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Tack and tape: cleats

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  • Giuseppe 'Pippo' Bianco
    Reading Dynamite s books, I understand that he came up with the tack and tape (as opposed to stitch and glue) method because he hates working with metal
    Message 1 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
      Reading Dynamite's books, I understand that he came up with the tack
      and tape (as opposed to stitch and glue) method because he hates
      working with metal stitches. I'm not sure however that I understand
      how the whole process work. My interpretation is that one has to
      temporarily attach cleats along the bulkheads/frames sides, in order
      to provide a place for screwing or nailing the hull plates from the
      outside. However, when is the builder supposed to remove the cleats?
      I think that this should be done before completing the exterior of
      the hull, but then how should the hull plates be attached to the
      frames? Filleting and taping one side only, wait for cure, remove the
      cleat, fillet and tape the other side? This would mean, for an upside
      down boat, working inside (underneath) the hull...
      OTOH, stiches would allow epoxy tabbing on both sides before removal.
      What's your experience? Best, Pippo
    • Chuck Leinweber
      Pippo: To me, it is not a matter of dogma. I use ties when they seem appropriate, and cleats at other times. Installing cleats on the inside of the hull may
      Message 2 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
        Pippo:

        To me, it is not a matter of dogma. I use ties when they seem appropriate,
        and cleats at other times. Installing cleats on the inside of the hull may
        mean crawling under the boat, but that may be true of ties too. I use duct
        or masking tape on the inside between the cleats and ties, then I putty the
        panels together everywhere except where the connectors are. If I
        accidentally get some epoxy on the cleats, it is not a problem as they are
        then removed with a hammer, and any excess wood on the hull is power sanded
        off. Now I remove all the ties and cleats, putty the gaps, and later sand
        the joints and tape. After the boat is turned over, I fillet and tape the
        inside of the seams.

        Chuck

        > What's your experience? Best, Pippo
        >
        >
      • richard@spellingbusiness.com
        Loose the tack and tape. Screw the panels losesly to the bulkheads and frames. Stitch them together, check fairness, and epoxy tab the hull. ... tack ...
        Message 3 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
          Loose the tack and tape. Screw the panels losesly to the bulkheads
          and frames. Stitch them together, check fairness, and "epoxy tab" the
          hull.

          --- In bolger@y..., "Giuseppe 'Pippo' Bianco" <giuseppe.bianco@a...>
          wrote:
          > Reading Dynamite's books, I understand that he came up with the
          tack
          > and tape (as opposed to stitch and glue) method because he hates
          > working with metal stitches. I'm not sure however that I understand
          > how the whole process work. My interpretation is that one has to
          > temporarily attach cleats along the bulkheads/frames sides, in
          order
          > to provide a place for screwing or nailing the hull plates from the
          > outside. However, when is the builder supposed to remove the
          cleats?
          > I think that this should be done before completing the exterior of
          > the hull, but then how should the hull plates be attached to the
          > frames? Filleting and taping one side only, wait for cure, remove
          the
          > cleat, fillet and tape the other side? This would mean, for an
          upside
          > down boat, working inside (underneath) the hull...
          > OTOH, stiches would allow epoxy tabbing on both sides before
          removal.
          > What's your experience? Best, Pippo
        • pvanderw@optonline.net
          ... the hull. Would you stitch with wire, or with plastic wire ties?
          Message 4 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
            > Lose the tack and tape. Screw the panels losesly to the bulkheads
            > and frames. Stitch them together, check fairness, and "epoxy tab"
            the hull.

            Would you stitch with wire, or with plastic wire ties?
          • bruce_hector@hotmail.com
            In my experience you need the cleats, 1X2 s or 2X2 s when the bulkheads are 3/8 or narrower. It s pretty difficult to hold the skin and nail or screw into a
            Message 5 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
              In my experience you need the cleats, 1X2's or 2X2's when the
              bulkheads are 3/8" or narrower. It's pretty difficult to hold the
              skin and nail or screw into a 1/4" frame like on a Nymph. Then I tape
              with good quality masking tape, 3M or similar. Goop in the gaps with
              thicken epoxy (I thicken with sawdust), but stay away from the
              temporary cleats. The next day you can remove the cleats and finish
              filling. Take the tape off as soon as you can, and don't put it in
              the sun with the tape on. I have bits of masking tape sealed into my
              Diablo's seams because after it was in the sun for a few days I just
              couldn't get it all out. Doesn't seem to hurt any thing though.

              On thicker bulkheads, like my Micro, no temporay cleats were needed.
            • Jeff Blunck
              Smaller boats say up to 1/4 or even 3/8 in most non-stressed places can use the plastic ties with great success. When I put my Frolic together, the plastic
              Message 6 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
                Smaller boats say up to 1/4 or even 3/8 in most non-stressed places can use
                the plastic ties with great success. When I put my Frolic together, the
                plastic ties had to be doubled and tripled in the bow area just to hold
                tight but for 90% of the stitching the plastic ties worked very well.

                They are quick and easy to use and are generally cheaper than copper wire
                and they don't pull through the ply as easy since they are wider than wire.

                Jeff

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: <pvanderw@...>
                To: <bolger@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Wednesday, August 01, 2001 9:58 AM
                Subject: [bolger] Re: Tack and tape: cleats


                > > Lose the tack and tape. Screw the panels losesly to the bulkheads
                > > and frames. Stitch them together, check fairness, and "epoxy tab"
                > the hull.
                >
                > Would you stitch with wire, or with plastic wire ties?
                >
                >
                >
                > Bolger rules!!!
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                01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
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                >
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                >
                >
              • richard@spellingbusiness.com
                Wire, any cheap kind. epoxy tab between, wait overnight, and pull the wires.
                Message 7 of 7 , Aug 1, 2001
                  Wire, any cheap kind. "epoxy tab" between, wait overnight, and pull
                  the wires.

                  --- In bolger@y..., pvanderw@o... wrote:
                  > > Lose the tack and tape. Screw the panels losesly to the bulkheads
                  > > and frames. Stitch them together, check fairness, and "epoxy tab"
                  > the hull.
                  >
                  > Would you stitch with wire, or with plastic wire ties?
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