Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Easiest way to get a smooth fiberglass surface - Thank You

Expand Messages
  • rrobar@segue.com
    Thanks everyone. I ve decided to breakout the sander, roll on some paint, and push Micro into the water. It is after all a working sailboat, not a yacht. ...
    Message 1 of 27 , May 2, 2001
    • 0 Attachment
      Thanks everyone. I've decided to breakout the sander, roll on some
      paint, and push Micro into the water. It is after all a working
      sailboat, not a yacht.


      --- In bolger@y..., "Jim Chamberlin RCSIS" <jchamberlin@r...> wrote:
      > I second Chuck's suggestion, but I have also used a belt sander
      with 60
      > grit. Used carefully and followed up with an orbital using 120 and
      > sometimes a lighter weight gets a nice finish for me. Standing
      back 10 feet
      > is also recommended.
      >
      > Jim C
      >
    • kwilson800@aol.com
      Yep. That s why the last two boats were lapstrake plywood. Spend a little more for good plywood, sand a lot less. I m getting less and less tolerant of
      Message 2 of 27 , May 2, 2001
      • 0 Attachment
        Yep. That's why the last two boats were lapstrake plywood. Spend a
        little more for good plywood, sand a lot less. I'm getting less and
        less tolerant of sanding. The guy who wrote "Canoecraft" (Ted
        Moore?) of Bear Mountain Canoe works, can do a better job of getting
        fiberglass cloth smooth and flat than seems possible, but he hasn't
        put his secret in the books. I wish he would.

        Keith Wilson

        --- In bolger@y..., "Orr, Jamie" <jorr@b...> wrote:
        > I hate sanding epoxy . . .
        > (I've promised myself that I'm going to build a boat without
        plywood, epoxy, or glass, but I haven't done it yet.)
      • Paul A. Lefebvre, Jr.
        I ve been sitting on the sidelines on this one, but having just recently sanded and varnished the fiberglass coating on my 4th cedar-strip canoe to foot-away
        Message 3 of 27 , May 2, 2001
        • 0 Attachment
          I've been sitting on the sidelines on this one, but having just recently
          sanded and varnished the fiberglass coating on my 4th cedar-strip canoe to
          foot-away quality bright finish inside and out, perhaps I oughta toss in my
          2 cents worth, elaborating on Jamie's suggestions.
          I do all my glass layup and subsequent coats in a single day - I put the
          cloth on dry on bare wood, on an upside-down boat, wet it out and squeegee
          off most of the resin with a very flexible plastic spatula (the ones sold by
          West system, or for autobody work, are too stiff and will scrape out too
          much resin! I prefer the plastic cake spatulas of the same rectangular
          shape, sold under various names - I bought a bunch with 'frugal gourmet'
          logos on them). This method takes alot of epoxy back out of the cloth in the
          form of non-reusable foamy semi-kicked gunk, but saves so much sanding work
          that I think it's worth the price.Once the resin is set up enough to be
          firm, but still a bit tacky, roll, brush, or squeegee on a second coat to
          fill the weave; a third coat for 6 oz and probably a 4th coat for anything
          coarser, but on 4 oz. cloth 2 coats is just enough. You don't want to sand
          through any cloth, it will seriously weaken the expensive sheath you went to
          all the trouble to put on in the first place, so filling in the weave is
          important; and if you leave it overnight and let the first layup coat harden
          completely before recoating, you really should sand for good adhesion before
          the second coat, or at least scrub with a scotchbrite and amonia to remove
          the blush. Sanding after only 1 coat means you're weakening your cloth,
          hence the long day and multiple coats to really do it most efficiently.
          Presumably the blush 'floats' to the surface if you apply coats in
          close-enough succession.
          After going through this and applying 6 coats of Epifanes varnish, and
          right up to delivering the canoe (it was a birthday gift to my brother), I
          was swearing I'd never go through this again, at least to an unforgiving
          varnish-perfect level of finish. Then we dropped it the Chesapeake on Easter
          Sunday, and it all evaporated... I hadn't launched a boat since June of '95,
          had forgotten what a sweet feeling it is - nothing comes close, and I feel
          like a boatbuilder again. I'd post a photo but it's not a Bolger boat, and
          I'll take the following cheap shot to help justify this post ;-): Now my
          shop's empty and I'm free to start construction on my micro (sails have been
          done for awhile), just as soon as I recover from Uncle Sam's rather vigorous
          pat-down on April 15..... anyone paying attention to my ravings a couple
          months ago already guessed I wouldn't make it to the Champlain messabout in
          a micro this year, but I will bring something pretty that floats..... sorry
          for the long post.

          Envious of Dave Jost up there in perfect epoxying weather, 60 miles to my
          north, and his iminent launch!

          Paul Lefebvre
        • djost@ma.ultranet.com
          Paul, I have been doing keel work with the weather, as you stated, perfect epoxying weather. It is actually a little warm for jobs that require a leisure
          Message 4 of 27 , May 2, 2001
          • 0 Attachment
            Paul,

            I have been doing keel work with the weather, as you stated,
            perfect epoxying weather. It is actually a little warm for jobs that
            require a leisure pace.

            I have run into a problem with drilling holes in my lead keel.
            The drill keeps grabbing and major pressure backwards is needed to
            extract the drill. I have tried oiling the tip, and drilling slowly
            but have broken $10 worth of drill bits so far. If no one has any
            better suggestions I will just pony up another $10. The good news is
            that when they break I just hammer them home into the lead. No
            damage done other than financial.

            DAvid JOst

            "working rather than boatbuilding :-("
            > Envious of Dave Jost up there in perfect epoxying weather, 60 miles
            to my
            > north, and his iminent launch!
            >
            > Paul Lefebvre
          • Jim Chamberlin RCSIS
            A lot of emails? I only had 153. BTW, your boat is beautiful. Jim
            Message 5 of 27 , May 2, 2001
            • 0 Attachment
              A lot of emails? I only had 153. BTW, your boat is beautiful.
              Jim

              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: Orr, Jamie [mailto:jorr@...]
              > Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 8:13 AM
              > To: 'bolger@yahoogroups.com'
              > Subject: RE: [bolger] Easiest way to get a smooth fiberglass surface?
              >
              >
              > I may be chiming in late on this one -- I had a pile of emails to
              > deal with
              > when I got home from Depoe Bay, so I probably didn't pay close
              > attention to
              > all of them. However, here's my two bits.
              >
              > I hate sanding epoxy, so I try not to put on more than I have to. I use a
              > squeegee to wet out the cloth, and to remove excess, so that only a thin
              > coat is left on. I sometimes use a squeegee for the second, and even the
              > third coat, but more often use a thin foam roller (west) followed by
              > brushing to even out the coat and smooth the surface. Keeping the coats
              > thin cuts the sanding way down, and (almost) eliminates any chance of
              > sagging.
              >
              > For a good description of the sanding operation, take a look at a the
              > Chesapeake Light Craft shop tips on their website. I follow these
              > guidelines for as long as I can stand it, then call the job
              > finished -- I'm
              > not sure there is an "easiest" way, but maybe there is one that is least
              > difficult!
              >
              > (I've promised myself that I'm going to build a boat without
              > plywood, epoxy
              > or glass, but I haven't done it yet.)
              >
              > Jamie Orr
              >
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: Jim Chamberlin RCSIS [mailto:jchamberlin@...]
              > Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2001 9:53 PM
              > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: RE: [bolger] Easiest way to get a smooth fiberglass surface?
              >
              >
              > I second Chuck's suggestion, but I have also used a belt sander with 60
              > grit. Used carefully and followed up with an orbital using 120 and
              > sometimes a lighter weight gets a nice finish for me. Standing
              > back 10 feet
              > is also recommended.
              >
              > Jim C
              >
              > > -----Original Message-----
              > > From: Chuck Leinweber [mailto:chuck@...]
              > > Sent: Monday, April 30, 2001 10:26 AM
              > > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
              > > Subject: RE: [bolger] Easiest way to get a smooth fiberglass surface?
              > >
              > >
              > > Don's method is fine if you want a nice finish, but many don't.
              > I go for
              > > work boat finish. I give the cloth a second coat to fill the
              > weave, then
              > > Random orbital sand, and paint. Be sure to stand back 10 feet
              > > when you show
              > > it off. This method will get you in the water a lot faster.
              > >
              > > Chuck
              > >
              > > Subject: Re: [bolger] Easiest way to get a smooth fiberglass surface?
              > >
              > > Randy,
              > >
              > > To get it really smooth, you have to use long semi-flexible
              > > sanding battens.
              > > Mine are made of 3/8" plywood and are 2 and 2 1/2 feet long,
              > > width is to fit
              > > a half sheet of paper. I stick the paper to them with 3M spray cement. I
              > > suppose you are fairing with a compound? Microballons and
              > resin, maybe? Be
              > > sure to use a notched trowel to apply the compound, or you'll
              > sand it all
              > > away each time :-)
              > >
              > > Cheers/Carron
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Bolger rules!!!
              > > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
              > > - no flogging dead horses
              > > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
              > > - stay on topic and punctuate
              > > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
              > > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
              > > Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
              > >
              > >
              > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
              > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              > Bolger rules!!!
              > - no
              > cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
              > - no flogging dead horses
              > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
              > - stay on topic and punctuate
              > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
              > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209, Gloucester, MA,
              > 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
              >
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
              >
              > Bolger rules!!!
              > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
              > - no flogging dead horses
              > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
              > - stay on topic and punctuate
              > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
              > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
              > Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
              >
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
              >
            • rrobar@segue.com
              Thanks for all the responses! I ve decided to go with the looks- great-from-10-feet option: sand lightly, cover with paint, then push Micro into the water.
              Message 6 of 27 , May 2, 2001
              • 0 Attachment
                Thanks for all the responses! I've decided to go with the looks-
                great-from-10-feet option: sand lightly, cover with paint, then push
                Micro into the water. Afterall, it's a sailboat, not a yacht.

                randy
                quickly turning lots of expensive wood and epoxy into dust outside
                Boston


                --- In bolger@y..., "Paul A. Lefebvre, Jr." <paul@w...> wrote:
                > I've been sitting on the sidelines on this one, but having just
                recently
                > sanded and varnished the fiberglass coating on my 4th cedar-strip
                canoe to
                > foot-away quality bright finish inside and out, perhaps I oughta
                toss in my
                > 2 cents worth, elaborating on Jamie's suggestions.
                > I do all my glass layup and subsequent coats in a single day -
                I put the
                > cloth on dry on bare wood, on an upside-down boat, wet it out and
                squeegee
                > off most of the resin with a very flexible plastic spatula (the
                ones sold by
                > West system, or for autobody work, are too stiff and will scrape
                out too
                > much resin! I prefer the plastic cake spatulas of the same
                rectangular
                > shape, sold under various names - I bought a bunch with 'frugal
                gourmet'
                > logos on them). This method takes alot of epoxy back out of the
                cloth in the
                > form of non-reusable foamy semi-kicked gunk, but saves so much
                sanding work
                > that I think it's worth the price.Once the resin is set up enough
                to be
                > firm, but still a bit tacky, roll, brush, or squeegee on a second
                coat to
                > fill the weave; a third coat for 6 oz and probably a 4th coat for
                anything
                > coarser, but on 4 oz. cloth 2 coats is just enough. You don't want
                to sand
                > through any cloth, it will seriously weaken the expensive sheath
                you went to
                > all the trouble to put on in the first place, so filling in the
                weave is
                > important; and if you leave it overnight and let the first layup
                coat harden
                > completely before recoating, you really should sand for good
                adhesion before
                > the second coat, or at least scrub with a scotchbrite and amonia to
                remove
                > the blush. Sanding after only 1 coat means you're weakening your
                cloth,
                > hence the long day and multiple coats to really do it most
                efficiently.
                > Presumably the blush 'floats' to the surface if you apply coats in
                > close-enough succession.
                > After going through this and applying 6 coats of Epifanes
                varnish, and
                > right up to delivering the canoe (it was a birthday gift to my
                brother), I
                > was swearing I'd never go through this again, at least to an
                unforgiving
                > varnish-perfect level of finish. Then we dropped it the Chesapeake
                on Easter
                > Sunday, and it all evaporated... I hadn't launched a boat since
                June of '95,
                > had forgotten what a sweet feeling it is - nothing comes close, and
                I feel
                > like a boatbuilder again. I'd post a photo but it's not a Bolger
                boat, and
                > I'll take the following cheap shot to help justify this post ;-):
                Now my
                > shop's empty and I'm free to start construction on my micro (sails
                have been
                > done for awhile), just as soon as I recover from Uncle Sam's rather
                vigorous
                > pat-down on April 15..... anyone paying attention to my ravings a
                couple
                > months ago already guessed I wouldn't make it to the Champlain
                messabout in
                > a micro this year, but I will bring something pretty that
                floats..... sorry
                > for the long post.
                >
                > Envious of Dave Jost up there in perfect epoxying weather, 60 miles
                to my
                > north, and his iminent launch!
                >
                > Paul Lefebvre
              • ellengaest@boatbuilding.com
                Hi David, Why are you drilling the holes? I would imagine that if you can drive the broken drill bits into the lead and are using bronze nails(stronger/stiffer
                Message 7 of 27 , May 2, 2001
                • 0 Attachment
                  Hi David,
                  Why are you drilling the holes? I would imagine that if you can
                  drive the broken drill bits into the lead and are using bronze
                  nails(stronger/stiffer then lead) then should they not drive in just
                  as easily?

                  Got my Micro all wet this evening at 18:25!!!!!!!What a wonderful
                  feeling to be on board after a long winter on the hard.Judging by the
                  way she dipped and rolled while I was on board,I would have to guess
                  that she is tickled pink at being back in her element.Were it not for
                  other obligations later this evening,I would have spent the night on
                  board!!!!!!!

                  Sure wish I coulda been there to help with the keel.......
                  Sincerely,
                  Peter Lenihan,going through something of a heat wave with temps in
                  the 29 to 30 degree celsius range,on the shores of the St.Lawrence....


                  --- In bolger@y..., djost@m... wrote:
                  > Paul,
                  >
                  > I have been doing keel work with the weather, as you stated,
                  > perfect epoxying weather. It is actually a little warm for jobs
                  that
                  > require a leisure pace.
                  >
                  > I have run into a problem with drilling holes in my lead keel.
                  > The drill keeps grabbing and major pressure backwards is needed to
                  > extract the drill. I have tried oiling the tip, and drilling slowly
                  > but have broken $10 worth of drill bits so far. If no one has any
                  > better suggestions I will just pony up another $10. The good news
                  is
                  > that when they break I just hammer them home into the lead. No
                  > damage done other than financial.
                  >
                  > DAvid JOst
                  >
                  > "working rather than boatbuilding :-("
                  > > Envious of Dave Jost up there in perfect epoxying weather, 60
                  miles
                  > to my
                  > > north, and his iminent launch!
                  > >
                  > > Paul Lefebvre
                • Clyde S. Wisner
                  When you spread this stuff with a roller, you might try tipping with a dry foam brush, drag the brush across after you spread a couple of sq ft, no down
                  Message 8 of 27 , May 3, 2001
                  • 0 Attachment
                    When you spread this stuff with a roller, you might try "tipping" with a dry foam brush, drag the
                    brush across after you spread a couple of sq ft, no down presure. May eliminate orange peel. Clyde

                    ellengaest@... wrote:

                    > Hi Randy,
                    > Not too sure what you're after;"a smooth fiberglass surface" or "a
                    > paintable surface".If "paintable",then I would stop where you are and
                    > begin with the paint à la workboat finish.However,if it is the smooth
                    > fiberglass look you are seeking then I would proceed as follows:
                    > Finish sanding the second coat of epoxy.
                    > Get hold of Interlux 401/402(if I recall correctly!) Barrier
                    > coat.
                  • djost@ma.ultranet.com
                    No Peter, In my test run, the bronze nails bent too much prior to seating due to the antimony that was added to the casting. The casting is too hard to drive
                    Message 9 of 27 , May 3, 2001
                    • 0 Attachment
                      No Peter,
                      In my test run, the bronze nails bent too much prior to seating
                      due to the antimony that was added to the casting. The casting is too
                      hard to drive the nails, yet too soft for very sharp titanium drills.
                      I will try dipping a less sharp drill bit in kerosene (plenty of those
                      hurricane lamps in the garage) and try the other side this weekend.

                      David Jost
                      "Suffering from Micro envy, knock it off Peter! :-)"
                      >
                      > Got my Micro all wet this evening at 18:25!!!!!!!What a wonderful
                      > feeling to be on board after a long winter on the hard.Judging by the
                      > way she dipped and rolled while I was on board,I would have to guess
                      > that she is tickled pink at being back in her element.Were it not for
                      > other obligations later this evening,I would have spent the night on
                      > board!!!!!!!
                      >
                      > Sure wish I coulda been there to help with the keel.......
                      > Sincerely,
                      > Peter Lenihan,going through something of a heat wave with temps in
                      > the 29 to 30 degree celsius range,on the shores of the St.Lawrence....
                      >
                      >
                      > --- In bolger@y..., djost@m... wrote:
                      > > Paul,
                      > >
                      > > I have been doing keel work with the weather, as you stated,
                      > > perfect epoxying weather. It is actually a little warm for jobs
                      > that
                      > > require a leisure pace.
                      > >
                      > > I have run into a problem with drilling holes in my lead keel.
                      > > The drill keeps grabbing and major pressure backwards is needed to
                      > > extract the drill. I have tried oiling the tip, and drilling slowly
                      > > but have broken $10 worth of drill bits so far. If no one has any
                      > > better suggestions I will just pony up another $10. The good news
                      > is
                      > > that when they break I just hammer them home into the lead. No
                      > > damage done other than financial.
                      > >
                      > > DAvid JOst
                      > >
                      > > "working rather than boatbuilding :-("
                      > > > Envious of Dave Jost up there in perfect epoxying weather, 60
                      > miles
                      > > to my
                      > > > north, and his iminent launch!
                      > > >
                      > > > Paul Lefebvre
                    • Paul A. Lefebvre, Jr.
                      Dave, I acquired a drill press a couple years ago, with vastly variable speed, and owning it has allowed me to experiment drilling things I never would have
                      Message 10 of 27 , May 3, 2001
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Dave,
                        I acquired a drill press a couple years ago, with vastly variable speed,
                        and owning it has allowed me to experiment drilling things I never would
                        have tackled by hand before. Seems like the slower speeds work better with
                        metals; not as much torque when it grabs, as it inevitably does when you
                        don't have the thing perfectly clamped down in a proper vise; your keel
                        isn't moving but your arms surely are, same effect. I've only drilled
                        aluminum and some steel, not lead, so can't speak from firsthand experience
                        (yet!) but a slower drill speed is easy and cheap to experiment with. I have
                        an old Sears 3/8" variable-speed reversing drill I picked up cheap at a yard
                        sale, hardly ever use it now that I have a cordless, but the little knob on
                        the trigger that lets you set the max trigger depth/drill speed might be
                        just the kind of gadget you'd need for this. Just a thought.... If you want
                        to borrow it, meet me at Logan Wednesday, lunchtime ;-).... or I can Fed-ex
                        it up to you if you want it sooner!
                        I've got even more micro envy than you! At least you're working on yours,
                        I'm preparing for a 2-week business trip, and looking at yet more delays to
                        start construction.... But I do enjoy Peter's ravings about his sweet little
                        boat.

                        good luck!

                        Paul

                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: djost@... [mailto:djost@...]
                        > Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2001 9:30 AM
                        > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                        > Subject: [bolger] Re: Easiest way to get a smooth fiberglass surface?
                        >
                        >
                        > No Peter,
                        > In my test run, the bronze nails bent too much prior to seating
                        > due to the antimony that was added to the casting. The casting is too
                        > hard to drive the nails, yet too soft for very sharp titanium drills.
                        > I will try dipping a less sharp drill bit in kerosene (plenty of those
                        > hurricane lamps in the garage) and try the other side this weekend.
                        >
                        > David Jost
                        > "Suffering from Micro envy, knock it off Peter! :-)"
                        > >
                        > > Got my Micro all wet this evening at 18:25!!!!!!!What a wonderful
                        > > feeling to be on board after a long winter on the hard.Judging by the
                        > > way she dipped and rolled while I was on board,I would have to guess
                        > > that she is tickled pink at being back in her element.Were it not for
                        > > other obligations later this evening,I would have spent the night on
                        > > board!!!!!!!
                        > >
                        > > Sure wish I coulda been there to help with the keel.......
                        > > Sincerely,
                        > > Peter Lenihan,going through something of a heat wave with temps in
                        > > the 29 to 30 degree celsius range,on the shores of the St.Lawrence....
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > --- In bolger@y..., djost@m... wrote:
                        > > > Paul,
                        > > >
                        > > > I have been doing keel work with the weather, as you stated,
                        > > > perfect epoxying weather. It is actually a little warm for jobs
                        > > that
                        > > > require a leisure pace.
                        > > >
                        > > > I have run into a problem with drilling holes in my lead keel.
                        > > > The drill keeps grabbing and major pressure backwards is needed to
                        > > > extract the drill. I have tried oiling the tip, and drilling slowly
                        > > > but have broken $10 worth of drill bits so far. If no one has any
                        > > > better suggestions I will just pony up another $10. The good news
                        > > is
                        > > > that when they break I just hammer them home into the lead. No
                        > > > damage done other than financial.
                        > > >
                        > > > DAvid JOst
                        > > >
                        > > > "working rather than boatbuilding :-("
                        > > > > Envious of Dave Jost up there in perfect epoxying weather, 60
                        > > miles
                        > > > to my
                        > > > > north, and his iminent launch!
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Paul Lefebvre
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Bolger rules!!!
                        > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
                        > - no flogging dead horses
                        > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
                        > - stay on topic and punctuate
                        > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
                        > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
                        > Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                        >
                        >
                        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • Jim Chamberlin RCSIS
                        Randy, This is the conclusion that I think most of us come to...decent finish and launch the thing. To satisfy that desire to put something on the boat with a
                        Message 11 of 27 , May 3, 2001
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Randy,

                          This is the conclusion that I think most of us come to...decent finish and
                          launch the thing.

                          To satisfy that desire to put something on the boat with a high quality
                          finish to it, try adding a few pieces of bright finished mahogany, oak, teak
                          (really expensive) etc. The gunwales and inwales of my first Pointy Skiff
                          are done in Philipine Mahogany. The hardwood looks good and so far has held
                          up great to dock banging, oar whacking, and little kids dragging things on
                          and off the boat.

                          Jim

                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > From: rrobar@... [mailto:rrobar@...]
                          > Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 2:15 PM
                          > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                          > Subject: [bolger] Re: Easiest way to get a smooth fiberglass surface?
                          >
                          >
                          > Thanks for all the responses! I've decided to go with the looks-
                          > great-from-10-feet option: sand lightly, cover with paint, then push
                          > Micro into the water. Afterall, it's a sailboat, not a yacht.
                          >
                          > randy
                          > quickly turning lots of expensive wood and epoxy into dust outside
                          > Boston
                          >
                          >
                          > --- In bolger@y..., "Paul A. Lefebvre, Jr." <paul@w...> wrote:
                          > > I've been sitting on the sidelines on this one, but having just
                          > recently
                          > > sanded and varnished the fiberglass coating on my 4th cedar-strip
                          > canoe to
                          > > foot-away quality bright finish inside and out, perhaps I oughta
                          > toss in my
                          > > 2 cents worth, elaborating on Jamie's suggestions.
                          > > I do all my glass layup and subsequent coats in a single day -
                          > I put the
                          > > cloth on dry on bare wood, on an upside-down boat, wet it out and
                          > squeegee
                          > > off most of the resin with a very flexible plastic spatula (the
                          > ones sold by
                          > > West system, or for autobody work, are too stiff and will scrape
                          > out too
                          > > much resin! I prefer the plastic cake spatulas of the same
                          > rectangular
                          > > shape, sold under various names - I bought a bunch with 'frugal
                          > gourmet'
                          > > logos on them). This method takes alot of epoxy back out of the
                          > cloth in the
                          > > form of non-reusable foamy semi-kicked gunk, but saves so much
                          > sanding work
                          > > that I think it's worth the price.Once the resin is set up enough
                          > to be
                          > > firm, but still a bit tacky, roll, brush, or squeegee on a second
                          > coat to
                          > > fill the weave; a third coat for 6 oz and probably a 4th coat for
                          > anything
                          > > coarser, but on 4 oz. cloth 2 coats is just enough. You don't want
                          > to sand
                          > > through any cloth, it will seriously weaken the expensive sheath
                          > you went to
                          > > all the trouble to put on in the first place, so filling in the
                          > weave is
                          > > important; and if you leave it overnight and let the first layup
                          > coat harden
                          > > completely before recoating, you really should sand for good
                          > adhesion before
                          > > the second coat, or at least scrub with a scotchbrite and amonia to
                          > remove
                          > > the blush. Sanding after only 1 coat means you're weakening your
                          > cloth,
                          > > hence the long day and multiple coats to really do it most
                          > efficiently.
                          > > Presumably the blush 'floats' to the surface if you apply coats in
                          > > close-enough succession.
                          > > After going through this and applying 6 coats of Epifanes
                          > varnish, and
                          > > right up to delivering the canoe (it was a birthday gift to my
                          > brother), I
                          > > was swearing I'd never go through this again, at least to an
                          > unforgiving
                          > > varnish-perfect level of finish. Then we dropped it the Chesapeake
                          > on Easter
                          > > Sunday, and it all evaporated... I hadn't launched a boat since
                          > June of '95,
                          > > had forgotten what a sweet feeling it is - nothing comes close, and
                          > I feel
                          > > like a boatbuilder again. I'd post a photo but it's not a Bolger
                          > boat, and
                          > > I'll take the following cheap shot to help justify this post ;-):
                          > Now my
                          > > shop's empty and I'm free to start construction on my micro (sails
                          > have been
                          > > done for awhile), just as soon as I recover from Uncle Sam's rather
                          > vigorous
                          > > pat-down on April 15..... anyone paying attention to my ravings a
                          > couple
                          > > months ago already guessed I wouldn't make it to the Champlain
                          > messabout in
                          > > a micro this year, but I will bring something pretty that
                          > floats..... sorry
                          > > for the long post.
                          > >
                          > > Envious of Dave Jost up there in perfect epoxying weather, 60 miles
                          > to my
                          > > north, and his iminent launch!
                          > >
                          > > Paul Lefebvre
                          >
                          >
                          > Bolger rules!!!
                          > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
                          > - no flogging dead horses
                          > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
                          > - stay on topic and punctuate
                          > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
                          > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
                          > Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                          >
                          >
                          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                          >
                          >
                        • djost@ma.ultranet.com
                          Paul, I am sorry I can t meet you at Logan on Wed. My school superintendent would frown on me skipping out on my teaching responsibilies. (I have a concert
                          Message 12 of 27 , May 3, 2001
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Paul,
                            I am sorry I can't meet you at Logan on Wed. My school
                            superintendent would frown on me skipping out on my teaching
                            responsibilies. (I have a concert that night anyway). I have been
                            using the cordless and it is either slow or fast with no inbetween. I
                            am going to try the variable speed electric and pick up an handful of
                            real cheap bits and just go through them. If they break they will
                            become part of the boat. what the heck . . .

                            David Jost
                            "avoiding work again"

                            > to borrow it, meet me at Logan Wednesday, lunchtime ;-).... or I can Fed-ex
                            > it up to you if you want it sooner!
                            > I've got even more micro envy than you! At least you're working on yours,
                            > I'm preparing for a 2-week business trip, and looking at yet more delays to
                            > start construction.... But I do enjoy Peter's ravings about his sweet little
                            > boat.
                            >
                            > good luck!
                            >
                            > Paul
                            >
                            > > -----Original Message-----
                            > > From: djost@m... [mailto:djost@m...]
                            > > Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2001 9:30 AM
                            > > To: bolger@y...
                            > > Subject: [bolger] Re: Easiest way to get a smooth fiberglass surface?
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > No Peter,
                            > > In my test run, the bronze nails bent too much prior to seating
                            > > due to the antimony that was added to the casting. The casting is too
                            > > hard to drive the nails, yet too soft for very sharp titanium drills.
                            > > I will try dipping a less sharp drill bit in kerosene (plenty of those
                            > > hurricane lamps in the garage) and try the other side this weekend.
                            > >
                            > > David Jost
                            > > "Suffering from Micro envy, knock it off Peter! :-)"
                            > > >
                            > > > Got my Micro all wet this evening at 18:25!!!!!!!What a wonderful
                            > > > feeling to be on board after a long winter on the hard.Judging by the
                            > > > way she dipped and rolled while I was on board,I would have to guess
                            > > > that she is tickled pink at being back in her element.Were it not for
                            > > > other obligations later this evening,I would have spent the night on
                            > > > board!!!!!!!
                            > > >
                            > > > Sure wish I coulda been there to help with the keel.......
                            > > > Sincerely,
                            > > > Peter Lenihan,going through something of a heat wave with temps in
                            > > > the 29 to 30 degree celsius range,on the shores of the St.Lawrence....
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > > --- In bolger@y..., djost@m... wrote:
                            > > > > Paul,
                            > > > >
                            > > > > I have been doing keel work with the weather, as you stated,
                            > > > > perfect epoxying weather. It is actually a little warm for jobs
                            > > > that
                            > > > > require a leisure pace.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > I have run into a problem with drilling holes in my lead keel.
                            > > > > The drill keeps grabbing and major pressure backwards is needed to
                            > > > > extract the drill. I have tried oiling the tip, and drilling slowly
                            > > > > but have broken $10 worth of drill bits so far. If no one has any
                            > > > > better suggestions I will just pony up another $10. The good news
                            > > > is
                            > > > > that when they break I just hammer them home into the lead. No
                            > > > > damage done other than financial.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > DAvid JOst
                            > > > >
                            > > > > "working rather than boatbuilding :-("
                            > > > > > Envious of Dave Jost up there in perfect epoxying weather, 60
                            > > > miles
                            > > > > to my
                            > > > > > north, and his iminent launch!
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > Paul Lefebvre
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > Bolger rules!!!
                            > > - no cursing, flaming, trolling, or spamming
                            > > - no flogging dead horses
                            > > - add something: take "thanks!" and "ditto!" posts off-list.
                            > > - stay on topic and punctuate
                            > > - add your comments at the TOP and SIGN your posts
                            > > - To order plans: Mr. Philip C. Bolger, P.O. Box 1209,
                            > > Gloucester, MA, 01930, Fax: (978) 282-1349
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                          • KF4call@aol.com
                            The Fall 2000 Epoxyworks , published by West, has an article titled Fiberglassing a Woodstrip Hull...Techniques for a Perfect Clear Finish . Covers all
                            Message 13 of 27 , May 4, 2001
                            • 0 Attachment
                              The Fall 2000 "Epoxyworks", published by West, has an article titled
                              "Fiberglassing a Woodstrip Hull...Techniques for a Perfect Clear
                              Finish". Covers all sorts of things such as vaiations in technique depending
                              on the coat. They recommend different approaches for first, second and third
                              coats. The content is quite thorough and even goes into detail on the type
                              of rags to use. There isn't a lot here on finishing, but I imagine, if ou
                              can get it on smoother, the finishing should be less demanding.

                              In our discussion, I haven't heard much on the use of scrapers...sharp
                              blades held nearly vertical to the surface. Anyone using them? What happens
                              if you hit the glass cloth with a scraper?

                              Regards,
                              Warren

                              In a message dated 5/4/2001 6:53:12 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
                              jorr@... writes:

                              << > -----Original Message-----
                              > From: Chuck Leinweber [mailto:chuck@...]
                              > Sent: Monday, April 30, 2001 10:26 AM
                              > To: bolger@yahoogroups.com
                              > Subject: RE: [bolger] Easiest way to get a smooth fiberglass surface?
                              >
                              >
                              > Don's method is fine if you want a nice finish, but many don't. I go for
                              > work boat finish. I give the cloth a second coat to fill the weave, then
                              > Random orbital sand, and paint. Be sure to stand back 10 feet
                              > when you show
                              > it off. This method will get you in the water a lot faster.
                              >
                              > Chuck
                              > >>
                            • Chuck Leinweber
                              Hi, Warren: I use scrapers a lot, not just on boats. They work very well on epoxy/glass, with these caveats: Try to do the scraping on heavy areas before the
                              Message 14 of 27 , May 4, 2001
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Hi, Warren:

                                I use scrapers a lot, not just on boats. They work very well on
                                epoxy/glass, with these caveats: Try to do the scraping on heavy areas
                                before the resin is completely cured, and use good steel, as they will get
                                dull fast enough when you hit glass.

                                Chuck


                                In our discussion, I haven't heard much on the use of scrapers...sharp
                                blades held nearly vertical to the surface. Anyone using them? What
                                happens
                                if you hit the glass cloth with a scraper?

                                Regards,
                                Warren
                              • phillip_lea@yahoo.com
                                Agree with Jim. I have used 100% acrylic satin house paint that can get scuffed off, but having a few varnished pieces (mast, tiller, etc.) sets off the whole
                                Message 15 of 27 , May 4, 2001
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Agree with Jim. I have used 100% acrylic satin house paint that can
                                  get scuffed off, but having a few varnished pieces (mast, tiller,
                                  etc.) sets off the whole boat -- scuffed paint doesn't look nearly so
                                  bad. Spar varnish over clear coat epoxy (System 3) is a rugged
                                  finish.

                                  Phil Lea

                                  --- In bolger@y..., "Jim Chamberlin RCSIS" <jchamberlin@r...> wrote:
                                  > To satisfy that desire to put something on the boat with a high
                                  quality
                                  > finish to it, try adding a few pieces of bright finished mahogany,
                                  oak, teak
                                  > (really expensive) etc. The gunwales and inwales of my first Pointy
                                  Skiff
                                  > are done in Philipine Mahogany.
                                • j.c.ewing@home.com
                                  I ve been using pull-scrapers to remove old finish on the hull of my Tendercraft stripper skiff, Nandessa. The cloth beneath is probably only about 2-oz. but
                                  Message 16 of 27 , May 4, 2001
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    I've been using pull-scrapers to remove old finish on the hull of my
                                    Tendercraft stripper skiff, Nandessa. The cloth beneath is probably
                                    only about 2-oz. but I've found the scraper only grazes it, without
                                    noticeable damage.

                                    I'm not keen on chemical stripping and a pull-stripper alone had left
                                    patches of old varnish on the (somewhat rough) oaken outer stem and
                                    keel, skeg and rub strips. So today I used a heat gun along with the
                                    pull-scraper and everything came off beautifully. I also tried this
                                    technique on a spot where I'd been unable to sand or scrape old
                                    varnish off the clear-coat (but deteriorated) epoxy. It almost worked
                                    too well, the epoxy bubbling when it got too hot. But it almost makes
                                    me think about heat-stripping the old epoxy right off the 'glass for
                                    a nice, fresh base.

                                    John in Victoria


                                    --- In bolger@y..., KF4call@a... wrote:
                                    > In our discussion, I haven't heard much on the use of
                                    scrapers...sharp
                                    > blades held nearly vertical to the surface. Anyone using them?
                                    What happens
                                    > if you hit the glass cloth with a scraper?
                                    >
                                    > Regards,
                                    > Warren
                                  Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.