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[bolger] Re: sneakeasy

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  • G Carlson
    Hopefully, Hank will be able to join up...
    Message 1 of 24 , Sep 2, 1999
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      Hopefully, Hank will be able to join up...

      >Thanks for forwarding Hank's letter. I went back and reread the Sneakeasy
      >chapter in Boats with an Open Mind. What a thing to be able to say "My
      >father commissioned Sneakeasy". I'm impressed.
      >
      >Chuck
      >
      >> >
      >> >Dear Mr. CarlsonI've gotten a lot of pleasure from your excellent
      >schooner
      >> >website. It
      >> >has inspired me to think of building another Bolger boat. I built a
      >> >Surf with my dad 20 years ago. The boat's still going strong, though
      >> >the fir plywood is showing its age with checking and whatnot. The boat
      >> >even survived a big hole smashed through the aft quarter when a tornado
      >> >blew down an apple tree onto the overturned hull. I'm thinking replacing
      >> >her with either a light schooner such as yours, or a folding schooner.I
      >> >thought you might be interested to know of the derivation of the
      >> >Sneakeasy name. My father, Jim Schultz, commissioned the orginal
      >> >outboard-powered design (not the box-cutwater derivative you built) from
      >> >Bolger in the early 80s. It in turn was derived from a low-sided
      >> >original that was powered by a steam engine.The boat was built by a
      >> >high-class professional named Jim Shea in
      >> >Sturgeon Bay, WI. He used to work for Palmer Johnson. My Dad was
      >> >casting about for a name and asked me what I thought. The boat's style
      >> >seemed reminiscent of the Prohibition years, so I suggested Rumrunner or
      >> >Speakeasy. (I hope I'm not insulting your intelligence, but in case you
      >> >don't know, a speakeasy was a sort of illegal tavern that operated
      >> >during Prohibition). He liked Speakeasy, and so she was christened.A
      >> >reporter from the late Small Boat Journal did a story on the boat, but
      >> >got the name wrong. I've tried several times to correct the mistake. I
      >> >wrote Bolger once and talked to Payson on the phone. Neither of them
      >> >seemed very interested in putting the matter straight, and I guess it
      >> >doesn't matter much anyway. Sneakeasy does seem to speak to how she
      >> >slips through the water with minimal fuss.Unfortunately, my dad entered
      >> >his final decline as the boat hit the
      >> >water. He used it only once. It has been in one brother or another's
      >> >barn or shed in southeastern Wisconsin ever since, and I think it has
      >> >been wet only three or four times.I hope you don't find this note too
      >> >long-winded. I'd like to join the
      >> >discussion group you founded, but our Internet access here at the Denver
      >> >Rocky Mountain News (the newspaper I work for) has a lockout on chat
      >> >groups and so forth. I might be able to find a way around that. In any
      >> >case, my address is Schultzh@.... I'd like to hear from you
      >> >sometime, and I promise I won't wear out my welcome.Sincerely, Hank
      >Schultz.
      >> >
      >>
      >>
      >>
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    • maosborn@aol.com
      Anyone have any experiance or thoughts on the sneakeasy? I like the looks and think it might fit my needs. A boat to cruise up the missiouri beach and enjoy
      Message 2 of 24 , Mar 31 6:42 AM
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        Anyone have any experiance or thoughts on the sneakeasy?
        I like the looks and think it might fit my needs. A boat to cruise up the
        missiouri beach and enjoy the sandbars.
        Mark
      • StepHydro@aol.com
        In a message dated 03/31/2001 9: Anyone have any experiance or thoughts on the sneakeasy? ...
        Message 3 of 24 , Mar 31 6:57 AM
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          In a message dated 03/31/2001 9:<BR43:<BR59 AM
          Eastern Standard , maosborn@... writes:> Anyone have any experiance
          or thoughts on the sneakeasy?
          > I like the looks and think it might fit my needs. A boat to cruise up the
          > missiouri beach and enjoy the sandbars.


          There are lots of sites on the web sith Sneakeasy pictures. I think she's
          Bolger's most beautiful boat. Have you read the Sneakeasy chapter in BWAOM?

          If you don't find those sites, let me know and I'll send URLs. I believe
          Payson links to them as does Square Boats.

          Cheers/Don carron
        • maosborn@aol.com
          I have seen the web sights. I wonder how this boat would handle turning at speeds? Lots of logs to dodge around here. Mark
          Message 4 of 24 , Mar 31 7:06 AM
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            I have seen the web sights. I wonder how this boat would handle turning at
            speeds?
            Lots of logs to dodge around here.
            Mark
          • StepHydro@aol.com
            In a message dated 03/31/2001 10:
            Message 5 of 24 , Mar 31 7:24 AM
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              In a message dated 03/31/2001 10:<BR08:<BR09 AM
              Eastern Standard, maosborn@... writes:
              > I have seen the web sights. I wonder how this boat would handle turning
              at
              >> speeds?
              Well, what speed? The boat isn't designed to go very fast. I talked at length
              with an owner in the Chicago area and he felt that the boat was
              treacherous...no, he understands its characteristics, so treacherous isn't
              the correct word...he felt that it would turn over and then under with a bit
              of inattention with the 40 hp he used. Bolger warned him against using such a
              large engine.

              I corresponded wtih PCB about working up a normal (for a 1920 boat) forefoot
              blending into the flat bottom, intended to be planked with plywood strips in
              epoxy, set at an angle to the chine. What he neded up delivering was a box
              deadwood version, as shown in BWAOM. I think he'd wanted to do this all
              along, and took the opportunity to work it up hoping that I'd like that
              enough to build her. Well, I dodn't, thoug I appreciated the attempt.

              I would not build the boat myself if I intended going over about 10 knots,
              which I did intend :-) as I lived at the time near Galveston Bay and wanted
              the ability to cover a lot of ground or dodge a fast-approaching storm.

              I still believe that a forefoot like a plumb-bowed Faye & Bowen launch from
              the mid 20s could be married to the flat bottom to produce a wonderful boat
              without the limitations set by sheet construction (at the bow). I don't know
              for sure, though, as it might require some deadrise, after which it wouldn't
              nearly be a Sneakeasy.

              Cheers/Don Carron
            • bgbeck55@yahoo.com
              Mark, There s been a lot of discussion on this board about Sneakeasy.If you go to the box above, Search Archive and type in Sneakeasy , it will give you a
              Message 6 of 24 , Mar 31 8:32 AM
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                Mark,
                There's been a lot of discussion on this board about Sneakeasy.If
                you go to the box above, "Search Archive" and type in "Sneakeasy", it
                will give you a list of what's been posted before. The list will
                start with the most recent posts. Just keep clicking on "next" and
                you'll eventually get to the first Sneakeasy post. I don't know if
                your questions will answered, but you'll have an enjoyable time
                reading everybody's thoughts on this design.

                Bruce


                > Anyone have any experiance or thoughts on the sneakeasy?
                > I like the looks and think it might fit my needs. A boat to cruise
                up the
                > missiouri beach and enjoy the sandbars.
                > Mark
              • Charlie Iliff
                I corresponded with PCB last fall, and bought Sneakeasy plans from him for construction this spring/summer. He indicated that the Sneakeasy had not displayed
                Message 7 of 24 , Mar 31 10:12 AM
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                  I corresponded with PCB last fall, and bought Sneakeasy plans from
                  him for construction this spring/summer. He indicated that the
                  Sneakeasy had not displayed anticipated bad habits, and therefore the
                  box bottom like Gregg Carlson's, although probably a bit more stable,
                  was not required. He also sent me plans of a version with some v
                  forward, primarily to reduce pounding. He does not recommend 40hp,
                  but reports, as does at least one of the websites, that a 30hp Sneakeasy
                  didn't have any bad habits. Speeds in the 20s are common Gregg - have
                  you compared yours with flat bottom sisters?
                  Charlie Iliff
                  Charles E. Iliff, Jr.
                  Iliff & Meredith, P.C.
                  Phone 410-685-1166
                • Chris Wood
                  StepHydro, I ran across a boat that is similar to what you were looking for: Chreck out http://www.parker-marine.com/parker2_1.htm. It is the Commuter 36.
                  Message 8 of 24 , Mar 31 1:02 PM
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                    StepHydro,
                     
                    I ran across a boat that is similar to what you were looking for:  Chreck out http://www.parker-marine.com/parker2_1.htm.  It is the Commuter 36.  Not sure if it could be scaled down, but for the size, it's economy and performance seemed great.
                     
                    Chris Wood
                    cwood@...
                  • GHC
                    I ve never seen another Sneakeasy in the flesh. I m of the opinion that my box-keel version pounds less, but other flat-bottom version owners don t seem to
                    Message 9 of 24 , Apr 1, 2001
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                      I've never seen another Sneakeasy in the flesh. I'm of the opinion that my
                      box-keel version pounds less, but other flat-bottom version owners don't
                      seem to have any complaint. I would assume, too, the box-keel is stiffer
                      and might oil-can less, but I don't hear those complaints, either.

                      Lastly, the box-keel would have to have more surface area and drag, which
                      is what I think mine sufffers from just a bit. I get about 22 mph from my
                      25 hp Envinrude, whereas I got 16-17 mph from the original 15 hp Merc.
                      I've played a fair bit with props on the big engine, so I'm assuming hp
                      ratings are a little different or something else is going on. The bottom
                      was never very slick, and I plan to roll it over and re-skin eventually.

                      By the way, I built it to run in the navigation channel, with the next marina
                      100 miles from home, so speed and range was important for me.

                      The boat has never exhibited any vices, though I have scared myself playing
                      games in the big wakes of large cruisers. I'll bet you could roll it over
                      with a big enough engine.

                      Gregg Carlson


                      At 01:12 PM 3/31/2001 EST, you wrote:
                      >I corresponded with PCB last fall, and bought Sneakeasy plans from
                      >him for construction this spring/summer. He indicated that the
                      >Sneakeasy had not displayed anticipated bad habits, and therefore the
                      >box bottom like Gregg Carlson's, although probably a bit more stable,
                      >was not required. He also sent me plans of a version with some v
                      >forward, primarily to reduce pounding. He does not recommend 40hp,
                      >but reports, as does at least one of the websites, that a 30hp Sneakeasy
                      >didn't have any bad habits. Speeds in the 20s are common Gregg - have
                      >you compared yours with flat bottom sisters?
                      > Charlie Iliff
                      >Charles E. Iliff, Jr.
                      >Iliff & Meredith, P.C.
                      >Phone 410-685-1166
                      >
                      >
                      >Bolger rules!!!
                      >- no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
                      >- no flogging dead horses
                      >- add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
                      >- stay on topic and punctuate
                      >- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
                      >- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
                      01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                      >
                      >
                      >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                      >
                      >
                      >
                    • jnf.trt@worldonline.nl
                      i think the main disafvantage of the sneakeasy is the size, it s too small to sail with more than three or four people, that is the reason i am looking to the
                      Message 10 of 24 , Oct 8, 2001
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                        i think the main disafvantage of the sneakeasy is the size, it's too
                        small to sail with more than three or four people, that is the reason
                        i am looking to the idaho

                        jan
                        the netherlands
                      • jmbell@mindspring.com
                        There has been a lot of interest on the group in Bolger s power sharpies of late. The problem most people seem to have is with their size. Sneakeasy is just
                        Message 11 of 24 , Oct 8, 2001
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                          There has been a lot of interest on the group in Bolger's power
                          sharpies of late. The problem most people seem to have is with their
                          size. Sneakeasy is just too long for its capacity for most potential
                          builders.

                          While I admire Bolger's groundbreaking work on power sharpies, I am
                          compelled to mention Jim Michalak's designs here. Yesterday I
                          launched a new boat to Jim's AF4 design. 'Mr. Moon' is 18' x 5',
                          weighs about 400 lbs. and handles three adults and two kids with
                          ease. It can also sleep two it it's Birdwatcher type cuddy. Judging
                          from the overwhelming response of all who saw her yesterday, she is
                          felt to be an attractive boat as well. Eighteen feet is a lot more
                          manageable for people to build and store than is 26 (Sneakeasy), 29
                          (Tennessee), or 31 (Idaho).

                          I just posted some pictures of 'Mr. Moon' in the photos section of
                          this group.

                          http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/lst

                          Best,

                          JB in Kennesaw

                          --- In bolger@y..., jnf.trt@w... wrote:
                          > i think the main disafvantage of the sneakeasy is the size, it's
                          too
                          > small to sail with more than three or four people, that is the
                          reason
                          > i am looking to the idaho
                          >
                          > jan
                          > the netherlands
                        • chris
                          John....... your Mr. Moon looks great Chris Flynn ... From: To: Sent: Monday, October 08, 2001 9:40 AM
                          Message 12 of 24 , Oct 8, 2001
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                            John....... your Mr. Moon looks great
                            Chris Flynn
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: <jmbell@...>
                            To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Monday, October 08, 2001 9:40 AM
                            Subject: [bolger] Re: sneakeasy


                            > There has been a lot of interest on the group in Bolger's power
                            > sharpies of late. The problem most people seem to have is with their
                            > size. Sneakeasy is just too long for its capacity for most potential
                            > builders.
                            >
                            > While I admire Bolger's groundbreaking work on power sharpies, I am
                            > compelled to mention Jim Michalak's designs here. Yesterday I
                            > launched a new boat to Jim's AF4 design. 'Mr. Moon' is 18' x 5',
                            > weighs about 400 lbs. and handles three adults and two kids with
                            > ease. It can also sleep two it it's Birdwatcher type cuddy. Judging
                            > from the overwhelming response of all who saw her yesterday, she is
                            > felt to be an attractive boat as well. Eighteen feet is a lot more
                            > manageable for people to build and store than is 26 (Sneakeasy), 29
                            > (Tennessee), or 31 (Idaho).
                            >
                            > I just posted some pictures of 'Mr. Moon' in the photos section of
                            > this group.
                            >
                            > http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/bolger/lst
                            >
                            > Best,
                            >
                            > JB in Kennesaw
                            >
                            > --- In bolger@y..., jnf.trt@w... wrote:
                            > > i think the main disafvantage of the sneakeasy is the size, it's
                            > too
                            > > small to sail with more than three or four people, that is the
                            > reason
                            > > i am looking to the idaho
                            > >
                            > > jan
                            > > the netherlands
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Bolger rules!!!
                            > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
                            > - pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
                            > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
                            > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
                            01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                            > - Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                            >
                            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                            >
                            >
                          • Dave
                            Hello, Does anyone know if the Sneakeast plans are available in a 16 version?
                            Message 13 of 24 , Jun 29, 2006
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                              Hello,
                              Does anyone know if the Sneakeast plans are available in a 16' version?
                            • Mark Albanese
                              Abosolutely! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BolgerCartoons/files/Lake%20Launch/
                              Message 14 of 24 , Jul 2, 2006
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                                Abosolutely!
                                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BolgerCartoons/files/Lake%20Launch/


                                On Jun 29, 2006, at 7:41 PM, Dave wrote:

                                > Hello,
                                > Does anyone know if the Sneakeast plans are available in a 16'
                                > version?
                                >
                                >
                              • superpum
                                hi, im Rodrigo Mattiello, im from south of Brasil and i want to buy a sneakeasy plans and i wanna know if can i pay by credit card? and if the plans explain
                                Message 15 of 24 , Jan 8, 2008
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                                  hi,
                                  im Rodrigo Mattiello, im from south of Brasil and i want to buy a
                                  sneakeasy plans and i wanna know if can i pay by credit card? and if
                                  the plans explain all the details to built it.
                                  thanks for now and hope to make some abroad friends,
                                  thanks Rodrigo
                                • Máximo
                                  Boa tarde Rodrigo! ¿Cómo andan los gaúchos? My name is Máximo, from Buenos Aires. I dont know if you could pay to Payson or Bolger with an international
                                  Message 16 of 24 , Jan 8, 2008
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                                    Boa tarde Rodrigo! ¿Cómo andan los gaúchos?

                                    My name is Máximo, from Buenos Aires. I dont know if you could pay to Payson
                                    or Bolger with an international credit card. On Payson website, it seams he
                                    only accept money orders or check.
                                    http://www.instantboats.com/overseas.htm

                                    Usually you get 2 or 3 big pages with the plans, and sometimes an A4 page
                                    with numbered step by step procedures. But if you are a first time builder,
                                    they are not very detailed, and you can get a nice panic attack on the first
                                    minutes :)

                                    Except Roberto "Cabinho" Barros, who has a book with instructions, any other
                                    designer I know (Wharram, Woods, etc) are not very friendly for the first
                                    time builder on the plans they sell, specially on international orders where
                                    you dont always have phone o fax facilities.

                                    So, I recommend you to buy the plans and build a scale model first, or
                                    better yet, buy Payson 3 books (with credit card from amazon) specially the
                                    last one, where you have a small print of sneakeasy plans among others
                                    designs.

                                    All 3 books are excellent, and have several chapters that introduces you to
                                    each step in boatbuilding. If you are confortable with what you read, then
                                    you could buy full scale plans if you want.

                                    Regards, Máximo.
                                  • Harry James
                                    You can get the plans from Herb Payson http://www.instantboats.com/ He doesn t do credit cards, you will have to send some kind of money order or check, see
                                    Message 17 of 24 , Jan 8, 2008
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                                      You can get the plans from Herb Payson

                                      http://www.instantboats.com/

                                      He doesn't do credit cards, you will have to send some kind of money
                                      order or check, see the section on ordering. Plans are complete plus
                                      there is Fritz Funk's site on building one that might give you some
                                      visual help on construction.

                                      http://www.alaska.net/~fritzf/Boats/Sneakeasy/Sneakeasy.htm

                                      HJ

                                      superpum wrote:
                                      > hi,
                                      > im Rodrigo Mattiello, im from south of Brasil and i want to buy a
                                      > sneakeasy plans and i wanna know if can i pay by credit card? and if
                                      > the plans explain all the details to built it.
                                      > thanks for now and hope to make some abroad friends,
                                      > thanks Rodrigo
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                    • adventures_in_astrophotography
                                      Hi Rodrigo, ... Welcome to the group. The only way I can think of to get Sneakeasy plans using a credit card is to buy Dynamite Payson s latest book. This
                                      Message 18 of 24 , Jan 9, 2008
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                                        Hi Rodrigo,

                                        > im Rodrigo Mattiello, im from south of Brasil and i want to buy a
                                        > sneakeasy plans and i wanna know if can i pay by credit card? and if
                                        > the plans explain all the details to built it.
                                        > thanks for now and hope to make some abroad friends,

                                        Welcome to the group.

                                        The only way I can think of to get Sneakeasy plans using a credit card
                                        is to buy Dynamite Payson's latest book. This book contains the plans
                                        for Sneakeasy (and 14 other plywood boats) in reduced size. The
                                        accompanying text describes the building process. The WoodenBoatStore
                                        http://www.woodenboatstore.com/ offers the book and you can use a
                                        credit card.

                                        Here's a direct link to the book on WoodenBoat's site:
                                        http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=300%2D708

                                        Sneakeasy is an eye-catching boat and I wish you good luck in building
                                        it.

                                        Jon Kolb
                                        www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
                                      • Bruce Hallman
                                        ... The excellent new Payson book explains general boat building instructions, instructions not covered in the plans. Also if you haven t already, I strongly
                                        Message 19 of 24 , Jan 9, 2008
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                                          > > sneakeasy plans ...
                                          > > do the plans explain all the details to built it?

                                          The excellent new Payson book explains general boat building
                                          instructions, instructions not covered in the plans.

                                          Also if you haven't already, I strongly recommend building several
                                          small boats, before building a big boat. Learning the tricks while
                                          building small boats will pay you back double when you build the big
                                          boat. Also, building a model of a boat is a very helpful way to learn
                                          with cheap mistakes instead of big expensive mistakes. (And mistakes
                                          always happen.)
                                        • mike weekes
                                          Mike Weekes here - yellowstone_michael@yahoo.com looking to correspond, learn from, share thoughts with S39 builders. How did it work for you? Can you live
                                          Message 20 of 24 , Jan 9, 2008
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                                            Mike Weekes here - yellowstone_michael@...
                                            looking to correspond, learn from, share thoughts with S39 builders.
                                            How did it work for you?
                                            Can you live aboard - what worked, what didn't
                                            things you'd do differently - memories to share.

                                            Thank you, all - GREAT SITE!


                                            Bruce Hallman <bruce@...> wrote:
                                            > > sneakeasy plans ...
                                            > > do the plans explain all the details to built it?

                                            The excellent new Payson book explains general boat building
                                            instructions, instructions not covered in the plans.

                                            Also if you haven't already, I strongly recommend building several
                                            small boats, before building a big boat. Learning the tricks while
                                            building small boats will pay you back double when you build the big
                                            boat. Also, building a model of a boat is a very helpful way to learn
                                            with cheap mistakes instead of big expensive mistakes. (And mistakes
                                            always happen.)





                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • Bob Rusk
                                            And, of course, you can purchase them full-size from Dynamite Payson -- but he doesn t take credit cards. Looks like $40 for the plans and $10 for overseas
                                            Message 21 of 24 , Jan 9, 2008
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                                              And, of course, you can purchase them full-size from Dynamite Payson
                                              -- but he doesn't take credit cards. Looks like $40 for the plans and
                                              $10 for "overseas" (export) shipping. Not sure how hard it is to get
                                              a check or money order in US funds in Brazil...

                                              Bob

                                              --- In bolger@yahoogroups.com, "adventures_in_astrophotography"
                                              <jon@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              > Hi Rodrigo,
                                              >
                                              > > im Rodrigo Mattiello, im from south of Brasil and i want to buy a
                                              > > sneakeasy plans and i wanna know if can i pay by credit card? and if
                                              > > the plans explain all the details to built it.
                                              > > thanks for now and hope to make some abroad friends,
                                              >
                                              > Welcome to the group.
                                              >
                                              > The only way I can think of to get Sneakeasy plans using a credit card
                                              > is to buy Dynamite Payson's latest book. This book contains the plans
                                              > for Sneakeasy (and 14 other plywood boats) in reduced size. The
                                              > accompanying text describes the building process. The WoodenBoatStore
                                              > http://www.woodenboatstore.com/ offers the book and you can use a
                                              > credit card.
                                              >
                                              > Here's a direct link to the book on WoodenBoat's site:
                                              > http://www.woodenboatstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=300%2D708
                                              >
                                              > Sneakeasy is an eye-catching boat and I wish you good luck in building
                                              > it.
                                              >
                                              > Jon Kolb
                                              > www.kolbsadventures.com/boatbuilding_index.htm
                                              >
                                            • Patrick Crockett
                                              For a boat of this magnitude, I would think that it would be worth paying the $50 plus whatever fee to get a money order in US currency to have the full size
                                              Message 22 of 24 , Jan 9, 2008
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                                                For a boat of this magnitude, I would think that it would be worth
                                                paying the $50 plus whatever fee to get a money order in US currency to
                                                have the full size plans. Much less chance of making a mistake due to
                                                being unable to read the tiny print.

                                                Patrick


                                                Bob Rusk wrote:
                                                > And, of course, you can purchase them full-size from Dynamite Payson
                                                > -- but he doesn't take credit cards. Looks like $40 for the plans and
                                                > $10 for "overseas" (export) shipping. Not sure how hard it is to get
                                                > a check or money order in US funds in Brazil...
                                                >
                                                > Bob
                                                >
                                                >
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