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Re: Common Sense Boats which site to buy from?

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  • Nels
    ... I would tend to agree and I am sure Mr. Bolger would. It seems to that his collaboration with Dynamite Payson was a wonderful event for folks who love
    Message 1 of 23 , Dec 11, 2003
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      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "doug6949" <prototype@c...> wrote:
      > I think you are correct. PCB is not a business
      > minded person - just a great designer.

      I would tend to agree and I am sure Mr. Bolger would. It seems to
      that his collaboration with Dynamite Payson was a wonderful event for
      folks who love small boats but don't have much money. PCB basically
      adapted ideas he had - to be produced in plywood - and Dynamite
      tested them out and Phil allowed him to sell the plans and likely
      charged a nominal royalty.

      The late Elrow Larowe commisioned a few designs and likely got
      permsission to advertise and market plans as well. He did it purely
      out of love for the designs with no intention of making money. He was
      already retired and on a pension. He probably paid a small royalty as
      well.

      When Bernie took over Elrowe's business he obviously had PCB's
      permission to market the plans and Phil even added a few more, some
      specifically to answer wish lists for Bernie. Fish Cat and Idaho come
      to mind but this was at a particularly creative period and Mr. Bolger
      was cranking out exciting designs much quicker than anyone could
      build prototypes. The Birdwatcher and Microtrawler variations and the
      State's designs, just to mention a few.

      Now here is where I think things went awry. Bernie Wolfard really
      thought he could make a good living out of his passion for building
      and trying out Mr. Bolger's designs and selling the plans through
      catalogues and newsletters. Being a secondary suppplier for materials
      and even producing kits. Wrong! It didn't work despite his best
      efforts and here is perhaps why:

      1. You can't get rich selling to poor people.

      2. Most of his customers were dreamers and not really buyers.

      3. He was spending most of his time, money and efforts promoting
      plans, offering help and advice to free loaders and getting more and
      more in the hole financewise.

      So he lowered his prices and got even more products - but there
      really wasn't a market to support the business. He could not
      encourage prototype builders to follow through and everyone was
      waiting for the other shoe to fall. Eventually he got fed up, and was
      behind on his royalty payments because he was broke.

      He ended up basically giving away the business to another gentleman
      who probably feels he can make a living at it to. However - although
      Bernie had permission to market many of the newer plans from PCB -
      that did not give him the right to sell that persmission to someone
      else. And that is where it all fell apart.

      Meanwhile Dynamite continued to sell plans as well as books and some
      other items. He is a very astute business man, and I am sure knows
      that you won't make a living selling small boat plans and therefore
      runs it as a hobby with no intention of making a living at it. His
      plans and services are a way underpriced. (You can purchase a boat
      plan from him for less than what a carton of cigarettes costs in
      Canada in most places.) By comparison, what PCB&F charge seems high,
      yet their prices are low compared to most places - even though many
      people complain about them being unreasonable.

      So what we end up with is proof again of an old adage: If you sell
      yourself too short, others will as well.

      The main problem is that this is a very limited market and if we
      don't adequately support it - the suppplies will disappear. And I
      include MAIB, in this scenario as well.

      That's how I see it, based on my own experience as a small business
      person.

      Nels
    • stampbrat
      ... some ... come ... Actually Fishcat was a LaRowe design as well as what we call the CSD Pirogue . See http://www.boatdesign.com/micro/letters/mnl05.htm
      Message 2 of 23 , Dec 11, 2003
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        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Nels" <arvent@h...> wrote:
        > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "doug6949" <prototype@c...> wrote:
        >
        > ....When Bernie took over Elrowe's business he obviously had PCB's
        > permission to market the plans and Phil even added a few more,
        some
        > specifically to answer wish lists for Bernie. Fish Cat and Idaho
        come
        > to mind .....
        > Nels

        Actually "Fishcat" was a LaRowe design as well as what we call
        the "CSD Pirogue". See
        http://www.boatdesign.com/micro/letters/mnl05.htm

        Brat
      • John Spoering
        Hi All - I think Peter has the right idea. PB and his wife run what must be pretty much a 2 man operation and the output is nothing short of prodigious. For
        Message 3 of 23 , Dec 11, 2003
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          Hi All -

          I think Peter has the right idea. PB and his wife run what must be pretty much a 2 man operation and the output is nothing short of prodigious. For now any one interested in bolger designs has plenty of info available to them. Get his books - new and used, go online to Yahoo's Bolger site & join-up, talk freely about your needs there and lastly FAX PB&F directly - the answeres to your questions come back very quickly. That's more than enough for now.

          Aloha - Jack Spoering - Ft Lauderdale

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Bruce Hallman
          ... .................^^^^^^ Better put, builders . There just might be a real market selling to the dreamers. Lower the prices on plans, selling them as
          Message 4 of 23 , Dec 11, 2003
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            --- Nels wrote:
            > 2. Most of his customers were dreamers
            > and not really buyers.
            .................^^^^^^

            Better put, "builders".

            There just might be a real market selling
            to the dreamers. Lower the prices on
            plans, selling them as 'study plans only'
            for $20 each. Make it up on volume.

            I would be a real buyer for a deal like
            that!.............^^^^^
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