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Re: power vs. sail

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  • pvanderwaart
    My observation is that a sailboat is a means of travel and a powerboat is a means of getting to a destination. PHV p.s. I got a message from geocities saying
    Message 1 of 16 , Jan 1, 2002
      My observation is that a sailboat is a means of travel and a
      powerboat is a means of getting to a destination.

      PHV

      p.s. I got a message from geocities saying that the popularity of my
      site caused more traffic than they allot for free. So, if you were
      not able to view the pictures of Arava and Schorpioen, try again in a
      couple of days. The .jpg's are pretty big because I like to keep the
      fine print on the drawing visible if I can.

      "Single Eagle with traing wheels" Good line!
    • Harry W. James
      One of our thoughts around this part of the world (SE Alaska) has been that the reason to own a big power sharpie is to pack lots of small Bolger Boats from
      Message 2 of 16 , Jan 1, 2002
        One of our thoughts around this part of the world (SE Alaska) has been
        that the reason to own a big power sharpie is to pack lots of small
        Bolger Boats from anchorage to anchorage, and that's when the adventure
        begins, rowing, sailing and poking around creeks, channels, inlets and
        islands.

        Hj

        David Ryan wrote:
        >
        > FBBB --
        >
        > At the end of Beuhler's "Backyard Boat Building" he hints that in the
        > boat/no boat equation, that sailing may be less practical than
        > motoring. My own disdain for motors has two roots:
        >
        > 1) It's a lot easier/cheaper to make and maintain you own sails and
        > oars than your own engine. For the way I use small boats, a motor is
        > simply an added expense and hassle with no meaningful return. The
        > boat/no boat calculus dictates my scooner has no engine. Whatever
        > status or romance accompanies that is incidental.
        >
        > 2) In any imaginings of long ocean passages, sails just seem more reliable.
        >
        > However, my "discovery" of Phil Bolger and the East Coast's great
        > inner waterways have turn my preconceptions of what a boat needs to
        > be, or should be on their head. I have discovered sharpies -- cheap,
        > fast to build, fun to sail and ideal for my circumstances.
        >
        > Now, rather than reading the classifieds in the back of "Sail"
        > magazine, and dreaming of which boat I could buy if I sold my house,
        > I draw up realistic balances of time and money and intentions and
        > hone in on real "on -the-water vacation home" that I could build
        > myself without giving up my day job or my equity.
        >
        > Fantasies of full-keeled seaboats no longer dominate my day dreams.
        > Instead it's a giant sharpie anchored at some out of the way location
        > where I can enjoy the company of my wife and daughter and dog, and my
        > own smug satisfaction at having built our vessel myself. The next
        > "casualty" of these realizations may well be the sailing. As I study
        > the plans for the Illinois, it occurs to me that she is much more
        > boat for the money anything of comparable capacities meant to be
        > sailed.
        >
        > Any boat of her size, sail or power, would need a similar power
        > plant. But any sail boat build to similar requirements would likely
        > spend much of her time under power. Why spend all that money on spars
        > and canvas and line when for her purpose they are nearly an
        > affectation? Why accommodate the ability to sail at the expense of
        > roominess or performance under power?
        >
        > For me, the answer is romance; and I'm never one to value romance
        > lightly. But actually being on the water, in a boat that makes being
        > there absolutely pleasant is romantic too -- perhaps more romantic
        > than dreaming about it.
        >
        > YIBB,
        >
        > David
        >
        >
      • thomas dalzell
        Sam Devlin Suggested that was the reason to own a houseboat, same kind of idea. ... One of our thoughts around this part of the world
        Message 3 of 16 , Jan 1, 2002
          Sam Devlin Suggested that was the reason to own a
          houseboat, same kind of idea.
          --- "Harry W. James" <welshman@...> wrote:

          <HR>
          <html><body>


          <tt>
          One of our thoughts around this part of the world (SE
          Alaska) has been<BR>
          that the reason to own a big power sharpie is to pack
          lots of small<BR>

          ______________________________________________________
          Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca
        • Hal Lynch
          On Tuesday, January 1, 2002, at 03:54 PM, David Ryan wrote: Stuff deleted ... For some time now I have noticed in publications such as MAIB that in most of the
          Message 4 of 16 , Jan 2, 2002
            On Tuesday, January 1, 2002, at 03:54 PM, David Ryan wrote:

            Stuff deleted

            > Any boat of her size, sail or power, would need a similar power
            > plant. But any sail boat build to similar requirements would likely
            > spend much of her time under power. Why spend all that money on spars
            > and canvas and line when for her purpose they are nearly an
            > affectation? Why accommodate the ability to sail at the expense of
            > roominess or performance under power?

            For some time now I have noticed in publications such as MAIB that in
            most of the articles involving sail boats with auxiliaries the auxiliary
            seems to be used as much or more the sails. It seems to me that a
            boat optimized for power would be more useful most of the time.

            hal
          • Harry W. James
            I have commented on this before. We get a lot of transient cruisers (SE AK), many of them large (35 -55 ) auxiliary cruisers. I fly for a living and I bet I
            Message 5 of 16 , Jan 2, 2002
              I have commented on this before. We get a lot of transient cruisers (SE
              AK), many of them large (35'-55') auxiliary cruisers. I fly for a living
              and I bet I see less than 5% with any sail up. It is subject for amazed
              comment in the cockpit as in "look at that one, they have the sails up!"
              In a normal summer I will only see 2-3 sailboats actually sailing.

              HJ

              Hal Lynch wrote:
              >

              > For some time now I have noticed in publications such as MAIB that in
              > most of the articles involving sail boats with auxiliaries the auxiliary
              > seems to be used as much or more the sails. It seems to me that a
              > boat optimized for power would be more useful most of the time.
              >
              > hal
              >
              > --
            • David Ryan
              My wife and I have been studying the plans for this great beast and I can figure out a couple of things. 1) Is the area under the after deck reserved for
              Message 6 of 16 , Jan 2, 2002
                My wife and I have been studying the plans for this great beast and I
                can figure out a couple of things.

                1) Is the area under the after deck reserved for anything in particular?

                2) Is there any privacy for the master bed when someone passes from
                the kitchen to the forecastle?

                If you can read these drawing any better than I, let me know what you see.

                YIBB,

                David

                >I have commented on this before. We get a lot of transient cruisers (SE
                >AK), many of them large (35'-55') auxiliary cruisers. I fly for a living
                >and I bet I see less than 5% with any sail up. It is subject for amazed
                >comment in the cockpit as in "look at that one, they have the sails up!"
                >In a normal summer I will only see 2-3 sailboats actually sailing.
                >
                >HJ
                >
                >Hal Lynch wrote:
                >>
                >
                >> For some time now I have noticed in publications such as MAIB that in
                >> most of the articles involving sail boats with auxiliaries the auxiliary
                >> seems to be used as much or more the sails. It seems to me that a
                >> boat optimized for power would be more useful most of the time.
                >>
                >> hal
                >>
                >> --
                >
                >
                >Bolger rules!!!
                >- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
                >- pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
                >- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you like
                >- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester,
                >MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                >- Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                >
                >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


                C.E.P.
                134 West 26th St. 12th Floor
                New York, New York 10001
                http://www.crumblingempire.com
                (212) 247-0296
              • sctree
                David, I think under the aft deck is tankage? The mastersuite is below the offset deckhouse, which hangs down into the mastersuite, meaning no standing
                Message 7 of 16 , Jan 2, 2002
                  David,

                  I think under the aft deck is tankage?

                  The mastersuite is below the offset deckhouse, which hangs down into
                  the mastersuite, meaning no standing headroom there. The corridor to
                  get from galley forward has full headroom and it seems that a bearing
                  wall separates it from the master, carrying the port side of the
                  deckhouse down to the hull bottom.

                  Leastwise that's what I see.

                  Best way for us all to find out is, you buy the plans, build her, and
                  send photos!

                  Rick

                  --- In bolger@y..., David Ryan <david@c...> wrote:
                  > My wife and I have been studying the plans for this great beast and
                  I
                  > can figure out a couple of things.
                  >
                  > 1) Is the area under the after deck reserved for anything in
                  particular?
                  >
                  > 2) Is there any privacy for the master bed when someone passes from
                  > the kitchen to the forecastle?
                  >
                  > If you can read these drawing any better than I, let me know what
                  you see.
                  >
                  > YIBB,
                  >
                  > David
                  >
                  > >I have commented on this before. We get a lot of transient
                  cruisers
                  (SE
                  > >AK), many of them large (35'-55') auxiliary cruisers. I fly for a
                  living
                  > >and I bet I see less than 5% with any sail up. It is subject for
                  amazed
                  > >comment in the cockpit as in "look at that one, they have the
                  sails
                  up!"
                  > >In a normal summer I will only see 2-3 sailboats actually sailing.
                  > >
                  > >HJ
                  > >
                  > >Hal Lynch wrote:
                  > >>
                  > >
                  > >> For some time now I have noticed in publications such as MAIB
                  that in
                  > >> most of the articles involving sail boats with auxiliaries the
                  auxiliary
                  > >> seems to be used as much or more the sails. It seems to me
                  that
                  a
                  > >> boat optimized for power would be more useful most of the time.
                  > >>
                  > >> hal
                  > >>
                  > >> --
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >Bolger rules!!!
                  > >- no cursing, flaming, trolling, spamming, or flogging dead horses
                  > >- pls take "personals" off-list, stay on topic, and punctuate
                  > >- add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts, snip all you
                  like
                  > >- To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester,
                  > >MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                  > >- Unsubscribe: bolger-unsubscribe@y...
                  > >
                  > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                  http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                  >
                  >
                  > C.E.P.
                  > 134 West 26th St. 12th Floor
                  > New York, New York 10001
                  > http://www.crumblingempire.com
                  > (212) 247-0296
                • brucehallman
                  ... particular? The PB&F plans call that area a Hold . I imagine it as where I would store my bicycle, and other junk. ... No, I don t think there is
                  Message 8 of 16 , Jan 3, 2002
                    --- In bolger@y..., David Ryan <david@c...> wrote:

                    > 1) Is the area under the after deck reserved for anything in
                    particular?

                    The PB&F plans call that area a "Hold". I imagine it as where I
                    would store my bicycle, and other junk.


                    > 2) Is there any privacy for the master bed when someone passes from
                    > the kitchen to the forecastle?

                    No, I don't think there is anything other than perhaps a curtain.
                    The PB&F commentary describes the bunks being for visits from the
                    grandchildren, which presumably would not happen every week.
                  • David Ryan
                    ... I suppose I could reduce the size of the king bed to a queen or even a full to pick up a little room for a solid partition. And a smaller bed would make it
                    Message 9 of 16 , Jan 3, 2002
                      >> 2) Is there any privacy for the master bed when someone passes from
                      >> the kitchen to the forecastle?
                      >
                      >No, I don't think there is anything other than perhaps a curtain.
                      >The PB&F commentary describes the bunks being for visits from the
                      >grandchildren, which presumably would not happen every week.

                      I suppose I could reduce the size of the king bed to a queen or even
                      a full to pick up a little room for a solid partition. And a smaller
                      bed would make it hard for my wife to get away from me!

                      YIBB,

                      David

                      C.E.P.
                      134 West 26th St. 12th Floor
                      New York, New York 10001
                      http://www.crumblingempire.com
                      (212) 247-0296
                    • brucehallman
                      ... The size of the bed is determined by the size of the pilot house floor [causing low headroom] from above. Though I am sure you could figure out a way to
                      Message 10 of 16 , Jan 3, 2002
                        --- In bolger@y..., David Ryan <david@c...> wrote:
                        > I suppose I could reduce the size of the king bed to a queen

                        The size of the bed is determined by the size of the pilot house
                        floor [causing low headroom] from above. Though I am sure you could
                        figure out a way to make a door, it just wouldn't be full height.
                      • thomas dalzell
                        I always liked Jim Browns comments regarding the anvil chorus: They always say they wanted a really big boat, so they could carry a lot of gas, for their
                        Message 11 of 16 , Jan 3, 2002
                          I always liked Jim Browns comments regarding the
                          anvil chorus: "They always say they wanted a really
                          big boat, so they could carry a lot of gas, for their
                          engine" Words he hears while ghosting along in his
                          tri. Does raise the issue of the Yanmar Endevour. A
                          35' trimaran, that outboarded it accross the Pacific.
                          Low resistance is where it is at.

                          >I have commented on this before. We get a lot of
                          transient cruisers (SE<BR>
                          AK), many of them large (35'-55') auxiliary cruisers.
                          I fly for a living<BR>
                          and I bet I see less than 5% with any sail up.

                          ______________________________________________________
                          Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca
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