Re: A Bolger Sailing Dory?
- Dories can be made into good sailboats, but then they're really no
longer dories. The sailing Swampscott dories and the Alphas are a
long way from the original dory shape. The ultimate development of a
sailing dory is the Alden Indian class, or the Town Class, see
for the Townie, and
for a drawing of the Indian Class.
These are very nice boats, and they're built like a dory with
lapstrake sides, sawn frames, longitudinally-planked bottom, but the
hull shape is rather different, much wider, particularly aft, to get
stability under sail. Semi-dories and dory skiffs are better
sailboats - the Cartopper, in fact, is like a simplified dory skiff.
This applies to the smaller sizes - the larger ones with keels like
the Hill's Badger or the ballasted St. Pierre boats (the Thousand
Dollar Yacht) are a different matter.
--- In bolger@y..., PseudoDion3@a... wrote:
> Why would I want a sailing Dory? . . .
> The question is whether these work boats can be
> transformed to function as pleasure craft primarily. The sharpie
> designs, which I also find beautiful and attractive, have been
> successfully converted. Why not a Dory?
- The real question is, "What do you mean by a dory?" The defining type
starts with a narrow, longitudinally planked, flat bottom, sawn frames, wide
planks, and a narrow, raking "tombstone" stern. Its straight, flaring sides
result in an obvious lack of stability for sail carrying, however. The
traditional approach to adding stability is to round out the sides in the
manner of Alpha/Beachcomber Swampscotts and Mower Massachusetts Bay racing
dories. These classes also enshrined the traditional, picturesque dory rig,
an almost equilateral, leg-of-mutton main on a plumb mast, well forward,
with a small jib. The narrow stern was preserved as a requirement of racing
rules. Inside ballast was required to keep them on their feet. These
boats are the handsomest of the dories.
Without racing rule constraints, and with freedom to explore modern
construction methods, sailing dory development has progressed in several
directions. One is to improve stability by attaching a fin keel, as in the
manner of Benford's cruising dories or Bolger's "Burgundy", all of which
retain the narrow transom or are double-ended. Another is to add power to a
shoal hull by widening the beam, particularly at the stern. With a straight
sides, you get sharpie designs like "Featherwind" and the Bolger boxes; with
multiple chines, you get "Bobcat" and "Chebacco"; with round sides, you get
designs like Bolger's "Nahant" and "Spartina". All of these can be seen as
developments of the dory toward greater sail-carrying ability. The raking
transom impairs rudder efficiency and shortens waterline length, so if the
transom need not be narrow to conform to rules, it is more efficient to
design it upright.
The original dory rig has two advantages: it is simple to bundle up and step
without stays or main halyard, and the high boom prevents tripping when
heeled. Disadvantages are an inefficient shape, weight of the long boom to
leeward, impossibility of reefing, need to rig some sort of lacing to permit
lowering if stays and halyards are wanted, and the absence of room for a
boom vang. The minimum modification is toward a simple, modern sloop
geometry, as in "Nahant" and "Featherwind".
Bolger has designed many sailing boats with dory ancestry, but preservation
of the distinctive dory characteristics would be sacrificing efficiency for
aesthetics, something he is reluctant to do.
- Looking at the sailing dory problem from the other side, consider
Suppose you begin with a very light dory in the Bolger style, perhaps
with even more flair to the sides. Fit sailing benches on each side
so the sailor can sit well to the side in some comfort. Add a
daggerboard and rig of carefully calculated size.
Is that boat actually going to be any trickier or more uncomfortable
to sail than a Laser, or many of the other modern boats? (Of course,
it won't be as fast due to the narrow stern.)
- The Atkins, per and fils, have designed some smallish sailing dories. A
couple of them can be seen here:
They also did some smaller ones that I don't have scans for. Look for
volumes in MoToR BoatinG magazine's Ideal Series. I'm plugging away at
making an index of the plans in the series, which you can look at here
(still very much under construction):
On Sun, 30 Sep 2001 20:00:58 -0000, Peter wrote:
> So, I thought of taking the lines of the Gardner "widened St. Pierre"
> dory and drawing them half size. Add a built-up, Micro-style keel.
> Arrange the rig, rudder and interior somewhat like the Herreshoff.
I care not for a man's religion whose dog or cat are not the better for it.
- At the risk of utter humiliation at the hands of the group, I'll point out a
dory-type that ought to sail reasonably well. I've drawn an 11' x4' dory
(rowing version only). It could stand a modest sail rig. So I've been
thinking of fitting it with the 59 sq. ft. leg o'mutton off of Bolger's Teal
and a Windsprint style bilge-daggerboard.
Go to Duckworks and look in the designs section if you are interested in the
rowing version. The sailing version only exists in my head at the moment,
but that is sure to change if there is interest.
Also, I'll have to disagree with Don (StepHydro) about dories being poor row
boats. Maybe the old heavy high-sided banks dories were crummy to row. But a
modern, low, light plywood dory rows pretty darn well. Lightweight Whitehall
types my row better in a chop, but the dory is quite a performer especially
considering how much less expense and complexity they have in comparison.
John Bell <><
mailto:jmbell@... - personal email
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, October 01, 2001 9:46 PM
Subject: Re: [bolger] Re: A Bolger Sailing Dory?
| The Atkins, per and fils, have designed some smallish sailing dories. A
| couple of them can be seen here:
| They also did some smaller ones that I don't have scans for. Look for
| volumes in MoToR BoatinG magazine's Ideal Series. I'm plugging away at
| making an index of the plans in the series, which you can look at here
| (still very much under construction):
- Putting that Ideal Series index together has addled my brain, all the
designs seem to run together... <g> The smaller Atkin flat-sided dories I
was thinkin of are power boats, the small _sailing_ dories are round-sided.
Perhaps the sailing dory idea just doesn't work well until the boats get
bigger. The boats Chapelle and Sucher call "Cape Ann" dories, sort of Bank
dories modified for sail by widening the bottoms a bit and adding a
centerboard, among other things, are a bit bigger than the usual bank dory
(almost 23' in Chappy's example and 24' for Sucher's). Apparently St.
Pierre dories can be successfully modified for sail, they start at around
27', IIRC. An Oregon boatbuilder, Bill Childs, designed and built a 19'
version of a Cape Ann dory that sailed so poorly he ended up ripping out
the centerboard trunk, her current owner uses her as a rowboat and
powerboat (she's good at those tasks). So maybe it's just a bad idea to try
making a flat-sided sailing dory much smaller than about 21'...
I forgot to mention that Abie Porpoise (22'4") and Pemaquid (20'11") have
ballast keels and inboard auxiliaries.
On Mon, 01 Oct 2001 18:46:24 -0700, I wrote:
> The Atkins, per and fils, have designed some smallish sailing dories. A
> couple of them can be seen here:
> They also did some smaller ones that I don't have scans for.
I must say I find television very educational. The minute somebody turns
it on, I go to the library and read a good book. <Groucho Marx>