Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: How much sail lead in a micro?

Expand Messages
  • Peter Lenihan
    ... The question ... tabernackle ... and ... the ... Hi Todd, Just curious but if you are doing your sailing along the beautiful sunny coast of Southern
    Message 1 of 18 , Jul 2, 2004
    • 0 Attachment
      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Todd" <ktsrfer@m...> wrote:
      The question
      > has risen from my interest in moving the mast foward on a
      tabernackle
      > and maybe adding a junk sail. I don't know much but would this
      > increase the percentage of leed and in turn reduce weather helm
      and
      > or be able to carry more sail area and not effect the balance as
      the
      > standard rig?
      >
      > Todd

      Hi Todd,
      Just curious but if you are doing your sailing along the
      beautiful sunny coast of Southern California,why would you need a
      tabernacle for you mainmast anyway? Surely there can't be that many
      low lying bridges to contend with :-)
      As long as the center of effort for the junk mainsail remains
      in the same postion as on the standard Micro rig,I think it fair to
      conclude that handling the helm will be the same.
      However,if you start shifting centers around without
      considering other adjustments,then you could be setting yourself for
      some disappointment.
      Perhaps to get the best return on your proposed modification,it
      would be best to write the designer for specs. best suited for your
      needs?
      Sorry I can't be more helpful :-(

      Sincerely,

      Peter Lenihan
    • Peter Lenihan
      ... I also mean winds above 15knots not ... helm ... seems ... the ... Another thought; do you have two reef points or just the one shown on the original Micro
      Message 2 of 18 , Jul 2, 2004
      • 0 Attachment
        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Todd" <ktsrfer@m...> wrote:
        I also mean winds above 15knots not
        > below 15mph. With the mizzen sheeted tight still lots of weather
        helm
        > and when main sail is reefed with mizzen still flying eases the
        > weather helm sure butt we have wicked short steep chop and it
        seems
        > the hull could handle more sail area but I would like it with out
        the
        > weather helm.
        > Todd

        Another thought; do you have two reef points or just the one shown
        on the original Micro sail plan? I had a second one put in about
        half way between the foot of the sail and the first(only) reef
        points shown on the original plans.
        I did this since I found that the original reefed main was only
        slightly larger then the mizzen in area and just about left the boat
        dead in the water in winds between 15 and about 25 knots.Putting in
        that second set of reef points allowed me to have better control
        over the amount of de-powering of the rig without going straight
        into full gale mode :-)

        Sincerely,

        Peter Lenihan
      • Peter Lenihan
        ... what ... Todd, I love that nifty image of your sampan! In particular,it has the proportions such that it could be almost any size and still look good. Lots
        Message 3 of 18 , Jul 2, 2004
        • 0 Attachment
          --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Todd" <ktsrfer@m...> wrote:
          > I posted a file of Todds micro sampan in bolgers 4 have a look
          what
          > do you think put some fun back into my micro I think.


          Todd,
          I love that nifty image of your sampan! In particular,it has the
          proportions such that it could be almost any size and still look
          good. Lots of great interior room too,I suspect :-)
          Sadly, I don't think it will help much in putting some fun back
          into your Micro since it is begining to get further away from the
          clean simple elegance afforded by the original Micro design.
          Nevertheless, your rendering certainly merits further study and
          perhaps even a proper design work-up,on a fresh clean sheet of
          drafting paper. Imagine this design about 20' to 24' loa,with full
          standing headroom,enclosed head,leeboards,flat steel-plate on
          outside of hull bottom for ballast and grounding protection.....!
          You could call it the TODDPAN 24 and market it world wide from
          the confines of your own floating office which,of course, would be
          the prototype of this new design offering :-)
          Now that sounds like good fun to me :-)


          Sincerely,

          Peter Lenihan
        • pvanderwaart
          ... In Bolgerland, Mizzen just for balance = yawl Mizzen provides drive = ketch Peter
          Message 4 of 18 , Jul 2, 2004
          • 0 Attachment
            > Mizzen behind the helm = yawl
            > Mizzen forward of helm = ketch

            In Bolgerland,

            Mizzen just for balance = yawl
            Mizzen provides drive = ketch

            Peter
          • dangonn@yahoo.com
            Seems to me that s a good suggestion...adding another set of reef points to give another reefing option for the conditions. I haven t suffered from too much
            Message 5 of 18 , Jul 2, 2004
            • 0 Attachment
              Seems to me that's a good suggestion...adding another set of reef points to give another
              reefing option for the conditions. I haven't suffered from too much weather helm with my
              Long Micro (which has a similar rig). I keep the mizzen snotter quite tight so that I can
              sheet in the mizzen a bit harder than the mainsail.

              Wouldn't moving the mainsail forward increase (not decrease) weather helm? The more
              lead the more weather helm, right? Or maybe I have this reversed. Just curious, thanks.

              Hope that helps,

              Dan

              Long Micro pages: http://www.znw.com/homepage/zephyr.htm

              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Peter Lenihan" <peterlenihan@h...> wrote:
              > Another thought; do you have two reef points or just the one shown
              > on the original Micro sail plan? I had a second one put in about
              > half way between the foot of the sail and the first(only) reef
              > points shown on the original plans.
              > I did this since I found that the original reefed main was only
              > slightly larger then the mizzen in area and just about left the boat
              > dead in the water in winds between 15 and about 25 knots.Putting in
              > that second set of reef points allowed me to have better control
              > over the amount of de-powering of the rig without going straight
              > into full gale mode :-)
              >
              > Sincerely,
              >
              > Peter Lenihan
            • Bill Kreamer
              Lead produces lee helm (because the sail’s center of effort, CE, is forward of the hull’s center of lateral resistance, CLR); more lead = more lee helm. -
              Message 6 of 18 , Jul 2, 2004
              • 0 Attachment
                Lead produces lee helm (because the sail’s center of effort, CE, is
                forward of the hull’s center of lateral resistance, CLR); more lead =
                more lee helm. - Bill

                -----Original Message-----
                From: dangonn@... [mailto:dangonn@...]
                Sent: Friday, July 02, 2004 10:31
                To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [bolger] Re: How much sail lead in a micro?

                Seems to me that's a good suggestion...adding another set of reef points
                to give another
                reefing option for the conditions. I haven't suffered from too much
                weather helm with my
                Long Micro (which has a similar rig). I keep the mizzen snotter quite
                tight so that I can
                sheet in the mizzen a bit harder than the mainsail.

                Wouldn't moving the mainsail forward increase (not decrease) weather
                helm? The more
                lead the more weather helm, right? Or maybe I have this reversed. Just
                curious, thanks.

                Hope that helps,

                Dan

                Long Micro pages: http://www.znw.com/homepage/zephyr.htm

                --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Peter Lenihan" <peterlenihan@h...>
                wrote:
                > Another thought; do you have two reef points or just the one shown
                > on the original Micro sail plan? I had a second one put in about
                > half way between the foot of the sail and the first(only) reef
                > points shown on the original plans.
                > I did this since I found that the original reefed main was only
                > slightly larger then the mizzen in area and just about left the boat
                > dead in the water in winds between 15 and about 25 knots.Putting in
                > that second set of reef points allowed me to have better control
                > over the amount of de-powering of the rig without going straight
                > into full gale mode :-)
                >
                > Sincerely,
                >
                > Peter Lenihan



                Bolger rules!!!
                - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
                - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                - Pls add your comments at the TOP, SIGN your posts, and snip away
                - Plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930,
                Fax: (978) 282-1349
                - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com





                Yahoo! Groups Sponsor


                ADVERTISEMENT

                <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129mqos5m/M=296967.5106131.6227187.3294649/
                D=groups/S=1705065791:HM/EXP=1088865053/A=2196952/R=2/id=noscript/SIG=13
                04ck1na/*http:/www.sodaclubusa.com/referrer.asp?redirect=rv_boat_camp.as
                p&referrer=0002_0015_0178_0002%20>


                <http://us.a1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/a/so/sodaclub/alternate_320x250_06150
                4.jpg>


                <http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?M=296967.5106131.6227187.3294649/D=group
                s/S=:HM/A=2196952/rand=166634919>

                _____

                Yahoo! Groups Links
                * To visit your group on the web, go to:
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/

                * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                <mailto:bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>

                * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Service.


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.