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Bilge pump, wiring/voltage questions.

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  • Bruce Hallman <brucehallman@yahoo.com>
    I am beginning to think through the wiring for my Micro Navigator project, [Before I cover up every wiring chase.] As I plan on having the boat wired for
    Message 1 of 6 , Feb 5, 2003
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      I am beginning to think through the wiring
      for my Micro Navigator project, [Before I
      cover up every wiring chase.]

      As I plan on having the boat 'wired' for
      comfort, two RV batteries, charged
      with one (or two) 50 watt photovoltaic cells...
      ...with an AC converter. So I can have a TV
      for watching SF Giants games in McCovey Cove
      waiting for the next Barry Bonds splash hit.

      Pricing light fixtures, 110V florescent bulbs
      and fixtures are cheaper by a factor of 10 than
      the 12V florescent light fixtures. Would I be
      nuts to have 110V lighting circuits in the boat?

      Also, I am guessing that installing an automatic
      bilge pump would be cheap insurance. Anyone
      have ideas and suggestions about this?

      As for navigation lights, I need port, starboard, stern light
      and an anchor light on top of the main mast, right?

      Does the stern light belong on top of the mizzen mast, or on an
      independent light pole on the stern?
    • Chuck Leinweber
      Bruce: I have a 55 watt solar panel, a deep cycle battery, 12 volt florescent fixtures and a 120 vac one on my Caprice. I have found that one battery is all
      Message 2 of 6 , Feb 5, 2003
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        Bruce:

        I have a 55 watt solar panel, a deep cycle battery, 12 volt florescent fixtures and a 120 vac one on my Caprice. I have found that one battery is all we have ever needed for just lights. If you were going to use anchor lights all night for several days with little sunshine for recharging, you might want the additional battery.

        The 12 volt fixtures are not only expensive, they don't work well. Essentially, each one of them has it's own inverter to boost the voltage, and they are subject to breakdowns. I think it is better to have one inverter, and several 120 volt fixtures. Remember that the light emitted is relative to the wattage. The 12 volt jobs put out little light relative to the smallest of kitchen fixtures which are very bright indeed.

        Chuck
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Bruce Hallman <brucehallman@...>
        To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 12:44 PM
        Subject: [bolger] Bilge pump, wiring/voltage questions.


        I am beginning to think through the wiring
        for my Micro Navigator project, [Before I
        cover up every wiring chase.]

        As I plan on having the boat 'wired' for
        comfort, two RV batteries, charged
        with one (or two) 50 watt photovoltaic cells...
        ...with an AC converter. So I can have a TV
        for watching SF Giants games in McCovey Cove
        waiting for the next Barry Bonds splash hit.

        Pricing light fixtures, 110V florescent bulbs
        and fixtures are cheaper by a factor of 10 than
        the 12V florescent light fixtures. Would I be
        nuts to have 110V lighting circuits in the boat?

        Also, I am guessing that installing an automatic
        bilge pump would be cheap insurance. Anyone
        have ideas and suggestions about this?

        As for navigation lights, I need port, starboard, stern light
        and an anchor light on top of the main mast, right?

        Does the stern light belong on top of the mizzen mast, or on an
        independent light pole on the stern?


        Bolger rules!!!
        - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
        - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
        - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
        - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Doug Harrison
        ... Bruce; 12V lighting is generally a rip-off. However, I found a place in AZ that carries electronic ballasted 12V lights for a fraction of what the RV
        Message 3 of 6 , Feb 5, 2003
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          2/5/2003 1:44:03 PM, "Bruce Hallman <brucehallman@...>" <brucehallman@...> wrote:
          >Pricing light fixtures, 110V florescent bulbs
          >and fixtures are cheaper by a factor of 10 than
          >the 12V florescent light fixtures. Would I be
          >nuts to have 110V lighting circuits in the boat?
          >
          Bruce;
          12V lighting is generally a rip-off. However, I found a place in AZ that carries electronic ballasted 12V lights for a fraction
          of what the RV suppliers charge. Try http://www.solar-electric.com/

          The electronic ballast lights are easier on the eyes, quieter and more reliable than conventional magnetic ballast
          lamps. These use regular bulbs. Also, there is no difference in quality or reliability between 12V and 120V as long as
          you stick with electronic. This is not the case with mag ballast. All the new 120V screw-in florescent bulbs have
          electronic ballasts. These would be my first choice if I were using 120V.

          The only caviat with automatic bilge pumps is that you must use a reliable switch or you will end up with either a dead
          battery or sunken vessel. Practical Sailor Magazine tests the various switches occasionally and is probably the best
          source for current information. Previous tests have shown that function and price are not related.

          Doug
        • prthober <prthober@yahoo.com>
          Message 4 of 6 , Feb 5, 2003
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            <As for navigation lights, I need port, starboard, stern light and an
            anchor light on top of the main mast, right? Does the stern light
            belong on top of the mizzen mast, or on an independent light pole on
            the stern?>

            Port and Starboard can be one combination light. On my Chebacco I put
            the anchor light at the top of the mizzen to allow easier
            maintenance; my stern light is at deck level at the transom.

            <Would I be nuts to have 110V lighting circuits in the boat?>

            The greater complexity and cost of an inverter plus the danger of
            110VAC easily outweighs the cost of the 12 VDC lamps.

            Paul
          • John Cupp <caj@kfalls.net>
            Bruce try to stay away of 120V on your boat unless you have 120V at dockside then get a big bilge pump for those extended times away from the boat. See f you
            Message 5 of 6 , Feb 5, 2003
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              Bruce try to stay away of 120V on your boat unless you have 120V at
              dockside then get a big bilge pump for those extended times away from
              the boat. See f you can find a new wrecked RV trailer for all the
              electrical systems. Then you can have dual power lights and a circuit
              box to die for. You may even be able to save the frame to make a boat
              trailer. You can buy them for a song because most scrap dealers think
              they are more work than profit.

              With all the 12V devices out there now why would you need AC on your
              boat. I buy fuel for my pickup at a Pilot truck stop and they have
              everything you could imagine for trucker to run on 12V DC. I even saw
              a 12V deep fryer. can't you imagine some guy cruising down I-5 making
              French fries in his 18 wheeler! I even saw some 12V white LED cab
              lights that all you have to do is connect the wires. They even have
              12V color TV/VCR's with radios so you can get the play by play on
              KGO.

              You also can go the route of have a portable gen set. I have a small
              Honda that measures about 20" X 15" X 12" with the handle it looks
              like a tool box but it can charge 12V DC batteries and it also puts
              out 120 V AC for lights and a TV ON the lake here when I would go
              fishing I could just use my trolling motor and when it was time to go
              home I would hook up the Honda on the 12V side and run at full power
              all the way home. It uses to much gas though about every ten hours
              you have to add a quart and check the oil.


              John




              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce Hallman <brucehallman@y...>"
              <brucehallman@y...> wrote:
              > I am beginning to think through the wiring
              > for my Micro Navigator project, [Before I
              > cover up every wiring chase.]
              >
              > As I plan on having the boat 'wired' for
              > comfort, two RV batteries, charged
              > with one (or two) 50 watt photovoltaic cells...
              > ...with an AC converter. So I can have a TV
              > for watching SF Giants games in McCovey Cove
              > waiting for the next Barry Bonds splash hit.
              >
              > Pricing light fixtures, 110V florescent bulbs
              > and fixtures are cheaper by a factor of 10 than
              > the 12V florescent light fixtures. Would I be
              > nuts to have 110V lighting circuits in the boat?
              >
              > Also, I am guessing that installing an automatic
              > bilge pump would be cheap insurance. Anyone
              > have ideas and suggestions about this?
              >
              > As for navigation lights, I need port, starboard, stern light
              > and an anchor light on top of the main mast, right?
              >
              > Does the stern light belong on top of the mizzen mast, or on an
              > independent light pole on the stern?
            • sctree
              My two cents, base only on my experience; Batteries... I vehad good luck with gel batteries. Yes, I know they cost more and there are special charging
              Message 6 of 6 , Feb 5, 2003
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                My two cents, base only on my experience;

                Batteries... I'vehad good luck with gel batteries. Yes, I know they cost
                more and there are special charging requirements, but .... they don't
                spill, leak, or fume, very nice as I assume you'll be living "in" the
                battery compartment. They are very tolerant of long term non-use, low
                temperature storage, and are vibration resistant. Very easy to stow away
                a second backup battery that you can swap out when the juice goes down.

                Wiring chase .. Are you building in pvc pipe chases? Cheap and neat.
                Make em much bigger dia. than you think you'll need. For gosh sakes used
                the tinned ancor marine grade wire, and marine grade adhesive-shrink
                waterproof terminals.

                Nav lights... You need port and starboard sidelights (or a combo) plus a
                stern light which should be low for sailing. AND a white masthead
                (steaming) light facing the forward 112.5 degrees, which does not have
                to be at the top of the mast, but it does need to be at least a meter (I
                think) above the sidelights for use when under power.. A sailboat under
                power IS a powerboat. The anchor light is another additional light.
                You could go with a masthead tricolor. Big bucks, wiring up the mast is
                tougher to do and maintain. Also, if you go out on the Bay at night
                you'll notice a tricolor on the masthead of a small boat does not stand
                out as well as deck mounted nav lights.....

                Anchor light... can be stowed below and hoisted on a halyard when
                necessary. Davis makes a nice low amp (0.074A) auto off in daylight
                "Mini Mega Light" with a 12v lighter plug. They claim a 1000 continuous
                hours on an 80Ah battery. Visible 2 nm, but not USCG approved as an
                official anchor light..

                As nice as solar sounds it's much easier and cheaper to take the battery
                home and charge it up. (Remember that non leaking, no-spill, non fuming,
                ok to lay it on it's side gel battery?)

                120volt and salt air/water is not a good combo. Don't you lose a lot of
                juice going through an inverter? How much light do you need in that
                cabin? And how big is that TV? There are small low draw 12v TV's out there.

                Bilge pump... Tough decision, you'd need something pretty big, with a
                dependable switch and a good battery that was mounted high to keep up
                with much of a hull breach, then how long would that battery last?. A
                small slow leak would just let water slosh around as there is not a sump
                area for the water to collect into. By the time she was down enough for
                the pump to do much, I'd think someone at the marina (or you if you were
                aboard) would notice... So, Idaknow...

                So much to decide............

                Good luck,

                Rick


                Bruce Hallman wrote:

                > I am beginning to think through the wiring
                > for my Micro Navigator project, [Before I
                > cover up every wiring chase.]
                >
                > As I plan on having the boat 'wired' for
                > comfort, two RV batteries, charged
                > with one (or two) 50 watt photovoltaic cells...
                > ...with an AC converter. So I can have a TV
                > for watching SF Giants games in McCovey Cove
                > waiting for the next Barry Bonds splash hit.
                >
                > Pricing light fixtures, 110V florescent bulbs
                > and fixtures are cheaper by a factor of 10 than
                > the 12V florescent light fixtures. Would I be
                > nuts to have 110V lighting circuits in the boat?
                >
                > Also, I am guessing that installing an automatic
                > bilge pump would be cheap insurance. Anyone
                > have ideas and suggestions about this?
                >
                > As for navigation lights, I need port, starboard, stern light
                > and an anchor light on top of the main mast, right?
                >
                > Does the stern light belong on top of the mizzen mast, or on an
                > independent light pole on the stern?
                >
                >
                > Bolger rules!!!
                > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
                > - stay on topic, stay on thread, punctuate, no 'Ed, thanks, Fred' posts
                > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts and <snip> away
                > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
                > 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                > - Open discussion: bolger_coffee_lounge-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                >
                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
                > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.




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