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  • tommol@netcon.net.au
    Message tommol@netcon.net.au Folders Create Message Preferences Address Book Log Out Move to: INBOXSent.2002.05-MaySent.2002.06-JunTrash Message 1 of 61
    Message 1 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
      Message tommol@...


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      Message 1 of 61



      From: tommol@...
      To: bolger_coffee_lounge@yahoogroups.com
      Date: 02 Dec 2003, 10:14:40 PM



      ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      ----
      BOLGER AS39 (or is it AS38?). First time I have ever attempted a group
      discussion. What is the drill? I want to talk to someone who is building the
      38 (or 39) and preferably someone in Australia. I am TOM MOLONEY and I live
      in Bendigo which is 100 miles from the sea in the south of Australia. I saw
      the 38 in Boats with an Open Mind in 1996, got the plans and have been
      putting together little bits of it ever since. Now I want to get stuck into
      major building but i want to talk with a builder who may have solved some of
      my problems already.
      For example,

      - 12mm ply or 15mm?
      - will there be distortion of the sides of the boat with what appears to be
      so little support?
      - are galvanised bolts safe in the lower part of the bottom? are they
      sufficiently protected by the suggested several layers of fibreglass? what
      is the experience of owners who have had the boat in the water for some
      years?
      - hundreds of other predictable questions

      That sort of question.

      Is there anyone who wants to talk about this sort of thing?

      Regards,

      Tom Moloney
      tommol@...
      3 December 2003
    • David Ryan
      Tom, Welcome to the list! As far as I know, there has only been one Loose Moose II (aka AS38) built following the original plan. This was build by Bob and
      Message 2 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
        Tom,

        Welcome to the list!

        As far as I know, there has only been one Loose Moose II (aka AS38)
        built following the original plan. This was build by Bob and Sheila
        Wise, who commissioned the design. I've talked with Bob quite a bit
        about his experience in commissioning, building and cruising the
        LMII. He'd be the first to tell you it's not a perfect boat, but
        overall he seems very happy with it. Bob and Sheila cruise the Loose
        Moose II throughout the French Canal System, the Med, the coast of
        West Africa, and ultimately cross the Atlantic in it. They found it
        to be a seaworthy, fast, capacious boat. I'm sure if you write him a
        polite e-mail he'd have a few thoughts for you.

        At least one other LMII was built, with some deviation from the
        specs. How happy the owner was with the outcome I can't say.

        There is currently under construction in Quebec a LMII with PCB
        modifications. Some of these are revisions based on the first boat
        performance, some are modifications to make the Quebec LMII more
        suitable for cold weather, and some are evolutions in Bolger's
        thinking. As far as I know this boat has yet to be launched.

        Yours In Boat Building,

        David






        ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
        ----
        BOLGER AS39 (or is it AS38?). First time I have ever attempted a group
        discussion. What is the drill? I want to talk to someone who is building the
        38 (or 39) and preferably someone in Australia. I am TOM MOLONEY and I live
        in Bendigo which is 100 miles from the sea in the south of Australia. I saw
        the 38 in Boats with an Open Mind in 1996, got the plans and have been
        putting together little bits of it ever since. Now I want to get stuck into
        major building but i want to talk with a builder who may have solved some of
        my problems already.
        For example,

        - 12mm ply or 15mm?
        - will there be distortion of the sides of the boat with what appears to be
        so little support?
        - are galvanised bolts safe in the lower part of the bottom? are they
        sufficiently protected by the suggested several layers of fibreglass? what
        is the experience of owners who have had the boat in the water for some
        years?
        - hundreds of other predictable questions

        That sort of question.

        Is there anyone who wants to talk about this sort of thing?

        Regards,

        Tom Moloney
        tommol@...
        3 December 2003


        --

        C.E.P.
        415 W.46th Street
        New York, New York 10036
        http://www.crumblingempire.com
        Mobile (646) 325-8325
        Office (212) 247-0296
      • pvanderwaart
        ... It seems to me that there was a fellow who had a LMII built by a professional. Once it was built, he hated it, finding the interior too much of a dark
        Message 3 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
          > At least one other LMII was built, with some deviation from the
          > specs. How happy the owner was with the outcome I can't say.

          It seems to me that there was a fellow who had a LMII built by a
          professional. Once it was built, he hated it, finding the interior
          too much of a dark tunnel.

          A story like this is food for thought. I would always hesitate to
          take it literally, at least without some confirmation, because
          someone who is greatly dissatisfied is likely to overstate his case,
          and without investigation it's impossible to know if his expectations
          were reasonable in the first place. In fact, it's hard to know if our
          own expectations are reasonable.

          Peter
        • Bruce Hallman
          ... Wow. I am impressed that you still have a positive attitude, 7 plus years into building such a monumental boat. Questions ... Those are all trivial
          Message 4 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
            --- Tom Moloney wrote:
            > BOLGER AS39 ...got the plans and have been
            > putting together little bits of it ever since.

            Wow. I am impressed that you still have a
            positive attitude, 7 plus years into building
            such a monumental boat.

            Questions
            > - 12mm ply or 15mm?
            > - will there be distortion of the sides
            > - are galvanised bolts safe
            > - hundreds of other predictable questions

            Those are all trivial questions <smile>!

            Don't be distracted, work on your Zen,
            push ahead without hesitation!
          • pvanderwaart
            ... Hi, You might want to search the archives of this group to find the thread about the AS-29 Alisa, keeping in mind that it is one particular boat, and that
            Message 5 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
              > - will there be distortion of the sides of the boat with
              > what appears to be so little support?

              Hi,

              You might want to search the archives of this group to find the
              thread about the AS-29 Alisa, keeping in mind that it is one
              particular boat, and that other builders have not had the same
              problems.

              There were maintenance problems on Alisa that seem to have originated
              with poor constuction at the chines and the centerboard cases,
              complicated by a lack of effective epoxy encapsulation. For all I
              know, the material was of a rot-prone type. If I remember the report
              correctly, a distortion formed in the bottom during constuction so
              that the bottom section mid-ships was concave (i.e. higher in the
              middle) rather than perfectly flat as it should be. To me, this
              suggests too much stress in the ply bottom planking.

              As for the galvanized bolts, Bolger is not casual about his
              recommendations for materials, and in most cases I would trust his
              specs. It is possible, however, that the cost/longevity tradeoff that
              he has in mind for a particular design (appropriate to the original
              client) is not the one that you would prefer. If you have any doubts,
              fax him; he would be happy to respond to that sort of inquiry.

              Peter
            • David Ryan
              Tom, Did I misunderstand? Do you already have a Loose Moose II under construction? Are you really out in the Australian desert, building an ark, and waiting
              Message 6 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
                Tom,

                Did I misunderstand? Do you already have a Loose Moose II under
                construction? Are you really out in the Australian desert, building
                an ark, and waiting for the flood?!?

                If so, please post pictures!

                YIBB,

                David
                --

                C.E.P.
                415 W.46th Street
                New York, New York 10036
                http://www.crumblingempire.com
                Mobile (646) 325-8325
                Office (212) 247-0296
              • Bruce Hallman
                Tom, You may or not know of the Bolger upgrade to the AS39 design from about one year back. As I recall, 1) They revised the ballast, to be external steel
                Message 7 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
                  Tom,

                  You may or not know of the
                  Bolger 'upgrade' to the AS39
                  design from about one year back.

                  As I recall,

                  1) They revised the ballast,
                  to be external steel plate.

                  2) They revised the shape of
                  the bow, including 'rounding'
                  the lines, and widening the
                  size of the tabernacle well
                  with greatly improved the
                  anchor handling through a clever
                  'A-frame' winch thingy.

                  3) They added a contoured
                  bulb to the bottom at the bow
                  to improve 'armor' against
                  collisions while at the same
                  time improving the splashing
                  noise problem while anchored.

                  4) Other changes I don't remember.

                  You could learn more by asking them.
                • Nels
                  ... case, ... expectations ... our ... I seem to recall something along that line too. Seems to me that somebody had bought one and were re-selling it. One of
                  Message 8 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
                    --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "pvanderwaart" <pvanderw@o...> wrote:
                    > > At least one other LMII was built, with some deviation from the
                    > > specs. How happy the owner was with the outcome I can't say.
                    >
                    > It seems to me that there was a fellow who had a LMII built by a
                    > professional. Once it was built, he hated it, finding the interior
                    > too much of a dark tunnel.
                    >
                    > A story like this is food for thought. I would always hesitate to
                    > take it literally, at least without some confirmation, because
                    > someone who is greatly dissatisfied is likely to overstate his
                    case,
                    > and without investigation it's impossible to know if his
                    expectations
                    > were reasonable in the first place. In fact, it's hard to know if
                    our
                    > own expectations are reasonable.
                    >
                    > Peter

                    I seem to recall something along that line too. Seems to me that
                    somebody had bought one and were re-selling it. One of the reasons
                    given was that every time he wanted to enjoy a coffee on deck - or
                    get a re-fill he had to climb down and back up the ladder. Things
                    like that. He was however quick to point out it's many advantages as
                    well. Just wasn't his cup of tea (or coffee) as he hadn't considered
                    these things before he bought it.

                    What you say about expectations is a very good point, as that
                    information gave me pause for thought about living aboard full time!

                    Cheers, Nels
                  • Nels
                    ... bAS39 (or is it AS38?). First time I have ever attempted a group ... want to talk with a builder who may have solved some of ... . ... Here are a couple of
                    Message 9 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
                      --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, tommol@n... wrote:
                      ----
                      bAS39 (or is it AS38?). First time I have ever attempted a group
                      > discussion. What is the drill? I want to talk to someone who is bi
                      want to talk with a builder who may have solved some of
                      > my problems already.
                      > For example,
                      .
                      >
                      > Is there anyone who wants to talk about this sort of thing?
                      >
                      > Regards,
                      >
                      > Tom Moloney
                      > tommol@n...
                      > 3 December 2003

                      Here are a couple of websites with information:

                      http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/as39ba.htm#start

                      http://www.paradiseconnections.com/about-info.html

                      You might be able to email Bob Wise if he is still in St. Thomas

                      Good luck, Nels
                    • Nels
                      ... mais oui, en Francais! http://cf.geocities.com/lecabotin/
                      Message 10 of 10 , Dec 2, 2003
                        --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Nels" <arvent@h...> wrote:
                        > Here are a couple of websites with information:
                        >
                        > http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/as39ba.htm#start
                        >
                        > http://www.paradiseconnections.com/about-info.html
                        >
                        > You might be able to email Bob Wise if he is still in St. Thomas
                        >
                        > Here is the link to the one being built in Quebec -

                        mais oui, en Francais!

                        http://cf.geocities.com/lecabotin/
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