket. It seems to add about
              triple the tendency to foul things up over just having two reefs, but
              if the lines are led carefully, it works. There are line stoppers and
              a #20 Barlow winch at the aft end of the cabin top to help handle the
              lines.

              If you like, I can e-mail some pictures of the reefing setup.

              Gary Blankenship
              Tallahassee, FL


              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "captreed48" <captreed@s...> wrote:
              >
              > The boat is still rigged as a
              > > balanced lugger, and the sail can be raised, lowered and up to
              > triple
              > > reefed from the cockpit.
              >
              > Hi Gary,
              >
              > Not too much at all. Fascinating, actually.
              >
              > I was curious how you managed to reef the balanced lug from the
              > cockpit.
              >
              > Reed
            • Nels
              ... Hi Gary, Would be great if you could post them to Bolger4photos or if you email them to Bruce maybe he would if you are not a member of all the groups. We
              Message 6 of 21 , Mar 2, 2005
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                --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "gbship" <gbship@c...> wrote:
                >
                > Reed & Bruce:
                > If you like, I can e-mail some pictures of the reefing setup.
                >
                > Gary Blankenship
                > Tallahassee, FL
                >
                >
                Hi Gary,

                Would be great if you could post them to Bolger4photos or if you
                email them to Bruce maybe he would if you are not a member of all the
                groups.

                We also be interested in you experience with the swing wing keel and
                how complicated it was to build and use and anything else you would
                like to share about the boat and it's capabilites, and how seaworthy
                and effecient it is.

                I have always been fascinated by the idea of such a simple design
                having such potential.

                Thanks, Nels
              • Harry James
                CC me also please welshman@ptialaska.net HJ
                Message 7 of 21 , Mar 2, 2005
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                  CC me also please

                  welshman@...

                  HJ

                  gbship wrote:

                  >Reed & Bruce:
                  >The boat is a custom design from Bolger. It's basically a doubled
                  >Gypsy, about twice as long and not quite twice as wide. Originally it
                  >had a deep fixed fin keel; it now has a shorter keel with wings.
                  >
                  >On reefing, lines are rigged at the luff and leech like conventional
                  >jiffy reefing lines, only they are led through turning blocks at the
                  >mast, and then back to the cockpit. There's a couple cleats at the
                  >mast where the boom downhaul the block (I use three sets of double
                  >blocks) have a rope tail and are fastened to those cleats. It might
                  >be better to fastened them to the boom at the pivot point, but that's
                  >a lot of blocks on a not very wide boom. BTW, the reefing lines led
                  >this way become the boom downhaul when the sail is reefed. The third
                  >reef is my substitute for a security blanket. It seems to add about
                  >triple the tendency to foul things up over just having two reefs, but
                  >if the lines are led carefully, it works. There are line stoppers and
                  >a #20 Barlow winch at the aft end of the cabin top to help handle the
                  >lines.
                  >
                  >If you like, I can e-mail some pictures of the reefing setup.
                  >
                  >Gary Blankenship
                  >Tallahassee, FL
                  >
                  >
                  >--- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "captreed48" <captreed@s...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  >> The boat is still rigged as a
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>>balanced lugger, and the sail can be raised, lowered and up to
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>triple
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>>reefed from the cockpit.
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>Hi Gary,
                  >>
                  >>Not too much at all. Fascinating, actually.
                  >>
                  >>I was curious how you managed to reef the balanced lug from the
                  >>cockpit.
                  >>
                  >>Reed
                  >>
                  >>
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >Bolger rules!!!
                  >- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
                  >- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                  >- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                  >- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                  >- Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  >- Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  >Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                • captreed48
                  Hi Gary, Thank you for the explanation. I had 3 jiffy reefs on a balanced lug and the boom was crowded. One thing I did was put the forward attachment point
                  Message 8 of 21 , Mar 2, 2005
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                    Hi Gary,

                    Thank you for the explanation. I had 3 jiffy reefs on a balanced lug
                    and the boom was crowded. One thing I did was put the forward
                    attachment point for the third reef aft along the boom so the COE
                    didn't move forward with that reef.

                    I've changed the rig to a standing lug that allows roller reefing.
                    Since the luff moves aft when reefing no lee helm developes.

                    Your lug nut, Reed
                  • gbship
                    Nels: I wrote a long article about the wing keel, titled Wing Keel Travails
                    Message 9 of 21 , Mar 3, 2005
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                      Nels:
                      I wrote a long article about the wing keel, titled Wing Keel
                      Travails< for Duckworks Magazine (www.duckworksmagazine.com, and you
                      can find it in the December 2004 archives, although I think you have
                      to be a member to read it. If you not, I'll copy it and send it to
                      you.
                      In a nutshell, it worked, but was complicated to install and get the
                      angle of the wings set properly. It was neat. the keel pivoted up
                      like a centerboard, while the wings rotated to remain parallel to the
                      bottom. Unfortunately a key part failed, and the wings are now fixed
                      in place. The keel still swing up, but the wings obviiously create
                      more drag the more the keel is lifted. I joke that I've got the only
                      sailboat with brakes. As originally installed, you could sail with
                      the keel lifted and you could use it to adjust helm balanced. Now its
                      only raised to get in and out of shallow channels, and under power.

                      Bolger told me this was a prototype effort, and he intended to use my
                      experience to include a swing wing, with the swiveling wings, on the
                      Insolent 60, but I've never seen drawings of any information on that
                      design, so I don't know if that was done. If anyone has seen plans
                      for the Insolent 60, let me know!

                      Gary Blankenship

                      > We also be interested in you experience with the swing wing keel
                      and
                      > how complicated it was to build and use and anything else you would
                      > like to share about the boat and it's capabilites, and how
                      seaworthy
                      > and effecient it is.
                      >
                      > I have always been fascinated by the idea of such a simple design
                      > having such potential.
                      >
                      > Thanks, Nels
                    • Harry James
                      I know two on this list that really want to see them:) HJ
                      Message 10 of 21 , Mar 3, 2005
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                        I know two on this list that really want to see them:)

                        HJ

                        gbship wrote:

                        >Nels:
                        >I wrote a long article about the wing keel, titled Wing Keel
                        >Travails< for Duckworks Magazine (www.duckworksmagazine.com, and you
                        >can find it in the December 2004 archives, although I think you have
                        >to be a member to read it. If you not, I'll copy it and send it to
                        >you.
                        >In a nutshell, it worked, but was complicated to install and get the
                        >angle of the wings set properly. It was neat. the keel pivoted up
                        >like a centerboard, while the wings rotated to remain parallel to the
                        >bottom. Unfortunately a key part failed, and the wings are now fixed
                        >in place. The keel still swing up, but the wings obviiously create
                        >more drag the more the keel is lifted. I joke that I've got the only
                        >sailboat with brakes. As originally installed, you could sail with
                        >the keel lifted and you could use it to adjust helm balanced. Now its
                        >only raised to get in and out of shallow channels, and under power.
                        >
                        >Bolger told me this was a prototype effort, and he intended to use my
                        >experience to include a swing wing, with the swiveling wings, on the
                        >Insolent 60, but I've never seen drawings of any information on that
                        >design, so I don't know if that was done. If anyone has seen plans
                        >for the Insolent 60, let me know!
                        >
                        >Gary Blankenship
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >>We also be interested in you experience with the swing wing keel
                        >>
                        >>
                        >and
                        >
                        >
                        >>how complicated it was to build and use and anything else you would
                        >>like to share about the boat and it's capabilites, and how
                        >>
                        >>
                        >seaworthy
                        >
                        >
                        >>and effecient it is.
                        >>
                        >>I have always been fascinated by the idea of such a simple design
                        >>having such potential.
                        >>
                        >>Thanks, Nels
                        >>
                        >>
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >Bolger rules!!!
                        >- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
                        >- stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                        >- Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                        >- Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                        >- Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        >- Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        >Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • Nels
                        ... you ... have ... Hi Gary, For some reason I missed reading the entire December issue! Thanks for the great article and also the updates. I enquired quite
                        Message 11 of 21 , Mar 3, 2005
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                          --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "gbship" <gbship@c...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Nels:
                          > I wrote a long article about the wing keel, titled Wing Keel
                          > Travails< for Duckworks Magazine (www.duckworksmagazine.com, and
                          you
                          > can find it in the December 2004 archives, although I think you
                          have
                          > to be a member to read it. If you not, I'll copy it and send it to
                          > you.

                          Hi Gary,

                          For some reason I missed reading the entire December issue! Thanks
                          for the great article and also the updates.

                          I enquired quite awhile back about installing a small swing wing keel
                          in a Long Micro salient keel to give it some added offhsore
                          capability while not intruding on the cabin space. I was informed
                          that that it was most likly to add nothing to a hull of that shape
                          and hull speed. It is a keel designed for a fast narrow hull like
                          yours.

                          Great name for a boat!

                          Cheers, Nels
                        • Susan Davis
                          ... I have a preliminary draft of the plans; scans of the plan view and interior layout are in the Photos section on Bolger4. -- Sue -- (I read your article
                          Message 12 of 21 , Mar 5, 2005
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                            > If anyone has seen plans for the Insolent 60, let me know!

                            I have a preliminary draft of the plans; scans of the plan view and
                            interior layout are in the Photos section on Bolger4.

                            -- Sue --
                            (I read your article and enjoyed it very much, btw.)

                            --
                            Susan Davis <futabachan@...>
                          • Gary Blankenship
                            Susan: I signed up for Bolger4, but can t find the Insolent scans either in the photos or the files. Am I missing something or are they in a folder titled
                            Message 13 of 21 , Mar 5, 2005
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                              Susan:
                              I signed up for Bolger4, but can't find the Insolent scans either in the photos or the files. Am I missing something or are they in a folder titled something elese?

                              Gary

                              ----- Original Message -----
                              From: Susan Davis
                              To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                              Sent: Saturday, March 05, 2005 3:27 AM
                              Subject: [bolger] Swing Wing, was Re: More dipping lugger (probably too much...)



                              > If anyone has seen plans for the Insolent 60, let me know!

                              I have a preliminary draft of the plans; scans of the plan view and
                              interior layout are in the Photos section on Bolger4.

                              -- Sue --
                              (I read your article and enjoyed it very much, btw.)

                              --
                              Susan Davis <futabachan@...>





                              Bolger rules!!!
                              - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
                              - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                              - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                              - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                              - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                              - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com


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                            • Susan Davis
                              ... Eep! Sorry... they re on Bolger3. -- Susan Davis
                              Message 14 of 21 , Mar 5, 2005
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                                Gary:
                                > I signed up for Bolger4, but can't find the Insolent scans either
                                > in the photos or the files. Am I missing something or are they in
                                > a folder titled something else?

                                Eep! Sorry... they're on Bolger3.

                                --
                                Susan Davis <futabachan@...>
                              • Bruce Hallman
                                http://community.webshots.com/album/289729965jYUhbR/0 Just got back from a fun trip on my Micro Navigator, our first overnight trip. Lots of fun, some calm
                                Message 15 of 21 , Mar 6, 2005
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                                  http://community.webshots.com/album/289729965jYUhbR/0

                                  Just got back from a fun trip on my Micro Navigator,
                                  our first 'overnight' trip. Lots of fun, some calm weather,
                                  and then good wind in the afternoons, including a great
                                  reach home across the Golden Gate, with 3 or 4 foot seas.

                                  I had a couple realizations, first, with the hull speed
                                  of a 15 1/2 boat, it doesn't really take much sail
                                  to get the boat up to 'hull speed', beyond that is
                                  just wasted effort on such small hull.

                                  Also, budget extra time, where ever you go, boat ramp,
                                  the dock, etc.. for the conversations with the passer-by's
                                  Really! I am not exaggerating that a dozen times in the
                                  last two days I was engaged by total strangers wanting
                                  to know more. If I was a drinker, I got offered enough
                                  'can I buy you a drink?'s" to get rather drunk if I had desired.
                                  Like it or not, sail an odd looking boat, and you become a
                                  de-facto Bolger emissary.

                                  Susan, David prepare yourself.

                                  The funny thing about the boat is that if feels
                                  simply huge inside, and when you get out and
                                  compare it to ther other boats, it seems very
                                  much tiny, 'Micro'.

                                  I got to try it out for 'windward' ability, and not
                                  having anything to measure against, it is hard
                                  to explain. But we left downtown San Francisco,
                                  under the typical 'westerly' and were able to do
                                  a long tack to windward ending up at downtown
                                  Sausalito. Not disappointing windward progress
                                  at all.
                                • dbaldnz
                                  Great Stuff Bruce! I like that salty shot looking aft with some nice heel. Windscreen wipers for the front next? She looks fine sitting in the berth next to
                                  Message 16 of 21 , Mar 7, 2005
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                                    Great Stuff Bruce!
                                    I like that salty shot looking aft with some nice heel.
                                    Windscreen wipers for the front next?
                                    She looks fine sitting in the berth next to the other yachts.
                                    I got everything set last saturday, wife organised to take sailing
                                    photos, loaded the gear in the car, got there and guess
                                    what?....painted ships on a painted sea. No wind at all for the rest
                                    of the day, so we went home again.
                                    DonB
                                    --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
                                    > http://community.webshots.com/album/289729965jYUhbR/0
                                    >
                                    > Just got back from a fun trip on my Micro Navigator,
                                    > our first 'overnight' trip. Lots of fun, some calm weather,
                                    > and then good wind in the afternoons, including a great
                                    > reach home across the Golden Gate, with 3 or 4 foot seas.
                                    >
                                    > I had a couple realizations, first, with the hull speed
                                    > of a 15 1/2 boat, it doesn't really take much sail
                                    > to get the boat up to 'hull speed', beyond that is
                                    > just wasted effort on such small hull.
                                    >
                                    > Also, budget extra time, where ever you go, boat ramp,
                                    > the dock, etc.. for the conversations with the passer-by's
                                    > Really! I am not exaggerating that a dozen times in the
                                    > last two days I was engaged by total strangers wanting
                                    > to know more. If I was a drinker, I got offered enough
                                    > 'can I buy you a drink?'s" to get rather drunk if I had desired.
                                    > Like it or not, sail an odd looking boat, and you become a
                                    > de-facto Bolger emissary.
                                    >
                                    > Susan, David prepare yourself.
                                    >
                                    > The funny thing about the boat is that if feels
                                    > simply huge inside, and when you get out and
                                    > compare it to ther other boats, it seems very
                                    > much tiny, 'Micro'.
                                    >
                                    > I got to try it out for 'windward' ability, and not
                                    > having anything to measure against, it is hard
                                    > to explain. But we left downtown San Francisco,
                                    > under the typical 'westerly' and were able to do
                                    > a long tack to windward ending up at downtown
                                    > Sausalito. Not disappointing windward progress
                                    > at all.
                                  • woofers94401
                                    Bruce, Looks like saturday was a nice day on the bay. Can you shed a little more light on some of the comments you got about your boat and you think the
                                    Message 17 of 21 , Mar 7, 2005
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                                      Bruce,
                                      Looks like saturday was a nice day on the bay. Can you shed a little
                                      more light on some of the comments you got about your boat and you
                                      think the impression people had of it?

                                      Greg


                                      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
                                      > http://community.webshots.com/album/289729965jYUhbR/0
                                      >
                                      > Just got back from a fun trip on my Micro Navigator,
                                      > our first 'overnight' trip. Lots of fun, some calm weather,
                                      > and then good wind in the afternoons, including a great
                                      > reach home across the Golden Gate, with 3 or 4 foot seas.
                                      >
                                      > I had a couple realizations, first, with the hull speed
                                      > of a 15 1/2 boat, it doesn't really take much sail
                                      > to get the boat up to 'hull speed', beyond that is
                                      > just wasted effort on such small hull.
                                      >
                                      > Also, budget extra time, where ever you go, boat ramp,
                                      > the dock, etc.. for the conversations with the passer-by's
                                      > Really! I am not exaggerating that a dozen times in the
                                      > last two days I was engaged by total strangers wanting
                                      > to know more. If I was a drinker, I got offered enough
                                      > 'can I buy you a drink?'s" to get rather drunk if I had desired.
                                      > Like it or not, sail an odd looking boat, and you become a
                                      > de-facto Bolger emissary.
                                      >
                                      > Susan, David prepare yourself.
                                      >
                                      > The funny thing about the boat is that if feels
                                      > simply huge inside, and when you get out and
                                      > compare it to ther other boats, it seems very
                                      > much tiny, 'Micro'.
                                      >
                                      > I got to try it out for 'windward' ability, and not
                                      > having anything to measure against, it is hard
                                      > to explain. But we left downtown San Francisco,
                                      > under the typical 'westerly' and were able to do
                                      > a long tack to windward ending up at downtown
                                      > Sausalito. Not disappointing windward progress
                                      > at all.
                                    • Bruce Hallman
                                      ... Best weekend of the year, so far! Calm in the morning and 10-15 kt westerlies in the afternoons 65 deg F. ... Curiosity more than anything else.
                                      Message 18 of 21 , Mar 8, 2005
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                                        > Bruce,
                                        > Looks like saturday was a nice day on the bay.

                                        Best weekend of the year, so far! Calm in the morning
                                        and 10-15 kt westerlies in the afternoons 65 deg F.

                                        > Can you shed a little more light on some of the
                                        > comments you got about your boat and you
                                        > think the impression people had of it?
                                        > Greg

                                        Curiosity more than anything else. Basically
                                        everybody starts out with the question: "Did
                                        you build it?" Followed by a long series of
                                        other questions, that after a dozen people
                                        become repetitive.

                                        Some people want to know 'how old' it is.
                                        A certain subset of the group wants to know
                                        how the odd looking sail rig works. Lots of
                                        others are amazed at the glasshouse comfy
                                        cabin on a sailboat. Many others guess that it
                                        must have a centerboard, and are skeptical
                                        that it can function without one.

                                        Considering the fact that 99% of the boats I
                                        see tend to be very much similar to each
                                        other, I suspect mostly their owners are
                                        'conformists' and my boat is definately not
                                        that! So, I am guessing that many who do
                                        not approach me probably view me and my
                                        boat as a "bit odd".

                                        Generally, the people that did have the initiative
                                        to approach me seemed to have a favorable
                                        impression of the boat, and all these people
                                        were friendly! That is a welcome thing! (most the
                                        time), except at times when you are in a hurry
                                        trying to get work done to beat the tide, etc.,
                                        while a small crowd gathers wanting to talk.
                                      • Peter Lenihan
                                        ... Don t worry Bruce,you ll get used to it...trust me :-) Sincerely, Peter Lenihan,ex-Micro owner/builder who finally sold his Micro because he couldn t take
                                        Message 19 of 21 , Mar 8, 2005
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                                          --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
                                          > > Curiosity more than anything else.

                                          Don't worry Bruce,you'll get used to it...trust me :-)

                                          Sincerely,

                                          Peter Lenihan,ex-Micro owner/builder who finally sold his Micro
                                          because he couldn't take the questions anymore..........:-D
                                        • m_doles
                                          You ve probably mentioned it before,but what is the head room on your navigator?
                                          Message 20 of 21 , Mar 9, 2005
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                                            You've probably mentioned it before,but what is the head room on
                                            your navigator?


                                            --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
                                            > http://community.webshots.com/album/289729965jYUhbR/0
                                            >
                                            > Just got back from a fun trip on my Micro Navigator,
                                            > our first 'overnight' trip. Lots of fun, some calm weather,
                                            > and then good wind in the afternoons, including a great
                                            > reach home across the Golden Gate, with 3 or 4 foot seas.
                                            >
                                            > I had a couple realizations, first, with the hull speed
                                            > of a 15 1/2 boat, it doesn't really take much sail
                                            > to get the boat up to 'hull speed', beyond that is
                                            > just wasted effort on such small hull.
                                            >
                                            > Also, budget extra time, where ever you go, boat ramp,
                                            > the dock, etc.. for the conversations with the passer-by's
                                            > Really! I am not exaggerating that a dozen times in the
                                            > last two days I was engaged by total strangers wanting
                                            > to know more. If I was a drinker, I got offered enough
                                            > 'can I buy you a drink?'s" to get rather drunk if I had desired.
                                            > Like it or not, sail an odd looking boat, and you become a
                                            > de-facto Bolger emissary.
                                            >
                                            > Susan, David prepare yourself.
                                            >
                                            > The funny thing about the boat is that if feels
                                            > simply huge inside, and when you get out and
                                            > compare it to ther other boats, it seems very
                                            > much tiny, 'Micro'.
                                            >
                                            > I got to try it out for 'windward' ability, and not
                                            > having anything to measure against, it is hard
                                            > to explain. But we left downtown San Francisco,
                                            > under the typical 'westerly' and were able to do
                                            > a long tack to windward ending up at downtown
                                            > Sausalito. Not disappointing windward progress
                                            > at all.
                                          • Bruce Hallman
                                            ... There is about 3 square feet of floor that has 5 feet 8 1/2 inches of head room. I am six feet tall, and find that plenty adaquate for standing and
                                            Message 21 of 21 , Mar 9, 2005
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                                              > You've probably mentioned it before,but what is the head room on
                                              > your navigator?


                                              There is about 3 square feet of floor that has
                                              5 feet 8 1/2 inches of head room. I am six feet tall,
                                              and find that plenty adaquate for standing and pulling
                                              up my pants, etc..

                                              Also, the roof hatch slides wide open, and
                                              gives unlimited headroom, when open.

                                              The headroom above the berths is very generous
                                              and non-claustrophobic. I don't think I can touch
                                              the ceiling with my hand while seated, 3' 7" from
                                              top of cushion to ceiling.
                                              .
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