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Re: [bolger] Re: Sneakeasy "Katie" report

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  • Roger Derby
    I wish I had more details to give. As far as the mix goes, one just plays around on test pieces until it feels right. (I suspect that the carbide powder is
    Message 1 of 9 , Sep 3, 2003
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      I wish I had more details to give. As far as the mix goes, one just plays
      around on test pieces until it feels right. (I suspect that the carbide
      powder is non-thixatropic so one would add that stuff (colloidal silica)
      first and then stir in the carbide.

      The Aussie had a local source which isn't worth much to us in the Northern
      hemisphere. I searched for the stuff on the net and since I wanted a few
      pounds, not several hopper cars full, didn't have any luck.

      Following a suggestion in MAIB from several years ago, I did experiment with
      lime (from the garden shop) as a filler. Not bullet-proof like the carbide
      would be, but it did give a hard surface and it was cheap. I used it on a
      bulkhead which formed part of the anchor storage bin and could be expected
      to get a lot of abuse. As above, I used colloidal silica first and then
      added the lime.

      Roger
      derbyrm@...
      http://derbyrm.mystarband.net

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Paul" <bys@...>


      > --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Roger Derby" <derbyrm@s...> wrote:
      > > A few years back, on rec.boats.building, some Aussie kayaker
      > > mentioned that they painted at least part of their boat's bottom
      > > with a mix of epoxy and carbide. Instead of the concrete
      > > wearing away the boat, their boats made
      > > grooves in the dock.
      > >
      > > Katie might still be right for you.
      > >
      > > Roger
      > > derbyrm@s...
      > > http://derbyrm.mystarband.net
      > >
      > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > From: "Sal's Dad" <sals_dad@b...>
      > >
      > > Wow!!! More details please, we all want a bulletproof bolger boat.
      > Could you supply the mix, type of carbide, suppliers etc. Great
      > discussion at the messabout. Paul McLellan
      > > <snip>
      > >
      > > > Why "almost-perfect"?
      > >
      > > > Half our landings are on ledge or sharp stone beaches,
      > > > which will tear up the plywood (Diablo has a metal
      > > > plate on the stem and forward bottom) and passenger
      > > > entry/exit must be over the bow.
    • chodges31711
      ... Northern ... a few ... I work for CE Minerals at the Andersonville mines. We crush and size fused white alumina and sintered tabular alumina. This is 99+%
      Message 2 of 9 , Sep 3, 2003
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        >
        > The Aussie had a local source which isn't worth much to us in the
        Northern
        > hemisphere. I searched for the stuff on the net and since I wanted
        a few
        > pounds, not several hopper cars full, didn't have any luck.


        I work for CE Minerals at the Andersonville mines. We crush and size
        fused white alumina and sintered tabular alumina. This is 99+%
        aluminum oxide like grinder discs are made from. We fuse it to get
        crystals and then fracture it to get the sharp edges. Sizes from 3
        mesh down to 325. It is very hard stuff and probably cheaper than
        carbide. I'm not in the marketing end but we package from 50 lb. bags
        to unit trains and ship loads. There are many other types of hard
        minerals that could be put in epoxy and would give good wear
        resistance. Maybe even granite fines from a stone cutters saw or
        monument carver.

        www.ceminerals.com

        Charles
      • chodges31711
        This site has a hardness scale in moh s. http://webmineral.com/help/Hardness.shtml diamond is 10, carbide is 9.5, corundum (Al. oxide) is 9.0 Quartz (sand/
        Message 3 of 9 , Sep 3, 2003
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          This site has a hardness scale in moh's.

          http://webmineral.com/help/Hardness.shtml

          diamond is 10, carbide is 9.5, corundum (Al. oxide) is 9.0
          Quartz (sand/ glass) is 7.0, steel is 5.5


          Most rocks are probably in the 3-5 range so if your coating is harder
          than steel (5.5) it should do the job. You would want it tough enough
          not to shatter and come off. The epoxy should bind it in a matrix and
          help that. An experiment with a small piece of wood might be
          worthwhile.

          Charles
        • Mark A.
          Others that are commonly used on the Northwest river running boats include mixed in graphite powder, or an overlay of UHMW. Mark
          Message 4 of 9 , Sep 3, 2003
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            Others that are commonly used on the Northwest river running boats include mixed in
            graphite powder, or an overlay of UHMW.


            Mark

            chodges31711 wrote:
            > There are many other types of hard
            > minerals that could be put in epoxy and would give good wear
            > resistance. Maybe even granite fines from a stone cutters saw or
            > monument carver.
          • Harry James
            A recent boatbuilder magazine had an article on a experiment by a boatbuilding amateur. He found 1 layer of Xynole to be 6 times as abrasion resistant as 1
            Message 5 of 9 , Sep 3, 2003
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              A recent boatbuilder magazine had an article on a experiment by a
              boatbuilding amateur. He found 1 layer of Xynole to be 6 times as
              abrasion resistant as 1 layer of 6 oz fiberglas. Because of the extra
              bulk of the xynole, it was only 2 times as resistant by thickness.

              HJ

              Roger Derby wrote:

              >I wish I had more details to give. As far as the mix goes, one just plays
              >around on test pieces until it feels right. (I suspect that the carbide
              >powder is non-thixatropic so one would add that stuff (colloidal silica)
              >first and then stir in the carbide.
              >
              >The Aussie had a local source which isn't worth much to us in the Northern
              >hemisphere. I searched for the stuff on the net and since I wanted a few
              >pounds, not several hopper cars full, didn't have any luck.
              >
              >Following a suggestion in MAIB from several years ago, I did experiment with
              >lime (from the garden shop) as a filler. Not bullet-proof like the carbide
              >would be, but it did give a hard surface and it was cheap. I used it on a
              >bulkhead which formed part of the anchor storage bin and could be expected
              >to get a lot of abuse. As above, I used colloidal silica first and then
              >added the lime.
              >
              >Roger
              >derbyrm@...
              >http://derbyrm.mystarband.net
              >
              >----- Original Message -----
              >From: "Paul" <bys@...>
              >
              >
              >
              >
            • philippe peltier
              You should try to do the first layer of underwater paint with pitch epoxy.. Works great...see : HYPERLINK
              Message 6 of 9 , Sep 4, 2003
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                You should try to do the first layer of underwater paint with pitch
                epoxy.. Works great...see :
                HYPERLINK
                "http://www.surtech2000.co.uk/Wall%20Product%20Pages/pitchepoxy.html"htt
                p://www.surtech2000.co.uk/Wall%20Product%20Pages/pitchepoxy.html
                You may use any underwater paint over it..

                --
                Phil.

                -----Message d'origine-----
                De : Mark A. [mailto:marka@...]
                Envoyé : Thursday, September 04, 2003 3:55 AM
                À : bolger@yahoogroups.com
                Objet : [bolger] Re: Sneakeasy "Katie" report


                Others that are commonly used on the Northwest river running boats
                include mixed in
                graphite powder, or an overlay of UHMW.


                Mark

                chodges31711 wrote:
                > There are many other types of hard
                > minerals that could be put in epoxy and would give good wear
                > resistance. Maybe even granite fines from a stone cutters saw or
                > monument carver.


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