Re: Japanese Beach Cruiser
- --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
> > I am posting to ask whether anyone here has built the JapaneseBeach
> > CruiserI daydream of spending a week in this boat nosing around the Deer
> > Anyone ever built her?
> About a dozen times in my mind's eye.
> What a great boat! Please build one and
> take lots of photos to share!
Isle - Isle au Haut region of the Maine coast. But I wonder if she
might be just a bit _too_ small, and possibly a bit tender under
sail. I also am curious about how her leeboards would interact with
the ubiquitous lobster buoys there.
So I thought I might try to find someone who has built and sailed one
before I invest in a set of plans.
- One of this design has been built! I saw it at Grand
Barrachois in New Brunswick. Unfortunately, I did not
get the owner's name, nor photos of the boat. I have
been toying with the idea of building this little
vessel to explore the thin waters around the coast of
Nova Scotia (if this dream reaches fruition, photos
will be forthcoming). Personally, I would not be
concerned at all about tangling with the buoys used on
lobster pots. In the event of entanglement, which for
the most part I believe could easily be avoided,
simply change tack, lift the leeboad and disengage.
According to Bolger's description of the boat, he
designed it so that it would be stiffer than the
average sailboat of this size. He mentioned that it
would not be necessary to hike out over the rail to
sail her. I would guess that the statement is made
with the proviso that an appropriate amount of sail is
shown relative to wind force.
While the design appeals to me, I would find it hard
to resist one or two modifications. First I would rig
the main with a lug sail rather than a sprit. The
second change I'm not so sure of . . . the bilge seems
a mite slack at the stern so I am tempted to push the
second chine down and out a bit to give a bit more
bearing as she heeled. My reservation about this
change is that the more robust bilge at the stern
might cause the rudder to roll up and out of the water
somewhat, thereby reducing its power to control the
boat while heeled.
I've had several years experience sailing a Paceship
17 day sailer which has a typical modern sloop rig
with main and jib. In heavy winds, it does not lend
itself well to single handing. I've had two capsizes
to atest to that difficulty. To my eye, the Japanese
Beach Cruiser is ideal. The small mizzen will tend to
make the boat weather vane into the wind in a gust,
assuming one hands the main sheet in such conditions.
Barring unforseen circumstances, I am hoping next
summer will see me begin construction of my own
Japanese Beach Cruiser.
--- robt_l_hazard <robt_l_hazard@...> wrote:
> --- In email@example.com, Bruce Hallman__________________________________________________
> <bruce@h...> wrote:
> > > I am posting to ask whether anyone here has
> built the Japanese
> > > Cruiser
> > > Anyone ever built her?
> > About a dozen times in my mind's eye.
> > What a great boat! Please build one and
> > take lots of photos to share!
> I daydream of spending a week in this boat nosing
> around the Deer
> Isle - Isle au Haut region of the Maine coast. But I
> wonder if she
> might be just a bit _too_ small, and possibly a bit
> tender under
> sail. I also am curious about how her leeboards
> would interact with
> the ubiquitous lobster buoys there.
> So I thought I might try to find someone who has
> built and sailed one
> before I invest in a set of plans.
Do You Yahoo!?
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> ...the bilge seemsBolger has written about this in several places including the
> a mite slack at the stern so I am tempted to push the
> second chine down and out a bit to give a bit more
> bearing as she heeled.
Spartina chapter of BWAOM. There is a trade-off in stern design. A
wide stern with a lot of bearing gives more power to carry sail and
a higher top speed, but requires that the live ballast keeps the
boat from heeling. If the boat heels and the bow goes down, the
sailing and handling suffer greatly. I would trust PCB. Besides, you
are not likely to change it enough to make a really big difference.
Down around where I am, I would be surprised if you capsized a
Paceship 17 once in a lifetime, though you probably could have
managed it yesterday since we had 20 kt winds and 3 1/2 ft seas (a
few 5' 'rogue waves' :)). It does suggest that you should have a rig
that is easy to reef and certainly the sprit does not shine in that
department. Your change to a lug could be an improvement. Chances
are that PCB used the sprit because the spars can be a little
- I would be very reluctant to make changes to
Japanese Beach Cruiser, unless I was willing to
accept that the changes would be likely for the
worse! Second guessing Phil Bolger is usually
a bad bet.
Bolger wrote: "This craft would make a good ship's
boat with lifeboat capabilities."
Neither the chapter in Boats With an Open Mind,
nor the writeup in Small Boat Journal #68 illustrate
the 'thatched' shelter but I would be curious what he
had in mind of this.
The use of a vang to the peak of the sprit is new to me.
Anybody care to estimate the weight of the
- --- In firstname.lastname@example.org, Bruce Hallman <bruce@h...> wrote:
> I would be very reluctant to make changes toHeheh. ;)
> Japanese Beach Cruiser, unless I was willing to
> accept that the changes would be likely for the
> worse! Second guessing Phil Bolger is usually
> a bad bet.
Jason, glutin for punishment
- --- In email@example.com, Richard Johnson
> One of this design has been built!I would certainly try to track down the owner if possible. For
example - Any potential challenges if one wants to have a motor on it?
Sure be great to see some photos of one and compare to say an OLDSHOE.
> Anybody care to estimate the weight of theWell, the plans are marked for 355Kg Displacement. Say 780 lbs.
> completed boat?
Subtracting 400 lbs for two crew and gear gives 380 lbs.
Subjectively, that seems just a bit high. I would have guess the bare
hull at less than 300.
Bolger does allow quite a bit for gear and crew in a boat like this.
This illustrates some of his thinkig about the light quarters. This
boat is going to be two heavy to get up and plane, so it makes sense
to make it easy to handle since the loss of speed is minimal.
- Re the Paceship 17 capsize:
After years of experience I came to realize that the
boat was either (a) poorly designed or (b) not built
to the designer's specifications particularly as to
the placement of the centerboard. When I bought the
boat I thought because I was purchasing from a
reputable manufacturer (Paceship, Mahone Bay, NS -
since defunct) and that the design came from a
reputsble design firm (C & C - still in business) that
I would not need the help of an experienced sailor
friend to take it for sea trials. Alas, such was not
the case. I suspect that Paceship did not built to
The boat was delivered with a rudder on which the kick
up portion was fabricated from steel plate. As many
are no doubt aware, this can cause lee helm on its
own. After the first year of sailing I realized that
there might be a problem so built new rudder of
plywood and covered it with glass cloth and resin. The
new rudder seemed to overcome the handling sensitivity
I felt with the metal rudder but still it did not
solve the problem. In my third sailing season, the
boat went over in a heavy gust despite having a three
foot reef tied in, letting go the jib and pushing the
helm to leeward.
At the time I thought the incident was a fluke. A
second capsize occurred in the fifth season at which
time I figured the mast should be raked aft to
compensate. This did help but still did not resolve
the problem. By the sixth season I believe the
inevitable restructuring was the only cure. I tore the
deck off the hull, cut out the centerboard and
replaced it with a dagger board. Unfortunately, its a
mite too far forward, so now I have lots of weather
helm - better than lee helm anyway. Now I figure I'll
build a mast two feet taller and shorten the boom, fit
a new mainsail with a shorter foot and longer luff to
reduce the weather helm. As well I'll have the sail
flattened slightly and bring the draft forward a bit
which should also help.
Some time over the last decade I've come into contact
with two other owners of Paceship 17s. Both experience
handling problems. One gent said he only sailed on
days when the wind was not too strong and the other
said that he was "very careful" when he was sailing in
Thanks to all for your comments re changing the bilge
at the stern. As I said, I had some reservations about
making such a change and I feel comfortable with the
consensus that that aspect should not be tampered
--- pvanderwaart <pvanderwaart@...> wrote:
> > ...the bilge seems__________________________________
> > a mite slack at the stern so I am tempted to push
> > second chine down and out a bit to give a bit more
> > bearing as she heeled.
> Bolger has written about this in several places
> including the
> Spartina chapter of BWAOM. There is a trade-off in
> stern design. A
> wide stern with a lot of bearing gives more power to
> carry sail and
> a higher top speed, but requires that the live
> ballast keeps the
> boat from heeling. If the boat heels and the bow
> goes down, the
> sailing and handling suffer greatly. I would trust
> PCB. Besides, you
> are not likely to change it enough to make a really
> big difference.
> Down around where I am, I would be surprised if you
> capsized a
> Paceship 17 once in a lifetime, though you probably
> could have
> managed it yesterday since we had 20 kt winds and 3
> 1/2 ft seas (a
> few 5' 'rogue waves' :)). It does suggest that you
> should have a rig
> that is easy to reef and certainly the sprit does
> not shine in that
> department. Your change to a lug could be an
> improvement. Chances
> are that PCB used the sprit because the spars can be
> a little
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