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Re: A five dollar failure

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  • rnlocnil
    The paint really RAN off? Did you wash the area with detergent of some sort first in case it was a little oily? Of course primer is a good idea, but I bet
    Message 1 of 8 , Jul 1, 2002
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      The paint really RAN off? Did you wash the area with detergent of some
      sort first in case it was a little oily? Of course primer is a good
      idea, but I bet there are latex primers that would work. None will
      stick if surface is dirty.

      ANother point, some types of latex take a long time to really dry.

      I try to test any new paint type or surface prep. I was lucky to think
      of it because the first couple of types I tried did NOT stick well. I
      can thank the list for warning me of this potential problem.
      --- In bolger@y..., David Ryan <david@c...> wrote:
      > Well yes, that would be the obvious answer. But because I've been
      > using Benjamin Moore over wood and/or glass without primer and
      > getting excellent results, I didn't think of it.
      >
      > And...
      >
      > For the price of buying the primer and the $5/gallon "oops" paint, I
      > could have just got more of Bennie's paint and skipped the priming
      > altogether.
      >
      > As I said, at least it washes up with water.
      >
      > YIBB,
      >
      > David
      >
      snip
      > >>
      > >> Yesterday I spend a good two hours scuffing up the cockpits of
      my
      > >> Scooner to ready them to receive their new coat of discount
      paint. By
      > >> the time I was finished my hair looked like a powdered wig. I
      rinsed
      > >> off, then slapped on a coat of nice grey paint. Once I was done
      I
      > >> called my wife out to admire my handy work. "Quite nice," she
      offered
      > >> "the grey looks great."
      > >>
    • David Ryan
      Yes, it really ran off. Big puddles of paint in the chine of the boat when I went out to look at it this morning. Nope, no detergent. Just scrubbed everything
      Message 2 of 8 , Jul 1, 2002
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        Yes, it really ran off. Big puddles of paint in the chine of the boat
        when I went out to look at it this morning. Nope, no detergent. Just
        scrubbed everything with the grinder before painting, then rinses the
        dust off and let it dry before painting.

        The biggest culprits were areas that were just bare epoxy. You could
        see the paint just slid off during the night. Other area were
        marginal, while still other came out fine.

        In any event, I'm going back to oil-based urethane paint porch paint.
        Haven't had anything but good luck with that. Just give your
        epoxy/glass a good sanding and then slap it on.

        YIBB,

        David


        >The paint really RAN off? Did you wash the area with detergent of some
        >sort first in case it was a little oily? Of course primer is a good
        >idea, but I bet there are latex primers that would work. None will
        >stick if surface is dirty.
        >
        >ANother point, some types of latex take a long time to really dry.
        >
        >I try to test any new paint type or surface prep. I was lucky to think
        >of it because the first couple of types I tried did NOT stick well. I
        >can thank the list for warning me of this potential problem.
        >--- In bolger@y..., David Ryan <david@c...> wrote:
        >> Well yes, that would be the obvious answer. But because I've been
        >> using Benjamin Moore over wood and/or glass without primer and
        >> getting excellent results, I didn't think of it.
        >>
        >> And...
        >>
        >> For the price of buying the primer and the $5/gallon "oops" paint, I
        >> could have just got more of Bennie's paint and skipped the priming
        >> altogether.
        >>
        >> As I said, at least it washes up with water.
        >>
        >> YIBB,
        >>
        >> David
        >>
        >snip
        >> >>
        >> >> Yesterday I spend a good two hours scuffing up the cockpits of
        >my
        >> >> Scooner to ready them to receive their new coat of discount
        >paint. By
        >> >> the time I was finished my hair looked like a powdered wig. I
        >rinsed
        >> >> off, then slapped on a coat of nice grey paint. Once I was done
        >I
        >> >> called my wife out to admire my handy work. "Quite nice," she
        >offered
        >> >> "the grey looks great."
        >> >>
        >
        >
        >
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      • rnlocnil
        Had you used the previous places before painting with the oil based? If you managed to get oil or slime of some sort on the boat during use, I wouldn t be
        Message 3 of 8 , Jul 1, 2002
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          Had you used the previous places before painting with the oil based?
          If you managed to get oil or slime of some sort on the boat during
          use, I wouldn't be surprised if the oil paint doesn't stick either
          without a detergent wash of some sort. TSP works great for this but is
          not environmentally good.
          --- In bolger@y..., David Ryan <david@c...> wrote:
          > Yes, it really ran off. Big puddles of paint in the chine of the
          boat
          > when I went out to look at it this morning. Nope, no detergent. Just
          > scrubbed everything with the grinder before painting, then rinses
          the
          > dust off and let it dry before painting.
          >
          > The biggest culprits were areas that were just bare epoxy. You could
          > see the paint just slid off during the night. Other area were
          > marginal, while still other came out fine.
          >
          > In any event, I'm going back to oil-based urethane paint porch
          paint.
          > Haven't had anything but good luck with that. Just give your
          > epoxy/glass a good sanding and then slap it on.
          >
          > YIBB,
          >
          > David
          >
        • Chris Crandall
          ... I really recommend a good primer. Primers serve many useful purposes, and certainly pay for themselves in terms of looks, time, and money. I like to use
          Message 4 of 8 , Jul 2, 2002
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            On Mon, 1 Jul 2002, David Ryan wrote:
            > In any event, I'm going back to oil-based urethane paint porch paint.
            > Haven't had anything but good luck with that. Just give your
            > epoxy/glass a good sanding and then slap it on.

            I really recommend a good primer. Primers serve many useful purposes, and
            certainly pay for themselves in terms of looks, time, and money. I like to
            use Kilz brand latex primer.

            If you want to smooth things out a little bit, you can add crushed
            limestone to the primer--it's not exactly a high-tech high build primer,
            but it does work nicely. Make sure you sand it when dry.

            The primer is more tenacious to surfaces, and provide a nice surface for
            the next coat of paint. Failure of David's sort are substantially less
            likely. In addition, they help build up a system that's more tolerant.
            David has concluded that latex is a bad bet, and that oil-based is what he
            should use. I feel that this is a hasty conclusion; the judicious use of
            primer would've created a good finish, I'll bet.

            Primer dries very quickly, at least latex primer does. I can put down a
            coat, and sand in 30 minutes, ready for the next coat.

            Finally, a good primer just doesn't cost all that much (OK, $10 gallon).
            But it keeps you from having to put down too many extra coats of top coat.
            The primer has aluminum oxide--an excellent cover for stains, wild grain,
            and other visually unwelcome flaws in the wood/epoxy below. It saves
            moeny in reducing the number of top coats.

            The primer is more forgiving in application than top coats--it's easy to
            slather on, compared to final top coats, which can be fussy.

            In short, I feel that there is simply no advantage at all to skipping the
            primer stage. It's fast, it's easy, it's cheap, and it's tenacious. On
            every dimension it improves the final appearance of the boat, at no
            ultimate cost to time, money, or effort.

            I've built without primer and with it. I'll never again go back to
            skipping the primer step.
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